- cypherpunks-legacy - lists.cpunks.org

Re: [NOISY] Your own Zundelsite in five minutes or less
by shamrock＠netcom.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 23:45 1/30/96, Rich Graves wrote: [...] >I do not expect these news outlets to bother to, or know how to, check >whether mirror sites had already popped up before these "demands." I do >not expect these news outlets to find out and publicize the fact that it >was a couple of cypherpunks who detest Mr. Zundel who came up with the >idea the afternoon of January 27th, and handed it to Zundel the next day. So we don't get the credit and the nazis do. We'll survive. Everybody on this list knows what happend. -- Lucky Green <mailto:shamrock@netcom.com> PGP encrypted mail preferred.

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FYR_wal
by John Young 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

1-31-96. WSJ: "Chinese Firewall: Beijing Seeks to Build Version of the Internet That Can Be Censored." "We've eliminated what is undesirable and kept what is good." Which is, succinctly, China's riposte to the information age, from satellite television and real-time news to the Internet. Beijing eagerly seeks the fanciest information hardware, but it fears much of the software. China, in short, is determined to do what conventional wisdom suggests is impossible: Join the information age while restricting access to information. The reason: If the Internet has proved its utility, it has also become a fluid medium for the two things China's authoritarian government most dreads, political dissent and pornography. Industry insiders say China -- which has already bought some of the most powerful equipment available, from U.S.-based Cisco Systems Inc. and Sprint International, a unit of Sprint Corp. -- ultimately aims to create a monolithic Internet backbone, centrally administered, that minimizes the threat posed by the Internet's amoeba-like structure. FYR_wal

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Re: Fw: Re: Free Pronto Secure Offer
by geoff＠commtouch.co.il 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- To: unicorn(a)schloss.li, cypherpunks(a)toad.com Date: Thu Aug 15 10:53:53 1996 On 14 Aug unicorn wrote: > "Do all the work I should be doing or have done in the first place > discover the critical flaws in my new-keen-o-ka-jive-o crypto system > and I will give you a free copy of a critically flawed crypto system > (a $99.00 value) ABSOLUTELY FREE. Wait, don't order yet. Included > you also get to> actually whitewash my fence and then mow my lawn. > All at NO COST to you." Unicorn, please try to take a minute to think before hitting that send key. You infer that a product is critically flawed without even trying it ? There are quite a few members of this list who are using Pronto Secure and will testify to the contrary. See http://www.commtouch.com/testers.htm for a list of people who take the trouble to try out a product before venturing an opinion. Agreed that feedback from external testers is a good deal for developers. It is also not a bad deal for evaluators, they get a free copy of a product which in the case of Pronto Secure many find useful (as witnessed by x-mailer headers on c'punk traffic). Testers also get an opportunity to contribute neat feature ideas which helps propagate secure messaging to the masses. Unicorn, you are invited to whitewash my fence :) - --------------------------------------------------------------- Geoff Klein, Pronto Secure Product Manager; www.commtouch.com My PGP public Key 1814AD45 can be obtained by sending a message to geoff(a)commtouch.co.il with "Get PGP Key" as the subject. - ---------------------------------------------------------------- -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.3i Charset: noconv iQCVAwUBMhLXlELv5OMYFK1FAQHoCQP/Tg13glNoTAq4OdHJ5tay+x67kpAg3eIn JwMG/spaV/R5z9iec2wE3BQNWbta2lGF2hZUwkyRNUPX/01024024rg4wp3dIrUQ gk5vl9hG7kbTIOzLKgyEKvQs8yBs+9A3KfE3HY47vm78qMVF0QE11PECMWubnfg6 be7yL9/U64M= =923l -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

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Email Survey Form
by Netscape Communications 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Thank you for downloading one or more trial versions of Netscape Server applications from our Web site. We appreciate your interest in taking the time to evaluate some of our newest and most exciting products. We would like to follow-up with you to learn more about your company environment and better understand your needs. To do so, please click below or copy the URL site address listed below. http://netscape.web-register.com/cgi/netscape/form/www_form?x=141270 If you experience problems entering the site, and are prompted to enter a customer ID number; your number is 141270 - or you may call 1-888-349-3100. Netscape respects your online time and Internet privacy. If you would prefer not to receive future online surveys, please go to the site listed above and click on the box that has unsubscribe. Thank you for your time, Netscape Communications

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[local] Minneapolis CP get-together
by Kevin L Prigge 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Who: Minneapolis Cypherpunks What: Local get-together & key signing party When: Saturday, Feb 10th @ approx 5pm -> ??? Where: Applebees (3200 W Lake St) I'll be facilitating a key signing, send your public key to me before hand to get on the list. If you have any questions or need directions, let me know. -- Kevin L. Prigge |"Have you ever gotten tired of hearing those UofM Central Computing | ridiculous AT&T commercials claiming credit email: klp(a)tc.umn.edu | for things that don't even exist yet? 010010011101011001100010| You will." -Emmanuel Goldstein

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Re: [rant] A thought on filters and the V-Chip
by Duncan Frissell 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 11:56 AM 1/26/96 -0800, Alan Olsen wrote: >I have known too many adults that believe that by restricting their kids >access to information, they can prevent them from growing up. In these >parent's minds, such information is what makes them want to hump their >little brains out. Biology has nothing to do with it in their limited way >of thinking. Cluelessness does not just cover computers with these people. >It also covers any other topic that required more than two brain cells to >understand. Actually, if you place a child in one sort of environment or another you do get a different "product." The behavior of Amish children raised on farms in rural Pennsylvania differs significantly from the behavior of children raised crack-addicted parents in Bed-Stuy. In fact, you get almost non-overlapping bell curves for every characteristic. I would guess too that if you switched kids at birth between these two populations, the final results wouldn't differ by much. What parents are attempting to do when they restrain their children's access to "sex and drugs and rock and roll" (or Republicanism for that matter) is to mediate their "spiritual" environment to keep them from becoming hardened. They know the kids will grow up, they just want them to grow up in a nice way. Children who listen to Vera Lynn's singing and Cole Porter's songs will end up quite different from those who favor louder, less vocal music. Note that in spite of what liberals might think, fundamentalist christians are less likely to divorce, less likely to report spousal beatings, less likely to kill themselves, and more likely to measure high personal satisfaction levels on standard psychological tests than are, say, readers of The Nation. The cypherpunks relevance of all this is that it should soon be possible to create completely mediated environments for ourselves and our children. Through the use of implants and real-time VR processing, it will be possible to edit our "interface" with the Real World such that unpleasant aspects are edited out. We will be able to change the attire, hair, facial expressions, voice, and even smell of those around us to conform to our own esthetic desires. Likewise with our physical surroundings. Safety may discourage making a complete transformation in one's surroundings, but one can certainly soften the edges. Note that this is just an easier-to-implement version of what we can do already with our own minds. It will be interesting to see the effects on people who live in these mediated worlds. DCF "My grandmother didn't like to use the word 'Democrats' in the presence of the children. She called them 'bastards' instead." -- PJ O'Rourke

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Noise and the Nature of Mailing Lists
by tcmay＠got.net 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 3:55 AM 1/31/96, Laszlo Vecsey wrote: >FYI the traffic on the PGPdomo list has been very low lately. I haven't >received a message from the list in a few days. But then again there is >even more 'noise' on that list because every message I've seen posted on >it talks about PGPdomo, the mailing list, getting PGP software to work, >etc.. From what I've seen people just sign up to test it out with a test >message, and thats about it. Even with mkpgp for pine its still a bit >inconvenient to use, I think thats the reason for the low-traffic. I've been on a fair number of mailing lists, and they basically divide up into two broad categories: * Category I -- Busy, contentious, lively, high volume, prone to noise bursts, vibrant, interesting lists. Above critical mass. Like a crowded bar, with lively debate and always something happening. * Category II -- Quiet, polite, quiet, low volume, moribun, quiet, dead lists. Below critical mass. Like an empty bar, with only a few drunks staring into their beers. * Category III -- Working mailing lists, for folks working on a specific project or Internet standard. These can be low-volume with good signal, because they are not primarily social discussion groups but are, instead, simple communication-of-information groups. The Cypherpunks list is an obvious Category I list, and has been since it was started in October of 1992. It has noisy periods, times of flaming, but also a "critical mass" of new thought which obviously keeps it going, and even growing. If we are doing everything wrong, it's hard to tell from a "who cypherpunks" query sent to majordomo(a)toad.com. Other lists I have been on have been much quieter, averaging a few messages a day (or even less). On these lists, there is just no life. The occasional pleas for help are like cries from someone stranded on the Greenland icesheets. And I have seen formerly vibrant lists die off, becoming Category II groups, or worse. One list I used to be an extremely active contributor to was the "Extropians" list, which perhaps a dozen or so of you reading this message are now still on. The history of it is a long and involved one, which I won't get into, for various good reasons. But around late 1993 there were many of the same concerns about "noise" as people are now expressing. For most of 1993 the daily posting volume on the Extropians list exceeded the volume here on Cypherpunks. So various things were tried (they had the advantage of not being an anarchy, and the disadvantage of not being an anarchy). Ratings systems for posters and their posts, even attempts to impose "quotas" on the number of posts a person could write. All well-intentioned, but all failures and cures that were worse than the problem. By early 1994, both Perry Metzger and I had left the Extropians list, for our own reasons. No doubt the list got quieter. No doubt the volume went down. However, and current subscribers will no doubt jump in and give their views, I hear that the current volume of messages is less than one per day, with--according to my sources--sometimes days between messages. (I also hear that the Extropians are devoting more of their energy to their magazine, which may also be a factor.) Note that several well-intentioned efforts to create sub-lists of the Cypherpunks list have mostly failed. The DC-Net list, the lib-tech list, etc. I suspect that the "Remailer Operators" list is viable because it's a Category III working group list. Digest like CP-Lite I don't characterize as a separate kind of list. As to the new encrypted list, I wish them well. I doubt that list will do real well, though, because of the critical mass problem. And remember, it's a whole lot easier using filters and reading tools to reduce the volume of messages on an active group than it is to get an inactive group up to critical mass! --Tim Boycott espionage-enabled software! We got computers, we're tapping phone lines, we know that that ain't allowed. ---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---- Timothy C. May | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money, tcmay(a)got.net 408-728-0152 | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero W.A.S.T.E.: Corralitos, CA | knowledge, reputations, information markets, Higher Power: 2^756839 - 1 | black markets, collapse of governments. "National borders aren't even speed bumps on the information superhighway."

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No Subject
by Anonymous 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

>> > >HOW MUCH CODE DID 'CYPHERPUNK' TIM MAY EVER WRITE? > >I suppose the cyphernomicon doesn't count as furthering >the cause to you? ahhh, so when you say "cypherpunks write code" that also means articles and other writings too???? so you can be a cypherpunk by writing a lot of stuff ABOUT cypherpunks code???? but just cause you write the code or text, that's only one part of the equiation, right??? in other words is david chaum a cypherpunk????

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KOH "Helpful" Crypto Virus
by Laszlo Vecsey 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

I'm looking for more information on the KOH Virus, a 'helpful' virus which kindly asks to infect your system and encrypt all of your data. It spreads to floppies (upon request) and to other systems, encrypting all files. I read about it in Boardwatch magazine, which surprisingly states that the U.S. government forbids the distribution of all cryptographic programs in binary form; source code can be freely distributed. Please point me towards the source/binary, or further information. (define(RSA m e n)(list->string(u(r(s(string->list m))e n))))(define(u a)(if(> a 0)(cons(integer->char(modulo a 256))(u(quotient a 256)))'()))(define(s a)(if (null? a)0(+(char->integer(car a))(* 256(s(cdr a))))))(define(r a x n)(cond((= 0 x)1)((even? x)(modulo(expt(r a(/ x 2)n)2)n))(#t(modulo(* a(r a(1- x)n))n)))) "SGI and Linux both run Motif and X11. They both compile c++ cleanly (using gnu g++). They're the same!"

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Re: [NOISE] Borenstein's Fatal Spam
by daw＠boston.CS.Berkeley.EDU 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- In article <pgpmoose.199602010813.60849(a)paganini.sydney.sterling.com>, Greg Rose <Greg_Rose(a)sydney.sterling.com> wrote: > A number of people have written words to the > effect of: > First Virtual, you lost a lot of ground with me. > (sounds like others feel the same way, too). > > I disagree. I think there is a big difference > between "knowing theoretically that X, Y and Z > are possible" and "look, I have a program that > does X, Y and Z in a certain order, and very > fast, and surprisingly successfully, and this has > major implications for the banking community". [...] > I think most of the problem here is that we heard > about it in media words first, and in a reasoned > argument second. That's life. Ok. Fair enough. Good points. Personally, what I found most distasteful about FV's post was their conclusions, not their experimental procedure. I agree that their keyboard-sniffer lends more evidence to the well-known argument that, to make good use of crypto, you need secure endpoint machines. I disagree when FV concludes that this makes crypto useless. Instead, I'd contend we just need to work to secure our endpoints better; then we can do all sorts of neat stuff with crypto. I found their conclusions to be academically displeasing. But I guess that's what happens when you're trying to sell a product... - -- Dave Wagner - --- [This message has been signed by an auto-signing service. A valid signature means only that it has been received at the address corresponding to the signature and forwarded.] -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.2 Comment: Gratis auto-signing service iQBFAwUBMQ/lHSoZzwIn1bdtAQG3bQF6AnSQY/3Hy6ha35vI5YrbyF8w7Xq/IcN9 IIwNqUKmrqlugKuduk0A9VqDG9Zi0Ksm =7awQ -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

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