December 2003 - cypherpunks-legacy

Re: No Subject ( camera nonsense )
by Michael Motyka 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

> I think we read a message not so long ago from a 'punk who > spotted the prototype of these 'bomb-sniffing cameras' along > a California highway, no? > Don't remember the date but when asked to pinpoint the thing so someone else could actually go take a look there was no response from the original poster. I wrote it off as babbling. There is one device above the westbound section of 580 on the Livermore side of the Altamont pass. About the size of a small SpectraPhysics Laser, the surface appears solid - i.e. no visual sensor. My best guess - radar for either speed measurement or traffic density measurement. Chemical sniffer - NOT. Radiation detector - perhaps, but I doubt it. Best bet - traffic analysis. These counties here are always fighting about population growth and the traffic implications. As if one stinking town owns the entire godamned federal interstate. Little, carpetbagging Napoleans everywhere you look. As for neural systems detecting illegal activity - yeah? what? Two people talking? Looking disreputable? Having their hands *appear* to coincide for a second? This "technology", if detected in a public place, should be zapped and the promoters tarred and feathered*. *Superglue or RTV and polyfill may legally be substituted for the traditional materials. m

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Re: (fwd)
by Jim Choate 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Forwarded message: > Date: Wed, 9 Dec 1998 07:26:21 -0800 (PST) > From: "Joel O'Connor" <ogrenivek(a)yahoo.com> > Subject: Re: > They say education is power abd naybe they were correct. I agree with > the fact that more people need to use encryption, the problem (as you > stated) is that people do not understand how to use it, or even know > it exists. Unfortunate for us, fortunate for big brother. While the > only way we can counteract this debate is through empowerment, the > question remains, how do you spread the word to up to a million > people, enough to get their interest and keep it, enough to take the > time to teach them how to use the tools. I work for an IT department I'd say the obvious answer is to buy a spammers mailing list and then use it to send out a one-time-only missive on the issues with a directive of where to go for more information. Mass email letters to newspapers all over the US (or whereever you are). Hit usenet with copies. Buy add space in newspapers and magazines. Hit up the local media for PSA's. Use the local public access television stations. etc. It's not the how that people are having a hard time with, it's the why. ____________________________________________________________________ If I can put in one word what has always infuriated me in any person, any group, any movement, or any nation, it is: bullying Howard Zinn The Armadillo Group ,::////;::-. James Choate Austin, Tx /:'///// ``::>/|/ ravage(a)ssz.com www.ssz.com .', |||| `/( e\ 512-451-7087 -====~~mm-'`-```-mm --'- --------------------------------------------------------------------

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Intelligent cameras, a reference
by Jim Choate 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Hi, Scientific American Apr. 1996 Smart Rooms Alex P. Pentland pp. 68 - 76 ____________________________________________________________________ If I can put in one word what has always infuriated me in any person, any group, any movement, or any nation, it is: bullying Howard Zinn The Armadillo Group ,::////;::-. James Choate Austin, Tx /:'///// ``::>/|/ ravage(a)ssz.com www.ssz.com .', |||| `/( e\ 512-451-7087 -====~~mm-'`-```-mm --'- --------------------------------------------------------------------

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LEA Interviews
by John Young 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

This is attorney protected information. We've been having discussion with a legal person about being interviewed by law enforcement officials and/or signing a statement. These comments are offered by permission (and might be coupled with DCF's advice of saying only "I Want a Lawyer"): [Begin comments] > What do you mean, that they would use the information to > "impeach" a possible witness? Do you mean that he would not > be called to testify against a defendant? Sorry to be opaque - "impeachment" means, basically, making a witness lose credibility with the jury. The only use I've been able to imagine for wanting a written statement is to make you look bad, in the event that you are called by either side to testify, and end up testifying favorably to the defendant. If you appear to be a "hostile witness", it's even possible that you can be impeached by the attorney/party who asked you to testify. The scenario I see looks something like this - 1. You're called as a defense witness to testify to the effect that you've been on the list for years, messages like the defendants's weren't unique or especially unusual, that you understood them as satire or political commentary and not as actual threats, given the wider context in which they occurred. The general impression conveyed by your testimony is that you're a rational, reasonable, respectable person who the jury can like and trust, that you think the defendant is perhaps weird but basically misunderstood and harmless. 2. The prosecution cross-examines you about your conclusions re the defendant - they're going to ask you how well you really knew/know him, how much you knew about his other behavior (they're likely to try to sneak in information about the defendant's other alleged misbehavior here, if they haven't already), and so forth. To the extent that you say you didn't know him, your direct testimony becomes less and less relevant - and if you start to say that you did know him well, they're likely to produce the document you wrote/signed, and ask you a series of uncomfortable questions about it, designed to create the impression you were lying to the jury earlier during your testimony, e.g., if the statement says "I didn't know that the defendant had done these other creepy things, and they make me question whether or not I know him very well, and I feel differently about his threats now that I know about those creepy things", the prosecutor will make a big production out of pointing out the differences between your testimony at trial and what you wrote during the LEA interrogation. Understandably, you probably wanted to distance yourself from the defendant when the LE agents were in your home, especially after they'd given you a list of creepy things he supposedly did - but they're going to hold you to the same degree of distance from him and his thoughts/actions if you end up testifying at trial. Writing it down and having you sign it serves several purposes - it gives the prosecutor a document s/he can wave around, ask you to read from, and otherwise organize a little production around - it also lets you be impeached with your own words, instead of calling the cops to the stand to dispute your recollection of your conversation, which takes on a "he said/she said" tone, and might make it look like the big mean cops were picking on poor little you. If they can make poor little you eat his own words, they look good, and you look bad. So .. that's what I'm afraid the document is for. I've been trying to think of something else - but especially where the agents asked you to pick out just key bits of your conversation, and assert that they're true, and let the rest of the information be lost to memory and time .. it makes me think the information they selected was important to them. The information they got seems helpful to them only in the context that you end up testifying at trial - I can't think of any other reason it would be useful to them. It sounds like the psychological factors of the questioning were pretty well optimized to make you want (probably partly subconsciously) to distance yourself from the defendant, both to avoid implied guilt by association, and to maintain a common ground of reasonableness with the cops while discussing other things like politics. The current issue of the Utne Reader has a piece by the Unabomber's brother and his wife talking about how the FBI manipulated them into providing evidence against the Unabomber by appearing sympathetic and reasonable, forming a common "us (good people) versus the actions of they crazy guy, who needs us to work together to help him get better" bond which was ultimately used to try to kill the crazy guy, to the horror of the brother/wife. While I do think that they may have pulled a fast one on you, I don't think that reflects badly on you as a person .. it's pretty difficult to tell which cops are actually reasonable people, and which are pretending to be reasonable people in order to further their own agendas. [End comments]

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RE: Encryption for the Masses
by Wilson, Jamie (J.R.) 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 We live in a society where freedom is largely an illusion and where Big Brother doesn't fear protest by the general population. In most cases, simply creating a crisis is enough for individuals to not only give their liberties up but to actually plead for their liberties to be taken away in the name of safety and security. What they don't realize is that the sheep are begging the wolves to protect them. It's not the militia guy next door that I'm worried about -- he pretty much tells us what he's up to. What I'm afraid of is the NSA reading my email and listening to my phone calls without my knowledge. So how do we get the masses to realize that we aren't talking about a potential threat, but are actually already living in a Big Brother society with very few secrets. We can continue to bury our heads in the illusion that we really are free, but we have to ask ourselves whether we are more free today than we were ten years, five years or even a year ago. If the answer is no, then there is a serious problem. So excusing my rant, my point is that when the average individual wakes up and realizes that his or her life really is an open book and that every piece of email sent has been filtered through a computer somewhere, that every posting to a newsgroup has been archived and just may pop up and haunt them in the future, when they realize that the only privacy available to them is the privacy that they claim and defend then, and only then, will we see a change in crypto policies around the world. When the citizenry begins demanding accountability by elected officials for the privacy that they've sold, for the chains they've placed on their constituents and for the oaths they have broken then we'll see the tide change for the better. Until then, the rest of us will have to wage the fight to protect the ignorant. ____________________________________________________ J. Richard Wilson -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: PGP for Personal Privacy 5.5.5 iQA/AwUBNm7BSsDUWXiy5rQXEQJRUQCdEUMFE6kfNz2/hzJmOmiKoAyEKEYAoNtd vAJ/Hc/RTsdDs+F7eLnroqCT =Gxd/ -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -----Original Message----- From: Joel O'Connor [mailto:ogrenivek@yahoo.com] Sent: Wednesday, 09 December, 1998 10:26 To: Anonymous Cc: Cypherpunks(a)toad.com Subject: Re: They say education is power abd naybe they were correct. I agree with the fact that more people need to use encryption, the problem (as you stated) is that people do not understand how to use it, or even know it exists. Unfortunate for us, fortunate for big brother. While the only way we can counteract this debate is through empowerment, the question remains, how do you spread the word to up to a million people, enough to get their interest and keep it, enough to take the time to teach them how to use the tools. I work for an IT department and the users I train rank from intelligent to "where the hell did you come from?!" Teaching people who have no want or need is the hardest part, just ask Christians, they know what it's like. Our greatest problems lie within our inability to train and make use of what lies in front of us, if people don't see the need, then why would they? Another point, some people feel that if they have nothing to hide, then why use it. An acquaitance of mine has the same stubborn attitude, what steps do you take to thwart that? That excuse bothers me beyond belief, but it is a common thought that if you need to take the steps to hide something, then it must be wrong. God help us. . . ---Anonymous <nobody(a)replay.com> wrote: > > I think setting up mirror sites of crypto archives > across the world is a great idea. However, I also > think we need to focus on getting more and more > people to use crypto. I would guess that the vast > majority of computer users worldwide see no use > for encryption in their day-to-day lives -- and > even those that do don't also use it. > > If everybody in the world is using encryption, it > is going to be extremely difficult for "democratic" > governments to tell them they can't use it any more. > > Unfortunately, it's easy for governments to blame > crypto for terrorism and a host of other crimes, > simply because the average citizen doesn't understand > the concept of an "electronic envelope". > > > == Ogre bounces like sonar. . .Peace. Ogre _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

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Re: The politics of crypto archives (fwd)
by Jim Choate 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Forwarded message: > Date: Wed, 09 Dec 1998 20:03:05 +0100 > From: Mok-Kong Shen <mok-kong.shen(a)stud.uni-muenchen.de> > Subject: Re: The politics of crypto archives > We were talking about a site that has to be closed because of (new) > crypto laws, not technically down which is seldom with modern hardware. > And also you said that money is no problem! You need to go back and re-read what prompted this. Your responce is completely out of context. > Why you care so much about people who voluteer to run sites? They > certainly know what kind of risks that they probably face, financial > or otherwise. Do you care your neighbour who opens up a new company > and do you feel unconditionally have to give him advices?? Are you > the one who is cleverer than all the others? It depends, do I shop there? I'm done with this discussion. You want to expect people to put their neck on the line and you use their services while owning them nothing then wonder why nobody does it, so be it. ____________________________________________________________________ If I can put in one word what has always infuriated me in any person, any group, any movement, or any nation, it is: bullying Howard Zinn The Armadillo Group ,::////;::-. James Choate Austin, Tx /:'///// ``::>/|/ ravage(a)ssz.com www.ssz.com .', |||| `/( e\ 512-451-7087 -====~~mm-'`-```-mm --'- --------------------------------------------------------------------

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Re: German government press release on Wassenaar (fwd)
by Jim Choate 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Forwarded message: > Date: Wed, 9 Dec 98 20:04 +0100 > From: ulf(a)fitug.de (Ulf =?iso-8859-1?Q?M=F6ller?=) > Subject: Re: German government press release on Wassenaar > 1.) Officials point out that "export control" does not mean "export > restriction". Spin-doctor bullshit. There are forms of "export control" (such as the > requirement to notify the Export Office of your exports) that do not > hinder the export of crypto software in any significant way. So it > remains to be seen how Germany and other countries will implement > the new rules. And why should one need to notify them if there is not at least the implied ability on their part to say "NO, you won't either."? > 2.) The government has acknowledged that public domain software > remains unrestricted. This also applies to copyrighted software such > as PGP which "has been made available without restrictions upon its > further dissemination". PGP is NOT unrestrited. ____________________________________________________________________ If I can put in one word what has always infuriated me in any person, any group, any movement, or any nation, it is: bullying Howard Zinn The Armadillo Group ,::////;::-. James Choate Austin, Tx /:'///// ``::>/|/ ravage(a)ssz.com www.ssz.com .', |||| `/( e\ 512-451-7087 -====~~mm-'`-```-mm --'- --------------------------------------------------------------------

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No Subject
by owner-cypherpunks＠Algebra.COM 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

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Re: News on Wassenaar anyone?
by Ted Rallis 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

If cryptography protecting intellectual property is exempt from regulation, my words are now my intellectual property -- all of them. Ted Jan Garefelt <jang(a)pobox.se> on 12/08/98 11:11:33 AM To: cypherpunks(a)toad.com cc: (bcc: Ted Rallis/Certicom) Subject: News on Wassenaar anyone? Does anyone have information on the new Wassenaar arrangement, or information on when official information will be available? I'm only interested in the crypto parts, and I have already read the Aaron/Reuter story found on http://www.crypto.com/reuters/show.cgi?article=912708583 Thanks /Jan Garefelt

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Global Strike to protest Wassenaar
by Ken Williams 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hi, "Strike to protest Wassenaar!" URL: http://www.zanshin.com/~bobg/ "This is a global call for computer professionals to strike on Monday, 14 December, 1998 to protest the signing of the Wassenaar Arrangement, an international treaty that imposes new restrictions on cryptographic software technology. The strike is meant to raise awareness about the importance of cryptography, about the U.S. government's wrongheaded attempts to curtail its use, and about the strong-arm tactics used by the United States to pressure other countries into limiting their citizens' rights the way it has limited its own." Regards, Ken Williams Packet Storm Security http://www.Genocide2600.com/~tattooman/ E.H.A.P. Head of Operations http://www.ehap.org/ ehap(a)ehap.org NC State CS Dept http://www.csc.ncsu.edu/ jkwilli2(a)unity.ncsu.edu PGP DSS/DH/RSA Keys http://www4.ncsu.edu/~jkwilli2/pgpkey/ ___________________________________________________________________ Get Your Email Sniffed and Decrypted for Free at http://www.nsa.gov -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: PGPfreeware 5.0i for non-commercial use Charset: noconv iQEVAwUBNm/VQJDw1ZsNz1IXAQGzygf/Zt/sP419T5dA1gY/Rru7ACtv6xWXWMUA HDBQPFbGV8yviOIU7N2bHndWGtr+hjPcdoudoXlOwYF73/TybNSzs6J/iAF9yhSR UmRKM+suH8FwJ90F+i36W8hCQrkhPYXEwXW4AWDEeGNKjZdRLApS/POMcnTWoTSK iHwDsdE+AevhlcWuC1nk80AlSEVNE/B2zmbWGax12tciM2NxTc4AqtqI3BwXebVq f/04ZC9515dR/XHGhtbmQ08sTNS9eQUG8H626XE58XtE+MOsVEJYjUQFDd9L13T2 dlun/4+U1J9xMmN8uYlUySxKr9XmharSXLJCmpmIaE0bwDwTx7Pkpw== =DaVN -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

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