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Re: Error Condition Re: Another charge question for you physics genius'es (fwd)
by Jim Choate 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Forwarded message: > From: "William H. Geiger III" <whgiii(a)openpgp.net> > Date: Sat, 21 Nov 1998 17:05:10 -0500 > Subject: Re: Error Condition Re: Another charge question for you physics genius'es (fwd) > In <199811212205.QAA16339(a)einstein.ssz.com>, on 11/21/98 > at 04:05 PM, Jim Choate <ravage(a)einstein.ssz.com> said: > > >I guess Bill's decided to play around with his filtering software.... > > No, listproc has some internal filtering to prevent message loops, subscribe requests, error messages, ect from going out to the main list. Unfortunately these settings can not be adjusted in the list settings but are set at compile time for the software. > > I have a shitload of error messages in my mailbox I have to sort through and figure out wether listproc is going to be too much of a PITA. I may have to get majordomo installed on the system and use that if this becomes too much of a problem (I really don't have time to be continually babysitting the system). > > Ahhh the joy and fun of running a CP node. :) :) Good luck and apologies for my incorrect conclusion. ____________________________________________________________________ Lawyers ask the wrong questions when they don't want the right answers. Scully (X-Files) The Armadillo Group ,::////;::-. James Choate Austin, Tx /:'///// ``::>/|/ ravage(a)ssz.com www.ssz.com .', |||| `/( e\ 512-451-7087 -====~~mm-'`-```-mm --'- --------------------------------------------------------------------

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PGP shells ...
by Jim choate 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Hi all, On the issue of shells for PGP, has anyone released a REXX based shell? I have REXX working on my Dos, Linux, and Amiga boxes and the cross-compatibility would be very nifty... Any info on existing REXX shells or front-ends would be appreciated.

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Re: Error Condition Re: Another charge question for you physics genius'es (fwd)
by William H. Geiger III 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

In <199811212307.RAA16588(a)einstein.ssz.com>, on 11/21/98 at 06:03 PM, Jim Choate <ravage(a)einstein.ssz.com> said: >Forwarded message: >> From: "William H. Geiger III" <whgiii(a)openpgp.net> >> Date: Sat, 21 Nov 1998 17:05:10 -0500 >> Subject: Re: Error Condition Re: Another charge question for you physics genius'es (fwd) >> In <199811212205.QAA16339(a)einstein.ssz.com>, on 11/21/98 >> at 04:05 PM, Jim Choate <ravage(a)einstein.ssz.com> said: >> >> >I guess Bill's decided to play around with his filtering software.... >> >> No, listproc has some internal filtering to prevent message loops, subscribe requests, error messages, ect from going out to the main list. Unfortunately these settings can not be adjusted in the list settings but are set at compile time for the software. >> >> I have a shitload of error messages in my mailbox I have to sort through and figure out wether listproc is going to be too much of a PITA. I may have to get majordomo installed on the system and use that if this becomes too much of a problem (I really don't have time to be continually babysitting the system). >> >> Ahhh the joy and fun of running a CP node. :) >:) >Good luck and apologies for my incorrect conclusion. FWIW when a message is rejected both the sender and myself should get CC'd a copy of the message and the reason for the reject so no messages should be "lost". Some of the filtering is nice, like those elmz blank subject error messages are filtered out by the program. Unfortunatly a "good" message gets filtered and I need to manually forward it to the list. Since I don't have any subscribers yet this has not been a problem. :) -- --------------------------------------------------------------- William H. Geiger III http://www.openpgp.net Geiger Consulting Cooking With Warp 4.0 Author of E-Secure - PGP Front End for MR/2 Ice PGP & MR/2 the only way for secure e-mail. OS/2 PGP 5.0 at: http://www.openpgp.net/pgp.html ---------------------------------------------------------------

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Oh, a warning about playing with glass & charge....
by Jim Choate 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

If you do decide to play with charges stored on glass plates wear eye protection because every once in a while the mechanical stress is more than the glass can take and it will shatter. One way you can do this is to go to your local video arcade and purchase one of the glass sheets they use to cover their pinball machines. Then carry that glass plate by the edge in your hand as you scuff your feet across a nylon pile carpet (again wear safety glasses). The result about 1 out of 100 times, or if you've got lots of patience and can afford hours to scuff feet on carpet, is that the glass plate will shatter with a report about equivalent to a .22. Anyone watching should also wear eye protection as the shards can go 20ft. or moe. It's best if you do this on a cold dry day. ____________________________________________________________________ Lawyers ask the wrong questions when they don't want the right answers. Scully (X-Files) The Armadillo Group ,::////;::-. James Choate Austin, Tx /:'///// ``::>/|/ ravage(a)ssz.com www.ssz.com .', |||| `/( e\ 512-451-7087 -====~~mm-'`-```-mm --'- --------------------------------------------------------------------

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Re: Oh, a warning about playing with glass & charge.... (fwd)
by Jim Choate 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Forwarded message: > Date: Sun, 22 Nov 1998 10:05:41 -0800 > From: Tim May <tcmay(a)got.net> > Subject: Re: Oh, a warning about playing with glass & charge.... > And when you do your "...and then take away one of the copper plates" > experiment, you'll find that force is needed. Force times distance is > energy. The energy to pull one of the plates away equals the 0.5CV^2 energy > no longer stored in the capacitor. This is true ONLY if the dielectric doesn't touch either plate and is simply used to increase the storage capability (via Gauss' Law) of the capacitor over an air gap type of the same physical structure. The reason you have this force is the induced charge on the surface of the dielectric and the electrostatic attraction this causes with the charge on the plate. If the plate ACTUALY TOUCHES there is NO INDUCED CHARGE via Gauss's Law, it's a REAL charge stored on the surface of the insulating dielectric and the plate remains NEUTRALY charged. Why is there no induced charged? Because as you place charge on the conducting plate it induces a charge via Gauss' Law on the dielctric. Since the metal has outer orbital electrons available (which an insulator doesn't) the charge in the plate gets transported to the surface of the insulator and bonds there (remember unlike charges attract) with the induced charge. Why does the charge storage increase because of the dielectric? The electrical moment of the atoms is greater than that of the air. This is another reason the charge once deposited on the dielectric surface will stay there when the plate is removed. If you go back and look at the examples in your physics books that your basing your position on you'll find that in EVERY case there is an air gap between the plates and the dielectric. Remove the air gap and the behaviour of the charge and hence it's explanation changes accordingly. > The energy stored is not stored either on the plate or on the insulator. It > is in the electric field. Q: Where does the electric field come from Tim? A: The charges (ie electrons and protons) that are sitting on the surface of the dielectric (where the di- comes from). The electric field strength is a measure of the wavelength of the photons those two contrary sets of particles are bouncing back and forth between themselves. Q: Explain why the charge sitting on the surface of that dielectric will stay on the metal plate when the metal plate is removed. The metal plate is a conductor so as it is removed it effectively carries the charge of the part of the dielectric that it still retains contact with. Why would that e- choose to move TOWARD a ne- charge when it's sitting there with an opposite charge already in a minimum energy configuration? A: It won't. To do so violates the minimal energy requirements of the system as well as the standard behaviour of charges (ie like repel, opposite attract). Another experiment.... Try removing the metal foil when there is a charge and when there isn't. You won't find an appreciable difference. As to the energy required to remove the foil, yes force times distance is energy and it's the energy requisite to overcome the inertia of the metal foil. There is also a small additional force caused by Gauss' Law because the the distance between the e- (for example) stored on the dielectric and the metal plate will form a 'virtual' charge on the surface of the plate. However, since the plate itself is neutral (by definition) there will be a contrary charge on the opposite side. Hence, you won't loose a single coulomb of charge to the metal plate. You can check this by using either an electronic charge meter (1-800-OMEGA if you're interested) or you can use a gold leaf electrometer. If the charge varies as Tim claims then the angle between the leaves should change (ie get smaller). It won't. As to the force, the maximal force will occur when the plate is removed as a single piece perpendicular to the surface of the dielectric. If you roll or peel it off it will for all intents and purposes come free effortlessy because you won't have to fight the electrostatic force. -------------------------------------- < Cu + ------------------------------------------ -------------------------------------- < Cu - ------------------------------------------ -------------------------------------- < Cu + ------------------------------------------ -------------------------------------- < Cu - NOTE: there is NO air gap between the glass and the Cu sheeting. I use normal old cinter blocks to press them together as tightly as I can. Another experinment: Build the stack as shown above and remove each later one at at time with and without charge. Note the behaviour of the metal plate. It will tend to go with the glass plate that is being removed. Because of induced charges via Gauss' Law the foil will tend to go with the glass plate as it's removed. --------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------- Cu + --------------------------------------------- As the top plate is removed the air gap will force a virtual charge to build up on the surface of the foil. As a consequence an opposite and equal charge will build up on the other side of the foil and it will be + and in opposition to the + charge already sitting on the bottem glass plate. The induced charge on the top of the Cu will be - and will be attracted to the + charge on the bottem of the top plate. This of course assumes you're using very thin foil. If it's very thick at all you won't see this because of gravity. I tend to use very heavy foil so that I don't get shocks from these various induced fields when I'm handling the plates. Be sure to use heavy rubber gloves. Rubbermaid kitchen gloves intended for industrial washing are sufficient unless you're going to use a high voltage and charge. Anybody who wants to understand the theory (despite Tim's claims to the contrary) is welcome to check out: Physics Jay Orear ISBN 0-02-389460-1 Chpt. 16, Electrostatics pp. 308 - 338 in particular, pp. 327, 16-6 Dielectrics ____________________________________________________________________ Technology cannot make us other than what we are. James P. Hogan The Armadillo Group ,::////;::-. James Choate Austin, Tx /:'///// ``::>/|/ ravage(a)ssz.com www.ssz.com .', |||| `/( e\ 512-451-7087 -====~~mm-'`-```-mm --'- --------------------------------------------------------------------

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Re: Hey, what does he know?
by Anonymous 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 09:23 AM 11/22/98 -0800, landon dyer wrote: >> long about 2020 or so it'll be a federal offense to own an EPROM >burner, a processor with re-flashed microcode, an unlicensed logic >analyzer, or a copy of linux... :-) A CPLD, a compiler, a computer-controlled radio, a soldering iron... :-(

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Wired: AOL selling E-Stamps
by Bill Stewart 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

http://www.wired.com/news/news/business/story/16374.html AOL's E-Stamp of Approval Wired News Report 12:20 p.m. 19.Nov.98.PST Is it time for stamp collectors to go online? America Online (AOL) and E-Stamp, an online postage firm, said on Thursday they will make Internet postage service available to customers of AOL, CompuServe, AOL.COM, and AOL's Digital City. AOL and E-Stamp's service will allow customers to securely purchase postage online and print "digital stamps" on envelopes, labels, or documents using their personal computer and a standard printer. Customers must first install E-Stamp software. They can then buy postage by credit card, electronic fund transfer, or check. Thanks! Bill Bill Stewart, bill.stewart(a)pobox.com PGP Fingerprint D454 E202 CBC8 40BF 3C85 B884 0ABE 4639

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Registration confirmation - Yahoo! Chat
by chat-register＠yahoo-inc.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Welcome to Yahoo! Please save this message for future reference. This confirmation message is sent to all users when they create a new account with Yahoo. During registration we require users to enter their email address. This confirmation notice is then sent to that address. If you DID NOT request this account, we encourage you to REMOVE it by doing the following: If your email software supports it, you can simply click on the link below. Since this web address (URL) is quite long you may find it necessary to copy the entire URL and paste it into your Web browser. http://edit.my.yahoo.com/config/remove_user?k=IXtKZI53f2J1aHdyeXw4jiF5Sjd3M… If you are prompted for the deletion key when using the URL above, please use the following deletion key: IXtKZI53f2J1aHdyeXw4jiF5Sjd3MnpOfDc1T2BlTnkhdUpONjZOMjU1MDQhc0pkf2Zz Or, if you do not have internet access, please reply to this email (and make sure to copy this entire email in your reply) with REMOVE as the subject line. ___________ Your Yahoo ID is: cypher_punk You can return to Yahoo! Chat by going to http://chat.yahoo.com/ Your Yahoo! ID may be used to access any of the Yahoo! services that request a Yahoo! ID, such as: My Yahoo - http://my.yahoo.com Yahoo Calendar - http://calendar.yahoo.com Yahoo Chat - http://chat.yahoo.com Yahoo Classifieds - http://classifieds.yahoo.com Yahoo Clubs - http://clubs.yahoo.com Yahoo Finance - http://quote.yahoo.com Yahoo Games - http://play.yahoo.com Yahoo Mail - http://mail.yahoo.com Yahoo Message Boards - http://messages.yahoo.com Yahoo Pager - http://pager.yahoo.com Yahoo Travel - http://travel.yahoo.com Your e-mail is: cypherpunks(a)toad.com We will use this address is case you ever forget your Yahoo ID or password. We'll need an address to automatically send a response to you. To change this address, go to http://my.yahoo.com and click on the Account Information link at the top of the page. The edit page will let you update your E-Mail address, and other personal information and preferences. ________ Yahoo! Accounts - Top Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ) Q. How much is all this going to cost me? A. Absolutely nothing. All Yahoo! information is paid for through advertising. Q. What if I forget my Yahoo! ID or password A. Just click on the Help is Here link at the bottom of the login page. We'll ask you some basic questions to confirm your identity, then send you the information to the email address listed in your account. Q. How do I change my password or Yahoo! ID? If you would like to change your Yahoo Password in My Yahoo!, just click Acct Info at the top of the page. Unfortunately, we do not have the ability to change your Yahoo! ID. You will have to create a new account if you wish to have a new Yahoo! ID. Please note that if you do re-register, you will need to re-set all of your preferences for your My Yahoo! and other Yahoo! personalized services. Q. What is an Alias? A. Under your Yahoo! ID, you may add additional names for use in our various services, such as Chat and Classifieds. Q. How is the Yahoo! ID stored? A. Your Yahoo! ID is stored as a cookie on your computer. This way, you only need to login once. If you upgrade your computer software, change computers, delete your internet files, or click Sign Out at any time, it will clear the cookie from the computer's hard drive. Just return to the login page and enter your Yahoo! ID and Yahoo Password in the spaces provided and click Sign In to restore the information. You do not need to register again. Q. I use a public terminal, how do I sign out? A. If you are using a public computer, you should always sign out to clear your Yahoo! ID and cookie from the computer's hard drive. Just click the Sign Out button or link near the top of the main page. Thank you for using Yahoo! [208.198.164.2]

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New Book: "Brothers Beware: Games Black Women Play"
by BSB009＠webmail.bellsouth.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

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Buffalo Sabres Chat Registration
by Sabres Webmaster 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Following is your Chat information (Please save this info!) ----------------------------------- username: cpunk password: 4199 Remember, the username and password are both CASE SENSITIVE!

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