- cypherpunks-legacy - lists.cpunks.org

A ban on cryptography?
by tcmay＠got.net 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Anyone know anything about the status of this bill? --begin bill excerpt-- S.1666 Department of Commerce Authorization Act for Fiscal Year 1997 (Passed by the Senate) SEC. 1042. PROHIBITION ON THE DISTRIBUTION OF INFORMATION RELATING TO USE OF CRYPTOGRAPHY FOR A CRIMINAL PURPOSE. (a) UNLAWFUL CONDUCT- Section 875 of title 18, United States Code, is amended by adding at the end the following new subsection: `(l) It shall be unlawful for any person to teach or demonstrate the use of cryptographic systems, or to distribute by any means information pertaining to, in whole or in part, the construction of digital ciphers, if the person intends or knows, that such cryptographic materials or information will be used for, or in furtherance of, an activity that constitutes a Federal criminal offense or a criminal purpose affecting interstate commerce.'. --end bill excerpt-- --Tim May (P.S. it may not be real, but it _could_ be real.) HOW TO MAKE A PIPE BOMB: "Buy a section of metal water pipe 1/2 by 6 inches long, threaded on both ends. Buy two metal caps to fit. These are standard items in hardware stores. Drill a 1/16th hole in the center of the pipe. This is easy with a good drill bit. Hanson is a good brand to use. Screw a metal cap tightly on one end. Fill the pipe to within 1/2 inch of the top with black powder. Do not pack the powder. Don't even tap the bottom of the pipe to make it settle. You want the powder loose. For maximum explosive effect, you need dry, fine powder sitting loose in a very rigid container." (more information at http://sdcc13.ucsd.edu/~m1lopez/pipe.html, or by using search engines)

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re: National Socio-Economic Security Need for Encryption Technology
by Bart Croughs 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Sandy Sandfort wrote: >On Sun, 11 Aug 1996, Bart Croughs wrote: >> If American companies are moving capital to Third World >> countries because of the low wages in these countries, then the >> workers in the Third World will of course be better off. But in >> the US, the amount of capital will be lowered. So the American >> workers will be able to get other jobs, but these jobs will pay >> less, because of the diminished amount of capital in the US. >The fallacy in this argument is the assumption that because some >American capital moves overseas, there will be less capital >available in the US for investment/wages. It doesn't contemplate >infusion of foreign capital investments in American industries >that have a competitive advantage over their foreign competition. At least you agree that wages are determined by the amount of capital invested! As to your argument, I don't see why the movement of American capital overseas would lead to the infusion of foreign capital investments in American industries. It seems to me that these two processes work independently. If they do work independently, then the movement of American capital overseas will lead to less capital in the U.S. Bart Croughs

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1024-bit keys
by David.K.Merriman＠toad.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- To: support(a)luckman.com, cypherpunks(a)toad.com Date: Mon Aug 12 14:29:39 1996 In the documentation for Web Commander (page 7-50, item 19, top of page), under the process for getting a digital ID from VeriSign, you state: "Also, please note that you cannot send keys longer than 512 to servers outside the United States." I would like to ask for clarification on this point. Is this meant to say that a server inside the United States is not allowed to use a 512+ bit key with a client outside the U.S., or that a Web Commander server outside the U.S. may not employ a key of greater than 512 bits? In either case, what is the justification for such a statement/restriction? If a Federal regulation, could you please cite the Title and Section? Thank you. David Merriman - -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- PGP Email welcome, encouraged, and PREFERRED. Visit my web site at http://www.shellback.com/p/merriman for my PGP key and fingerprint "What is the sound of one hand clapping in a forest with no one there to hear it?" I use Pronto Secure (tm) PGP-fluent Email software for Windows -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.2 iQCVAwUBMg7PWsVrTvyYOzAZAQFo3QQAn2stH5ZtI2/SGt2qEwTWyhTnp6cMA3qC hsukc3tEcvkaF75G2fdPdPkt/oyMpwU+X6jKk6kttbNNPSShrs7QtKgOoZS4FSU1 Zj+5sKrjUmluonly3JRJeZdIzWOOWGz6wd1pDBn90X9M9LzY+CBJT+yuoCWGVmh4 LJkvCJBkLrc= =b+Ui -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

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re: National Socio-Economic Security Need for Encryption Technology
by Bart Croughs 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

My statement that the wages depend on the amount of capital invested, has received a bad press. I thought cypherpunks were economically literate, so I didn't explain the principle and I didn't give any sources for further reading. This proved to be a mistake. To avoid this kind of uninformed criticism in the future, I recommend my critics read the following books, which can all be ordered from Laissez-Faire Books: 1) The economics of liberty (ed. L. Rockwell); 2) The free market reader (ed. L. Rockwell) - both books were published by the Ludwig von Mises Institute. 3) Economics in one lesson - Henry Hazlitt. These three books contain popular essays about economics, following the principles of the austrian school, the most radical free market school in economics. Some quotes: Henry Hazlitt in 'economics in one lesson' (p. 139): "The best way to raise wages, therefore, is to raise marginal labor productivity. This can be done by many methods: by an increase in capital accumulation - i.e. by an increase in the machines with which the workers are aided..." Murray Rothbard in 'the free market reader' (p. 31): "Wage rates are low in many foreign countries because capital equipment is small and technologically primitive. Unaided by much capital, worker productivity is far lower than in the United States." Lew Rockwell in 'the economics of liberty' (p. 26): "Wages are determined by the productivity of the individual laborer, which in turn is largely determined by the amount of capital invested per worker." I could go on, but I think this will suffice. Now I will explain why the austrian economists are right. Imagine Robinson Crusoe. In the beginning, he catches fish with his bare hands. He has no capital investment, and consequently he is not very productive. His wage will be low (he will not catch much fish). If there is more capital investment - if, for example, he has a fishing rod - he will catch more fish in less time. His productivity is higher. His wage is higher (more fish). If there is still more capital investment - if, for example, he has a boat and fishing nets - he will catch even more fish. His productivity is higher. His wage is higher. Etcetera. So, it's really not difficult to see that the Robin's standard of living depends on the amount of capital available on his island. The same goes for the rest of humanity. Bart Croughs

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re: National Socio-Economic Security Need for Encryption Technology
by Bart Croughs 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Arun Mehta wrote: >Indeed. Bart makes a very remarkable assumption, which is that the total >amount of capital in the fastest growing industry in human history is constant. I didn't make this assumption. When I say that when capital leaves the US, the amount of capital in the US will be lower, I mean that the amount of capital will be lower than it otherwise would have been. It will be *relatively* lower, and so the wages in the US will be *relatively* lower than when when the capital wouldn't have left the US. Of course, absolutely speaking the wages could still become higher. I thought this was so obvious that I didn't make this explicit. Bart Croughs

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re: National Socio-Economic Security Need for Encryption Technology
by Bart Croughs 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Perry Metzger wrote: > Bart Croughs writes: > > But there is another axiom of economics which the > > nationalist/socialist can use for his case against the free movement of > > capital. This axiom states that the wages of workers depend on the > > amount of capital invested. The more capital invested, the higher the > > wages are. >I failed to note obvious counterexamples. Well known authors get giant >advances for books written with manual typewriters. Minimum wage >workers routinely operate expensive equipment. Workers doing the same >job in different places using identical equipment that cost identical >sums earn different salaries. >Clearly, wages are defined by supply and demand -- not by "capital >investment". When economists say that wages are determined by the amount of capital invested, they mean on a regional/national level, not on the level of individuals. Bart Croughs

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re: National Socio-Economic Security Need for Encryption Technology
by morgan＠keilin.helsinki.fi 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

It seems clear that capital investment in tools will contribute to the -productivity- of workers. (Tools here meaning whatever machinery/ infrastructure is used to get work done.) Bart Croughs quotes a number of economists who seem to be saying that when capital investment leads to increased productivity (per worker) this also leads to higher wages. I'm not sure I understand -why- this should necessarily be so. It's my impression that in manufacturing industries, the more mechanized production is, the more workers will get paid. Then again, perhaps a more mechanized industry will pay more because more mechanized industries hire workers with higher skills (albeit fewer workers). It's my impression that when a company makes capital investments which increase productivity, the fruits of this increased worker productivity are shared (to some extent) with the workers. I can imagine a number of reasons why this might be done, but it's not absolutely clear to me that this would be a direct result of market forces. -- ===================================================================== Joel.Morgan(a)Helsinki.FI http://blues.helsinki.fi/~morgan "Over the mountains there are mountains." -- Chang-rae Lee =====================================================================

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Re: "X-Ray Gun" for imperceptible searches
by Alan Olsen 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 06:42 PM 8/12/96 -0700, Time Keeper wrote: >I wonder how well the imager works through mylar or gold lame' clothing (or >other high-metal content clothing)? You will be required to escrow such clothing with the proper government authorities. Inspections will be done by the Bureau of cocktails, discos, and munitions according to strict rules set down by President Clinton, with advisement from Former Sen. Bob Packwood. Actually they will just use harder radiation in those cases. The higher cases of radiation burns and sickness will be offset by the gains in perceived public safety. "Eyes melt. Skin explodes. Everybody dead!" - An unnamed source at the FBI. --- |"Computers are Voodoo -- You just have to know where to stick the pins."| |"The moral PGP Diffie taught Zimmermann unites all| Disclaimer: | | mankind free in one-key-steganography-privacy!" | Ignore the man | |`finger -l alano(a)teleport.com` for PGP 2.6.2 key | behind the keyboard.| | http://www.teleport.com/~alano/ | alano(a)teleport.com |

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Re: "X-Ray Gun" for imperceptible searches
by jim bell 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 05:43 PM 8/12/96 -0700, Mike Duvos wrote: >Color me skeptical. > >"E. ALLEN SMITH" <EALLENSMITH(a)ocelot.Rutgers.EDU> writes: > > > The gadget doesn't send out X-rays; instead, it picks up > > electromagnetic waves emitted by human flesh. > >Would these electromagnetic waves be something distinct from the >blackbody spectrum of a human-sized blob of "mostly water" at the >appropriate temperature? > >Or to put it another way, is this just a sophisticated IR imager >thickly coated in snake oil and marketing hype? That depends on what you mean by "IR." Near-IR is about 300 Terahertz; I've seen some items in electronic magazines recently concerning systems that emit and receive around 1 terahertz. Apparently, they can read writing in envelopes, etc. It isn't clear whether this particular system is more like a thermal IR system, or one of those newer ones. Chances are good that when such a system is produced, it will be produced WITHOUT any kind of recording system that must be installed. The problem is, this leaves it open to interpretation as to what a cop saw, and judges and juries tend to be too deferential to cops who "are trying to protect us." All a cop has to do is to claim he saw a gun, or drugs, or practically anthing else, and suddenly he has probable cause where he wouldn't have had it before. Yet more abuse with no obvious benefit. All the more reason to adopt an AP-type system: The so-called "justice system" rarely punishes its own; if we are to have a realistic deterrent, the only way to do it is to let outsiders deal with abuse. Jim Bell jimbell(a)pacifier.com

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re: National Socio-Economic Security Need for Encryption Technology
by Bart Croughs 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Perry Metzger wrote: >Bart Croughs writes: >> I would be proud if I had discovered this axiom, but alas, I haven't. >> It's an axiom that is generally accepted among austrian >>economists >>(Rothbard, Hazlitt, etc). I don't know who actually discovered it. >The truly hysterical part is that Tim and I are both (from what I can >tell) Austrians. >Perry Well, if you are an Austrian, then maybe you should study the Austrians a bit more and write a bit less about them. In several posts I gave quotes from famous Austrian economists that support my statement that according to Austrian economists wages depend on the amount of capital invested. And all that you answer to this is that you're an Austrian yourself. What do you expect me to say? "Well, Austrian economists like Murray Rothbard and Henry Hazlitt think that wages depend on the amount of capital invested, but Perry Metzger disagrees and says he is an Austrian himself, so we can't conclude that according to Austrian economists wages depend on the level of capital invested?" For the moment, I think it's more reasonable to conclude that you don't understand the Austrians. But of course you can try to attack the arguments of the Austrian economists, and convince them that they are wrong and that they ought to adopt your point of view. Bart Croughs

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