December 2003 - cypherpunks-legacy

Red-necks w/ a purpose...
by Jim Choate 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Forwarded message: > Date: Sun, 7 Dec 1997 03:54:05 -0500 > From: Anonymous <anon(a)anon.efga.org> Why does your remailer strip the subject header? > > Since crypto-anarchy & free-market economic anarchy both do away with > > centralized authorities isn't this sort of behaviour what is *expected* of > > members of the community under these systems? Doesn't the fact that there is > > a clear and present danger to both person and community justify these sorts > > of actions? > > > > The concept of "Free-Market-Crypto-Anarchy" doesn't jibe with the > "Lynch-Mob Democracy" mentality exhibited by Gates. What has this to do with a couple of rednecks stopping an alleged criminal out of the goodness of their hearts? Further, what exactly are you talking about in reference to Gates? Yes, he is rich but what specificaly are you referning to in regards to his mentality and lynch-mob democracies? All government or social systems resort to lynch-mod mentatility without some sort of bill of rights or other explicit restrainer on the system. Even free-market-crypto-anarchy will devolve to this. Why do supports of free-market-crypto-anarchy ignore issues regarding excesses of their beloved systems and what kinds of checks-and-balances need to be implimented to resolve those issues? Are you really going to claim that under free-market-crypto-anarchy we have finaly found angels in the forms of men? Is your claim that had there been a free-market-cryto-anarchy these people would not have committed the crime in the first place and hence the police and the rednecks could have stayed home? Is free-market-crypto-anarchy the final solution in human conflict resolution? > One of the > fundamental principles of anarchy is a willingness to let others hash > out their own problems, i.e. I will ignore him unless his actions > impact or affect me personally/financially. This is a tenet of democracy as well. However, am I to interpret your statement to mean that no, these rednecks were out of line? If so, my question still stands. With no centralized authority of any sort and by extension no centralized police force whose job is it to stop criminals? Under a free-market-crypto-anarchy exactly how does the peace-keeping process work? > It is not as if the Gates were going to be affected by the > "suspects"...they had to go out of their way to interfere with someone > else's pursuit of happiness. That is clearly unacceptable. The last > thing we need is a deputized citizenry...talk about a police state. > (I guess that would be the ultimate form of the "Policeman Inside") If there were no police force I am sure Gates with all his money would be on the top of a lot of hit lists - just too juicy a target to pass up. The police we have now are deputized citizens. *That* happens to be one of the safety checks. What is your point? ____________________________________________________________________ | | | | | We built your fort. We will not have it used against us. | | | | John Wayne - Allegheny Uprising | | | | | | _____ The Armadillo Group | | ,::////;::-. Austin, Tx. USA | | /:'///// ``::>/|/ http://www.ssz.com/ | | .', |||| `/( e\ | | -====~~mm-'`-```-mm --'- Jim Choate | | ravage(a)ssz.com | | 512-451-7087 | |____________________________________________________________________|

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Thanks all!
by Alex Woolfson 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

I LOVE the cypherpunks. :-) Thanks all for your very useful and thorough analysis of that documentation from the makers of Encypted Magic Folders. It was great (particular thanks to Ray and Bill!). As I like the concept behind it and would love to encourage these turkeys to use strong crypto, I would like to forward some of the messages to the company that makes the product. If you would prefer I not do this (or would like me to not include your name or email address), please let me know. I'm not going to do this for a week to give people time to get back to me. Looks like Bill is already on their butts, already, anyway. :-) Maybe he can smack some sense into 'em. And maybe someone here could come up with a cypherpunk equivalent? (unless someone already has...) Be cool if to have this at Punk Strength. Unfortunately, my own ability to code needs much work... Again, thanks. You guys were a great help. Alex

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CypherPunk Post of the Century [WAS: Get your hand off that <delete> button. Now!] [WAS: It's beginning to look a lot like...Donald?]
by Toto 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

:: Anon-To: isthisamistakeoratrick(a)theshadow.nose Nobody said: {Honest! Nobody said it, so I made it up and added quote marks so I wouldn't look like I was responding to my own post. If you'll check the archives, you'll find even Tim May _didn't_ say the following:} > I have refused to vote Republican for President ever since their > unconscionable travesty wherein they dropped the superior candidate, > the monkey, and ran Ronnie RayGuns for the position. > The die (no pun intended) has been set for the next Presidential > election, with Clinton being politically assassinated, and Gore > getting Clinton all over him (as opposed to vice-versa in a physical > assassination). > I have already made my quadra-annual vow not to vote for Donald Duck > for President again, but the muckers in power just won't give me a > reasonable option. > Oh, well. At least I can still say I'm an animal rights activist. FREEZE! Get your finger off of that <Delete> button, and slowly back away from the keyboard... After subjecting the subscribers to the CypherPukes and Flight-from- Censorship lists to multiple spams of an Eldridge cleaverly disguised and disgusting on-topic post, I thought it would be appropriate to make amends by wrapping myself in the state flag with the python on it and writing "The History of the Present : A CypherPunk Perspective." {Originally titled, "Everything You Wanted To Know About Freedom and Privacy, But Were Imprisoned For Asking."} First, allow me to point out that those who believe my disclaimers that my posts are meaningless may possibly be even bigger fools than those who believe list posts which claim to be packed with meaning. It's a tough call... There are list subscribers who provide spoon-fed information for those who are busy and important and don't have time to think (executive sheeple?), but (Young and Hettinga both being classical examples) the pressure of faking sanity eventually gets to them and they snap into an acid-flashback condition that results in posts containing existential poetry or advertisements for grits. I, on the other hand, help balance the lists by beginning at a point of total blathering, and work my way slowly toward sanity and reason. The fact that I rarely succeed at this indicates to me that my posts are usually not long enough to complete the process, so I will endeavor to ramble on endlessly in this missive, for the eventual benefit of the person who is still reading this post. (Me?) AN INFOWAR FAIRY TALE: Ode to Bianca Once upon time there was a woman with breasts so beautiful that men would try to grab them at every opportunity, with only an honored few being allowed to touch them (as a result of recognizing that she had an equally beautiful brain). The woman worked in a computer industry dominated by young men who had spent so much time cloistered among their machines that they did not know much about humans, and almost nothing about women, including the fact that women are all witches. Thus, the beautiful witch was able to trick the owners of protruding hardware into exposing their secret things to her, so that she was able to follow the bytes as they metamorphisized into software. These men were powerful lions of the computer industry, drawing their great strength from their long mane-frames, little suspecting that a female systems analyst, with a heritage that taught her how to use scissors to cut efficiently and shape the results into a new form of clothing, might cut off the long locks from which they drew their strength, while they were sleeping, and weave them into a wig of many colors, enabling her to let down her hair, thus allowing her secret lovers to climb up to the tower of the computer master's castle. THE REQUISITE 'MORAL OF THE STORY': 'Tit men' are unlikely to notice if Lady Godiva is riding a Trojan (pardon the pun) Horse. "Am I a Freeh, dreaming I am a Zimmermann, or Zimmermann, dreaming I am Freeh?" ~ Phil Dunkelberger, General Manager, Total Nework Security Division, Network Associates "As long as we have Kim Philby defending our country, Communist Americans can sleep safely at night." ~ J. Eggbert Hoover "Be afraid. Be very afraid..." ~ Huge Cajones, Addressing the 'Global Society of Unelected Secret Committees' "Why The Government Wants Our Guns" by John Young ----------------------------------- http://www3.phillynews.com/packages/somalia/nov16/rang16.asp "Why The Government Wants Our Keys" by Tim C. May ----------------------------------- The Feds have shown their hand: they want a ban on domestic cryptography "Why Privacy is Dangerous in the Hands of Non-Chinese-Communist American Citizens Who Don't Make Major Campaign Contributions" --------------------------------------------------------------- From: softwar(a)us.net (SOFTWAR) One example of Reno's conflict is the Clinton China Crypto Scam. It was Reno's Justice Anti-Trust Division that authorized the merger of a major company backed by a big donor to the DNC. The companies, RSA and Security Dynamics, sought the merger in 1996 just after RSA Chairman James Bidzos signed a memo of understanding to perform "encryption research" with China. The donor, Sanford Robertson, paid $100,000 to the DNC just prior to the merger. Of course, Mr. Robertson's investment firm made a cool two million dollars on the merger deal, spurred in part by the lucrative RSA contract with the PRC. Pro-Crypto-Export Bumper-sticker: "Export Free Speech and Privacy, Not Jobs!" Anti-Domestic-Crypto Bumpersticker: "Free Speech and Privacy Kill Molested Children With Terrorist Bombs." It's comforting to know that my right to speak freely and privately in Mandarin Chinese is not being abridged... It's discomforting to realize that George Orwell was an optomist... Anybody notice that PGP 5+ 'offers' to upload your newly created key _before_ it adds it to your keyring? Everybody realize that 'VoluMandatory Offer' == 'Requirement'? Anybody doubt the future of key generation <--> key registration? My point? Those who wish to 'fight-censorship' had better be prepared to start fighting 'dirty'...as well as fighting 'underground'. If you think I'm kidding, reflect for a moment on why the Chinese Communists are being allowed increasing access to strong encryption while censorship fighting CypherPunks are becoming subject to an increasing number of laws restricting domestic strong encryption. i.e. - The Chinese Communists do not fit the profile of domestic terrorists, as reported recently on the list--they don't quote the Constitution and Bill of Rights and speak out against big government. The Bottom Line: Big Brother is going Global. The PowerMongers are not just dividing up the financial spoils among themselves, they are also beginning to divide up the humans and human rights among themselves. You can already be imprisoned in Alabama for your web site in Utah. It will not be long before you can be imprisoned in Germany for your web site in Alabama. The government is building their backdoors. Individuals who value their freedom and privacy need to do the same. The government is arming themselves with meatspace and cyberspace weaponry. Ibid. Don't be alarmed...be armed! Be very armed... Toto ~~~~ "The Xenix Chainsaw Massacre" http://bureau42.base.org/public/xenix "WebWorld & the Mythical Circle of Eunuchs" http://bureau42.base.org/public/webworld "InfoWar" http://bureau42.base.org/public/infowar3 "The Final Frontier" http://www3.sk.sympatico.ca/carljohn "God's Canadian Hate Page" http://www3.sk.sympatico.ca/carljohn/godhate/godhate.htm

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Re: Singapore (fwd)
by Jim Choate 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Forwarded message: > From: frissell(a)panix.com > Date: Sun, 07 Dec 1997 20:58:27 -0500 > Subject: Re: Singapore > I think that many of us ("We Are All Liberals Now" -- The Economist, 1997) > ignore economic liberty when comparing regimes. Measure of government form: Type Manage Own Democracy Individual Individual Communism State State Facism State Individual Note that it is quite easy to have a government type that falls between these. Consider the current situation in the US, Rep-Democ Ind/State Ind/State ____________________________________________________________________ | | | | | We built your fort. We will not have it used against us. | | | | John Wayne - Allegheny Uprising | | | | | | _____ The Armadillo Group | | ,::////;::-. Austin, Tx. USA | | /:'///// ``::>/|/ http://www.ssz.com/ | | .', |||| `/( e\ | | -====~~mm-'`-```-mm --'- Jim Choate | | ravage(a)ssz.com | | 512-451-7087 | |____________________________________________________________________|

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Re: Singapore & Freedom
by Secret Squirrel 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Harish Pillay <harish(a)brokat.com.sh> wrote: >Interesting that you hide behind an anomymous name and you claim to >be outside Singapore. I for one, will stand by my name and say that >things I should say about this country of mine (warts and all) and >not have to hide behind anonymity (not that I would not use anonymity >ever :-)). Typical.

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Re: Singapore
by Phillip M. Hallam-Baker 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

> Hallam-Baker obviously thinks that he can thwart my insightful, >barbed diatribes against him by posting empty messages to the >CypherPunks list, No, I was merely speechless. If you think that Singapore is a Libertarian paradise then you are not a Libertarian. I don't doubt that Duncan is capable of being an appologist for the Signapore regime just as there were a lot of 'Communists' who used to fawn over Stalin. The fact is that Singapore taps every telephone call, monitors every public place and performs traffic analysis to identify dissident communities. The fear of being identified in such a community is a major means of suppressing dissent. Duncan and Declan are merely indulging in a very popular passtime of idealogues, fawning over benevolent dictatorships. Phill

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reno, encryption, rsa, etc. (softwar)
by Vladimir Z. Nuri 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

------- Forwarded Message Date: Thu, 04 Dec 1997 16:05:55 -0800 From: "J. Orlin Grabbe" <kalliste(a)aci.net> To: snetnews(a)world.std.com Subject: SNET: [Fwd: FREEH SPEECH] - -> SearchNet's SNETNEWS Mailing List From: softwar(a)us.net (SOFTWAR) Subject: FREEH SPEECH Date: Thu, 04 Dec 1997 17:09:51 GMT General Reno has declined to appoint an Independent Counsel to investigate campaign abuses by the Clinton White House. Several Congressional leaders have sputtered they are concerned about Ms. Reno's conflict of interest in the matter. Of course, the Republican specifics of her "conflict" never go past the fact that she was appointed by Clinton. However, the connections between Ms. Reno and the Clinton scandals are well known to at least one person inside the Beltway. One example of Reno's conflict is the Clinton China Crypto Scam. It was Reno's Justice Anti-Trust Division that authorized the merger of a major company backed by a big donor to the DNC. The companies, RSA and Security Dynamics, sought the merger in 1996 just after RSA Chairman James Bidzos signed a memo of understanding to perform "encryption research" with China. The donor, Sanford Robertson, paid $100,000 to the DNC just prior to the merger. Furthermore, Mr. Robertson was on the list of those called by Al Gore from the White House and the MONEY arrived just after Gore's call. In fact, $20,000 of Robertson's donation was split into a HARD money account by the DNC. Of course, Mr. Robertson's investment firm made a cool two million dollars on the merger deal, spurred in part by the lucrative RSA contract with the PRC. Yet, Ms. Reno was also directed officially by President Clinton to oversee the "encryption problem" and enforce policy. For example, according to recently declassified documents from the Clinton National Security Council, Ms. Reno was tasked by President Clinton in 1993 to oversee the Clipper project. Ms. Reno was directed by Clinton to purchase 9,000 Clipper phones for the FBI. In addition, Clinton directed Ms. Reno to prepare Clipper for export. Finally, Reno was tasked to convince the US communications and computer industry to voluntarily implement the Clipper "key escrow" back door into all US made products. Simply put, Ms. Reno was, and is still, in charge of bugging America's telephones. Yet, how far can Ms. Reno go? According to the Presidential Directive, "Should (US) industry fail to fully assist the government in meeting its requirements within a reasonable period of time, the Attorney General will recommend legislation which would compel manufacturers to meet government requirements." Thus, if we do not voluntarily give up our rights to privacy, Ms. Reno is tasked by President Clinton with drawing up the laws for "mandatory" government phone bugs. Yet, there is overwhelming evidence that Ms. Reno quietly turned her head as a major DNC backer managed a deal involving the Communist Chinese and advanced encryption technology. Other than approving the lucrative RSA merger/export, Ms Reno and the Justice Department are also major players in export policy. They are part of an Inter-Agency Working group specifically tasked to cover crypto and exports. As proof, Reno's Justice Department has written most of the Clinton encryption policy papers. In fact, some of the secret documents written by Reno's Justice Department on crypto policy were compromised by former DNC fund-raiser Ira Sockowitz. Sockowitz walked out of the Commerce Department with over 2,000 pages of secrets in 1996. Ironically, included in the Sockowitz papers are secret documents covering the 1996 RSA/China deal. Curiously, Ms. Reno has chosen NOT to look into the matter. The connections between Ms. Reno and the Clinton scandals are also well known to at least one person inside the Beltway. FBI Director Louie Freeh knows. He is aware of that advanced technology was being shipped to China while draconian laws banning the same technology were considered here. Director Freeh also knows that his boss, Ms. Reno, is deeply involved in criminal obstruction involving high tech exports, DNC donors, and her own Justice Department. He knows she is covering for crimes that she and her Department were charged to prevent. The question now is... Does Freeh have the guts to tell America? 1 if by land, 2 if by sea. Paul Revere - encryption 1775 Charles R. Smith SOFTWAR http://www.us.net/softwar Pcyphered SIGNATURE: 3B766150F4B90D30688C657BB44EE7016793781A184F584E7C129D2A8A03F3F5 0B833ABFCE759CC129AF6A33B104406F19EB68AF61050087B65A66C94EA8B0B9 1D70D66883BCA304 - -> Send "subscribe snetnews " to majordomo(a)world.std.com - -> Posted by: "J. Orlin Grabbe" <kalliste(a)aci.net> ------- End of Forwarded Message

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by fasc＠expno.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

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17 Dec '03

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PRZ/PGP loses it
by Vladimir Z. Nuri 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

------- Forwarded Message Date: Thu, 4 Dec 1997 15:02:44 -0500 From: bxs29(a)cas.org (Barry Skaggs-D26) To: cas(a)majordomo.pobox.com, ignition-point(a)majordomo.pobox.com Subject: IP: (OT) Cloud Over Future of PGP Seems like the days of peer-reviewed encryption software may be numbered. Just trust Us. Regards, Barry Skaggs Cloud Over Future of Pretty Good Privacy The Price of Key Recovery Following Monday's US$35 million cash acquisition of PGP by Network Associates, the man who once testified before the Senate that key recovery could "strengthen the hand of a police state" now works for a company that actively promotes it. Reaction from e-privacy activists was swift and harsh. "The users of PGP can no longer rely on the credibility of Phil Zimmermann to ensure that the product is everything that they've been promised it's been previously," said Dave Banisar, attorney for the Electronic Privacy Information Center and co-author of The Electronic Privacy Papers Network Associates, formerly known as the Key Recovery Alliance, an organization that lobbies Congress for key recovery that would grant law enforcement agencies back-door access to private encrypted communications. Network Associates and other companies support key recovery because it would allow them to export strong crypto software without bothering to make a separate nonrecoverable version for the domestic market. The Commerce Department forbids export of the strongest available encryption without elaborate promises from manufacturers to develop key recovery features. Thus many companies are forced to develop both export and domestic versions of their software, each with differing crypto strengths. But Zimmermann, a pioneer of strong encryption, has spent years crusading against key recovery, calling it an invasion of privacy. And the most recent release of PGP's encryption software allows users to disable key recovery. "People should give their consent to use [recovery]," Zimmermann said. When asked whether future versions of the package will retain that option, Zimmermann replied, "Certainly, as long as I have anything to say about it." Zimmermann's new title at Network Associates is "fellow," but he declined to comment on exactly what authority and responsibility that confers. Meanwhile, Phil Dunkelberger, PGP's former president and CEO, was named general manager of Network Associates' Total Network Security Division. "It's going to take some time to figure things out," said Zimmermann. EPIC's Banisar was less diplomatic and postulated that Zimmermann's new title reflected a clash of values between him and Network Associates on key recovery. "We have a number of fellows here, and they are usually unpaid volunteers," Banisar said. "It will require a fundamental examination by human rights groups and others about whether any newer versions of PGP are truly trustworthy," said Banisar. Network Associates could not be reached for comment. Wired, Dec. 3, 1997 ********************************************** To subscribe or unsubscribe, email: majordomo(a)majordomo.pobox.com with the message: subscribe ignition-point email@address or unsubscribe ignition-point email@address ********************************************** http://www.telepath.com/believer ********************************************** ------- End of Forwarded Message

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