December 2003 - cypherpunks-legacy

Re: [noise] (was Re: PBS show)
by AwakenToMe＠aol.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

In a message dated 96-06-16 11:57:22 EDT, nelson(a)crynwr.com writes: << Perry, if someone is so clueless as to post a general programming question to cypherpunks, do you think they're going to "get it"? You need to explain it in very small words. This mailing list, cypherpunks, is about encryption. It's not about reminiscing about old personal computers (however much fun it is to do) and showing off our respective ages. Yes, you may consider this a Russ-o-gram. >> Yes you are right. BUT its funny. I only asked something about another mailing that was done yesterday about real-protected mode and the chip desing. So while its there.. why not take a question outta it!! hehe

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Bye Bye Middleman
by middle-man-admin＠nym.jpunix.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

To Whom it may Concern: The middleman remailer has not been as robust or reliable as I had hoped. It relies too heavily on the nym servers and the reliability of the other remailers that it randomly selects. As you can tell by Raph's list, middleman has not responded to a ping a ping in some time. I've been looking at the process for several days now and have come to the conclusion that it will probably never achieve a level of reliability that will make it a reasonable remailer. With this in mind, I am formally announcing the retirement of the middleman Type-II remailer. It was an interesting experiment but it just didn't pan out. middle-man-admin(a)nym.jpunix.com

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Re: [noise] (was Re: PBS show)
by AwakenToMe＠aol.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

In a message dated 96-06-16 06:17:43 EDT, perry(a)piermont.com (Perry E. Metzger) writes: << AwakenToMe(a)aol.com writes: > new lows??? Its a rather reasonable question about the protected mode on the > intel chips considering the limits of 640K mem...Sorry if Im not as 'versed' > in proteected mode as you,master, seem to be. Oh please teach us lesser ones. Some people really just don't get it, do they. Let the sewer flow... .pm >> Guess Not. Maybe thats why I subscribe to mailers. So I can learn and share what I know. Although the internet is such a vast resource..... it is nevertheless an area where egotistical, hard headed, and very arrogant people lurk. Take this to heart some of you. Remember... internet is information. let the sewer flow?? Man.. get outside one of these days.

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Snake Oil on the Water...
by Alan Olsen 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

I recieved this on another list. The snake oil is starting to flow pretty heavy. I expect it to get worse... >Subject: Windows 3.x or Win95 FREEWARE Mail/Encryption Program >X-UIDL: 788ef8d7083cb4f8e94b2c20183773b5 > >Date: Sat, 15 Jun 1996 13:26:23 -0600 >To: freematt(a)coil.com (Matthew Gaylor) >From: Joe Horn <6mysmesa(a)1eagle1.com> >Subject: Re: Security and Freedom through FREEWARE Mail/Encryption Program. > > >At the following two sites, you may download the FREEWARE Pegasus Mail >program version 2.3.3 16 bit for windows 3.x or a version for WIN95. The >unique thing about it, besides its simplicity and that it's a great mail >program better than Eudora, it has a built in encryption program that is as >effective as PGP and lots simpler. All you do is agree on a password with >your correspondent. That simple. The encryption program and the mail program >were developed in New Zealand, and were legally imported, so the encryption >program is better than PGP, which is regulated by Federal Cypher Laws. >Honest.Plus, it's free. The sites are: > >http://www.pegasus.usa.com/ > >or > >http://www.env.com/tucows/files/winpm233.zip >---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > >**************************************************************************** >Subscribe to Freematt's Alerts: Pro-Individual Rights Issues >Send a blank message to: freematt(a)coil.com with the words subscribe FA >on the subject line. List is private and moderated (7-30 messages per week) >Matthew Gaylor,1933 E. Dublin-Granville Rd.,#176, Columbus, OH 43229 >**************************************************************************** --- |"The moral PGP Diffie taught Zimmermann unites all| Disclaimer: | | mankind free in one-key-steganography-privacy!" | Ignore the man | |`finger -l alano(a)teleport.com` for PGP 2.6.2 key | behind the keyboard.| | http://www.teleport.com/~alano/ | alano(a)teleport.com |

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Re: alpha.c2.org in deep shit?
by Hal 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

I peeked at a few messages passing through my remailer from alpha.c2.org (mea culpa) to see whether the problem might be at my end. As far as I could tell, the messages were correctly formatted and all, but simply lacked message bodies. So it looked like the data being sent from alpha.c2.org was already messed up and had stripped the bodies. I set up an alpha.c2.org alias a few days ago and when I sent mail to myself I got mail without a body, so I think it is a definate screwup. I sent a report of this to remailer-operators list but have not seen a response yet from Sameer. Hal

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Re: Netscape Mail Security and PGP Plugins
by Hal 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

From: Greg Kucharo <sophi(a)best.com> > A couple of questions I have right off the bat are; > 1. In Hal's Java mail encryptor, what are the legal aspects of > sending code across that contains crypto? There are two main issues, export and patent. Export laws keep it from being used outside the U.S., and patent laws keep it from being used within the U.S. Everyone else should have no problem. > 2. Can any plugin access the Netscape Mail program. According to discussion on the coderpunks list, this is not presently possible: : From coderpunks-errors(a)toad.com Sat Jun 8 18:33:32 1996 : Date: Sat, 8 Jun 1996 18:07:06 -0700 (PDT) : From: Kurt Thams <thams(a)thams.com> : Subject: Re: plugging in : : On Sat, 8 Jun 1996, strick -- henry strickland wrote: : : > > >> >You could hand any websurfer a Netscape PGP plugin without much work : > > >> >at all, and you could easily build it on lots of platforms. After all, : > > >> >look at how many platforms that lowly C code like PGP runs on. : > : > not knowing what Netscape plugins do, : > let me ask the plumbing question: what would this do, and how? : > allow users to send/receive encrypted PGP mail in the "netscape mail" window, : > transparently like Raef's sendmail wrapper? : > how do you invoke a plugin, when & why? : : This is not possible yet. The Netscape API doesn't expose the mail service : to plug-ins. One would think that future versions of Navigator will do : this, however. : : -- kurt thams : -- thams(a)thams.com However as has been mentioned here a PGP/MIME mail type could theoretically be used to activate a handler for that incoming mail. I don't know exactly how this would work. Glancing at the netscape plug docs near <URL: http://home.netscape.com/eng/mozilla/2.0/handbook/plugins/ > it appears that plugins are activated on HTML page downloads, not (necessarily) on mail receipt. So unless you typically find your incoming mail on a web page, it doesn't look like this will work. I will ask about it on coderpunks for clarification. > 3. When is S/MIME going to be in Netscape, I tried to find info on the > web site but thier statements about S/MIME seem vague. Sorry, can't help you here. > I hope I'm not running over old ground, but this has to be alot more > intresting than discussing that PBS show! Agree! Hal

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Re: Remailer Operator Liability?
by David Rosoff 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- At 12.58 PM 6/15/96 -0700, Hal wrote: >I am pretty sure it is illegal, CDA or not, at least if the material >is obscene rather than merely indecent. As Declan says, the issue is >accountability. If the remailer operator ends up being considered the >person who sent the mail, he could be in deep trouble. This is the problem I have with the whole issue. Obviously, since nyms use reply blocks, the remailer operators that are inside the reply block have no control over what is sent (PGP-encrypted) through their remailer. If I was to go out into the city, and tack up some porno on a building, maybe something where kids walk by, then someone would take it down, most likely, but there would be no tracing it to me, because I would be already long gone from the building. We should make the best efforts we can to make remailers fully anonymous. My ideas are more that accept PGP, and (has this already been suggested and/or rejected?) automatic chaining. That is, remailer #1 could automatically encrypt and send to #2, #3, ... #n before going on to its destination. The number of added remailers and which were used could be made random. (ie, have a list of remailers and pick from it each time...) Would this work? =============================================================================== David Rosoff (nihongo o chiisaku dekimasu) -------------> drosoff(a)arc.unm.edu For PGP key 0xD37692F9, finger drosoff(a)acoma.arc.unm.edu or get from keyservers pub 1024/D37692F9 1995/07/01 David Rosoff <drosoff(a)arc.unm.edu> Key fingerprint = 25 7D AA 01 85 41 43 89 50 5A 33 76 F1 F1 99 67 I accept anonymous mail. If I didn't sign it, you don't know I wrote it. === "Made weak by time and fate, but strong in will / To strive, to seek, to find-- and not to yield." <---- "Ulysses", by Alfred, Lord Tennyson -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.2 iQCVAwUBMcRVXhguzHDTdpL5AQFc1wP9GiJ6mXeAOY1x/7g1GrCPsWYEZlS5iq84 wfKwgs1W8L+PBQcbrgdhyK2RKDJ7sFrCbz0eSa3OLbDiw5NeKD0LSDAvxuF3Redu aUpv4yWdYMz71sHz8MF7TxzdOo5a6dg3XtIaRA3Sbt4i2p9dozm/Xg5h4vhgKwWu /nG1BhTlNGs= =O4wy -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

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Re: Snake Oil on the Water...
by Rich Burroughs 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 11:19 AM 6/16/96 -0700, Alan Olsen wrote: >I recieved this on another list. Me too :) >The snake oil is starting to flow pretty heavy. I expect it to get worse... Here's the reply I sent to that list. I cc'd the person who sent the original message... =========== At 01:00 PM 6/16/96 -0400, Joe Horn <6mysmesa(a)1eagle1.com> wrote: [snip] >At the following two sites, you may download the FREEWARE Pegasus Mail >program version 2.3.3 16 bit for windows 3.x or a version for WIN95. I like Pmail. Had I not been an experienced Eudora user before I tried it (and pretty stuck on the Eudora interface) I would have probably stuck with it. Kudos to the Pegasus team for releasing a freeware program with such excellent filtering capabilites. It is much more of a full-fledged program than Eudora Lite, IMHO. > The >unique thing about it, besides its simplicity and that it's a great mail >program better than Eudora, it has a built in encryption program that is as >effective as PGP and lots simpler. All you do is agree on a password with >your correspondent. That simple. This would seem to eliminate the immense benefit of public key encryption -- that you can send encrypted email to someone you haven't met, without any prior communication. If you have security concerns, they will probably apply to whatever communication media that you would use to agree on the password. If I have a secure method to agree on a password with someone, what the heck do I need crypto for? ;) Also, I'm assuming that you can only send encrypted mail to other Pmail users. PGP is above those kinds of limitations -- it can be used on many platforms and with many different types of email packages. > The encryption program and the mail program >were developed in New Zealand, and were legally imported, so the encryption >program is better than PGP, which is regulated by Federal Cypher Laws. This is misleading, IMHO. While the export of the US version is "regulated by Federal Cypher Laws," PGP is not like some products which export a weaker version to accomodate ITAR. The version of PGP for people outside of the US is developed outside of the US, and is just as strong as the domestic version, AFAIK. Some people's lives, business, etc. depend on what type of crypto they use. I don't think it's really appropriate to make misleading claims like the one above when the stakes are that high. Please drop this claim for your promotional efforts, or back it up with specific evidence showing how ITAR has weakened PGP. >Honest.Plus, it's free. The sites are: [snip] For those people who want to use PGP with Pegasus, there's a nice little plug-in for Pegasus called PGP JN, by John Navas, which allows you to choose to encrypt with PGP (you need to have a copy) instead of the Pmail crypto. It has a few small drawbacks, IMHO, but I found it much easier to use than PGP shell interfaces that require cutting text to the clipboard first. John's program is available at: http://www.aimnet.com/~jnavas/winpmail.html I really think the Pegasus team would do better to mention that John's program is available, rather than try to steer people away from PGP. PGP JN makes using the basic email features of PGP more streamlined than most other mail packages I've used (except Private Idaho, which is not a full-fledged email package). I think it would be better to mention that both options exist, rather than seeking to convert the masses away from PGP, which is unlikely to succeed anyway, IMHO. PC users who use PGP should try Pegasus and PGP JN. Private Idaho is available from Joel McNamara's page, at: http://www.eskimo.com/~joelm/ Rich ______________________________________________________________________ Rich Burroughs richieb(a)teleport.com http://www.teleport.com/~richieb See my Blue Ribbon Page at http://www.teleport.com/~richieb/blueribbon U.S. State Censorship Page at - http://www.teleport.com/~richieb/state New EF zine "cause for alarm" - http://www.teleport.com/~richieb/cause

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new type2.list/pubring.mix
by John A. Perry 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hello everyone, A new type2.list/pubring.mix combination that reflects the retirement of the experimental remailer, middleman, has been posted. You can get it by web from www.jpunix.com. or by FTP from ftp.jpunix.com. John Perry - perry(a)alpha.jpunix.com - PGP-encrypted e-mail welcome! WWW - http://www.jpunix.com PGP 2.62 key for perry(a)jpunix.com is on the keyservers. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.2 iQCVAwUBMcR58lOTpEThrthvAQGocgP/V3UuU11iwo6Yme295YygWqXekKKxkXXH 4u94vrwkYF3qTT+9W3vrgRuUueOf/xF6FP0FZj14wc0sZ51wAnHvPxpHNxzoXuFH Z7IAOv7MsSfm8Cn2/kFqK+KAGlaKRFpHzJUZS61Oo2u7HrLvejjNd4ZOfAhZ83m7 opBUlcYqCPA= =0LW8 -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

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Re: Does information want to be free?
by Joseph M. Reagle Jr. 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 10:41 PM 6/14/96 -0400, Declan B. McCullagh wrote: >I confess I was amused by how he described >those Internet anarchists who delighted in publicizing books that should >in fact be restricted. I am amused (though I am not taking sides) by the general lack of attention or rhetoric that "crypto-anarchists"/"crypherpunks"/whatever, otherwise privacy respecting people, usually espouse. If someone found out all the medical information of cypherpunks list members and distributed about the Net, how would people feel? (This is a rhetorical question, and I am familiar and agree with some of the arguments regarding public interest, public figures, copyright isn't a privacy protecting mechanism, yada yada yada. Just something to think about, what if large corporations, public interest groups, lobbeys, or governments can use this as a precedent against "us".) _______________________ Regards, Democracy is where you can say what you think even if you don't think. -? Joseph Reagle http://rpcp.mit.edu/~reagle/home.html reagle(a)mit.edu E0 D5 B2 05 B6 12 DA 65 BE 4D E3 C1 6A 66 25 4E

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