- cypherpunks-legacy - lists.cpunks.org

GRAVY on the attack
by GRAVY 13 Sep '01

13 Sep '01

Fire is what brought the towers down. An engineer friend explained that after a fire burns for awhile, the steel holding up the structure softens. When it fails, the part above falls with impact on the part below, which causes progressive collapse of the building, or pancaking, as one floor crunches onto the next onto the next. Once one floor goes there is no stopping it. The World Trade Center was likely designed to last 1-2 hours in a major fire, long enough for most people to evacuate. The tower that fell first lasted 57 minutes, in a fire driven by 100,000 pounds of jet fuel. No one anticipated that part when the building was designed, and there is no way to build a building to withstand such an event. The TV newscasters who keep asking what could have been done to make the buildings more resistant should go home. An astonishing thing is the way the towers collapsed straight down. As horrifying as that was, imagine how much more damage and loss of life there would have been would have been if they had tipped over like falling trees, landing on surrounding buildings for a quarter mile. A building demolition expert interviewed on NPR said that what made the disciplined collapse possible was the external skeleton, the girders that lined the edges of the towers. These girders contained the collapse. The expert considered this an extraordinary achievement by the architect. The World Trade Center was designed by the late Minoru Yamasaki, at the firm of Skilling, Ward, Magnusson and Barkshire, in Seattle. You have to think it's good he didn't live to see this. The rest of his firm is said to be shock, as are the employees of Boeing, whose engineers are acutely aware of the destructive energy contained in a 767 going three hundred miles an hour and full of fuel. A few random notes: This attack seems different from Pearl Harbor in the same way that the Vietnam War seemed different to fight than previous wars, which is that the enemy did not stand up and "fight like a man," but rather was hidden, hard to find, and devious, as well as surprising. The British felt the same way about the American "irregulars" in the revolutionary war. They felt we weren't fighting fairly or properly. In all three cases, one side deliberately ignored the "code of war" of the time to powerful effect. In this way the definition of war changes. It just changed again, whether we like it or not. Whatever we do to retaliate risks an escalation of terrorist-style attacks on American citizens. We will not get to watch our distant military on newsreels and TV like the old days. One of the things that makes this scary is that we have found a bomb, and it is everywhere. Every plane is a terrific bomb for a pilot who is willing to die. This attack has been called cowardly. That's silly. It was no more cowardly than flying a stealth fighter loaded with smart bombs into Iraq, when by the same definition the uncowardly thing would have been to ride in on a camel with a broadsword. The plane that crashed in Pennsylvania was headed for Washington but the plan was foiled by the passengers who had heard what the planes did in New York. Bravo. Instead of banning knives, perhaps we should issue one to every passenger on all commercial flights. This attack was a huge failure of American military intelligence. This attack points up the value of an unworkable and insanely expensive missile defense system. For those of you who are sleepy, that value would be zero. Bush said that we were attacked because we believe in freedom. This is not why we were attacked. There is much about the execution of our foreign policy that rarely makes it into US news reports. If you have lived abroad for more than a few months, you have seen this. If not, it is educational to talk to someone who has. At the same time, nearly all Arabs and other Muslims abhor terrorism. The Arab-Americans I know are as dismayed and horrified as we are. Our airport security has always been a joke. My dad's crutches were consistently handed around the inspection points by the nice people working there. All I could think was how much explosive or how many knives and zip guns I could have packed into each crutch, while they were busy making business travelers go through their briefcases. It is hard to fight people who believe they will achieve martyrdom and go to heaven following a suicide attack for their cause. It is an impossible stretch for us to understand how our enemy thinks when it is that different from how we think. It is difficult to protect yourself from someone who does not value his life on this earth. Of course fight them we shall. No one gets to do what they did. We need to start by repealing some laws, like the one that says we can't use intelligence agents to infiltrate groups with human rights violations (which wizard thought up that one?), and the one that says we can't assassinate heads of state. We must not try to bring anyone to trial. We must be as surgical as possible, to minimize the loss of innocent life that would would be both a new tragedy and a fuel for escalation. I support Bush's plan to treat harboring states and helpers as indistinguishable from the terrorists themselves. Above all, we must not rush. There is no advantage or need to hurry. We must take our time, learn everything we need to learn, make no mistake. And then it will be time to execute. I regret that that will not be the end of it. jb -- It ain't so much the things you don't know that get you in trouble. It's the things you know that just ain't so. -- Artimus Ward, 1834-1867 Put another way: You can always spot a well informed man - his views are the same as yours. -- Ilka Chase -*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*-- The GRAVY letter, edited by James Bradley. -*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*-- To SUBSCRIBE to the GRAVY Letter, or to UNSUBSCRIBE, send mailto:jbradley@earthlink.net with SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE in the SUBJECT LINE. You will be subscribed at the address you are writing from. -*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*-- DISCLAIMER: GRAVY does not promise to be or not be any particular way. GRAVY postings are not verified. GRAVY is intended only as entertainment. You should never use GRAVY as basis for any judgement or decision without thoroughly investigating the relevant facts yourself. Opinions expressed in GRAVY may not even be those of the author, much less GRAVY management. -*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*-- GRAVY SUBSCRIPTIONS are free. One day GRAVY may go commercial, and subscriptions may change from free to cheap. -*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*-- CONTRIBUTIONS are welcome. Send to jbradley(a)earthlink.net. If we use your contribution we will credit you unless you request otherwise. If we don't use it, don't be discouraged, keep 'em coming. PLEASE DO NOT SEND COPYRIGHTED MATERIAL UNNATTRIBUTED. -*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*-- FORWARDING by any non-automatic electronic means is authorized and encouraged with this footer intact. Other rights are reserved, to the extent that we own them. If someone is forwarding GRAVY to you and you like it, why not subscribe? -*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*-- This footer is proof that text is deliverable to everyone right now. ************************************************************************** Subscribe to Freematt's Alerts: Pro-Individual Rights Issues Send a blank message to: freematt(a)coil.com with the words subscribe FA on the subject line. List is private and moderated (7-30 messages per week) Matthew Gaylor, (614) 313-5722 ICQ: 106212065 Archived at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/fa/ **************************************************************************

1 0

GRAVY on the attack
by GRAVY 13 Sep '01

13 Sep '01

Fire is what brought the towers down. An engineer friend explained that after a fire burns for awhile, the steel holding up the structure softens. When it fails, the part above falls with impact on the part below, which causes progressive collapse of the building, or pancaking, as one floor crunches onto the next onto the next. Once one floor goes there is no stopping it. The World Trade Center was likely designed to last 1-2 hours in a major fire, long enough for most people to evacuate. The tower that fell first lasted 57 minutes, in a fire driven by 100,000 pounds of jet fuel. No one anticipated that part when the building was designed, and there is no way to build a building to withstand such an event. The TV newscasters who keep asking what could have been done to make the buildings more resistant should go home. An astonishing thing is the way the towers collapsed straight down. As horrifying as that was, imagine how much more damage and loss of life there would have been would have been if they had tipped over like falling trees, landing on surrounding buildings for a quarter mile. A building demolition expert interviewed on NPR said that what made the disciplined collapse possible was the external skeleton, the girders that lined the edges of the towers. These girders contained the collapse. The expert considered this an extraordinary achievement by the architect. The World Trade Center was designed by the late Minoru Yamasaki, at the firm of Skilling, Ward, Magnusson and Barkshire, in Seattle. You have to think it's good he didn't live to see this. The rest of his firm is said to be shock, as are the employees of Boeing, whose engineers are acutely aware of the destructive energy contained in a 767 going three hundred miles an hour and full of fuel. A few random notes: This attack seems different from Pearl Harbor in the same way that the Vietnam War seemed different to fight than previous wars, which is that the enemy did not stand up and "fight like a man," but rather was hidden, hard to find, and devious, as well as surprising. The British felt the same way about the American "irregulars" in the revolutionary war. They felt we weren't fighting fairly or properly. In all three cases, one side deliberately ignored the "code of war" of the time to powerful effect. In this way the definition of war changes. It just changed again, whether we like it or not. Whatever we do to retaliate risks an escalation of terrorist-style attacks on American citizens. We will not get to watch our distant military on newsreels and TV like the old days. One of the things that makes this scary is that we have found a bomb, and it is everywhere. Every plane is a terrific bomb for a pilot who is willing to die. This attack has been called cowardly. That's silly. It was no more cowardly than flying a stealth fighter loaded with smart bombs into Iraq, when by the same definition the uncowardly thing would have been to ride in on a camel with a broadsword. The plane that crashed in Pennsylvania was headed for Washington but the plan was foiled by the passengers who had heard what the planes did in New York. Bravo. Instead of banning knives, perhaps we should issue one to every passenger on all commercial flights. This attack was a huge failure of American military intelligence. This attack points up the value of an unworkable and insanely expensive missile defense system. For those of you who are sleepy, that value would be zero. Bush said that we were attacked because we believe in freedom. This is not why we were attacked. There is much about the execution of our foreign policy that rarely makes it into US news reports. If you have lived abroad for more than a few months, you have seen this. If not, it is educational to talk to someone who has. At the same time, nearly all Arabs and other Muslims abhor terrorism. The Arab-Americans I know are as dismayed and horrified as we are. Our airport security has always been a joke. My dad's crutches were consistently handed around the inspection points by the nice people working there. All I could think was how much explosive or how many knives and zip guns I could have packed into each crutch, while they were busy making business travelers go through their briefcases. It is hard to fight people who believe they will achieve martyrdom and go to heaven following a suicide attack for their cause. It is an impossible stretch for us to understand how our enemy thinks when it is that different from how we think. It is difficult to protect yourself from someone who does not value his life on this earth. Of course fight them we shall. No one gets to do what they did. We need to start by repealing some laws, like the one that says we can't use intelligence agents to infiltrate groups with human rights violations (which wizard thought up that one?), and the one that says we can't assassinate heads of state. We must not try to bring anyone to trial. We must be as surgical as possible, to minimize the loss of innocent life that would would be both a new tragedy and a fuel for escalation. I support Bush's plan to treat harboring states and helpers as indistinguishable from the terrorists themselves. Above all, we must not rush. There is no advantage or need to hurry. We must take our time, learn everything we need to learn, make no mistake. And then it will be time to execute. I regret that that will not be the end of it. jb -- It ain't so much the things you don't know that get you in trouble. It's the things you know that just ain't so. -- Artimus Ward, 1834-1867 Put another way: You can always spot a well informed man - his views are the same as yours. -- Ilka Chase -*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*-- The GRAVY letter, edited by James Bradley. -*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*-- To SUBSCRIBE to the GRAVY Letter, or to UNSUBSCRIBE, send mailto:jbradley@earthlink.net with SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE in the SUBJECT LINE. You will be subscribed at the address you are writing from. -*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*-- DISCLAIMER: GRAVY does not promise to be or not be any particular way. GRAVY postings are not verified. GRAVY is intended only as entertainment. You should never use GRAVY as basis for any judgement or decision without thoroughly investigating the relevant facts yourself. Opinions expressed in GRAVY may not even be those of the author, much less GRAVY management. -*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*-- GRAVY SUBSCRIPTIONS are free. One day GRAVY may go commercial, and subscriptions may change from free to cheap. -*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*-- CONTRIBUTIONS are welcome. Send to jbradley(a)earthlink.net. If we use your contribution we will credit you unless you request otherwise. If we don't use it, don't be discouraged, keep 'em coming. PLEASE DO NOT SEND COPYRIGHTED MATERIAL UNNATTRIBUTED. -*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*-- FORWARDING by any non-automatic electronic means is authorized and encouraged with this footer intact. Other rights are reserved, to the extent that we own them. If someone is forwarding GRAVY to you and you like it, why not subscribe? -*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*-- This footer is proof that text is deliverable to everyone right now. ************************************************************************** Subscribe to Freematt's Alerts: Pro-Individual Rights Issues Send a blank message to: freematt(a)coil.com with the words subscribe FA on the subject line. List is private and moderated (7-30 messages per week) Matthew Gaylor, (614) 313-5722 ICQ: 106212065 Archived at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/fa/ **************************************************************************

1 0

Priceless (tm)
by Dynamite Bob 13 Sep '01

13 Sep '01

Two dozen boxcutters $20 18 airplane tickets, one way $3500 Jet airplane schooling for four $40,000 Imploding the Bill of Rights, turning US into Israel: Priceless There are some things money can't buy, for everything else there's MasterCard (tm)

1 0

where do we go from here (and where should we have gone)
by attila! 13 Sep '01

13 Sep '01

The time for a massive one-shot 'retaliation' has passed --it should have been done within the hour. I had hoped when Bush went to Orfit AFB (US missile command, sometimes referred to as 'nuke city') we might see a proper response --we did not. As members of the Church we are required to forgive our "trespassers"; I have no problem with forgiving them as they are obviously misguided, but that does not change the need and responsibility to protect our families and therefore punish not only the direct participants but also their leaders and any nations who harbor them. In so much as the terrorists are outside the reasonable laws of man, extraordinary measures are warranted. I consider 'war, in and of itself, a war crime', but that does not diminish the occasional requirement to maintain the rule of law, but war should only be entertained if you are determined to strike a decisive (and hopefully permanent) victory. To the victors go the privilege to write history; to the losers go the war crime trials. Terrorists are a special case. Bin Laden is following the playbook of the old Chinese master, Sun Tzu: kill one man and you terrify 10,000. Terrorists can only be eliminated by turning the people against them with pain and suffering --eg: 18 million Iraqis all do not wish to be martyrs when the chips are down. If we had taken out Iraq and Afghanistan, we should have smiled and said: "Next?" Geostrategy Direct detailed the Israeli assessment of Bin Laden's and Hussein's dirty hands. Today's Federalist article was the strongest (and most rational) I have seen --their bottom line is part of what I demanded yesterday: Afghanistan becomes molten silicon. What do we do now? Probably slide down the slope of the talking heads as the Left criticizes Bush's lack of decisive leadership (and U.S. intelligence failure) and permits the UN to convene to condemn the terrorism, but even more strongly condemn U.S. foreign policy for creating the world problems which brought forth the terrorist response --in other words, the U.S. must pay off the radical Islamists. Jefferson made the correct statement in history vis a vis the Barbary pirates: '...not one penny in tribute' --even the Brits had been paying tribute. A task force, led by the USS Constitution (Old Ironsides) and the Marine Corps, leveled Tripoli. They did not ask for their surrender: they eliminated them. Summary justice. George blew his window of opportunity --he had a chance to go down in history as a decisive leader in crisis, rather than just a president who presided over the worst single casualty ever suffered by America, here or abroad; the diminution of our military status; the abrogation of our leadership in the free world; and the potential destruction of our economic base if the financial markets collapse when the stock markets reopen on Monday. But even more pernicious, few Americans will trust the government to protect them or represent them in the world. Sorry, George, I thought you were more of a man.

4 3

The WTC was designed by the late Minoru Yamasaki
by Matthew Gaylor 13 Sep '01

13 Sep '01

1 0

An assault on liberty?
by Peter Wayner 13 Sep '01

13 Sep '01

I realize that many will use this event as an excuse for many political agendas, but I think it's important that we think through exactly what happened. It doesn't seem like it was an assault on liberty or a misuse of the liberties we have. Most people can't fly planes. The learning process is long and the licensing requirements are many. Flying a 757 is even more restricted by both cost and licensing requirements. It's not a liberty like walking around the streets or speaking one's mind. It doesn't seem to me that this attack had anything to do with liberty. It's not like someone abused the right to bear arms by shooting someone, it's not like someone abused the right to speak freely by libeling someone, it's not like someone abused the right to drink alcohol by plowing into a school bus after drinking too much. These guys were unauthorized to have knives, they were unauthorized to have bombs, they were unauthorized to fly 757s, they were probably unauthorized to be in the country. Yet they did all of these despite the controls. The hard lesson is that controls don't always work. Licensing requirements, security checkpoints, and armed guards fail. It's sad, but there's no physical law like gravity that we can depend upon to keep ourselves safe. If you ask me, the biggest danger is that we'll add more ineffective security measures in the hopes of doing something. And the real problem is the controls may never be enough to keep us safe. -Peter

1 0

Re: Cypherpunks and terrorism
by Nomen Nescio 13 Sep '01

13 Sep '01

Declan McCullagh writes: > On Wed, Sep 12, 2001 at 06:00:46PM +0200, Nomen Nescio wrote: > > Some terrorists have exactly this as their goal. They are hoping > > to trigger a counter-reaction, an over-reaction, by the authorities. > > They want to see a crackdown on liberties, a police state. This will > > weaken the enemy and demoralize him. It will increase hostility and > > make the population less willing to support the government. > > This is nonsense. I suspect the bin Laden want the U.S. to stop > handing Israel billions of dollars a year in aid and weapons. Not > bombing pharmecutical plants and lifting an embargo that kills > hundreds of thousands (allegedly) of Iraqi women and children might be > a nice move too. It's always amazing to see how stupid the responses are to various messages. There seems to be no limit to the ignorance of the cypherpunks. It is well known that this is a motivation for many terrorists. If you will not believe it from an anonymous message, perhaps you will be convinced by quotes from the two co-founders of the cypherpunks, both of whom have said exactly the same thing in messages posted today: Tim May wrote in 1996 and reposted today: : Revolutionary theory says of course that this increased clampdown is a : desired effect of terrorist bombings and attacks. Fear and doubt. : Revolutionary ends rarely happen by slow, incremental movement. Hundreds of : examples, from the original "bomb-throwing anarchists" to the modern mix of : terrorist bands. The Red Brigade in Italy sought a fascist crackdown, and : the "strategy of tension" is common. (And even revolutionists of crypto : anarchist persuasion often think laws like the CDA are good in the long : run, by undermining respect for authority and triggering more extreme : reactions....) Note his comment about how the Communications Decency Act is actually considered good by revolutionaries of the crypto anarchist persuasion. Know any of those? Gee, the anonymous message made exactly the same point earlier, that someone like Tim May would welcome crackdowns on freedom. Eric Hughes wrote today (in a beautiful message that deserves to be widely distributed): : The goal of these terrorists is to : restrict freedoms in America, to steal its essence and to weaken it. I : shall pray we do not cooperate with this their goal in a hot-headed rush to : immediate results. The same point, made each time: that the terrorists seek to weaken America by causing what Tim May calls an "increased clampdown", what Eric Hughes describes as "to restrict freedoms in America", and what the anonymous poster characterized as "a crackdown on liberties". The difference is that Tim May welcomes the change; Eric Hughes pleads against it; and the anonymous poster merely calls upon cypherpunks to recognize that they have a choice between these contrasting views. There are two contrasting forces at the heart of the cypherpunk philosophy, well exemplified by the two co-founders, and their messages posted today show the difference well. The dark anger of May versus the bright hope of Hughes. Make your choice.

3 2

IP: [ I take it back djf ] U.S. Intelligence Gathering Reviewed(fwd)
by Eugene Leitl 13 Sep '01

13 Sep '01

-- Eugen* Leitl <a href="http://www.lrz.de/~ui22204/">leitl</a> ______________________________________________________________ ICBMTO : N48 10'07'' E011 33'53'' http://www.lrz.de/~ui22204 57F9CFD3: ED90 0433 EB74 E4A9 537F CFF5 86E7 629B 57F9 CFD3 ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2001 08:25:22 -0400 From: David Farber <dave(a)farber.net> Reply-To: farber(a)cis.upenn.edu To: ip-sub-1(a)majordomo.pobox.com Subject: IP: [ I take it back djf ] U.S. Intelligence Gathering Reviewed >U.S. Intelligence Gathering Reviewed > >By THE ASSOCIATED PRESS > > > >Filed at 7:11 a.m. ET > >NEW YORK (AP) -- A current emphasis on technology over human >intelligence-gathering, a funding shortage and an information >overload may help explain U.S. intelligence agencies' failure to >forestall the worst terror attack on American soil. > >``Our raw intelligence has gotten weaker, partly because we're not >hiring, we're not paying and we're not analyzing what we're >collecting,'' said Anthony Cordesman, an anti-terrorism expert with >the Washington-based Center for Strategic and International >Studies. > >His comments echoed those of former Secretary of State James A. >Baker III, who told CNN that ``it would be well ... to consider >beefing up some of our intelligence capabilities, particularly in >the areas of human intelligence.'' > >That's easier said than done, said Gideon Rose, managing editor of >Foreign Affairs magazine. > >``It's incredibly difficult to find the right people who can >infiltrate these groups,'' Rose said. ``As far as making other >changes, it means going up against Washington's bureaucratic >inertia.'' > >During the Cold War, the United States began pouring billions into >satellite imagery, communications interception and reconnaissance >equipment. The tools were also useful in monitoring the moves of >organizations such as the PLO and the IRA -- which had traditional, >low-tech structures that were relatively easy to follow. > >But the extraordinary costs meant cutbacks in personnel at the CIA >and the National Security Agency, the nation's international >eavesdropping arm. > >As the Cold War came to a close, the number of threatening groups >increased tenfold just as the digital revolution hit, making global >communications suddenly very cheap and secure. Meanwhile, the >numbers of people working in U.S. intelligence remained constant. > >These days, terrorists can download sophisticated encryption >software on the Internet for free, making it increasingly difficult >to tap into their communications. > >One recent report said Osama bin Laden, a suspect in Tuesday's >attacks, has used complex digital masking technology called >steganography to send photos over the Internet bearing hidden >messages. > >The head of NSA, Gen. Mike Hayden, acknowledged in an interview >with CBS' ``60 Minutes II'' earlier this year that his agency is >``behind the curve in keeping up with the global telecommunications >revolution,'' adding that bin Laden ``has better technology'' than >the agency. > >Former national security adviser Sandy Berger said Wednesday that >the terrorists responsible for Tuesday's carnage displayed ``a >level of sophistication that is beyond what any intelligence outfit >thought was possible.'' Yet, many believe the perpetrators used >low-tech methods to elude Western intelligence. > >Wayne Madsen, a former NSA intelligence officer, said he believes >the terrorists shunned e-mail and mobile phones, using couriers and >safe houses instead. He said it was likely the terrorists in each >of Tuesday's four hijacked planes didn't know the others existed. > >Terrorist ``cells are kept small and very independent so >intelligence agencies can't establish any sort of network,'' Madsen >said. > >Others say the big problem is not the technological shortcomings >but the inability to get inside tightly-knit organizations such as >bin Laden's. > >``It's not easy to knock on bin Laden's cave and say we'd like to >join,'' said Frank Cilluffo, a senior analyst at the Center for >Strategic and International Studies. ``These are hard targets for >Americans to infiltrate and we need to recruit the kind of people >who have the language and the cultural understanding to gain access >to these organizations.'' > >Eugene Carroll, a Navy admiral and a defense expert, agreed. >``These people can only be countered by superb intelligence. The >U.S. doesn't have it,'' he said. > >Experts say intelligence-gathering, to be effective, must involve >close coordination between eavesdropping and spying. In practical >terms, this means cooperation between the NSA and CIA. > >Madsen said there is reason to believe the NSA received some good >intelligence showing bin Laden's involvement in Tuesday's attacks >but that it wasn't recognized as such. > >``There's an information overload out there and not surprisingly it >becomes very hard to process, prioritize it and share it,'' said >Ian Lesser at the Rand Corporation think tank. > >Others said that some of the best intelligence people had been lost >to the dot.com boom while promising junior personnel were pushed >out by inflexible veterans. > >``The intelligence community needs to do a lot more to retain the >best and the brightest, who are lured away to companies that can >offer the kinds of incentives and salary that government jobs just >don't have right now,'' Cilluffo said. > >^------ > >AP writers Steve Gutkin and Jim Krane contributed to this >report. > >http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/national/AP-Attacks-Intelligence.html?ex=10… For archives see: http://www.interesting-people.org/

1 0

Let's launch an 'all-armed, all-smoking' airline
by Matthew Gaylor 13 Sep '01

13 Sep '01

1 0

New FAA measures likely to fail as well
by Steve Schear 13 Sep '01

13 Sep '01

[My wife worked for one of the major airlines for several years. The following is from conversations we had regarding airport security.] Knives The knife ban won't work against anyone with even a smidgen of metal detector knowledge. Anyone can purchase a razor sharp ceramic knife like this one http://www.google.com/search?q=cache:Rd6ExOvaDz8:www.smarthome.com/9126.htm… Without millimeter wave body scanners enforcing this one will be difficult. Even advanced scanners may not detect objects secreted between butt cheeks or on the inside of thighs (especially if legs are fat or held together closely.) Guns Airline personnel will allow law enforcement agents, with proper forms, which are easily obtained, to board a flight with their firearms. Available fake badges, laminators and photo quality printers on home PCs allow anyone with the interest, law LE demeanor and general appearance to pose as a Fed. My wife raised concerns to her management that the gate people responsible for determining if a passenger claiming to be a LE agent was in fact an agent had no training to determine the authenticity of their credential. (Her supervisors listened, smiled and did nothing.) An FBI agent explained to her what she should look for in examining a bona fide FBI ID, but there are too many agencies accorded this privilege to make any simple training possible. A centralized data base, with authentication capability by gate agents, of LE personnel allowed to carry firearms aboard U.S. domestic routes is needed. Crew IDs Both uniforms and IDs have been forged in the past and in at least one case used for a hijacking. Authentication can and should be improved. Expectations The people entrusted with maintaining a safe air travel environment are minimum or low wage people with little training. Israel airline and security personnel are much better paid and well trained (days or weeks vs. hours in the U.S.) Isn't our safety worth more than minimum wage? steve

3 2