- cypherpunks-legacy - lists.cpunks.org

Re: URG_ent
by droelke＠rdxsunhost.aud.alcatel.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Not to beat up on Medcom - but doesn't this sound like a nice DES cracking target? > > "Medcom introduces a "Super Cafe" data encryption product" > > Medcom's latest data encryption product, the Secure Socket > Relay (SSR), features strong encryption with full key length > (56-bits DES). A demo version can be downloaded at > http://www.medcom.se/. > > ------------------------------------------------------------------ Dan Oelke Alcatel Network Systems droelke(a)aud.alcatel.com Richardson, TX

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"Fortune" article on crypto
by Timothy C. May 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Wading through 150 or more messages from while I was away (a huge fraction of them either about or from Vulis), I didn't see mention of the long article on crypto, export issues, RSADSI, Bidzos, the NSA, etc., in the current issue of "Fortune" magazine, 11 November. One think caught my eye, though I haven't finished reading the whole thing. "Bidzos professes what seems sincere respect for the spy agency--several of its former staffers even work for him. But he insists that it needs a gadfly: "I've gone there a few times and listened to their dark-side folks. I always come out feeling that I'm a traitor. I deserve to die. I'm causing the early demise of society and should just scuttle the company, But an hour after I leave the agency, my head clears and I think, "Okay, back to reality."" This echoes the feeling I often have (though I have never been given the "If you knew what we know" spiel, though I have a vivid imagination and have known for the last half-dozen years what the implications of strong and untraceable crypto implies). That is, I understand the role of the NSA and the longterm "threats" strong crypto implies. (I avoid blather about how all it is useful for is to protect the democratic and privacy rights of citizen-units. That's comforting twaddle, popular with some journalists and some namby pamby privacy advocates. In fact, strong crypto is a tool for deconstructing and demolishing democratic institutions, which is why I support it. Obviously. Yes, I sometimes get concerned about the lives which will be affected, but, ultimately, the ubermensch must do what he must do, regardless of how some in the herd are affected.) Also Sprach Tim, "The government announcement is disastrous," said Jim Bidzos,.."We warned IBM that the National Security Agency would try to twist their technology." [NYT, 1996-10-02] We got computers, we're tapping phone lines, I know that that ain't allowed. ---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---- Timothy C. May | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money, tcmay(a)got.net 408-728-0152 | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero W.A.S.T.E.: Corralitos, CA | knowledge, reputations, information markets, Higher Power: 2^1,257,787-1 | black markets, collapse of governments. "National borders aren't even speed bumps on the information superhighway."

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HAPPY GUY FAWKES DAY!
by Sandy Sandfort 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ SANDY SANDFORT . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . C'punks, On this day in 1605 the Gunpowder Plot was foiled. Guy Fawkes and his compatriots had intended to blow up Parliment. The English celebrate it because Guy Fawkes failed. I celebrate it because he tried. :-) S a n d y ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

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RE: Dr. Vulis
by jbugden＠smtplink.alis.ca 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Hallam-Baker <hallam(a)ai.mit.edu> wrote: > the main theory [Mill's book _On_Liberty_] advances is of the *balance* > between the rights of communities and the rights of individuals. Two words: Schelling Point. James

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RE: Dr. Vulis please read this.
by dlv＠bwalk.dm.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

"Butler, Scott" <SButler(a)chemson.com> writes: > Dr. Dimitri Vulis (KOTM) > > Do you think that it would be possible for you to leave this mailing > list quietly WITHOUT sending mail to it again unless you have anything > that may be found interesting / useful regarding cryptography. Thank you, Scott, for your advice, which reminds me of the following story: One day the Germans were about to shoot two Jews, named Abram and Moisha. The Germans offered the Jews blindfolds. Abram bravely declined, to which Moisha said: "Take it, Abram, don't make trouble!" --- Dr.Dimitri Vulis KOTM Brighton Beach Boardwalk BBS, Forest Hills, N.Y.: +1-718-261-2013, 14.4Kbps

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Re: [NOISE] If the shoe fits, wear it [VULIS]
by Rich Graves 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Dr.Dimitri Vulis KOTM wrote: > > I've pointed out already that apparently John is not, so far, > filtering out my submissions to the c-punks list. Correct. It's just a formal way of saying you're unwelcome, really. Shoo. > However I'd like to take exception with the two claims made in > the articles cc'd to me so far: > > A that only governments can censor; > > B that post-factum punishment for "inappropriate" speech is not > censorship. I agree with your objections, probably because you're attacking straw men. > Certainly Disney owned WABC and was within its rights to censor it. > Likewise John Gilmore is within his rights to destroy his own > credibility and to expose his own hypocricy. Yes, this gets to my point. Private censorship tells more about the censor than about the censored. In this case, John acted properly, and his credibility has only been enhanced. You are of course free to rant and rave about his hypocrisy, but expecially since you'll always be able to post to the list, at least under a nym (the only thing he's prevented is your reading the list under your own name), you're only proving yourself to be an idiot. - -rich - --- [This message has been signed by an auto-signing service. A valid signature means only that it has been received at the address corresponding to the signature and forwarded.] -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.2 Comment: Gratis auto-signing service iQBFAwUBMn+0UioZzwIn1bdtAQE+DwF/YHGRdPpQ3JqotsUWw303aYCmKn7d9il1 4sCKaEIMy7NHT1uvRR1DL8oBgZGsVUwH =acPs -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

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Re: Dr. Vulis
by Sandy Sandfort 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ SANDY SANDFORT . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . C'punks, On Tue, 5 Nov 1996 Phill wrote: > Of course the two sentences don't say exactly the same thing, > otherwise I would have written one. That never stopped academics before. > I don't think we have a problem with the statements conflicting, > there is an interaction. What a Hegelian would call dilectic. > I prefer to use a different term for much the same reasons as > Sorros, the misuse of the term has created garbage that one > does not want to associate with (eg Historical materialism). Please eschew the obfuscation. The sentences Phill hastely wrote are simply contradictory. It's fatuous to claim, after the fact, that he intended some sort of dialectic (i.e., a system of arguement in which conflicting ideas are resolved). Intellectual honesty isn't required on this list, but it is appreciated. S a n d y ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

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Re: Censorship on cypherpunks [RANT]
by camcc＠abraxis.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 07:20 AM 11/4/96 -0800, you wrote: : :So if c-punks is really "private", how does it decide (arbitrarily?) who to include :and who to reject? Since it IS private, the owner has to justify NOTHING, vis-a-vis the list. We _choose_ to supplicate to join; we are _allowed_ to join (or not allowed) by the owner's grace; we may always _choose_ to unsubscrive [sic]; if we do it correctly, we are off the list. Let me repeat, the onus is NOT on the owner to justify the use of his property. Cordially, Alec PGP Fingerprint: pub 1024/41207EE5 1996/04/08 Alec McCrackin <camcc(a)abraxis.com> Key fingerprint = 09 13 E1 CB B3 0C 88 D9 D7 D4 10 F0 06 7D DF 31

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Re: Dr. Vulis is not on cypherpunks any more [VULIS]
by Rich Graves 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Igor Chudov @ home wrote: > > I guess libertarian philosophy permits operating a private mailing > list and imposing whatever rules the host deems necessary to invent. Clearly. And contractural principles suggest that there should be transparency in those rules. > The question is, can this ist be called a free medium for exchange of > ideas, or not. My answer is no. I say you're wrong. Vulis has been denied nothing but the dignity of reading the list under his own name. He still has freedom to read under a pseudonym, and he still has freedom to post under his own name, or any other. > Moderated forums might create some utility (by saving the time of > their participants, for example), but they should identify themselves > as such. Such as by notifying the list that exactly one particularly obnoxious member has been kicked off, and allowing *unlimited* discussion on the list about the impact of doing so? I think this is working. - -rich - --- [This message has been signed by an auto-signing service. A valid signature means only that it has been received at the address corresponding to the signature and forwarded.] -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.2 Comment: Gratis auto-signing service iQBFAwUBMn/BzSoZzwIn1bdtAQGk+wGAgv2SrJzetHEzgs9DxahGvB8ReGWi8mDB aEGj8o8aW2DNGrDSx4f8DBDS4a8605Tc =oQeM -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

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[rant] Re: Censorship on cypherpunks
by Sean Roach 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

> >Obviously many voluntary religious organizations have quite strict rules >for their members and are compatible with libertarianism. Government >monopoly regulations that cannot be opted out of are not compatible with >libertarianism. May I remind you that if you want to leave this country, all you have to do is board a plane. Many people have suggested similar things about various groups for about two centuries. The major difference between this list and this government is that it is easier to start a new list.

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