December 2003 - cypherpunks-legacy

Re: Crypto CD UpDate (fwd)
by Jim Choate 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Forwarded message: > It pains me to often be the one who throws cold water on what seems to be a > good idea, and what comes from a well-intentioned person. But I have to > call 'em as I see 'em. And maybe I'm wrong. But here are my thoughts. You know you love it...;) > 1. The CD-ROM "freezes" the various programs, archives, etc. at the moment > the files are finalized and the CD-ROMs are pressed (or burned individually > on a CD-R, at somewhat higher per-copy price). If the author of the CD-ROM > is not committed to updating the CD-ROM at frequent intervals--say, every > few months--then the programs will exhibit "version decay" and be nearly > useless. > The next point is the reason. I do soho consulting and I help provide several of my customers with software of various nature. One thing I have come to realize is that they are not interested in being in the fast lane. They are secure in knowing that the software behaves in a predicible way (not necessarily designed that way either). A large part of this attitude is based in their not being computer anything sorts. I find CD's a great way to keep libraries of old software that sometimes comes in handy. > 2. The Web does a better job at making the latest versions instantly > accessible. True, a CD-ROM will generally have faster access, but I care > more about getting the _latest_ version of PGP, even if takes a minute or > two to snarf off the Web. That I could get an _older_ version of PGP in > fractions of a second off this CD-ROM is not compelling to me. (And > fractions of a second is too charitable: in actuality, I'd have to locate > the CD-ROM, dismount anything already mounted, mount the CD-ROM, search it > for "PGP," etc. Probably not even faster than using Alta Vista and > downloading.) Yes, except it is much easier to track my access to the web than my CD-Rom. > 4. The Web approach allows powerful search engines, links from other pages, > and--importantly--multiple jurisdictions. The PGP could come from the U.S., > the Digital Postage code from Sweden, and so on. And, again as noted in # > 1, the developers could keep improving and iterating the code. CD's are great advertising.

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Random Number Testing (fwd)
by Jim Choate 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Hi Fred, Forwarded message: > Subject: Random Number Testing > Date: Tue, 26 Mar 1996 18:00:26 -0800 (PST) > From: Fred <admin(a)dcwill.com> > > The limitation seems to be in the testing process. > > An inviolable rule of test and measurement is that the testing process > must have a higher degree of accuracy and precision than is expected from > the item under test. If all you have is a non-graduated stick one meter > long, you can't measure increments of less than one meter unless you add > some additional resolution to the system (such as a human's judgment > that the object is four sticks, plus about another third of a stick, > long). Not if I am allowed geometry. I believe such situations are a test of lateral thinking more than any fundamental insite into nature. > > Our ability to synthesize pseudo-random data, and the degree to which > it approaches true random data, is limited by our ability to discern > between the two. If the best testing process available yields the > same results for the output of a true RNG and a particular PRNG, what > can be done to improve the randomness of the PRNG? How could we tell > the difference based on the data itself? What are you defining as random? The definition I use in practice is basicly that if I am given 100% intelligence on a stream of numbers the odds of my succesfully choosing the next number is never higher than chance. All data is random (by definition) until the pattern(s) can be discerned. In this context pseudo-random has a definite meaning, namely that it takes a long time to amass enough information about the data stream to break the chance boundary. The question quickly becomes, how do you test various sequences against one another for robustness? It seems to me that it has to be done statisticaly. One aspect of this is what I call the 'ghost' pattern. In short, in the process of analyzing some random data a pattern is found. Is it possible that there could be more than one pattern (ie interpretation) of the data? Is it possible for a data stream to contain two (or more) messages coherently? If a message does contain two or more coherent messages, how does this affect the size of the data? Can this occur only on messages above a certain size?

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Re:
by David K. Merriman 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- At 04:42 AM 03/28/96 -0800, Anonymous wrote: >At 12:21 AM 3/28/96, Syed Yusuf wrote: >>If a person who speaks three languages is tri-lingual >>If a person who speaks two languages is bi-lingual >> >>What do you call a person who only speaks one language? >> >>---------------------answer follows: >> >>An American. > >Or our version: > >What do you call a person who has to learn English as a second language in order to compete in the world? > >A foreigner. > >(Sorry for the insult, but it seems that this thread is bringing out insults from foreigners of all sorts.) > >--Tim > > >Dont be sorry! > >Foreigner can atleast speak broken English. Can American speak broken foreign language? As a matter of fact, I speak broken Tagalog, broken Japanese, pidgin Korean, and and can generally make myself understood in Chinese, Thai, Vietnamese, Spanish, and French. Oh, yes, I'm also fluent in Aussie :-) Dave Merriman -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.2 iQCVAwUBMVoK/8VrTvyYOzAZAQHrXAP/ZMOgx+VkqHXCQHBFXIdVVHzlCcJIo3L6 2LyqMnY0cJ5ZFD8mCNsBTTe2DAXFpN1WV03JFym/JIxAuL0TQuN0WKZ2HFSuk997 AZPo21whZbXVQlRGrr6JjiR8p2nqHMMBpNC2bfr2r/rny7UmnGGp8C1e6crPtrQF PiyDbd20zbM= =Swae -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- ------------------------------------------------------------- "Giving money and power to government is like giving whiskey and car keys to teenage boys." P. J. O'Rourke (b. 1947), U.S. journalist. <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><> http://www.shellback.com/personal/merriman/index.htm

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DES or RSA on a PIC
by MeRC 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Does anyone have ANY code for DES or RSA encryption for use on a PIC microcontroler? A friend and I are developing an ASCII terminal (dumb term) that encrypts data going to the serial port and decrypts data coming from the serial port, so you could successfully send a message over a modem and have it automatically encrypted\decrypted. We have all the hardware almost done, but we are having a hell of a time writing the code for the encryption... Thanx in advance... l8r, -MeRC merc(a)redrose.net -or- merc(a)success.net -----BEGIN PGP MESSAGE----- Version: 2.6.2 iQCVAwUAMUC05tnn3Dsf47p5AQE6AAP9E/JebLn1UtkOk41IGw/i4XHKckVcI6RH ptBMucqx01sSTxaR8tXPmmkKjz5f3xndxepbbs6nKfoNuSaODWSirOlNvt3i1DWL iUmB9+rUYmwwlpD7t6qyy2XzsAxO/M/nFT4ZxO8wi96nR/Rmp00LvCoK+YcjgQnj HReyQrIl4X+ZAI0DMUCzOgAAAQQAv6IH+OnLeP+chsgwymSVKqsXHO1xwJLxs657 Cf3miDM3mNBB/qmRziQ1zHeC/nXgaGhR7eAdidL6MngDXl6+cw4Z5xXvenu5MpEW zpZpwDK5/XwuvCIexQP2eHIb2Ms6vna7fUoaHGrrV4844KIVg+E36ZgWT1ZP2efc Ox/junkABRGwAYe0I01pY2hhZWwgRC4gV2hpdGUgPG1lcmNAc3VjY2Vzcy5uZXQ+ sAED =ZbPJ -----END PGP MESSAGE-----

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Re: So, what crypto legislation (if any) is necessary?
by shabbir＠vtw.org 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Lucky Green writes: >At 2:08 3/26/96, Shabbir J. Safdar wrote: > >It is a widespread myth that wiretaps require warrants. Court ordered >warrants are not required for a wiretap. They have not been required since >the Digital Telephony Bill passed. (see below) >That the net, the media, and even >attorneys are so blissfully unaware of this, even years after the provision >doing away with requiring warrants became law, is one of the finest >examples of cognitive dissonance you are ever likely to find. It is too >disturbing to believe it, so the mind ignores the facts. When everyone in the world seems to disagree with you, isn't it a good idea to check the facts? >Excerpt from the Digital Telephony Bill (deleted) [..] >"My supervisor approved it" may well suffice. Your misunderstanding of how interceptions are done is dangerous to what is otherwise a rational, intelligent argument. Indeed, there are ways to conduct a wiretap without a judge. They require dispensations from people like the Attorney General, for example. And this is certainly not a normal practice. There are a lot of reasons to object to DT, but this is not one of them. -Shabbir J. Safdar * Online Representative * Voters Telecomm. Watch (VTW) http://www.vtw.org/ * Defending Your Rights In Cyberspace

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Re: Let's *NOT* "Raise their Awareness"
by David K. Merriman 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- At 12:23 AM 03/27/96 -0800, Charles Bell wrote: >On Tue, 26 Mar 1996, David K. Merriman wrote: > > >Yes, and some years ago a State legislature (I forget which) passed a >resolution setting the value of pi at exactly 3. I'm not sure how they >planned to enforce their will. Do you know how the Texas judge means to >enforce his? Frankly, no. I would suspect some kind of visits from Child Welfare, or somesuch - fruitless though it may be. Dave -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.2 iQCVAwUBMVjxCsVrTvyYOzAZAQFWfAP7BQTesPRwoK+ubvFxLg36tq634FdFAlue 5sMZO1D2yBfHEHsHyfpR7RBB2DrP8vqTjrcZjz9ctxg7ph5/sqYUWf37xkKbyLu2 byJMWfZhZDXIwDyhWU3RmJOUL+loisDzP7uNZtjoodJLro/QceSR4sqdgWa4xl59 eiPapVoaXdU= =1+fS -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- ------------------------------------------------------------- "Giving money and power to government is like giving whiskey and car keys to teenage boys." P. J. O'Rourke (b. 1947), U.S. journalist. <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><> http://www.shellback.com/personal/merriman/index.htm

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Re: ITAR double standards?
by rkmoore＠iol.ie 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

3/26/96, Timothy C. May wrote: >So, did Intel have to apply to the State Department's office on munitions >exports in order to send engineers to Malaysia, Israel, Germany, Ireland, >etc., to do development work? Not that I ever heard. Engineers simply >hopped on planes and that was that. So true. When I worked in Silicon Valley firms, I noticed how International Air Courier services were used entirely like Interdepartmental Mail, with no concern for export laws or import duties, etc. If we travelled overseas, _of course_ we took our laptop with all it's software (including encryption), and _of course_ we'd leave software copies on colleagues hard disks, after doing demos and such. All with a sense of total righteousness -- we were tax-paying wage-earners just doing our job. There's a real irony here, if you think about the Barlow-expressed sentiment that cyberspace is a new free domain, having achieved escape velocity from terrestial anachronisms. While Barlow's critics, it seems, demolished _that_ thesis as wishful thinking, there's a parallel thesis that may actually be true: that _corporate environments_ have achieved escape velocity from civil jurisdiction, and now live in a world where rules & ethics are relative only to corporate culture, and "parochial" national laws are to be quietly ignored, knowing there's a highly-paid legal staff to deal with occasional embarrasments. We dream and they implement. Cheers, Richard rkmoore(a)iol.ie (not on cypherpunks) ~=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=~=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=~--~=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=~=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=~ Posted by Richard K. Moore - rkmoore(a)iol.ie - Wexford, Ireland Cyberlib: www | ftp --> ftp://ftp.iol.ie/users/rkmoore/cyberlib ~=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=~=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=~--~=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=~=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=~

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Re: Bad news from Judge Richey
by anonymous-remailer＠shell.portal.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 11:33 PM 3/25/96 tcmay wrote: ------------------- jim bell: >talk to Jim Bell about implementing a program using encryption that doesn't >_need_ to be exported...legally anyway. tcmay: You're coming perilously close to actually calling for the killing of a federal judge. My recollection is that a couple of folks have been arrested and charged for calling for the killing of judges. ------------------- Any half-wit falling for Bell's agent provocateur setup will do hard time, or maybe get popped by his twitchy TLA watchers. The son-of-a-bitch's baiting with pigeons, no question. He's too myopic to see he's setting up falcons for gutting by high-circling eagles, who'll claw him too. Bell's going down blind-sided with his gulls, all easy prey.

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Re: Why Americans feel no compulsion to learn foreign languages
by tcmay＠got.net 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 8:17 PM 3/27/96, Michael Helm wrote: >On Mar 27, 3:13am, Timothy C. May wrote: >> Americans are typically thousands of miles away from those speaking >> Japanese, Mandarin, Tagalog, Polish, Italian, Dutch, Spanish, Hindi, >> Talegu, and the hundreds of other languages. It is not at all clear what >> language Americans should pick as a "second language" to study. > >I don't really disagree with the conclusions drawn by this poster, or >with the quasi-economics argument he makes. However, I must say that >the above is completely wrong. MOST Americans live in large urban >areas, & as such are within seconds/footsteps of people whose native >languages are not English (or who don't have a single "native language", >but several!). There are probably _hundreds_ of languages spoken in the >San Francisco Bay Area. The school districts here routinely report double >digit languages in the school age population. And? Your point being? "All learning is economics," to paraphrase our noted saying about security. Because there are diverse groups within 100 miles away speaking a babel of languages, including a per cent or so each of Thai, Talegu, Mandarin, Vietnamese, and so on, do I understand your point that I should pick one of these languages and spend a year or so learning it well enough to say to one of these groups, "Hello, can you tell me which way to the train station?" My point is not against the learning of a foreign language, just that economic considerations _must_ play a role. (Of course, people are free to ignore economics and "follow their bliss." A friend of mine studied Sanskrit for several years, and I even spent some time studying some Old Icelandic a few decades ago.) My European friends usually study the language of their direct neighbors and important trading/scientific partners. English, German, French, typically. >There are 3 Spanish language channels (& another 2 ... "multiple >choice") on my tv cable system. That anglophones choose to tune them >out, or to not even notice the Noah's ark around them, says something >about this culture. "Says something about this culture." Insults aside, you are right. I will sign up with the local JC for a study of Vietnamese, just so I won't be ignoring this cornucopia of polyglotism. (One person communicated with me in private about this, saying that the international nature of the Internet is an ironic counterpoint to my point. So I promised this guy I would learn Hindi and Polish to better be able to use the Internet. Of course, this'll take me a few years, and then I'll no doubt find that I don't have any interest in talking to the people on the Net who speak in Hindi or Polish, but, what the hell, I will have reduced my "anglophone chauvinism quotient.") --Tim Boycott "Big Brother Inside" software! We got computers, we're tapping phone lines, we know that that ain't allowed. ---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---- Timothy C. May | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money, tcmay(a)got.net 408-728-0152 | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero W.A.S.T.E.: Corralitos, CA | knowledge, reputations, information markets, Higher Power: 2^756839 - 1 | black markets, collapse of governments. "National borders aren't even speed bumps on the information superhighway."

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Re: Tim's friend's mildly retarded son
by E. ALLEN SMITH 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

From: IN%"tcmay(a)got.net" 22-MAR-1996 00:47:25.47 >At 11:17 PM 3/21/96, E. ALLEN SMITH wrote: >> This topic's relevance to Cypherpunks, aside from the confirmations >>that you mentioned, is low... aside from that it's of interest to Extropians >>such as myself and Tim May. >In recent months, a self-appointed group of list members have taken upon >themselves to argue that _anything_ that does not have to do with certain >topics they find appropriate is "not related to crypto, so take it >elsewhere." Regrettably, most reasonable people have grown quiet about >anything that smacks of politics or ideology, leaving the field clear for >certain ranting lunatics. Umm... I was referring to the discussion in regards to whether "smart drugs" work or not, not the discussion on the FDA. Sorry if I wasn't clear. Admittedly, some of my comments with regards to the FDA's ultraconservative/better-safe-than-sorry (depending on whose side you take) policy can be extended to an analysis of the NSA's behavior - putting the brakes on cryptography even after it becomes useless to do so, and after it becomes _necessary_ for America's future (commerce et al). -Allen

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