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Re: Saving money
by Brian B. Riley 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

On 10/25/97 7:30 AM, harka(a)nycmetro.com (harka(a)nycmetro.com) passed this wisdom: >Your repeating of government-propaganda about the "abuse of the >welfare-system" etc. doesn't really cut it as an argument in a >discussion about the realism of having total financial independence >and the freedom of choices, that comes with it. no he is not .... he is repeating what we all see in the grocery store checkout lines and in the gutters with regularity ... even here in Vermonte where self-sufficiency is a way of life we see third, fourth, and fifth generation welfare families. I literally just came from picking up groceries in a Grand Union in Essex Junction (biiiggg suburb of Burlington, also home of a big IBM plant) the lady in fromt of me was playing the food stamp game ... there was more junk in that basket along with the beer. I teach 'at risk' students in a high school near here and I am dealing with kids who have some potential to do something with themselves and have no inclination to try. I have a kid who is definitely got the brains to go to college to do something with himself whose main aim in life right now was figuring out how to forge the slip for free school lunches for him and his sister so he can pocket the lunch money from his parents ... yeah, I know, send him into politics! Brian B. Riley --> http://www.macconnect.com/~brianbr For PGP Keys <mailto:brianbr@together.net?subject=Get%20PGP%20Key> "...Those of you who turned your swords into plowshares will soon find yourselves under the yokes of those of us who kept our swords..." -- author unknown

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key recovery meeting/demonstration in DC, 11/5
by Greg Broiles 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

See <http://gits-sec.treas.gov/const.htm>; there's going to be a meeting discussing key recovery technology and legislation in Washington, D.C. on November 5. I don't really have time to track down the organizational pedigree of "GITS" (Government Information Technology Services), the institution organizing the conference, but they've got space on the Dept of Treasury's web server. The meeting features, among other folks, William Reinsch, undersecretary at the Dept of Commerce, and an unnamed luncheon speaker who will discuss the future of KR legislation. The cost is $100, and they want you to register by today. Am unsure how easy it'd be to crash the conference - it's at the Omni Shoreham Hotel. The web page features plenty of obfuscation/confusion which tries to link KR technology with encryption/security technology, suggesting that a combination of the two (or merely the former) is required to allow widespread use of the Internet for commerce and data transfer. If anyone happens to attend, I imagine that list subscribers would be interested in a summary of the comments, etc. -- Greg Broiles | US crypto export control policy in a nutshell: gbroiles(a)netbox.com | Export jobs, not crypto. http://www.io.com/~gbroiles | http://www.parrhesia.com

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Re: NABMLA embattled -- mirror sites?
by nobody＠REPLAY.COM 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Anonymous (no, another Anonymous!) wrote: >Anonymous wrote: > >> I'm not sure the right to free speech includes the right to endorse guys >> fucking little boys, whether they give it a moniker like "transgenerational >> love" or not. Any sex with a minor is rape, since they can't legally give >> consent. > >That's right. People who are too lazy to drive a fourteen year old >to New Mexico, where they can legally fuck their brains out, should >go to jail for a long, long time. >When I cruise the children's chat lines, I always tell them I would >like to meet them in New Mexico and fuck their brains out. That's >legal. > >What I love about the law is that it gives us clear guidelines to >help us recognize the difference between those filthy fucking >child-molesting perverts fucking fourteen year olds in California, >and the decent, upstanding citizens fucking the fourteen year >olds in New Mexico. Excellent! So have NAMBLA move their HQ to New Mexico. Then they can talk about fucking little boys' brains out to their heart's content, in person or on their Web site, without breaking any local laws. Welcome to the Fifty Fiefdoms. Of course, there'll be changes in the next revision of the Constitution: 1) The First, Second, Fourth and Fifth Amendments will be missing. 2) The Tenth Amendment will be altered so that the it says: "The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people -- unless we feel like usurping them, or we can convince people they don't need them by spreading FUD."

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Use a Mac...Go to Jail / Re: Saving money
by nobody＠REPLAY.COM 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Brian B. Riley wrote: > Brian B. Riley --> http://www.macconnect.com/~brianbr > For PGP Keys <mailto:brianbr@together.net?subject=Get%20PGP%20Key> > > "...Those of you who turned your swords into plowshares will soon > find yourselves under the yokes of those of us who kept our swords..." > -- author unknown I have always envisioned Mac users as sitting at their computers and drawing flowers while they bounce a cute baby on their knee. Lately, however, I have seen increasing militantism from a wide variety of Mac users, from the quote above to "MacNuke DC" ranters. Is this a 'Death of the '60's' thing, or a sign of 'Armageddon'?

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Roby latest
by Jeff Barber 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

See http://www.sj-r.com/roby.html for the latest. My favorite excerpt: > Illinois State Police feared that any progress in getting Allen - who's > suspected to suffer from paranoia, delusions and suicidal thoughts - to > exit on her own may have been undone. On Sunday, troopers broke out most > of the remaining windows in Allen's house, tossed nine pepper-spray > grenades inside and sent a police dog in to subdue Allen. > > All the tactics failed: Allen fired what police believe was a small-caliber > handgun as troopers inserted mirrors into her house to look around, she > apparently huddled in a bathroom to ward off the pepper spray, and she > shot the police dog through the mouth. [snip] > Police movement toward the house was sparked by a long silence inside. > Despite sophisticated surveillance and listening devices monitoring > the house, Allen hadn't been seen or heard since 1 p.m. Saturday, > McDonald said (not 1 a.m. as previously reported). Troopers wanted to > see if she had collapsed or fallen ill. > > Should similar circumstances arise again, police may try different > tactics to check Allen's health. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Oh! They were checking her health! Of course. -- Jeff

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Re: Using PGP on Insecure Machines
by p.v.mcmahon.rea0803＠oasis.icl.co.uk 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

James Hightower writes: > Which brings me to the question; "What ARE people using, and what are > they GOING to use?" Can anyone point me to a survey of the most used > Consumer will be using so that we can be there with strong, usable ^^^^^^^^ Who? > crypto when he gets there. ^^^^^ Where? Or less tersely, which users of messaging are you interested in providing crypto for? Apart from the Defence sector, there seem to be three main communities: 1 "Formal" inter-business electronic messaging using commercial value-added networks (VANs) - which are perceived as secure - and associated user agent software (which varies greatly). About fifty thousand North American companies are "there" already (for EDI, and at a cost). Leakage (due to high VAN costs) of formal messaging business from VANs onto the insecure Internet is not yet significant - although CommerceNet will doubtless fix that. 2 Intra-organisation nessaging based on LAN or corporate workflow and email systems. This has built both bottom-up and downwards (e.g. from PROFS or equivalent). The prevalent software is diverse, proprietary and volume. I don't have total market figures to hand, but as an example, the 11JUL94 Government Computer News ranks MS Mail (Windows 3), cc:Mail (Windows), cc:Mail(DOS), MS Mail (PC Networks), and WordPerfect Office as the most preferred e-mail packages amongst Federal users. I would expect a similar list in most commercial email-enabled organisations (with the addition of Lotus Notes). Varying security facilities are bundled within these packages already. 3 The "informal messaging" sector (including most Internet traffic). The associated software is more diverse and "open", but its users have a marginal and/or occasional need for end-to-end / message-transfer security. Note: for both 1 and 2, an "insecure machine" (i.e.: with administrative intrusion potential into an individual's messaging security) is more likely a requirement than a problem for medium/large corporations - as management supervision and control over information assets need to be possible. -- Tim May writes: > I had assumed the poll was of *us*, which is both a manageable poll to > take, and a useful one. What would be done with the results? --- James A. Donald says: > High Tech industry has considerable experience with surveys of > consumers for nonexistent products. > > Such surveys are useless at best, and dangerous at worst. On the other hand, how else do you find out whether a sufficiently serious market exists to warrant investment in developing / productising a technology ? - pvm

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Re: I don't need no steenking badge...but I got one anyway (fwd)
by Jim Choate 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Forwarded message: > Date: Wed, 29 Oct 1997 04:48:17 +0100 (MET) > Subject: Re: I don't need no steenking badge...but I got one anyway > From: nobody(a)REPLAY.COM (Anonymous) > Why do the average citizens put up with behavior from legislators and > law enforcement agents that they would not tolerate in their children? I'll tell you, course I won't be lucky enough your head will then explode but I can wish.... It's called *trust* in a ideal. ____________________________________________________________________ | | | The financial policy of the welfare state requires that there | | be no way for the owners of wealth to protect themselves. | | | | -Alan Greenspan- | | | | _____ The Armadillo Group | | ,::////;::-. Austin, Tx. USA | | /:'///// ``::>/|/ http://www.ssz.com/ | | .', |||| `/( e\ | | -====~~mm-'`-```-mm --'- Jim Choate | | ravage(a)ssz.com | | 512-451-7087 | |____________________________________________________________________|

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Re: Design proposal: crypto-capable generic interface
by Carl Ellison 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

>Date: Sat, 18 Nov 1995 00:42:21 -0800 (PST) >From: Raph Levien <raph(a)c2.org> > First, a few words about what I consider to be good interface that >can support plug-in crypto. [...] > I propose that the new interface lives as a sort of daemon, rather >than a static collection of command line script pieces. Danger, Will Robinson! (see below) [...] > Once the negotation has been established, the application can send >the daemon MIME objects that the app does not understand but the >daemon does (for example, an image/fractal). The daemon can return a >MIME object that the app does understand (for example, an image/ppm). This part sounds good...a sort of master translation service. > Alternatively, the daemon may request an authentication. This is >useful when resolving external bodies that require authentication, >including non-anonymous FTP, and standard authenticated HTTP. In this >case, the daemon sends a message to the app requesting the >authentication. It specifies whether it needs both username and >password, or just password. In the latter case, it hands a username to >the application. > The application can then query the user for the authentication >data. It hands this back to the daemon. In reply, the daemon indicates >success or failure. In case of success, it hands the object back to >the app. Now I get worried. This communication with the demon is via some IPC -- maybe even via a LAN. Some things can't be distributed safely and authentication is #2 on my list. > Encryption is a bit more tricky, but in essence you just hang a >premail-alike off this kind of protocol. The hard part is specifying >the key, but you just call it a "parameter" and put in hooks for the >daemon to ask for whatever parameters it needs. Crypto keys are #1 on my list of things you can't distribute (unless they are wrapped, of course). > This requires that >keys have some nonforgeable names, which is unfortunately not a >feature of PGP 2.6.2. S/MIME will do it just fine, if you buy into the >Certifcation Authority (<wink> at Nick Szabo). Public keys, if that's what you're talking about, have perfectly good nonforgeable names -- themselves. They are unique. They are the proper name which can collect all the attributes of that key which are of interest (e.g., permission to spend $, name of a human who knows the private key, attributes about that human, etc.). > One final aside: I've been fairly frustrated with this mailing list >as a forum for talking about real design proposals and implementation >issues. Ignorant posts by the likes of Dr. Fred and Alice d'Clueless >tend to attract far more attention than real crypto work. I want a >forum for, and just for, cypherpunks who write code. If I had just a >smidgen more free time (as if), I'd be trying to start one >myself. Anyone else? I've seen this happen several times. As a list gets popular, it diversifies. You might try sci.crypt.research -- since it's moderated. - Carl +--------------------------------------------------------------------------+ |Carl M. Ellison cme(a)tis.com http://www.clark.net/pub/cme | |Trusted Information Systems, Inc. http://www.tis.com/ | |3060 Washington Road PGP 2.6.2: 61E2DE7FCB9D7984E9C8048BA63221A2| |Glenwood MD 21738 Tel:(301)854-6889 FAX:(301)854-5363 | +--------------------------------------------------------------------------+

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Re: Bob - FYI -- not sure if this was already posted ?
by Mark Grant 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Jonathan Wienke (JonWienk(a)ix.netcom.com) wrote: > Like a kidnapper is really going to encrypt a ransom note so the kidnap > victim's friends won't be able to figure out how to deliver the ransom > money. DUHHHHHHH! But what if you're out at lunch or on vacation, or just moved, and no-one can read the message because they don't have the key? We must have GMR encryption to FBI keys now, just in case! (That's not entirely facetious, I could see them making this kind of argument if CMR is widely adopted... it's not Big Brother, it's just another useful public service). Mark

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Re: Orthogonal (fwd)
by Jim Choate 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Forwarded message: > From: Mark Rogaski <wendigo(a)ne-wendigo.jabberwock.org> > Subject: Re: Orthogonal (fwd) > Date: Wed, 29 Oct 1997 02:28:33 -0500 (EST) > : Some of you people are fucking worthless for anything other than baiting. > > Oh, come now, any human has many uses if you put your mind to it. > A cheap, renewable replacement for ballistic test gelatin, maybe? ;) Ok, so I was wrong that particular point. Come to think of it, I do need somebody to wipe my butt after I shit too, when I do it my carpal-tunnel syndrome gets aggravated... ____________________________________________________________________ | | | The financial policy of the welfare state requires that there | | be no way for the owners of wealth to protect themselves. | | | | -Alan Greenspan- | | | | _____ The Armadillo Group | | ,::////;::-. Austin, Tx. USA | | /:'///// ``::>/|/ http://www.ssz.com/ | | .', |||| `/( e\ | | -====~~mm-'`-```-mm --'- Jim Choate | | ravage(a)ssz.com | | 512-451-7087 | |____________________________________________________________________|

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