December 2003 - cypherpunks-legacy

Re: FV fine print
by Nathaniel Borenstein 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Excerpts from fv: 15-Dec-94 FV fine print Eric Hughes(a)remailer.net (403) > * YOU shall retain computer data of all sales for at least > three years from the date of the transaction. In the event > you are not able to store such information, you may contact > infohaus-info(a)fv.com to make storage arrangements. > Interpretation is left to the reader. FYI, this is a direct carryover from the standard terms & conditions of a Visa/MasterCard merchant account. Basically, this is a legal necessity to process inquiries from the cardholder's issuing bank, etc. You'll note that we don't say you have to provide the information to us, merely that you have to keep it -- that way, if there's a court action requiring us to provide the information, we can point out that you are required to have the information. If you haven't kept it, you won't have nearly as much of a problem with us as with the government. In any event, the most we can do is say, "oh, you violated our terms and conditions, you can't be an FV seller any more." What we're doing here, in essence, is allowing ANYONE to function as a Visa/MC merchant, with the addition of the 90 day hold and a few other things. In order to do that, our terms and conditions have to ensure that you comply with the Visa/MC terms and conditions, that's all. -- Nathaniel

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Re: Less Flaming, More Civility
by amanda＠intercon.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

> C'punks, when this list started we were a bunch of idealistic privacy > freaks. Look who's on the list now: the developers of cutting edge Internet > software. The two are not necessarily mutually exclusive :). And from this point of view, I have to say that for all of my complaints about the specifics of various things Netscape has put forth, I cannot fault them for trying to improve the status quo. One thing that everyone has in common here is that we all believe that the issues we discuss are important, and that it's worth trying to solve the problems. This is in part, I think, why tempers flare from time to time--I know this was true in my case. Amanda Walker InterCon Systems Corporation

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Re: PGP 2.7
by NetSurfer 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- On Thu, 15 Dec 1994, DNA wrote: > I keep seeing pgp 2.7 in public key & sig blocks. > > Where do we get it? Viacrypt. It is the commercial version of 2.6.x - -NetSurfer #include <standard.disclaimer> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> == = = |James D. Wilson |V.PGP 2.7: 512/E12FCD 1994/03/17 > " " o " |P. O. Box 15432 | finger for full PGP key > " " / \ " |Honolulu, HI 96830 |====================================> \" "/ G \" |Serendipitous Solutions| Also NetSurfer(a)sersol.com > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> - --- [This message has been signed by an auto-signing service. A valid signature means only that it has been received at the address corresponding to the signature and forwarded.] -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.2 Comment: Gratis auto-signing service iQBFAwUBLvB4nyoZzwIn1bdtAQFBKgF8Cpy4syrgzPe7Q4vQ7elW/7gvcK+3rfwJ byzKrS8TF7rwL1eLiVZfW+qolOyMB2TG =svxJ -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

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voice over SLIP?
by erc＠khijol.xmission.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

This might be somewhat off-topic, but could someone send me a list of ftp'able software for doing voice over SLIP? I'd prefer linux-based software, but DOS-based would work, too... Thanks very much! -- Ed Carp, N7EKG Ed.Carp(a)linux.org, ecarp(a)netcom.com Finger ecarp(a)netcom.com for PGP 2.5 public key an88744(a)anon.penet.fi ** PGP encrypted email preferred! ** "What's the use of distant travel if only to discover - you're homeless in your heart." --Basia, "Yearning"

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Re: FV & PGP (was Re: First Virtual email security)
by NetSurfer 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- On Thu, 15 Dec 1994 nsb(a)nsb.fv.com wrote: > Moreover, if we supported PGP today, we might indirectly lend > credibility to what we perceive as the incorrect belief that > cryptography is NECESSARY for commerce. Because we see cryptography as > helpful, but not necessary, we aren't going to support PGP right away, > but will probably add such support when a large enough portion of our > customer base wants it and can make use of it. Without cryptography how exactly are you going to protect my credit card numbers from sniffer-snoopers and crackers? Either you will send the credit card text in the clear, or it will be encrypted somehow. Or perhaps you will have customers call you over the phone to give you their credit card info? - -NetSurfer #include <standard.disclaimer> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> == = = |James D. Wilson |V.PGP 2.7: 512/E12FCD 1994/03/17 > " " o " |P. O. Box 15432 | finger for full PGP key > " " / \ " |Honolulu, HI 96830 |====================================> \" "/ G \" |Serendipitous Solutions| Also NetSurfer(a)sersol.com > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> - --- [This message has been signed by an auto-signing service. A valid signature means only that it has been received at the address corresponding to the signature and forwarded.] -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.2 Comment: Gratis auto-signing service iQBFAwUBLvB6FCoZzwIn1bdtAQE9PAF/W2kx2n8l+Qz9Z/51MVQqjjPgGPdQRK8p WFPmh42CywQKiUjjg2qhqPrmzzz6V91r =6zTt -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

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Re: MIME (again)
by Michael Conlen 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- On Wed, 14 Dec 1994, L. McCarthy wrote: > I'm using a version of ELM which claims to be MIME-compliant and usually is, > but all I saw in Peter Cassidy's message was a collection of random-looking > extended-ASCII characters. Usually when something arrives in a locally- > unsupported MIME format (like Amanda's GIF a while back), I just get an > "unrecognized format" error message. I didn't see any error messages at all > this time, just a meaningless jumble of characters (different, incidentally, > from the PGP-cipherptext-like characters Tim quoted). Thats what that thing was susposed to be. I got the same things with pine, which I know is susposed to be mime aware. Anyway all this talk about it gave me an idea. A PGP mime extention, where your mail says that you have a PGP encoded message, enter secret pass phrase to contiue. I think this would do a couple of things First get PGP installed on more machines. Sys Admins who install MIME aware applications would almost be required to install PGP beacuse it is a part of MIME. Secone more people would be introduced to PGP. The first time they use a MIME aware application ie. PINE they would be given a message that they do not have a public/private key set up, ect. That time could be used to explain the basics of encryption, public/private key's, and security issuse of using PGP. Third PGP would be more frequently used beacuse it would be right there with there E-Mail, ect. It would not require as much work to set up beacuse the programs could prompt to do things ... Do you want to encrypt this E-Mail with the recipiants public key [Yn] ... Groove on dude Michael Conlen - --- [This message has been signed by an auto-signing service. A valid signature means only that it has been received at the address corresponding to the signature and forwarded.] -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.2 Comment: Gratis auto-signing service iQBFAwUBLvCAzyoZzwIn1bdtAQFCnQGAi19XGrhhoUi7gaAJnG6UUeUjUqvX9yL+ m7qc768s3wEs5sdEqY2mT+JVCT1ES3PB =tQFE -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

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Re: FV & PGP (was Re: First Virtual email security)
by Nathaniel Borenstein 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Excerpts from fv: 15-Dec-94 Re: FV & PGP (was Re: First.. NetSurfer(a)gold.chem.hawa (1237*) > Without cryptography how exactly are you going to protect my credit card > numbers from sniffer-snoopers and crackers? Either you will send the > credit card text in the clear, or it will be encrypted somehow. Or perhaps > you will have customers call you over the phone to give you their credit > card info? We NEVER put your credit card number on the Internet. It is entered ONCE via telephone, and after that it is never needed directly -- people sell you things using your FV account-id, which does not have the same security properties as a credit card number. For more information, please send mail to info(a)fv.com or check out our web pages at http://www.fv.com. - --- [This message has been signed by an auto-signing service. A valid signature means only that it has been received at the address corresponding to the signature and forwarded.] -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.2 Comment: Gratis auto-signing service iQBFAwUBLvCB4CoZzwIn1bdtAQHLuAGAzvgG7jYAqpyHC/HD2NCmN3DkxnCeGT6J 3opxp30Uyo0T/5me04hlzvYe4A6IEDbA =yQOr -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

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Re: McCoy is Right! New Mail Format to Start Now.
by jalicqui＠prairienet.org 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Don't freak with the address... I'm moving. Check the sig if you're paranoid. Tim's wise words were: >The issue is not unwillingness to use new technology, it is, rather, >the issue of "stable attractors." That is, what can I/we reasonably >expect others to also have. Clearly if I issued my paper to the list >in FrameMaker format, or Acrobat format, or even TeX format, only a >few people would be able to read it. Fewer still would actually take >the steps needed to actually display the paper. > >Standards, standards, standards! > >I don't think the minor extensions to e-mail (loosely called "MIME," >though MIME serves other functions besides attaching graphics) are >worth the effort, frankly. Most of the MIME messages (the ones that >tell me about "ISO 558972 fonts" and "Press any key to return") don't >seem to warrant the effort....I think in 90%+ of the cases people >simply send messages as MIME by default, not becuase non-ASCII stuff >is included. Well, ignoring the fact that MIME appears to be infiltrating the Web as well... I would differ with your analysis of MIME's lack of usefulness. It does provide a possible way to integrate PGP into the mail/Web landscape (from a crypto standpoint). Multimedia I'm not so sure about; I think the big draw to MIME will come when Person A drags and drops a spreadsheet into a MIME mailer and sends the message to Person B, who then clicks on an icon to pull up the spreadsheet. But I digress... I'd say, however, that MIME isn't a done deal yet, though it's getting there. Until it's there, it's probably a bad idea. It's been my experience that many mailers are just MIME-compliant enough to cause their users lots of headaches. (As I write this, I notice I'm using Eudora, which MIMEs all its stuff. Oh, well; I hope this message isn't too much trouble for y'all...) >If we make the leap, I say make the leap to the Web: > >cave drawings --> text --> e-mail --> Web > >(By Web I of course mean the whole ball of wax involving HTML/HTTP/etc.) > >This is not a rejection of new technology, just a wise selection of >which technology to bet on. I vote for MIME-encoded cave drawings. :-) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.2 iQCVAwUBLvCxGjER5KvPRd0NAQH+bgP8C5oOpT0Cgzh0m3yXYZmsvpaZqB5FuZUt ZFQAHkKrIhaJ39IBhcJXv9Xmda/Jhp2wluvMDKlyzDxG/lvHJnr+h4cTJEUq6H57 bWPuQO2MBuBViOE77GFKreFzyLeamidlIlva3cIm/m/eYQXcF8l5qsNRB6O5kGe0 wq97dXfrVQ8= =OyM1 -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

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Algebra
by A5713643665＠attpls.net 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Dear Eric and Cypherpunks, So, how is division defined in Fp? Tom

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1984 shirt
by 'Kasey Uthurusamy' 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

> > Hi, > > Do you know where I could order 2 XXL shirts? These are the ones that > say '1984 ....we're behind schedule'... > > Thanks! :) > > Kurgan > -- =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- _O_ "Ah...the KURGAN...he kurgan(a)gnu.ai.mit.edu \/\ /\/=<---- is the strongest of the punisher(a)ccwf.cc.utexas.edu * immortals...." kaseyu(a)acad.stedwards.edu / \ _/ |_ "INVICTUS MANEO" -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

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