December 2003 - cypherpunks-legacy

Re: Modified Token Posting Scheme
by ed.falk＠Eng.Sun.COM 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

How about this simple policy scheme: 1) posts from known list members forwarded to list automatically 2) posts with "approval cookie" also forwarded automatically 3) otherwise, forwarded only after approval by moderator, whose charter only permits spam filtering. People who don't want to use their own name in a post, and also don't want to be bothered with creating a cookie are the only ones whose posts are delayed.

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To pay credit when it's due
by ichudov＠algebra.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Dear Cpunks, I forgot to mention that during the design phase of my robomod I have received a number of thoughtful and helpful advices from Dr. Dimitri Vulis KOTM, mostly regarding authentication protocols, as well as some other programming matters. For example, a suggestion to add an option requiring all preapproved posters to sign their articles was originally made by him. - Igor.

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Re: Thoughts on moderation
by Douglas Barnes 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Goodness knows most people who are fully engaged in a mailing list get involved in an unproductive discussion or argument from time to time. My main assertion about Sandy is that although he has his likes and dislikes (and is not shy about sharing them) I can't see him bouncing messages just because someone was disagreeing with him. There might be someone who is less opinionated, but I think that you need to find someone who cares enough about a subject to be interested in moderating it (one antonym of "opinionated" is "dispassionate" -- think about it.) The only way to tell if Sandy will be fair _as a moderator_ is to give him a chance. Years of knowing him as a friend, and four months of sharing an office indicate that while he's stubborn and opinionated, he's also extremely fairminded, and will not bounce for content he disagrees with. He also has a broad concept (some might argue too broad) of acceptable list topics, but since we're looking primarily to screen out the worst dreck & outright spam, he seems like a logical choice as moderator. I don't see this move as censorship of any sort -- cleaning the Augean stables is more like it. I am profoundly tired of wading through completely worthless and vapid trash accusing Tim and John of various sexual perversions. (Note that if the writers actually knew these folks, they'd at least be able to write better or more interesting libel.) At 10:35 PM 1/6/97 -0800, you wrote: >Douglas Barnes wrote: >> 1) I've known Sandy for a couple of years, and I trust him to >> use good judgement as a moderator. It will be important to >> develop guidelines so that the job can be rotated, but it's also >> important that the moderator be someone who doesn't have any >> major axe to grind. Sandy has his personal likes and dislikes, >> but I don't think he'll ever stoop to tossing out opinions that >> he disagrees with. > >Wishful thinking, Doug. Sandy will take an emotional (non-objective) >position on an issue, and argue it beyond any reasonable limit. I wish >I had all his replies to things I've said - you'd see what I mean. > >Not to promote anyone who I might not be a friend of, but, there are >people on this list who are "well respected" who are light-years ahead >of Sandy in areas that are important for a list moderator. > >Maybe Gilmore should have publicly announced for a moderator, and then >let the subscribers pick.... > >

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No Subject
by anonymous＠miron.vip.best.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

NOVEMBER 11, 1996 INFORMATION WARFARE U.S. sitting duck, DOD panel predicts BY BOB BREWIN AND HEATHER HARRELD (antenna(a)fcw.com and heather_harreld(a)fcw.com) The dependence of the United States on computers and communications systems to run its critical power, finance and transportation systems places the country at risk in the event of an information warfare (IW) attack, according to a report prepared by a top-level Defense Department advisory panel. This reliance, it said, has "created a tunnel of vulnerability previously unrealized in the history of conflict" and could have a "catastrophic effect on the ability of [DOD] to fulfill its mission." The report of the Defense Science Board Task Force on Information Warfare-Defense (IW-D), obtained by Federal Computer Week, called the threat of an IW attack "significant," adding that the nation's "vulnerabilities are numerous, [and] the countermeasures are extremely limited...." Citing a specific example, the DSB report said one building in Savannah, Ga., (a Bell South switching facility, FCW learned) houses not only a vital communications hub but information technology systems supporting key electric power and transportation companies. Because Savannah serves as a vital port of embarkation for Army troops based in that area, an IW attack against that one building would "make it impossible to deploy military forces at the pace specified in operations plans." The DSB task force, chaired by two former assistant secretaries of Defense for command, control, communications and intelligence (ASD/C3I), Duane Andrews and Donald Latham, viewed the IW problem as so severe that it urged the Pentagon to embark immediately on a crash course to protect against this new form of warfare, providing detailed policy, funding and legal recommendations. These recommendations included a controversial call for the Pentagon to have the legal power to protect nongovernmental portions of the infrastructure in the name of "the common defense." To defend DOD and critical nongovernmental systems against IW, the report recommends new legal authority that will allow "DOD, law enforcement and intelligence agencies to conduct efficient, coordinated monitoring of attacks on the critical civilian information infrastructure...." In carving out a position for DOD to take on this role in the civil sector, the report bluntly summed up the problem: "We should not forget information warfare is a form of warfare, not a crime or an act of terror." It took an equally blunt approach on how the Pentagon should respond to such an attack or intrusion. "The response could entail civil or criminal prosecution, use of military force...diplomatic initiatives or economic mandates." DSB, which said it has urged immediate and concerted action on the IW-D front for the past three years, had a number of recommendations on how DOD should get its own information warfare act together. The report said it would take $3 billion over the next five years to translate these recommendations into reality. This includes establishing the ASD/C3I as the single focal point for IW-D within the department - a necessary step to spread the diffusion of IW responsibilities among the services and Defense agencies, according to a source familiar with the thinking of the task force. Emmett Paige Jr., ASD/C3I, said he had read a copy of the DSB briefing to deputy secretary of Defense John White. Paige said, "I saw nothing in that briefing I do not agree with. I strongly support everything in their briefing." DISA's Role The Defense Information Systems Agency would take on a pivotal IW-D role, based on the recommendations in the report. It called for DISA to set up an IW operations center to provide tactical warning, attack, assessment and emergency response with infrastructure restoration capabilities, and it pegged funding for this center at $275 million over five years. DISA also should establish a joint office for system, network and infrastructure design, the report said, with funding estimated at $225 million over five years. DISA director Lt. Gen. Al Edmonds has already acted on these recommendations, setting up last week a Global Operations and Security Center and a Programs office (see Intercepts). Edmonds said DISA decided not to wait to have these recommendations approved. "We're doing this on our own. We want a new focus here...and we're funding it out of our own budget [by] prioritizing on Information Warfare-Defense. The DSB is right on target, and they got us rolling." The Pentagon also needs to refocus its IW research and development, the report said, recommending $580 million over five years. This poses a tough challenge, DSB said, because "prior R&D efforts have been in areas such as computer and network security.... Little attention has been paid to surviving willful malicious attack, or detecting and eliminating corrupt software." The DSB task force also took some potshots at some well-established and well-entrenched DOD IW policies and programs. Looking at the national debate over the key escrow encryption systems backed by the Clinton administration, the DSB report dismissed encryption as a "distraction.... Encryption simply does not solve all of the information security problems some are led to believe." The National Security Agency's long-running Multilevel-Secure Information Systems Security Initiative also received short shrift from the task force, which suggested commercial products such as security "tokens" rather than passwords could go a long way in the near term toward resolving DOD's security problems. The task force also brought sober realism to the theme of "information superiority" promulgated by all the services during the past several years to such an extent that it has become almost a mantra. "The doctrine of information superiority assumes the availability of information and information technology - a dangerous assumption.... Published service and joint doctrine does not address the operational implications of a failure of information and technology," the report said. The intelligence community's ability to handle IW also came in for a similar assessment by the task force, which called IW "a nontraditional intelligence problem [that is]...not easily discernible by traditional intelligence." Traditional intelligence skills "are largely irrelevant in the information warfare environment." Percy Pierre, an electrical engineering professor at Michigan State University and a member of the DSB task force, said DOD's interest in protecting critical infrastructure is a result of "the recognition that the Defense Department is dependent on private-sector assets for logistical support and other types of support." Any move by government toward civil electronic defense must be delicately balanced to avoid antagonizing the private sector, said Winn Schwartau, a security consultant and author of several information warfare books. "For them to blatantly say, `We want to monitor,' that creates a huge problem," he said. "If the government says, `You don't worry, private sector, we're going to take care of you,' they're going to have a problem." You must register to read this week's news or to use the search or forums. If you haven't signed up yet, fill out the registration form. Mail questions about this Web page to webmaster(a)fcw.com. URL: http://www.fcw.com

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Re: Sandy and I will run a cypherpunks "moderation" experim
by Ross Wright 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

On or About 6 Jan 97 at 1:21, Dale Thorn wrote: > Ross Wright wrote: > > On or About 5 Jan 97 at 22:38, Black Unicorn wrote: > > > Excellent until the flames list is eliminated. > > > Yes I want to read this list, flames and all. I guess I'm just > > used to it by now. I don't filter it myself (except manually) so > > I don't want to trust someone I don't know to do it. > > Just one other thing, Ross. Don't assume that the stated purpose > and the real purpose are one and the same. Shit, I learned that in the service of my great country. Who's sig-line talks about liberty being taken away little bits at a time? As I said before freedom of speech has a price other than the blood of patriots. That price is the tolerance of IDEAS! Any fucking ideas that happen to come the fuck up!!!!! I'm gonna tolerate who-the-hell-ever I want to! There are not any grey areas when it comes to free speech. You censor one because of bad manners or downright bad taste, then you censor all. And fuck all you guys who *plonked* me over my last flame war with T.M., cause you just missed a great post! (I learned that in film school: you have to like your own work). So my question is: is there going to be a maximum number of times I can say fuck in a good post? Like a 3-fuck limit? Or will you take out the magic marker and draw through them? Ross

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Moderation
by thad＠hammerhead.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

I think that this is a completely fabulous idea, an commend John and Sandy for doing this. Let me add my own suggestion. This will fail if flames migrate from cypherpunks-flames to cypherpunks, I would attempt to prohibit threads that only exist in cypherpunks-flames being continued into the moderated list. This'll be hard to do, Sandy, I know, but if you could think of a way to do this, I think that your experiment is more likely to succeed. Phrases like "As I said in the letter that only got sent to cypherpunks-flames" should cause the whole article to be yanked, IMHO. thad -- Thaddeus Beier thad(a)hammerhead.com Visual Effects Supervisor 408) 287-6770 Hammerhead Productions http://www.got.net/people/thad

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by http://www.cybertimes.org 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

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Infowar Digest Volume 02: Number 01
by Betty G. O'Hearn 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

We thank our sponsors: Internet Security Solutions New Dimensions International - Security Training HOMECOM Communications National Computer Security Association OPEN SOURCE SOLUTIONS, Inc. __________________________________________________ Infowar(a)infowar.com is brought to you in the the interest of an open, unclassified exchange of information and ideas as a means for advancement of Information Warfare related issues. Topics of discussion for this list include: Infowar, Electronic Civil Defense, Hacking, Defensive Techniques, Policy, Non-Lethals, Psyops, Chemical Warfare Agents and WMD. As the list expands we will adapt to the needs and desires of our subscribers. This is a MODERATED DIGEST format. __________________________________________________________ Infowar Sunday, January 12, 1997 Volume 02: Number 01 RE: Call for Anecdotes RE: The Media and Information Warfare RE: British PsyOps RE: Futuristic Battlefield RE: IWAR Journal RE: Discussion Forums Open ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ To: infowar(a)infowar.com From: Jules Siegel <jsiegel(a)mail.caribe.net.mx> Subject: Call for anecdotes Date: Fri, 5 Jan 1996 17:17:32 -0600 CALL FOR ANECDOTES I need your help. I'm a writer. My work has appeared in Playboy, Esquire, Rolling Stone, Best American Short Stories. You can examine my credentials at http://www.caribe.net.mx/siegel/jsiegel.htm I am currently researching the following article for American Reporter: The End of Privacy When the chief operating officer of a major telephone company can't keep his unlisted telephone number secret, you know the battle for personal privacy is pretty much lost. New York magazine found the address of reclusive novelist Thomas Pynchon through an on-line credit-card checking service in two minutes. Encrypting messages attracts attention and no secret remains secret very long when hackers with the skills of con men trick the unsuspecting into revealing passwords. So what would a world without privacy be like? Maybe it's not all 1984 -- honesty could be another by-product. I wonder if anyone might want to share: [1] Any unusually biting anecdotes that would fit the theme above? [2] Other sources of similar information? [3] Quotable opinions? I'm basically interested in personal opinions and experiences. Example: I received a reply from a writer who had been the subject of a searching expose and came out of it feeling liberated of her secrets. I think that as a practical matter privacy no longer exists, if it ever did. I think it's an illusion created by industrialism. Only hermits had privacy in the past. As we pass into the next phase of social evolution, I believe that our constructs will resemble animism -- that is they will be living or life-like, soft rather than hard, transparent rather than opaque. Today, the cost of maintaining secrets is beginning to outweigh the value. Yet we're still addicted to this illusion. What would a genuinely transparent world be like to those used to living behind masks? I'm also interested in comments on the following: [4] Electronic surveillance In last November's PC Computing, John Dvorak claimed that government intelligence agencies had set up remail services in order to check on people using them. In a private letter I received, a very sane but prudent journalist working for a mainstream newspaper cited fears of e-mail being read by intelligence agencies as a reason for not telling me something he had on his mind. Questions: What do we know about this sort of thing? What do are we doing about it? [5] Spying in the newsroom Earlier this year, The Miami Herald's Jim Hampton came out strongly against the CIA using reporters as spies in foreign country. What about in the United States? I have received information on more than one occasion about journalists on the payroll of intelligence and/or police agencies spying on their colleagues, as well as making trouble for specific targets, and helping squelch certain themes, among other activities. Question: Do publications tolerate this? Cooperate fully? If not, how do they handle these cases when they become aware of them? [6] Blacklisting The existence of black lists was very well documented in the wake of the McCarthy era. I'm sure we have good reason to believe that they still exist. Questions: Do electronic editorial black lists exist? Other fields? How do they work? How does a victim get off a black list? All replies will be fully attributed and I will send a checking copy of the final draft to anyone whose anecdote I use. Many thanks for your interest and cooperation. Jules Siegel http://www.caribe.net.mx/siegel/jsiegel.htm >From USA: http://www.yucatanweb.com/siegel/jsiegel.htm Mail: Apdo. 1764 Cancun QR 77501 Mexico Tel: 011-52-98 87-49-18 Fax 87-49-13 E-mail: jsiegel(a)mail.caribe.net.mx ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ To: Infowar(a)infowar.com From: Daigle166(a)aol.com Subject: The Media and Information Warfare Date: Tue, 26 Nov 1996 22:14:59 +0000 Message-Id: <22145965403068(a)infowar.com> Hi, I am currently working on a thesis paper concerned with the subject of information warfare as it relates to the media. Specifically, my research question is: "Is it morally and ethically acceptable for military commanders and staff members to purposely mislead the media for the purpose of tactical deception and information warfare against one's enemies?" I will obviously be taking a look at both sides of this issue and would appreciate any information you may have on the subject. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ To: "Winn Schwartau" <winn(a)infowar.com> Cc: Infowar(a)infowar.com Date: Tue, 7 Jan 1997 07:53:57 +0000 From: Maobrien95(a)aol.com I'm looking for books that would detail British PsychOps, especially its use in Northern Ireland. Thank you very much for your time.My e-mail: Maobrien95(a)aol.com Respectfully, Frank O'Brien ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ To: "Betty G. O'Hearn" <betty(a)infowar.com> From: "Michael H. Sedge" <pp10013(a)cybernet.it> Subject: Futuristic Battlefields Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 12:56:54 +0100 Dear Betty, Thanks in part to the input you provided and the quotes obtained through your resources, I was able to produce a feature on Cyber Warfare that will appear in the February issue of ARMED FORCES JOURNAL INTERNATIONAL, and perhaps other publications around the world. I am now working on a story which takes a look at the FUTURISTIC BATTLEFIELD and seek experts for quotes, insight, products, etc. Such things as robotic soldiers and unmanned aircraft will be discussed, as well as warfare controlled from romote sites. Any help, leads, manufacturers, etc., that you could provide would be helpful. Best regards & Happy New Year. Sincerely, Michael H. Sedge ARMED FORCES JOURNAL INTERNATIONAL ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Sun, 12 Jan 1997 21:29:26 -0500 To: infowar(a)infowar.com From: "Betty G. O'Hearn" <betty(a)infowar.com> Subject: IWAR Journal. The Journal of IWAR Intelligence Acquisition - is now being made available at http://www.iwar.org/. This journal is published by William Church, a distinquished journalist in the field. Current Issue: Spring 1997: Information Warfare Threat Model. Articles by Michael Wilson, Robert Steele, Philip H.J. Davies, Special Report on the IPTF, and an interview with Winn Schwartau. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ To: Infowar(a)infowar.com From: "Betty G. O'Hearn" <betty(a)infowar.com> Subject: Discussion Forums Open On Monday, January 13, 1997 WWW.InfoWar.Com will begin hosting a series of discussion forums, available to anyone on the Internet. Everyone who logs onto the forums will also be provided with a mini-home-page (for free!) so other participants may get to know with whom they are interacting. The discussion forums may be accessed from the Infowar.Com Home Page by clicking on the "Digest, Discussion & Chat Groups" icon. The forum moderators will be: Moderator Topic Winn Schwartau Information Warfare and President, Interpact, Inc. Electronic Civil Defense Carolyn Meinel Hackers/Hacking Publisher of Happy Hacker Digest Matthew Devost Terrorism Systems Engineer, SAIC William Church IWAR Publisher of The Journal of IWAR Intelligence Acquisition Scott Brower EBR Electronic Bill of Rights/Privacy Executive Director, Electronic Frontiers Florida Robert Steele OSSINT President OPEN SOURCE SOLUTIONS, Inc. Unmoderated Viruses Unmoderated Infosec We welcome this distinguished group of moderators and encourage you to participate in these forums. Sign in and start posting! Have an idea for a new discussion forum? Want to be a moderator? Contact betty(a)infowar.com. _______________________________:) InfoWar.Com will also be introducing several hundred "chat" lines in the coming weeks. Keep contributing..... keep up your input. We are introducing these new modules that you have requested. Thanks for all of your invaluable support. Winn Schwartau and the incomparable staff at www.infowar.com ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ END Infowar Volume 2 No. 1 January 12, 1997 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ DIRECT REQUESTS to: list(a)infowar.com with one-line in the BODY, NOT in the subject line. Subscribe infowar TO JOIN GROUP Unsubscribe infowar TO LEAVE GROUP Help infowar TO RECEIVE HELP TO POST A MESSAGE: E-Mail to infowar(a)infowar.com _____________________________________________________ Infowar.Com Interpact, Inc. Winn Schwartau winn(a)infowar.com http://www.infowar.com 813-393-6600 Voice 813-393-6361 FAX Sponsor Opportunities/Comments/Help Betty G. O'Hearn Assistant to Winn Schwartau http://www.infowar.com betty(a)infowar.com 813-367-7277 Voice 813-363-7277 FAX

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Igor asks what these examples prove...
by dlv＠bwalk.dm.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Here's another article from s.c.r.m where one of the moderators verbally abuses a person banned from posting in that forum (myself :-). The gratuitous abuse is totally off-topic and has no connection to the flame thread it's in. That's what the lying cocksucker John Gilmore wants to be able to do on his private mailing list - to post more lies which the victims of his libel will not be allowed to refute. ]X-SCRM-Policy: http://www.algebra.com/~ichudov/usenet/scrm/index.html ]X-SCRM-Info-1: Send submissions to scrm(a)algebra.com ]X-SCRM-Info-2: Send technical complaints to scrm-admin(a)algebra.com ]X-SCRM-Info-3: Send complaints about policy to scrm-board(a)algebra.com ]X-Comment: moderators do not necessarily agree or disagree with this article. ]X-Robomod-Version: STUMP 1.1, by ichudov(a)algebra.com (Igor Chudov) ]Date: Sun, 12 Jan 1997 05:27:03 CST ]From: vladimir(a)chinook.physics.utoronto.ca (Vladimir Smirnov) ]Message-ID: <199701121028.FAA06007(a)chinook.physics.utoronto.ca> ]Subject: Re: Russian diplomats are pigs ]Newsgroups: soc.culture.russian.moderated ]X-Auth: PGPMoose V1.1 PGP soc.culture.russian.moderated ] ]rqk10(a)oes.amdahl.com (Roman Kostin) wrote: ]> Po suschestvu, govorish'? Ya sejchas tebe skazhu po suschestvu. ]> ]> Tvoj kommentarij byl tsinichen, tup i beschelovechen. I kogda ]> tebe na eto ukazyvayut, tebe sleduet izvinit'sya i zatknut'sya, ]> a ne ogryzat'sya kak shavka. ] ] Narod, ja vas ubeditel'no proshu ne ustraivat' gryznju v ]moderiruemoj newsgruppe. Kommentarij u Sashi, konechno, byl ]tak sebe, no sobak na nego naveshali po polnoj programme, ]kak budto on dejstvitel'no uzh chego-to takoe skazal. ]Idi von (eto Kostinu) Dr. D.V.Ulissa popinaj, esli principial'nost' ]v golovu udarila. Ili stremno? ] ]- Smirnov ] ] ]

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STUMP
by Paul Elliott 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Not too long ago, I attempted to post a PGP signed message to a STUMP moderated newsgroup. Even though the moderators approved my post, it never arrived because of sme technical problem with PGP and STUMP. The people running the newsgroup never could figure out what went wrong, and my post never made it in spite of the best efforts of those running the newsgroup. I advise caution with STUMP. - -- Paul Elliott Telephone: 1-713-781-4543 Paul.Elliott(a)hrnowl.lonestar.org Address: 3987 South Gessner #224 Houston Texas 77063 -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.3 Charset: cp850 iQCVAgUBMtltLvBUQYbUhJh5AQGHiQP9GBOikHp+trnA6C8v9xjJA/zadXlY8sde B48dOdMX47pougoYeUyTOcDRRJ3y/2FWnTfjNbiT/oFXm8R+vLtFEhD8baULjUfd eqv+rvOrkNLajI61Io4Jfc8cOc0Yyhc7A5tZHvxuKbEK0Hv9F7tOehksrFjhHdGQ VwmgcqGa6RM= =22bZ -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

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