December 2003 - cypherpunks-legacy

Re: Dr. Vulis' social engineering experiment
by camcc＠abraxis.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 12:27 AM 1/21/97 -0600, you wrote: :Jane Jefferson wrote: :> :> The heart and soul of the problem is that "sin", "freedom", "good", :> and "evil" are abstract concepts which fluctuate from individual to :> individual. : :An excellent point, Jane. Worth remembering. : : - Igor. Not only from individual to individual. Please consider the changes in the concepts of "sin", "freedom", "good", and "evil" which occur over time even within the same individual; to wit the on and off again love affair with our nation's past "enemies; individual responses to drug use especially alcohol; premarital sex (ok for me but not my daughter). This constant flux within both society and individual makes creation and implementation of rules extremely difficult and hazardous. Alec

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The Purpose of the List
by Blanc Weber 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

If the cpunk list discusses only crypto, then mathematician-programmers will do their cold work in an isolation which eliminates the need to think about the consequences of their actions. So discussions on philosophy, society, etc., are important, to remind everyone of the context within which this subject operates. However, if "community feeling" is the only thing created on the list, and crypto is no longer the focal topic, then what is to be accomplished: the list will become just a playing ground for wayward KOTM PhDs who are not welcome in most other cyberspaces. So the question of "how will this impact society", must maintain association with "but how does this relate to crypto?". (unless the list has changed its stripes, evolving into something completely different, which many will agree it has). .. Blanc

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Fighting the cybercensor.
by Phillip M. Hallam-Baker 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Mission: Singapore and China are blocking certain net groups. I think this is a bad thing, question is how can we stop it? The Web was conceived as offering despots and dictators a choice between remaining in the dark ages and allowing freedom of speech. Blocking and filtering schemes threaten this ideal. Requirements: A scheme which makes blocking of individual IP addresses impractical. Architecture: The Web allows for proxies such as provided by the CERN server (and versions of Apache etc). A proxy server configured to accept connections from domains enforcing blocking (china, Singapore etc) can serve as a means of circumventing the restrictions. The problem then arises, how can the victims of censorship find out about the holes in the curtain? I believe that it would not be difficult to persuade large numbers of people to mirror a list of sites maintained at a central location. The blue ribbon campaign attracted a lot of interest on the same topic. Activity that brought to light the political aspect of Web censorship would help the domestic anti-CDA effort. Considerations: [i.e. areas needing brainstorming] 1) Copyright. Clearly copyright holders such as CNN etc would need to be involved. Although proxies have long been a part of the Web and the scheme does not threaten their interests it would be as well to get them on board at an early stage. 2) How can one prevent the proxies themselves being blocked? Some ideas that come to mind: 2a) Only issue new sites gradually so that blocking requires continuous updates. 2b) Use DHCP to change network addresses regularly. 2c) Some crypto hack I can't quite work out (hence the post to cypher punks). I can phrase the challenge more compactly though. We have two sets of opposed groups A and M. The A group wish to establish a continued conversation with groups B and C. M is willing to permit communication with group B but not C. Whenever M discovers that a member of group B is willing to act on behalf of group C, M transfers that member to the C group. The problem is to keep A's channels of communication open despite the efforts of M for very large group sizes. I'm not sure if this is a pure crypto challenge or a game theory problem. Comments? If people are willing to work on this I can provide some facilities and act as a media contact. Phill

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No Subject
by mixmaster＠remail.obscura.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Is there a moderated list available which expunges only Dale? The good Dr., though vicious, is really quite clever, though vicious. Dale is only a bore. Only. Hugs to all.

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Re: Dr. Vulis' social engineering experiment
by Dale Thorn 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Jane Jefferson wrote: > Also Sprach Toto:[snip] > And fiendishly, it is the very chaos and anarchy and random chance > espoused by proponents of the cypherpunk philosophy that allows these > people to gain this power, unchecked![snip] > We have to face the fact that humans are predators, and as long as > we are, the cycle of this behavior will continue. Jane is showing signs of independent thought. Tsk tsk. > The human race has not evolved to such a point where privacy is not an > essential thing. If tomorrow everyone turned instantly telepathic and > we all were capable of knowing each other's thoughts, you'd best believe > the suicide rate would be beyond belief. Buisnesses would instantly > fail, countries would instantly be absorbed by other countries, many > relationships based on love and trust would be destroyed. > And during that time, the deadliest person alive - the toughest and > the meanest, and the most effective in the face of all the chaos, would > not be the person who was capable of preserving their privacy. Rather, > it would be the one who was capable of surviving in it's complete absence. Telepathy would do no good. You can (if you're hooked into someone's "consciousness") see the general outlines of thought, feel some of the emotions, etc., but the construction of one's abstract thoughts can't be interpreted by an observing person or computer. There are too many variables and random influences. Perhaps someday the quantum machines will make headway there. In the meantime, we can imitate, but we can't speak the full language, a la Star Trek IV. BTW, the suicide rate would not go ballistic, since the suicide rate as reported today is largely ficticious anyway. People would switch to survival mode *very* quickly, which would have the beneficial effect of taking their minds off of their pre-survival-crisis problems.

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Re: Airport security [no such thing]
by Nurdane Oksas 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

On Sun, 19 Jan 1997, Dr.Dimitri Vulis KOTM wrote: > Nurdane Oksas <oksas(a)asimov.montclair.edu> writes: > > > On Sat, 18 Jan 1997, Dr.Dimitri Vulis KOTM wrote: > > > Nurdane Oksas <oksas(a)asimov.montclair.edu> writes: > > > > > > > On Sat, 18 Jan 1997, Dr.Dimitri Vulis KOTM wrote: > > > > > > > > > Nurdane Oksas <oksas(a)asimov.montclair.edu> writes: > > > > > > > > > > > On Fri, 17 Jan 1997, Dale Thorn wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dr.Dimitri Vulis KOTM wrote: > > > > > > > > snow <snow(a)smoke.suba.com> writes: > > > > > > > > > > I say we make people fly naked and ship their stuff via UPS ; > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >>shudder<< > > > > > > > > > No!. A clear case of the cure being worse than the disease. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Why. it might be fun - those long flight can be so boring with cl > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This one I really don't understand. Cypherpunks lobbied heavily fo > > > > > > > the Final Solution to Spamming and flaming, now along comes the per > > > > > > > solution to the airport security problem, and nobody's gonna go for > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Guess those old, out-of-shape guys don't want anybody laughing at t > > > > > > > Besides, they can put all the clothes in the same plane's baggage > > > > > > > compartment. And planes have those little blankets and pillows, > > > > > > > so what's the problem? > > > > > > > > > > > > Cold temps... > > > > > > > > > > What can naked people do to keep warm??? > > > > > > > > steal blankets from nearby passenger.. > > > > > > I once saw a movie where they had a heroin (or cocaine?) processing lab > > > and everybody was supposed to work naked so it would be hard to steal > > > some of the product. Of course in the movie all the employees were good- > > > looking women (Oksas would have been the big star!). > > > > Thank you for the complement; You've only seen me with clothes :) > > I can tell. > > > Would you like to share my blanket? > > Sure! A true gentleman (like me) is always ready, willing, and able to share > a security blanket with a lady. I am very embarassed... > > "Something nekkid's in the air!" > i think i am in trouble ;) > --- > > Dr.Dimitri Vulis KOTM > Brighton Beach Boardwalk BBS, Forest Hills, N.Y.: +1-718-261-2013, 14.4Kbps >

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fingerd
by Toto 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

> > Lynx 2.6 is the "latest" for UNIX and they "got" mine. However, > >someone suggesed that it may have been done through finger as well, and > >since my ocmputer is a UNIX box...the people using UNIX shells are gonna > >get nailed too... > > Couple of things you can do: > > 1. Comment out "fingerd" in /etc/inetd.conf and refresh > 2. Install a more secure "fingerd" such that it only > allows "finger `userid(a)node.domain`" instead of > "finger `(a)node.domain`". > > While I've seen #2 in action, I don't know where to go to snarf it. I just > use #1. Anyone know where to 'snarf it'?

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Re: Rejection policy of the Cypherpunks maiing list
by Dr.Dimitri Vulis KOTM 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

ichudov(a)algebra.com (Igor Chudov @ home) writes: > I would like to start a thread to discuss the moderation and rejection > policy. I predict that Sandy won't allow any posts on the censored list that question his moderation poilicy - only the unanymous praises. > My perfectly crypto-relevant article regarding possible attacks > on human relationships with the use of forged mail and anonymous > remailers, has been tossed out (sorted) into cypherpunks-flames > mailing list. A dishonorable act. > You can receive a copy of my article by an email request. Perhaps you want to start putting up rejected articles on a Web page? > The explanation that Sandy Sandfort gave me mentioned that he rejected > my message because it continued a thread where Sandy noticed instances > of "flaming". Note that my message was free of any flames, including > its quoted part. That's correct. > Sandy also states rather plainly that crypto-relevance is not the > criterion by which he moderates this list. I question this policy. Sandy's personal likes and dislikes of certain posters are the criterion. > I would like to hear your opinions as to whether such policies satisfy > the current readership. You won't be allowed to on this censored mailing list. --- Dr.Dimitri Vulis KOTM Brighton Beach Boardwalk BBS, Forest Hills, N.Y.: +1-718-261-2013, 14.4Kbps

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Re: seeds of our own destruction
by Attila T. Hun 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- In <32E72BCB.3CBA(a)deltanet.com>, on 01/23/97 at 01:13 AM, Kevin Stephenson <cts(a)deltanet.com> said: +You wrote some very interesting articles. It is the UN. if you want a real scare, read the UN "world constitution" on human rights and privacy --their idea of a Bill of Rights. It just happens that it is virtually word for word equivalent to the mainland Chinese "rights" -in other words: rights as long as they are consistent with the aims of the state (UN) and the security needs of the state at the given moment. ...and the UN is to be granted overall sovereignity by virtue of the right to unilateraly tax its 'member' states, and not necessarily in an equitable fashion. to put it in context, it is clearly the havenots reducing everyone to the status of havenot; there will be no others. this, of course, will eventually give way to tribal governments and the cycle will start over after the population is reduced by its own pollution and starvation to a new balance with nature. disease, more than starvation, will be the biggest killer. men will be too hungry, and too sick, to fight until it stabilizes. there will be exceptions, of course, but they will lack sufficient power to extend their sphere of influence before they are overrun by the mass, or destroyed by chemical and germ warfare in the last gasp. the meaning of the 144,000 becomes more clear... +Read Revelations (if you haven't). have more than several textbooks on it, and have taught classes on Revelation. however, I strongly believe the interpretations are still 'every man for himself' --presuming, of course, the propounder has at least the prerequisite grounding and understanding in the fundamental concepts, starting with John the Revelator, who never died, and why portions of the book are sealed. the best general reference on symbology, at least of what I have seen so far: Opening the Seven Seals (The Visions of John the Revelator) Richard D. Draper Desert Books, Salt Lake City ISBN 087579-547-1, SKU 2142298 +Maybe put some scriptures on cypherpunks. casting pearls before swine? +Happy Armageddon. Frances Ford Coppola wasted the good title: 'Apocolypse Now' -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.3i Charset: latin1 Comment: Encrypted with 2.6.3i. Requires 2.6 or later. iQCVAwUBMuc64b04kQrCC2kFAQFXBwP/RhEeldizuSelbrHtfCSDsrwRaT0hn1qd e/j6Q0IPHMkzrFS+bnTGia5hLogTgU61tdvq38AGlRt2LpQZVekStZqCog4Jfmx0 olK1xzpNEr71UsDxxYe5ooIhHwWVWfZsxtj6k8/eSYtLbontN+BCHbk6V+Py3BOi HOpugpbs8V4= =2XXx -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

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Re: If you were unable to download UDCM V2.0 before...
by Toto 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Krenn wrote: > Oh most certainly! I'm gonna run out and implement EVERYTHING in UDCM!! > Thanks man!! Yours is the post these guys have been waiting for. All of those other CypherPunks just 'flamed' them by asking technical questions about their products. Who knows, they may make you their marketing manager. Toto

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