December 2003 - cypherpunks-legacy

JOIN US IN THIS NEW PROGRAM
by L. A 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

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Re: IWD_ism
by Thaddeus J. Beier 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

John Young wrote: > > 1-6-96. > > "Information-Warfare Defense Is Urged" > > The Defense Science Board said the Pentagon should > launch counterattacks against computer hackers by > injecting the attackers' computers with "a polymorphic > virus that wipes out the system, takes it down for weeks." > This is completely unbelievable, who are these people? I believe that the polymorphic virus is originally from the classic "Shockwave Rider" and was seen as an impossible fiction even in that book of improbable fiction. -- Thaddeus Beier thad(a)hammerhead.com Visual Effects Supervisor 408) 287-6770 Hammerhead Productions http://www.got.net/people/thad

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JOIN US IN THIS GREAT PROGRAM
by L. A 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

=================================================================== IF YOU'RE NOT INTERESTED IN THIS KIND OF BUSINESS, PLEASE FORGIVE ME FOR THE INTRUSION INTO YOUR MAIL BOX !!!! I'M JUST TRYING TO MAKE A SECOND JOB, WHICH WILL GIVE ME - AND YOU OFCOURSE - A SECOND INCOME !!! =================================================================== WELCOME TO I.D.E.A. CONCEPTS, INC !!! If you have not yet heard about IDEA nor joined us in this powerful income producing opportunity for 1997 THEN please read the below and I think you will decide to join us as we take our I.D.E.A. around the world!! This I.D.E.A. will propel you into financial security for 1997 and beyond!! I am willing to bet that this one product alone will bring more people into I.D.E.A. than any other product that is currently available right now. It is our VITAMIN "O" and it is called "SYNTRA-GEN" . Below are some interesting facts surrounding the use of "Stablilized Liquid Oxygen" as reviewed in the Bio/Tech News that is readily available for YOUR review when you visit us at: www.ideaconcepts.com/ Stablilized Liquid Oxygen as reviewed in the Bio/Tech News is "One of the most important new health giving, disease preventing and life extending breakthroughs of the entire 20th century" Increases oxygen uptake at the cellular level; Dramatically boosts energy levels; Strengthens the Immune System; Quickly heightens concentration and alertness; Has a calming effect on the nervous system; Allows the body to focus plenty of oxygen on it's primary metabolic functions without having to draw down oxygen reserves to fight illness and disease; Rapidly kills infectious bacteria, viruses, fungi and parasites without harming the beneficial microorganisms needed by the body; Gives the body the added oxygen it needs to oxidize and eliminate built up toxins and poisons in the cells, tissues and bloodstream; Greatly enhances uptake of vitamins, minerals, amino acids, proteins, enzymes and other essential nutrients from either natural food sources or from dietary supplements....... All of the above are very important BUT the one that really made its mark on me was THE LAST! Every vitamin/mineral/amino acid, etc will be enhanced as to its value to my family's health. This is VERY EXCITING NEWS! Now visit : www.multi-level.com/millennium/lefty.html join us, and visit : www.ideaconcepts.com/ through the links on it !! And you haven't even heard about the 60% payout on your 1st three levels yet plus "infinity bonuses". Then there is "NETmax" to handle all of your advertising needs for 1997. Prepare yourself for almost more excitment that you could ever have expected this early in 1997! Make I.D.E.A. Concepts, Inc your catalyst to Health & Wealth in 1997!! Join us NOW !!! YOU WON'T REGRET IT, THAT'S SURE !!!!

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Thoughts on moderation
by Douglas Barnes 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Some thoughts -- 1) I've known Sandy for a couple of years, and I trust him to use good judgement as a moderator. It will be important to develop guidelines so that the job can be rotated, but it's also important that the moderator be someone who doesn't have any major axe to grind. Sandy has his personal likes and dislikes, but I don't think he'll ever stoop to tossing out opinions that he disagrees with. 2) I don't think that a post should be tossed out simply because it contains an ad-hominem attack, but only if it is entirely or almost entirely an ad-hominem attack. (Timmy May sucks cock, or John Gilmore dead of AIDS, or found drowned in his hot tub, or whatever...) I'd hate to see an otherwise substantive post get pitched out because it referred to Dorothy Denning as the Wicked Witch of the East or somesuch. 3) I agree that maintaining the list of posts that are tossed out is important as a check against abuse by the moderator. 4) I think that anyone who confuses the editing of a list with censorship is a complete fool, and should be sentenced to running a free counterculture newspaper in which he or she is compelled to publish whatever fevered ramblings enter the head of the members of the "community" without editing. [This is the voice of experience speaking here -- you don't want to do this.] Freedom of the press belongs to those that own presses. The Internet makes it a lot easier to own a "press", but it doesn't make them grow on trees, nor does it give you any special rights to appropriate someone else's press. (I'm assuming that the peurile lamers -- oops,ad-hominem alert -- who are arguing so strongly against editing the list also believe in property rights, yes?) FWIW, Doug

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Re: ONE MILLION CHILDREN.....
by ed.falk＠Eng.Sun.COM 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

What did cypherpunks do to get so much spam?

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To pay credit when it's due
by ichudov＠algebra.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Dear Cpunks, I forgot to mention that during the design phase of my robomod I have received a number of thoughtful and helpful advices from Dr. Dimitri Vulis KOTM, mostly regarding authentication protocols, as well as some other programming matters. For example, a suggestion to add an option requiring all preapproved posters to sign their articles was originally made by him. - Igor.

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Re: Sandy and I will run a cypherpunks "moderation" experiment in Jan
by Against Moderation 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > Date: Mon, 6 Jan 1997 18:29:51 -0500 (EST) > From: "Mark M." <markm(a)voicenet.com> > > The problem with making an undelayed, unedited version of the list > available is that it would increase the burden on toad.com. I > suppose someone could run a mail exploder that would receive the raw > version and mail it out to all subscribers. I don't see the > increased lag as much of a problem. If an automatic moderation > program is used, the lag should be insignificant for most posts. Why do you think that load is a problem? I mean most people are not going to want to subscribe to multipel versions of the mailing list, right? So why are three mailing lists with a total of ~3,000 users any more of a load than 2 mailing lists with a total of ~2,000 users? Hell, I'll even volunteer to run the cypherpunks-raw list on my own hardware (thus blowing my nym, if it's really necessary) if I can get the articles as they are submitted in real time. > This would not only increase the load on toad.com, but would also > make it more difficult for people who want to receive the moderated > version and monitor the moderators decisions. Mail filtering can be > done simply on many mail programs, but checking a list of moderation > decisions against the mailing list traffic would be just too > complicated. NoCeM is a nice idea, but most people on this list > probably do not have the platform needed to run the software. 1. How would this increase the load? I don't see how multiple mailing lists cause more load if it doesn't mean more subscribers. 2. Even if it did mean more subscribers, why is load a problem? I mean, even sendmail can easily handle the current load of cypherpunks, and there are many packages way faster than sendmail (exim should be particularly good at this kind of load, for instance. Qmail is also generally way more efficient than sendmail). And don't tell me these are hard or a pain to install, because I'm willing to set this up and run it on my hardware if that's what it takes to get an unedited, unmoderated cypherpunks list. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.2 iQCVAwUBMtGXboCHQnqYPZ9VAQHzcwQArv9i3yiYlqRxqM1zAN/lhS8z9biL1guM 5YQJRGX8MFdh7IxYBkCvsV6r3qfmpfRKJuF/GqZZ0boYfwIF0BRPT3PGV/qoh1IR 5ltGMAaj/k5fpSIxRBk4NdtWR5RhpvMJSdqo7WDNWBuZtYCozno2G8BXwKPkZ5a2 Phqjs68VswE= =WWIq -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

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Moderation
by thad＠hammerhead.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

I think that this is a completely fabulous idea, an commend John and Sandy for doing this. Let me add my own suggestion. This will fail if flames migrate from cypherpunks-flames to cypherpunks, I would attempt to prohibit threads that only exist in cypherpunks-flames being continued into the moderated list. This'll be hard to do, Sandy, I know, but if you could think of a way to do this, I think that your experiment is more likely to succeed. Phrases like "As I said in the letter that only got sent to cypherpunks-flames" should cause the whole article to be yanked, IMHO. thad -- Thaddeus Beier thad(a)hammerhead.com Visual Effects Supervisor 408) 287-6770 Hammerhead Productions http://www.got.net/people/thad

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Modified Token Posting Scheme
by Mixmaster 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

>The proposal to limit "noise" posts by using re-usable tokens is >interesting because it has the effect of filtering and at the >same >time remains responsive because the "moderator" passes judgement >after posting has occurred. > >In essence, the poster is betting that the moderator will approve >the post retroactively. > >The purpose of limiting the tokens available is to give them >value >so that there is a cost associated with losing the bet. > >However, distribution of the tokens has the same problems that >centrally >planned economies have distributing bread. Should people wait in >line, >receive bread at random, or get their bread through connections? > None of >these solutions is attractive. > >The right way to implement the scheme is to use dollars for >tokens >because the USG has already solved the problem of giving the >tokens >value. > >The "moderator" returns the money to people when posts are >worthwhile >and keeps it otherwise. This means that the "bet" can be quite a >bit >larger than a dollar because responsible posters will get their >money >back. Starving graduate students will not be discouraged from >posting. >Abusive posters, anonymous posters, or spam artists will have to >pay >a substantial fee for the privilege. > >Of course, there's no reason to have just one moderator on the >list. >A moderator could just be an e-mail account that forwards mail to >the list if valid payment is received. (Moderators should PGP >sign >their messages so mail forging won't work.) Readers could filter >on which moderators have approved the kinds of posts they want to >read. > >The effect of this scheme is to allow newcomers, infrequent >posters, >or anonymous posters to get through killfiles without taking the >time and effort to develop a reputation. > >Peter Hendrickson >ph(a)netcom.com Why the FUCK don't we just find the antichrist or call on GOD to kill all spammers and then buy a gun and shot holes in the computer?? this whole isssue will never be solved without action get a fuckin real job!!!!!!

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Re: Modified Token Posting Scheme
by Lucky Green 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 02:55 PM 1/6/97 -0800, Ed Falk wrote: > >How about this simple policy scheme: > > 1) posts from known list members forwarded to list automatically > 2) posts with "approval cookie" also forwarded automatically > 3) otherwise, forwarded only after approval by moderator, whose charter > only permits spam filtering. Seems this is what the STUMP scheme we read about yesterday does. I suggest Sandy and John take a good look at it. -- Lucky Green <mailto:shamrock@netcom.com> PGP encrypted mail preferred Make your mark in the history of mathematics. Use the spare cycles of your PC/PPC/UNIX box to help find a new prime. http://www.mersenne.org/prime.htm

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