December 2003 - cypherpunks-legacy

Re: Anguilla - A DataHaven?
by Arun Mehta 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 10:27 14/08/96 -0700, Timothy C. May wrote: >* the role of physical vs. cyberspace data havens ... >3. Vince seems to be a in a somewhat precarious position, awaiting renewal >of a one-year work permit. I'm sure this has come up before, but what would prevent a server being located on a buoy or something at sea outside territorial limits (or when satellites become cheaper, on a satellite itself) offering such services? Arun Mehta Phone +91-11-6841172, 6849103 amehta(a)cpsr.org http://www.cerfnet.com/~amehta/ finger amehta(a)cerfnet.com for public key

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re: National Socio-Economic Security Need for Encryption Technology
by Bill Stewart 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

>At 08:33 13/08/96 -0700, James A. Donald wrote: >> > Demand for Indian programmers is less than supply not because capital >> > has somehow failed to flow to India, but because an engineer in India >> > is not free to produce the value that engineers elsewhere are free >> > to produce. I've worked with companies that bring Indian contract programmers to Silicon Valley and also contract for work back home in Bangalore. Sure, part of the lower price paid for programmers in India vs. importing the same people here is probably because the government is annoying. Why is it worth paying nearly-American-scale wages to have them do the work here rather than 1/5 as much back home? Part of it is because it's harder to interact with people halfway around the world, even using email and faxes, so the jobs that succeed well in that environment are big jobs with well-defined inputs and outputs. For work that needs real interaction between the customer and the worker, it helps to have the worker nearby, so it's worth paying them to come here. For work that needs interaction between workers and machines, especially brand-new-not-yet-working machines on high-speed networks that aren't easy or cheap to drag across the Pacific and then connect to India, you need bodies on site. Even for standard equipment you can buy more of, it's still more productive to work here where you have lots of it and can get spare parts at Fry's than to ship some of it to India and have people use it there. Also, of course, the folks who are good enough to ship halfway around the world to do a job for you are usually the best they've got; they'd get more than the average programmer back in Bangalore as well. # Thanks; Bill # Bill Stewart, +1-415-442-2215 stewarts(a)ix.netcom.com # <A HREF="http://idiom.com/~wcs"> Defuse Authority!

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Re: Anguilla - A DataHaven?
by Bill Stewart 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 11:15 AM 8/15/96 +0600, you wrote: >At 10:27 14/08/96 -0700, Timothy C. May wrote: >>* the role of physical vs. cyberspace data havens >... >>3. Vince seems to be a in a somewhat precarious position, awaiting renewal >>of a one-year work permit. > >I'm sure this has come up before, but what would prevent a server >being located on a buoy or something at sea outside territorial >limits (or when satellites become cheaper, on a satellite itself) >offering such services? Piracy. Some pirates may have black Jolly Roger flags on their ships, but most have flags that say "Coast Guard" or "Navy" or "Harbor Police", and think they're protecting their National Security or something. Satellite launching is generally somewhat government-controlled, though you could get a remailer into space if you didn't tell the government too much about it until it was launched. The US apparently has restrictions on crypto capabilities of satellites launched from the US, according to something I read on the net once. But I suppose you could launch a programmable satellite, and then reprogram it by radio.... # Thanks; Bill # Bill Stewart, +1-415-442-2215 stewarts(a)ix.netcom.com # <A HREF="http://idiom.com/~wcs"> Defuse Authority!

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Re: Anguilla - A DataHaven?
by Bill Stewart 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 10:27 AM 8/14/96 -0700, Tim wrote: >* the role of physical vs. cyberspace data havens ..... > so I tended to view data havens as not being tied to physical communities > where the local potentates could revoke work permits, visas, > travel permits, business licenses, etc. Agreed. At least for now, banking havens are a different kind of market than data havens - people want to be able to demonstrate that activities are being run from Non-Taxing states, though there's a parallel need for private data communications to hide any connections back to a potentially more greedy state, and perhaps to move money back home as well. Data havens, on the other hand, may need public ports in tolerant locations, but most of their business really needs to be encrypted any way; the visible parts such as web pages are only a small part of the game. I suspect that, rather than having fixed physical locations, they probably need to operate on a Temporary Autonomous Zone basis, moving elsewhere when a jurisdiction becomes unfriendly but mostly trying to avoid too much notice. >What the form of these "cyberspace data havens" might take is unclear. >Several pieces of technology are missing, just as they were missing four >years ago when one of the early list members contacted me to tell me how >easy it would be to set up a data haven with computers. (It wasn't easy >then, and it ain't easy now. The pieces that are missing are the >reifications of protocols we talk about a lot....mere encryption and >authentication are only the starting points, and look at how hard it's been >just to get _them_ deployed.) Reification is one thing; developing business models and markets is another, and making the activities visible so potential users can _find_ data havens is a third. There are some activities that operate as temporary data havens today - child pornography, warez, police Red Squad and blackmail files on citizens kept illegally on home machines outside the public's control, and other unsavory groups that limit the people who know about them. Public data havens are a bit different. Finding a reason to Just Do It means you either need a real threat model or you end up becoming Yet Another Spam Server like many of the remailers have been. Some things we need to implement Data Havens - 1 - digicash or equivalent - it's coming, but it's not widely used, and if you can't pay anonymously it's tough to pay for data havening anonymously. 2 - practical temporary registration of connections - is hacking a DNS server enough? Or do we need IRC meetmes? Not sure. # Thanks; Bill # Bill Stewart, +1-415-442-2215 stewarts(a)ix.netcom.com # <A HREF="http://idiom.com/~wcs"> Defuse Authority!

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Last word: auto video surveillance report[long]
by The Prisoner 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

I know this is pushing it as far as crypto-relevance. I won't bring up the subject again. But this was too much to not pass along - there are some interesting insights into the mindset at work, and if I had to justify the cryptorelevance it would be by promoting the value of knowing the mind of Brother ... both Little and Big. For those not familiar with Calif. bureaucratese: "HOV" is "High Occupancy Vehicle" and an "HOV Lane" is a carpool lane. Edited doc. follows (from http://www.bts.gov/smart/cat/274.html) Use of Videotape in HOV Lane Surveillance and Enforcement: Final Report USE OF VIDEOTAPE IN HOV LANE SURVEILLANCE AND ENFORCEMENT FINAL REPORT By John W. Billheimer Ken Kaylor Charles Shade Submitted to State of California Department of Transportation under Contract 55 G710 D232 March 1990 SYSTAN,INC. in ATD,INC. 343 Second Street Association 6431 Independence Avenue P.O. Box U with Woodland Hills, CA 91367 Los Altos, CA 94023 PREFACE AND ACKNOWLEDGEMENTS This report covers a six-month study designed to explore the use of vidoetape in HOV lane surveillance and enforcement. The study is an extension of an earlier investigation of the effects of different enforcement strategies and engineering designs on violation rates on California's mainline HOV lanes. The report has been prepared in the Los Altos, California offices of SYSTAN, Inc. under Contract No. 55 G71 0 with the California Department of Transportation (CALTRANS). The project was jointly sponsored by the California Highway Patrol (CHP). Mr. Philip Jang, Chief of the HOV Systems Branch of CALTRANS Division of Traffic Operations served as project administrator, while Scott McGowen of CALTRANS acted as the project's technical monitor. ... SYSTAN wishes to thank all those who provided information and insights on the enforcement and operation of California's mainline HOV lanes, and acknowledges full responsibility for the analysis, interpretation, and presentation of the data they provided. ... 1.1.1 Background ... It has been suggested that using video equipment to assist in HOV lane enforcement could reduce the requirements for patrol officers, increase citation rates, and minimize freeway disruption. The current investigation has been designed to extend past studies of HOV lane enforcement by testing both the feasibility and accuracy of the use of video equipment in HOV lane surveillance. 1.1.2 Objective The objective of the current study has been to demonstrate and test the use of video equipment in determining vehicle occupancy, documenting violator identity, and aiding enforcement of HOV lanes. ... Field tests showed that it is technologically possible to record several accurate views of vehicles traveling in mainline HOV lanes. Specifications and costs of the equipment needed for videotape surveillance are summarized below. Cameras. Best results are obtained with high speed color cameras capable of achieving exposure times of 1/1000 of a second. A 14:1 zoom lens is needed to focus on oncoming vehicles at distances of approximately 1200 feet. Cameras placed at eye-level on the freeway itself should be small and unobtrusive. Auxiliary Equipment. Two monitors with split screen capability are required in the control van. One monitor provides an on-line review capability, while the other provides a permanent record of all camera views. A special effects generator should be used to make the exact time and location a permanent part of the videotape record. Polarizing filters help to solve problems with glare from shiny cars and windshields, although they reduce the light-gathering capability of the cameras. Infra-red cameras and light sources can be used to document license plates after dark by videotaping the rear license plates of departing cars. However, it does not appear feasible to videotape oncoming vehicles under conditions of darkness or low visibility. Results are not clear and the infra-red light source can distract oncoming drivers. ... 1.3.3 Potential Applications Although it is technologically possible to record a series of accurate views of vehicles traveling in mainline HOV lanes, no combination of recorded views currently provides enough information to support prosecution for occupancy violators. Even so, videotape surveillance of HOV lanes can provide useful information for a variety of other purposes. These include: 1. Support for on-line enforcement. In cases where there are no refuge areas adjacent to mainline HOV lanes, videotape surveillance provides a means of alerting officers stationed downstream from the cameras to the presence of oncoming violators. 2. Support for remote ticketing . Although videotape by itself does not appear to be accurate enough to provide a basis for citations, the combination of videotape and an observing officer could conceivably provide the accuracy needed for a system of mailed warnings and citations. If a system of mailed warnings or citations can be installed, the officer would not have to pursue violators, and a videotape record of driver, occupancy, and license plate would be available for court hearings. Such a system would be more cost-effective than the current system of freeway pursuit and roadside citing, and will reduce the congestion caused by rubbernecking. 3. Performance Monitoring. There are several applications in which videotape surveillance appears to provide a marked improvement over current practice. These include: (a) Freeway monitoring to document vehicle type and occupancy over time; ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ... The cost of videotaping HOV lane activity is more than double the cost of monitoring operations manually. However, videotape provides more accurate records, a consistent data base, and a permanent, verifiable record of traffic activity. It also provides information on the vehicle mix, traffic speed, and the license plates of carpoolers and suspected violators. 1.3.4 Public Reaction In a state in which radar cannot legally be used to enforce speed laws on state freeways, videotape surveillance of HOV lanes has significant legislative and public relations implications. These implications are beyond the scope of the current study. However, two pieces of information related to the current study may shed some light on the potential reactions of the public and the media to the possibility of videotape surveillance. .... Press Coverage. The field tests undertaken during the current study attracted the attention of the Los Angeles media and resulted in a limited amount of press coverage. Articles in the Los Angeles Times and Ontario Daily Report/Progress Bulletin were both balanced and informative. To the extent that these stories can be viewed as an indication of press and public reaction to the use of videotape in HOV lane enforcement, there was no suggestion that CALTRANS and the CHP would be exposed to a massive public outcry if videotape proves to be technologically and legally feasible as an enforcement tool. Furthermore, it can be assumed that the articles themselves made potential HOV lane violators in the Los Angeles area more cautious. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ... Video cameras operating in conjunction with officer observation may provide sufficient accuracy to support mail-out citations for HOV lane occupancy violations. An officer stationed downstream from the video cameras is in a position to verify the occupancy of vehicles which appear suspect to observers monitoring camera output. ... Moreover, the presence of an observing officer may remove some of the "Big Brother is watching" stigma from the use of videotape.

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RE: Fun with M$
by Andy Brown 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

On 15 August 1996 06:16, Bill Stewart[SMTP:stewarts@ix.netcom.com] wrote: > >Microsoft has chosen what Sun should have: leave the security to the user, > >don't take it away from everyone. Java has been severely crippled by the > > User? What user? The poor unsuspecting fool who hits the web page? > The kind friendly person who writes web pages that turn off Win95? > Executing signed code from web pages is semi-ok, if the default is to > trust no one and make the user explicitly grant permission to code authors. > Executing anything that comes down the wire is foolish, and writing > software to do so is rabidly negligent. The default (at least on beta-2 of ie) is to not trust anyone unless you explicity say so. If the user then decides to execute "k3wl kontro1" from phreak.net then that's their problem. Does anyone know what the legal implications of signed code are? That is, if Company A signs their Active X control and it's later found to corrupt users data, does the signature (which is supposed to make the user trust the control as safe), open up the company to litigation for damages?

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Re: Anguilla - A DataHaven?
by Remo Pini 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- To: cypherpunks(a)toad.com Date: Thu Aug 15 12:42:40 1996 > I'm sure this has come up before, but what would prevent a server > being located on a buoy or something at sea outside territorial > limits (or when satellites become cheaper, on a satellite itself) > offering such services? Space: How often does your system crash? (Imagine sending a shuttle up there to troubleshoot the server) Sea: If your server swims in the ocean I could think of several drawbacks: - - per satellite only: costs - - must be very robust (salt water, shocks) - - must be powered by battery (Hey Jeff, have you ordered the 2000 Alkaline batteries yet, I think it's about time to change them on the server) - - everybody can go and get it (after all, no jurisdiction also means no protection - I believe that everybody can claim stuff floating in international waters, he just has to get it). But I like the idea anyway. But then again, why don't you just buy an island and get the country to grant you jurisdictional power over it? (sounds a lot cheaper than a satellite) - ------< fate favors the prepared mind >------ Remo Pini rp(a)rpini.com PGP: http://www.rpini.com/crypto/crypto.html - ----< words are what reality is made of >---- -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.3i Charset: noconv iQEVAwUBMhL/IxFhy5sz+bTpAQE7zggAuCJo0i0X49nmLWtlQ2ZgKcapn80F0z8T +LJ/5SIjcbfvAZOZHKJVRwjh2GmQjaro4AskgBY4UHg2BTumUlsOiLwXM6hvoCx+ mdd2znkiiWfFarD067Vvur7KTSD87XZWMXR9I/8f1ONzWRdASE/kLQ/azCEgne1P GO/u0T0kKWWORSVgLc638U9raxJTPmn0Q6vEwvgVU4ARFGAEIPsFN3p8TfbIBAQ5 SqQbzNShqYzHrLgSDiarH2OyHA6o3hghwK1jUs2zHe2bAxvdjzMc3BaodWOi1tlT DJSq79cTrYItzCK+nn0INtaIeOQy2XwPFEA+1FglIScyxtiPcV0AYQ== =Xwjf -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

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Re: National Socio-Economic Security Need for Encryption Technology
by Bart Croughs 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Sandy Santford wrote: >Bart Croughs wrote: >> If you don't know the answer, there's nothing to be ashamed of. It is just this sort of unnecessary condescending snottiness that create the clear impression that Bart is an asshole. Perhaps he is a fine chap and this is just his style, but I find it very offensive an counter-productive in this discussion. S a n d y< To prove that I'm behaving badly you quote me out of context. My statement 'If you don't know the answer, there's nothing to be ashamed of', was immediately followed by the statement 'I don't know the answer either'. In this context, my statement wasn't that snotty. After all, I made clear that in this respect I wasn't any better than you. So I think you are overreacting a bit. Second, I didn't complain about the tone of your previous posts when you talked about me 'fretting' about the dropping wages of American workers, or when you wrote 'yada, yada, yada' in response to one of my posts. I don't even complain when you call me an asshole (except that maybe next time you start calling names you could be a bit more imaginative...) It's not that important. I guess I just get subconsciously a little irritated, and that's the reason I'm maybe a little less polite when I answer your posts than you would like me to be. So if you want me to behave nicer when I answer your posts, the best way to achieve this would be to start behaving nicer yourself. Bart Croughs

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Re: Fw: Re: Free Pronto Secure Offer
by Charley Sparks 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- To: geoff(a)commtouch.co.il, cypherpunks(a)toad.com Date: Thu Aug 15 07:45:59 1996 Nicely Put !! I. for one, love it... warts ( for now ) and all ! To: unicorn(a)schloss.li, cypherpunks(a)toad.com Date: Thu Aug 15 10:53:53 1996 On 14 Aug unicorn wrote: > "Do all the work I should be doing or have done in the first place > discover the critical flaws in my new-keen-o-ka-jive-o crypto system > and I will give you a free copy of a critically flawed crypto system > (a $99.00 value) ABSOLUTELY FREE. Wait, don't order yet. Included > you also get to> actually whitewash my fence and then mow my lawn. > All at NO COST to you." Unicorn, please try to take a minute to think before hitting that send key. You infer that a product is critically flawed without even trying it ? There are quite a few members of this list who are using Pronto Secure and will testify to the contrary. See http://www.commtouch.com/testers.htm for a list of people who take the trouble to try out a product before venturing an opinion. Agreed that feedback from external testers is a good deal for developers. It is also not a bad deal for evaluators, they get a free copy of a product which in the case of Pronto Secure many find useful (as witnessed by x-mailer headers on c'punk traffic). Testers also get an opportunity to contribute neat feature ideas which helps propagate secure messaging to the masses. Unicorn, you are invited to whitewash my fence :) - --------------------------------------------------------------- Geoff Klein, Pronto Secure Product Manager; www.commtouch.com My PGP public Key 1814AD45 can be obtained by sending a message to geoff(a)commtouch.co.il with "Get PGP Key" as the subject. - ---------------------------------------------------------------- -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.2 iQCXAwUBMhMN+eJ+JZd/Y4yVAQFQ1wQKA4D7OyVKQDyM93653ffUgG3iRUtMkYc6 ozcSRGz1RHlH2HdUWPuM7M9YGvF8hhcccPwWUA1G1NuJypeEsCwKKHuaEiTIpRVk ZRAb1nA2AP/dLZ2NQTBxDr7JQMZ4zfSfX376Ejk7Ep1oR2XAr/fFP/QYHzpHsvme FYPEzNtejjDQSg== =/O/z -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

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Re: National Socio-Economic Security Need for Encryption Technology
by tcmay＠got.net 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 9:39 PM 8/15/96, Bart Croughs wrote: > > If the situation is so clear, why can't you give the proof I'm asking for? > Several people have given explanations of why your question is both too simplistic and too tied to subjective definitions of "good for the economy." You ignore these points and keep repeating your protectionist mantra. You seem to have a one-track mind, suggesting you are probaby a rabid Objectivist. OK, so I will give you an Objectivist proof: A is A. Not-A is not Not-Not-A. A is real, Not-A is not real. Reality is good, non-reality is not good. Man exists in reality. Therefore Man is good. Existence is not optional. Non-existence is nothingness. Nothingness is darkness. The opposite of darkness is light. Fire produces light, therefore fire is good. Fire is the embodiment of good. Smoking is the embodiment of fire. Therefore, smoking is good. Non-smoking is bad.... What was the question again? --Tim May (P.S. Since Bart seems to have only one thing on his mind, and since our list members seem unable to persuade him about anything, I suspect this list is not the list for Bart. May he find the list he seeks.) Boycott "Big Brother Inside" software! We got computers, we're tapping phone lines, we know that that ain't allowed. ---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---- Timothy C. May | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money, tcmay(a)got.net 408-728-0152 | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero W.A.S.T.E.: Corralitos, CA | knowledge, reputations, information markets, Licensed Ontologist | black markets, collapse of governments. "National borders aren't even speed bumps on the information superhighway."

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