December 2003 - cypherpunks-legacy

re: Hlep
by nobody＠REPLAY.COM 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Misty Ed the incredible talking horse.

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Re: NAMBLA embattled -- mirror sites?
by nobody＠REPLAY.COM 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Declan writes: >Folks on f-c and cypherpunks have mirrored holocaust revisionist web >pages, banned books, and censored newspapers. Now I understand that NAMBLA >is in danger of losing its home on the web. Anyone up for mirroring the >(text-only) publications of perhaps the world's most controversial >organization? Nah, I'll pass on this one. If the membership list is included, I'd be glad to forward it to my local police, though... I'm not sure the right to free speech includes the right to endorse guys fucking little boys, whether they give it a moniker like "transgenerational love" or not. Any sex with a minor is rape, since they can't legally give consent. All Hillary Klinton's "It Takes A Village" bullshit aside, I can't see giving NAMBLA the same kind of protection as someone like Zundel. Ratbert

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Don't Worry, Be Happy
by Blanc 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Unix and other OSes were designed for Elite Techno-savvy Info Warriors like yourselves. Windows and the other MS apps are designed to appeal to the "common folk" who would still rather use a pc than a Mac in spite of psychological counseling against it (<g>). They have choices, there are many stores and vendors, they take their pick. As long as you can get what you want, what do youall care what other people use - why do you worry for everyone? .. Blanc

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Re: Orthogonal (fwd)
by Jim Choate 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Forwarded message: > From: Mark Rogaski <wendigo(a)ne-wendigo.jabberwock.org> > Subject: Re: Orthogonal (fwd) > Date: Mon, 27 Oct 1997 01:36:06 -0500 (EST) > An entity claiming to be Jim Choate wrote: > > : I can see the union 'build complicated things out of basic building blocks' > : and the use of Occam's Razor (I'm as lazy as any other programmer) but fail > : to see how this maps to anything relating to the concept of orthogonal. > : Which clearly doesn't have any inherent minimalist cast. > : > > Minimalism is merely a by-product of orthogonality. Which orthogonality are you speaking of? > A language is considered > orthogonal if builtin functions do not provide overlapping functionality. Are you talking linguistics, philosophy, or computer? Consider, historicaly the point of 'orthogonality' was to indicate a *non-overlapping* or reducable structure, something which provides a reference to evaluate other things. > So the term orthogonal probably refers to the fact that there is no > point of intersection in the functionality of the language (or system, as > the thread started out). Orthogonal implies there is intersection, it's hard to have a closed geometric shape (-gonal) or a right angle (ortho-) axis system without them. > And I will not argue about vector spaces until I get bookshelves and actually > dig my Linear Algebra texts out of the boxes around my apartment. Good, I understand how it is used in vector spaces and don't really get my jollies off on arguing on unrelated issues. What I *would* like to know is how a mathematical term related to geometry and right angles got expanded *historicaly* to mean something completely unrelated. I don't think a linear algebra book is relevant to this question, despite the protestations of the techno-masturbatory ot the contrary. There are a whole host of users on this list who live by strawman arguments. I am glad to see you aren't one of them (apparently). ____________________________________________________________________ | | | The financial policy of the welfare state requires that there | | be no way for the owners of wealth to protect themselves. | | | | -Alan Greenspan- | | | | _____ The Armadillo Group | | ,::////;::-. Austin, Tx. USA | | /:'///// ``::>/|/ http://www.ssz.com/ | | .', |||| `/( e\ | | -====~~mm-'`-```-mm --'- Jim Choate | | ravage(a)ssz.com | | 512-451-7087 | |____________________________________________________________________|

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Re: CMR versus GAK?
by Blanc 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

John Young wrote, I think: >Same goes for workers and youngsters who think the bosses and >oldsters are duncemunge: WSJ, Dilbert and Phrack are funnies to >avoid the admitting the deeper complicity of secret crossovers by >your favorite peer group into the opposing camps, political, economic, >legal, scientific, not to say no longer secure national and sexual borders. .................................................. John, you should write a book. Light reading. haiku. .. Blanc

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Re: Singaporean control freaks & CMR (Re: puff pieces vs tough
by Blanc 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Harish Pillay wrote: >So, now to come back to the first line. Tell me how you can tolerate living >in wherever that it you live in? ....................................................... Well, it's not so bad - I live about 3 minutes drive from Microsoft, with micro-millionaires all around. I live across the street from Crossroads Mall, which has practically everything I need, including free music/jazz concerts on weekends, the weather is nice most of the time (I *like* rain), and I'm not far away from the sea, the mountains, hiking, skiing, biking, boating, snorkeling, whatever, and lots of other genteel entertainment of all kinds. Frankly, I can just barely tolerate it, and I've been contemplating what life would be like in Anguilla. :>) No seriously, I'm referring to the political climate in the U.S. in general (although The East Side, as this side of Washington Lake is called, is considered too conservative by most Seattlites and has a large Libertarian representation, probably because of all those programmers at MS). But then, I'm a real purist and wish for extreme things, and like the princess & the pea in the fairy tale, am highly sensitive to deviations from perfection. :O It's hard to tolerate being moved to act by people (whether in government or otherwise, but of course mostly in political circles) who carelessly and disrespectfully override my personal choices in order to make their social dreams for everyone come true, using any resources they can "legitimize" taking from myself or anyone to accomplish them; it's a pain to contemplate their rationalizations. I read/study in psychology & cognition, and the area of Thinking in general, and it helps me to understand people like them, as well as to maintain a rational, balanced state of mind when contemplating their existence and considering ways to deal with it. It takes a lot of creativity to see beyond collectivist/coercive methods and carry on in spite of having to subserviently respond in "voluntary complicity". I've been mulling the whole situation over, and I think it's a good idea to emulate Bill Gates. "We're not taking over the whole world", he protested in one interview. "I mean, all we do is produce these small boxes that you can buy and put it into your pc, what does that have to do with taking over?" (hee-hee). No, it's just dragging some people, kicking and screaming, to a new level of technological opportunities. I like that. <g> I think they all deserve it. Anyway, thanks for the reply. I wouldn't argue against Singaporean citizens who actually like their way of life. I would only be concerned if they couldn't go in the directions they prefer. Micro-management is not something I myself could laugh off, as my sense of humor isn't that good, although my sense of the ridiculous is easily aroused. .. Blanc

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PGP 5.5 available outside US
by Lucky Green 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

It seems that unknown Cypherpunks have yet again shown their disrespect of US export laws by exporting the latest version of PGP. The Windows version of PGP 5.5 is now available for your downloading pleasure at ftp://ftp.replay.com/pub/crypto/incoming/PGP55.zip PGP 5.5 features superior LDAP keyserver integration, multiple signature categories, and automatic decryption (set Preferences -> Email -> Automatically Decrypt). "You heard the rumors. Now try it yourself." :-) -- Lucky Green <shamrock(a)cypherpunks.to> PGP encrypted email preferred. "Tonga? Where the hell is Tonga? They have Cypherpunks there?"

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the usual two sided mouth political free speech
by Attila T. Hun 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- the usual two sided mouth political free speech in re: NYTimes letter to the editor, 26 Oct 97 sometimes I wonder if free speech isn't already muffled; the rest of the time I know it is. anytime a politician can get a headline, they will stamp on someone's rights. common sense has been exerminated more effectively than NYC's vermin. I dont like my kids being exposed to that "kind" of material, but I would sure rather it was done in an educational environment (unless it is some faggot teacher then advocating homosexual practice). children will find that "knowledge" one way or the other. You can not condemn "evil" without observing "evil" and making a _personal_ value judgement which should not be reflected in calling for laws for or against. If the adults would stop acting like 6 year olds, and the politicians as 4 year old bullies, our children might get an education. OB Crypto: maybe the teacher should be distributing this material on PGP with individual student keys; the teacher can sort out the Christian Coalition and Orthodox Jews early on and just forget to include their key --end of problem. So there is a valid use for PGP in the schools --of course, the old PGP, not their GAKed sellout. To the Editor: Gov. George E. Pataki's comments regarding Charles Self, the New York City schoolteacher who distributed a sexually explicit poem to his students, were transparently political (news article, Oct. 23). First, the Governor disassociated himself from ruling on the matter ("the appropriate sanction is not something for Albany to decide"), and then jabbed the system that must rule on it ("I think a letter in a file is not good enough"). It would have been better to remain silent. Second-best would have been to remind us of reality: most teachers are competent most of the time. They occasionally make errors in judgment. Mr. Self, reputedly a teacher who motivates his students, made a mistake -- apparently the first in 17 years to be placed on the record. In such matters we ought to set aside the broad political brush and work to rebuild the trusting relationship that teachers so richly deserve to enjoy. The Governor would do well to remember that politicians are currently held in even lower esteem than teachers. GILBERT CASS New Haven, Oct. 24, 1997 -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.3i Charset: latin1 Comment: No safety this side of the grave. Never was; never will be iQBVAwUBNFTB07R8UA6T6u61AQHhRQH/SAdMr/RJ6Ix6of7FPxIohxn/oOY2KOsN a09/LtVErCffpMJc0tH4ZYF5aUrBH24CyNVCeIpDQjAYEg+5TH6LLQ== =PM10 -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

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Re: Singaporean control freaks & CMR (Re: puff pieces vs tough crypto issues)
by Blanc 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Harish Pillay wrote: >I don't think the "micro management" is at it's worst in Singapore - not by >a long shot. It is true that the Singapore government tries to do so and >in a lot of what they attempt, they somehow come out smelling roses. But >they have goofed up royally as well. ................................................................... If you don't mind my asking in front of everybody, how do you stand it, living there? Do you get very frustrated (it sounds as though you might), and want to leave for Anguilla? Do you remind yourself not to litter with those gum wrappers you're not supposed to have anyway, what do you think when you're being incentivized to find a sexual partner and produce children, or to Do This and Not do That or risk painful punishments? Do co-workers become critical of each other's petty "crimes", do you feel opressed all around, or is it not as bad as it seems from here? .. Blanc

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Re: Orthogonal (fwd)
by Jim Choate 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Forwarded message: > Date: Sun, 26 Oct 1997 19:13:12 -0800 > From: Kent Crispin <kent(a)bywater.songbird.com> > Subject: Re: Orthogonal (fwd) > > > I do believe the use of the term this way was inspired by the > > > notion of a 'basis' in a vector space -- a set of orthogonal > > > vectors that span the space, ideally, unit vectors. > > > > Can you better define the term 'basis'? > > This is basic linear algebra: > > V a vector space -- the set of all (s1,s2,s3,...,sn), where si is an > element of the set of reals. Actualy si (scalars) can be rational, real, or complex. It is also possible to use more general structures such as fields. [1] Note that complex numbers numbers may be used, in other words a vector can be used to multiply another vector. > A set of vectors {v1,v2,...,vm} in V is A vector of vectors, and you haven't even really defined vector yet...:( > linearly independent if there is no set of scalars {c1,c2,...,cm} with > at least one non-zero element such that sum(ci*vi) == 0 Are you saying: (c1*v1)+(c2*v2)+...+(cn*vn) <> 0 where at least one ci is <>0, is some sort of test for membership in a vector space? What about, (1/c1*v1)+(-1/c2*v2)+(0*v3)...+(0*vn) = 0, 1 -1 if so it should be clear that except for the case of c=0 there is always a way to take two, which is clearly more than one, of the scalars and cause the sum to be zero. Now if you have a single non-zero scalar multiplier then it seems reasonable that you can create such a structure that is always <>0. > A set of > vectors S spans In other words 'are expressible in'? > a vector space V iff every element of V can be expressed > as a linear combination of the elements of S. ^^^^^^^^^^^ Need to better define this one. The operations that are applicable to a vector space are: [1] 1. Associative law of addition: (x+y)+z = x+(y+z) 2. Commutative law of addition: x+y=y+x 3. Existance of zero: x+0=x for all x in V 4. Existance of inverses: x+(-x)=0 5. Associative law of multiplication: a(bx)=(ab)x 6. Unital law: 1*x=x 7. First distributive law: a(x+y)=(a*x)+(a*y) 8. Second distributive law: (a+b)*x=(a*x)+(b*x) where x is of the form 'asubn(x^n)+bsubn-1(x^n-1)+...+asub1x+asub0' This is a remarkably circular definition to present. In clearer wording; The set of vectors S is expressible in a vector space V iff S is contained in V. While this may be a requirement or test for membership in a vector space (as used below) it doesn't qualify as a definition. > Finally, a basis for > V is a linearly independent set of vectors in V that spans V. A > space is finite dimensioned if it has a finite set for a basis. The ^^^ set of what? > standard basis (or natural basis) for a vector space of dimension n > is th set of vectors > > (1,0,0,...0) > (0,1,0,...0) > (0,0,1,...0) In other words, any 'vector' can be expressed as the sum of the multiplication of unit elements by some set of scalars. Is this definition something you just wrote or would you be so kind as to give the reference if it isn't. This definition uses 'basis', doesn't define it. You can't use a term to define the term, it's called circular reasoning. My question still stands, can you please better define 'basis'. Or is your claim that basis is simply a way of stating 'elements of unit magnitude'? Furthermore, a definition of vector space has nothing to do with orthogonal measurement systems, it does have to do with polynomials. It just so happens that this sort of geometry shares the same sort of rules, that doesn't make them the same thing. There is nothing in your description, in particular the nifty little (*,*,*,...*)'s that implies any sort of measurement system based on line-segment axis that are 90 degrees apart, merely that there is more than one variable (ie x,y,z,...a) involved. Vector space - a vector space is a set of objects or elements that can be added together and multiplied by numbers (the result being an element of the set), in such a way that the usual rules of calculations hold. [1] ____________________________________________________________________ | | | The financial policy of the welfare state requires that there | | be no way for the owners of wealth to protect themselves. | | | | -Alan Greenspan- | | | | _____ The Armadillo Group | | ,::////;::-. Austin, Tx. USA | | /:'///// ``::>/|/ http://www.ssz.com/ | | .', |||| `/( e\ | | -====~~mm-'`-```-mm --'- Jim Choate | | ravage(a)ssz.com | | 512-451-7087 | |____________________________________________________________________| [1] The VNR Concise Encyclopedia of Mathematics Gellert, Kustner, Hellwich, Kastner ISBN 0-442-22646-2 17.3 Vector spaces pp. 362 [Hallowen Trivia] 'Dracula' is a word derived from 'dracul' meaning dragon and was given to Vlad Tepish, whose name means 'son of the devil', he was further known as Vlad the Impaler because he would impale people on poles and place them along the roads in Transylvania. When he died in 1496 his head was impaled on a stick as well.

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