- cypherpunks-legacy - lists.cpunks.org

Stop Dreaming & Start Making Money!
by 72384400＠13117.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

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Your Listing on Yahoo
by search10＠earthlink.net 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

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Re: Request for illegal electronic surveillance examples and cases
by John Young 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Declan wrote: >So I'm putting together a special report featuring examples of illegal >wiretapping by governments -- to show why we shouldn't trust them with >mandatory domestic key escrow. Also illegal electronic surveillance, >generally speaking. Especially more recent ones. Maybe non-U.S. examples >too. There are a number of US cases in the just published "Secrets: The CIA's War at Home," by Angus Mackenzie. What is worth exploring to supplement the perhaps too facile gov-bash is the burgeoning private industry of illegal electronic surveillance, staffed with mostly ex-gov folks (and those not deft enough to get a global Cold War sinecure) who are not always as scrupulous as the government. These operations are growing worldwide as governments down-size, up-size and sneaky-rig their NatSec and LE programs, often most slyly by privatizing them behind false fronts. Indeed, the bigger story may be the ways illegal electronic snooping is being hidden behind "legal" operations by both government and industry, often working in concert to camouflage the bastardly deeds by pointing fingers at each other to justify higher budgets and higher fees and more restrictions on free expression. Get Stewart Baker looped and talkative. Then John Deutch, William Perry, and on and on. The media and DC public interest groups are not outside this long-running covert loop of mutual back-scratchers. Read "Secrets." Trace for example where the heads and legal counsels of military, spy and law enforcement agencies go in private industry, and the affiliations they form in commerce and non-profit orgs, beginning with SAIC, say, and the Council on Foreign Relations, the lobby-law firms and schools, but do not stop with the obvious, easy to find. Get Stewart Baker looped and talkative. Then John Deutch, William Perry, ex-legislators, and on and on. Be prepared to have your not-so-secure comm systems hacked by the New Terrorists as dirty secrets are threatened. Read "Secrets:" some of the characters in the crypto debate are mentioned in earlier disguises and, in a few case, where they show now.

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counter-intuitive -- spam is good for you. anonymous assholes are your friend
by Zooko Journeyman 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

I just got through reading another hilarious post from Anonymous, and I realized that instead of filtering anonymous posts _out_ of my reading list like I used to, I've gradually started filtering them _in_. I was thinking about why, and it illustrates a counter- intuitive hypothesis that's been germinating in my head for a few days/months/years. I'll call it "Zooko's Law of Evolutionary, Counter-Intuitive, Painful Serendipity": In an evolving ecosystem, things which appear to do harm often result in benefit. For example, if you consider having lots of healthy, happy bunnies to be a benefit, you might consider an influx of voracious wolves to be bad news. But in many cases the selective pressure exerted by the wolf population will result in stronger bunny genes, healthier bunnies, more bunny babies and cetera. In the case that the wolves leave again, or some other aspect of the environment changes (winter comes, etc.) then the population of passive grass-nibbling bunnies will turn out to be disappointingly fragile compared to the population of well-exercised wolf-fleeing bunnies. Now you might complain that I am not playing fair by tossing in these hypothetical environment changes late in the game. If we are evaluating _just_ the influx of wolves, and not some possible developments such as the wolves passing on, winter coming and so forth, then "obviously" the bunnies were better off without wolves. But perhaps that's just the point. In an evolving ecosystem, you _can't_ measure success without considering the likelihood of continual change. You might also object that I am sneaking in some unfounded Platonic concept of "bunny goodness" which only holds in certain contexts. I.e. maybe the environment will change in a way that penalizes bunnies with sinewy muscles and fast hearts and rewards big fat stupid bunnies who only think of the next nibble. Okay. Maybe I am. But my intuition tells me that this isn't some human-prejudice Platonic Ideal slipping in, but that in fact competition _does_ usually make the competitors better suited for all sorts of likely environmental changes. Now why do the cpunks care? Because I think the invasion of flaming, spamming Vulisses and "Graham-John Buellers" was good for the cpunks list. It drives away people with too little intelligence, stomache-strength, technical know-how or egostic attitude manage their own list input without depending on group dynamics to manage it for them. Okay, so like all "natural" selections, it takes out a few of the good guys too. I still miss Perry Metzger's involvement, but if we had to lose Perry in order to lose a few dozen clueless loudmouths, then so be it. Anyway, I consider it a Bad Thing that anonymous remailers are so difficult to learn and use. I would approve if point-n- click remailers and remailer clients were widely distributed. But in another application of Zooko's Law of Evolutionary Serendipity, the fact that remailers are hard to use means that the people who use them are smarter than average. So maybe _that's_ why I've found it rewarding to select _for_ anonymous posts instead of against in recent times. And why I toy with the notion of fomenting the kind of infowar "war games" that Phill Hallam-Baker hates. Damn, I wish Daniel Dennett were reading this list. Regards, Zooko Journeyman P.S. Just to tie up one loose end-- you might notice that I counted the flame-invasion as a goodness because it drove off "clueless loudmouths". But what's the difference between a "Graham-John Buellers" and a normal crypto-groupie? Is this a double-standard? Not at all. The clueless loudmouths that I am glad to be rid of are an insidious sort, like William H. Geiger III, Paul Bradley, and rest-his-soul Jim Bell who are on-topic and sane enough to attract attention from the real thinkers, but who are prolific and mediocre enough to pull down the over-all quality of discourse. Apologies to the named people for hurting your feelings. It's nothing personal, but I have to call 'em like I see 'em. Cut down the volume of your output to just the very best of your articles, and maybe I'll stop filtering you out.

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Upgrade to first class - nearly every time you fly...
by 53199432＠hotmail.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

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Re: Orthogonality and Disaster Recovery (fwd)
by Jim Choate 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Forwarded message: > Date: Sun, 26 Oct 1997 18:03:16 -0800 > From: David Sternlight <david(a)sternlight.com> > Subject: Re: Orthogonality and Disaster Recovery > > Do all E-Mail vendors need to be cryptologist?? > > If the client's e-mail is to be secure, yes. But let's be accurate here. I absolute agree we need to be accurate. To that end, it is not the applications that need security but rather the network and session layers. > > Do all cryptologist need > > to be application vendors?? Obviously not. > > Now that IS nonsensical because cryptology is a wide and deep art only a small > part of which has to do with mail applications themselves. In contrast, mail > applications to be secure must use encryption. There's some very muddy > thinking going on in your post. He said 'application vendors', not just mail. Pay attention to the details of the argument and quit trying to change the subject without specificaly noteing the change, otherwise known as a strawman. His muddy thinking doesn't stand alone. > > PGP is a tool much like a > > database is. The majority of vendors who develop apps that require a > > database do not go out and write their own, rather they use a database > > engine that is suited to their needs. > > Except for the occasional password protection, databases don't need encryption > to the extent e-mail does. I work everyday with the NSA, CIA, Dod, Army, SAIC, all the phone companies, many of the major banks, Intel, Human Genome Project, etc. Every one of these folks would disagree with you. In fact it was one of the motivating factors behind Tivoli comming out with their new Security Management application because vendors required us to move away from our custom databases and toward industry standards (Oracle, Sybase, Informix, DB2, DBMX, etc.) *AND* at the same time requiring a better security mechanism than the existing one we use (DES & Kerberos based). The reality of the market does not support your thesis. > You miss the point here. And you miss the many worked examples. RSA is selling > lots and lots of toolkits for lots and lots of money for in-line integration > into applications, not for pre- and post-processing. The former is the way to > go; the latter a kludge until something better comes along. Are they involved with the new Cryptographic Standard projects of the government and Tivoli - IBM? I don't think so, at least I still haven't seen them involved in any of the work I have had access to so far; much to my own personal disappointment. ____________________________________________________________________ | | | The financial policy of the welfare state requires that there | | be no way for the owners of wealth to protect themselves. | | | | -Alan Greenspan- | | | | _____ The Armadillo Group | | ,::////;::-. Austin, Tx. USA | | /:'///// ``::>/|/ http://www.ssz.com/ | | .', |||| `/( e\ | | -====~~mm-'`-```-mm --'- Jim Choate | | ravage(a)ssz.com | | 512-451-7087 | |____________________________________________________________________|

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Re: Orthogonal (fwd)
by Jim Choate 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Forwarded message: > Date: Sun, 26 Oct 1997 19:13:12 -0800 > From: Kent Crispin <kent(a)bywater.songbird.com> > Subject: Re: Orthogonal (fwd) > > > I do believe the use of the term this way was inspired by the > > > notion of a 'basis' in a vector space -- a set of orthogonal > > > vectors that span the space, ideally, unit vectors. > > > > Can you better define the term 'basis'? > > This is basic linear algebra: > > V a vector space -- the set of all (s1,s2,s3,...,sn), where si is an > element of the set of reals. Actualy si (scalars) can be rational, real, or complex. It is also possible to use more general structures such as fields. [1] Note that complex numbers numbers may be used, in other words a vector can be used to multiply another vector. > A set of vectors {v1,v2,...,vm} in V is A vector of vectors, and you haven't even really defined vector yet...:( > linearly independent if there is no set of scalars {c1,c2,...,cm} with > at least one non-zero element such that sum(ci*vi) == 0 Are you saying: (c1*v1)+(c2*v2)+...+(cn*vn) <> 0 where at least one ci is <>0, is some sort of test for membership in a vector space? What about, (1/c1*v1)+(-1/c2*v2)+(0*v3)...+(0*vn) = 0, 1 -1 if so it should be clear that except for the case of c=0 there is always a way to take two, which is clearly more than one, of the scalars and cause the sum to be zero. Now if you have a single non-zero scalar multiplier then it seems reasonable that you can create such a structure that is always <>0. > A set of > vectors S spans In other words 'are expressible in'? > a vector space V iff every element of V can be expressed > as a linear combination of the elements of S. ^^^^^^^^^^^ Need to better define this one. The operations that are applicable to a vector space are: [1] 1. Associative law of addition: (x+y)+z = x+(y+z) 2. Commutative law of addition: x+y=y+x 3. Existance of zero: x+0=x for all x in V 4. Existance of inverses: x+(-x)=0 5. Associative law of multiplication: a(bx)=(ab)x 6. Unital law: 1*x=x 7. First distributive law: a(x+y)=(a*x)+(a*y) 8. Second distributive law: (a+b)*x=(a*x)+(b*x) where x is of the form 'asubn(x^n)+bsubn-1(x^n-1)+...+asub1x+asub0' This is a remarkably circular definition to present. In clearer wording; The set of vectors S is expressible in a vector space V iff S is contained in V. While this may be a requirement or test for membership in a vector space (as used below) it doesn't qualify as a definition. > Finally, a basis for > V is a linearly independent set of vectors in V that spans V. A > space is finite dimensioned if it has a finite set for a basis. The ^^^ set of what? > standard basis (or natural basis) for a vector space of dimension n > is th set of vectors > > (1,0,0,...0) > (0,1,0,...0) > (0,0,1,...0) In other words, any 'vector' can be expressed as the sum of the multiplication of unit elements by some set of scalars. Is this definition something you just wrote or would you be so kind as to give the reference if it isn't. This definition uses 'basis', doesn't define it. You can't use a term to define the term, it's called circular reasoning. My question still stands, can you please better define 'basis'. Or is your claim that basis is simply a way of stating 'elements of unit magnitude'? Furthermore, a definition of vector space has nothing to do with orthogonal measurement systems, it does have to do with polynomials. It just so happens that this sort of geometry shares the same sort of rules, that doesn't make them the same thing. There is nothing in your description, in particular the nifty little (*,*,*,...*)'s that implies any sort of measurement system based on line-segment axis that are 90 degrees apart, merely that there is more than one variable (ie x,y,z,...a) involved. Vector space - a vector space is a set of objects or elements that can be added together and multiplied by numbers (the result being an element of the set), in such a way that the usual rules of calculations hold. [1] ____________________________________________________________________ | | | The financial policy of the welfare state requires that there | | be no way for the owners of wealth to protect themselves. | | | | -Alan Greenspan- | | | | _____ The Armadillo Group | | ,::////;::-. Austin, Tx. USA | | /:'///// ``::>/|/ http://www.ssz.com/ | | .', |||| `/( e\ | | -====~~mm-'`-```-mm --'- Jim Choate | | ravage(a)ssz.com | | 512-451-7087 | |____________________________________________________________________| [1] The VNR Concise Encyclopedia of Mathematics Gellert, Kustner, Hellwich, Kastner ISBN 0-442-22646-2 17.3 Vector spaces pp. 362 [Hallowen Trivia] 'Dracula' is a word derived from 'dracul' meaning dragon and was given to Vlad Tepish, whose name means 'son of the devil', he was further known as Vlad the Impaler because he would impale people on poles and place them along the roads in Transylvania. When he died in 1496 his head was impaled on a stick as well.

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Mmphmmphmmmph! (WAS Re: I Broke PGP!!!)
by bureau42 Anonymous Remailer 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

That was the sound of me eating crow. Although I am a closet reader of the True Story of the Internet series I am generally perturbed by the many of the inane Truthmonger posts to the list. I had decided several days ago to make a small apology to Truthmonger for some of my more emotional attacks on him (or her) but I put it off and put it off. I decided not to put it off after reading the following: Six wrote: > Bonus Question: "Who is TruthMonger #1?" > Bonus Answer: "He's Randall Farmer's best friend." That is _exactly_ what I thought when I read Randalls whining post about how Truthmongers rudeness might necessitate Randall instituting security and identity procedures that would enable others to verify whether a digitally signed message was indeed from himself. When I saw Tokoyo Rose echoing my thoughts then I thought I should take the trouble to point out what I myself learned from Truthmonger. [Although I am not certain if it is the same one.] I made the mistake of informing several people that the exercise that was suggested in Epiloge 5? of Infowar was bullshit but when I tried it it spit out my secret key like a hot damn much to my surprise. So I owe Truthmonger an apology but it will not be a public one. [Very few of you would know me anyway since I am mostly a list lurker.] The reason I will not make a public apology is because I also had PGP spit out the secret keys of my boss and coworkers. Although I am not a bad person in general possession of these keys is making me begin to think like Truthmonger. I will probably just test whether I can indeed password break them and use them to decipher a few files and then erase my copy of them. [Maybe.] [Maybe I should make my .sig line "Beware of Truthmonger inside!"] I did a search for the post that Tokoyo Rose talked about Truthmongers nephew adding things to Truthmongers email and found: > Also, as a 'teaser', I would like to announce to one and all that > the quickly closing saga of 'InfoWar' will include an epilogue > chapter titled, "I Broke PGP," written by myself. > Believe it or not, I speak the truth, although not in a way that > it direct and obvious. > If you think I am bullshiting, then stop washing your asshole, > starting today, because if you can show me I am wrong, I will kiss > your ugly, hairy ass. > > Love and Kisses, > TruthMangler After looking at other posts that have Truthmangler in them instead of Truthmonger I think that it might be a sign that the nephew is messing with them since they seem to have things inserted in them which appear to come more from a childs mind than Truthmongers. [If that is possible.] (;>) I would be interested in finding out if other people have been able to get secret keys using the method described in the Infowar book. We are using PGP 2.6.3i. I wonder about other versions. Croweatingmonger

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re: Hlep
by nobody＠REPLAY.COM 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Misty Ed the incredible talking horse.

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Re: Bell vs. Woodward--justice?
by nobody＠REPLAY.COM 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

MongerUnit #2347 writes: >It was apparent to many Canadians that the au pair would be found guilty >of having 'traditional British Reserve.' The American system of justice >is nothing more than a dog-and-pony show, particularly in hi-profile >cases. The dumb British kid was under some mistaken impression that >the trial would be based on facts. No doubt their decision to hire Barry Scheck was based on his quiet, gentle demeanor in front of a jury.

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