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Re: was: Echelon-like resources..
by Tyler Durden 13 Oct '02

13 Oct '02

"Yes: The factory was bombed, but actual deaths were one night watchman, "not tens of thousands"," Well, you haven't given me a very convincing argument here. In most of his writings, Chomsky makes it clear that the deaths were not due to the bomb, but the loss of medicine (such as penecillin) in Sudan's only pharmecuetical factory. "Or the fact that Nicaruaga brought the > > US before the world court and won? > >Perhaps that was true," Uh...perhaps? That should be a very easy thing to find out, and as the accusation and conviction were quite damming, and as you claim Chomsky regularly "lies" on many of his citations, I would have thought that this at least would be one citation you'd check. Got to say...I'm a busy man, and you haven't even said anything meriting even the investigaion of your dis-chomsky web page. >From: James Donald <jamesd127(a)yahoo.com> >To: cypherpunks(a)lne.com >Subject: Re: was: Echelon-like resources.. >Date: Sat, 12 Oct 2002 11:57:24 -0700 (PDT) > >Tyler Durden > > As for Chomsky lying, can you give us > > some specific citations? Did he lie > > about our support for Sadam Hussein? > >No > > > Our support for Indonesia? > >Yes > > > Our bombing of the sudanese > > pharmacuetical factory? > >Yes: The factory was bombed, but actual >deaths were one night watchman, "not tens >of thousands", and he asserted that the >Sudanese government are the good guys in >the civil war, and their opponents >terrorists. > > > Or the fact that Nicaruaga brought the > > US before the world court and won? > >Perhaps that was true, but pretty much >everything else he reported on Nicaragua >was a lie, for example that the >Sandinistas won free elections, and that >the contras were a creation of the US, >and that the Sandinistas were more >popular than the contras. > > > Granted, Chonskty can be a little > > tiring on the ears, but my knee-jerk > > reaction towards your calling him a > > liar is that you misunderstood the > > citation. But then again, I could be > > wrong, so do give us some examples, eh? > >See my web page "Chomsky lies" >http://www.jim.com/chomsdis.htm >Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More >http://faith.yahoo.com _________________________________________________________________ Join the worlds largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com

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13 Oct '02

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by EbaySecrets 13 Oct '02

13 Oct '02

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Re: was: Echelon-like resources..
by Eugen Leitl 13 Oct '02

13 Oct '02

On Sun, 13 Oct 2002, Sunder wrote: > Of course, for all you and I really know that could have been an Anthrax > factory cleverly disguised as as a pharmaceuticals factory, but we can put > up rethorical questions and answers such as these for the next millenia > and not get anywhere either. Exactly. So let's stop burning synapses on trivialities of daily politics. Being too out of touch is never advisable, but taking a deliberate vacation every now and then from the mass media sometimes pays.

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Re: was: Echelon-like resources..
by Sunder 13 Oct '02

13 Oct '02

> Yes: The factory was bombed, but actual > deaths were one night watchman, "not tens > of thousands", and he asserted that the > Sudanese government are the good guys in > the civil war, and their opponents > terrorists. And how many of their citizens have or will die due to lack of those very same pharamceuticals that the bombed factory can no longer produce? Or suffer from disease due to the same? Perhaps not tens of thousands, but more than just the single night watchman, I'd say. The point isn't how many deaths, but what collateral damage was done. Not just in the sense of civilian casualties, but also the damage inflicted on those by the effect of not having said facility around. Of course, for all you and I really know that could have been an Anthrax factory cleverly disguised as as a pharmaceuticals factory, but we can put up rethorical questions and answers such as these for the next millenia and not get anywhere either.

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by griceldaoj＠important.net 13 Oct '02

13 Oct '02

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Re: kraf
by Atilla Kuzu 13 Oct '02

13 Oct '02

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Re: why bother signing? (was Re: What email encryption is actually in use?)
by James A. Donald 13 Oct '02

13 Oct '02

James A. Donald: > >> > If we had client side encryption that "just works" we > >> > would be seeing a few more signed messages on this list, Major Variola (ret): > But Ben is not spoofed here! So there is little motivation. > > [...] > > In the absence of any need, its not rational to bother. There have been episodes of spoofing on this list. If client side encryption "just worked", and if what is considerably more difficult, checking the signatures "just worked", there would be no bother, hence it would be rational to sign --digsig James A. Donald 6YeGpsZR+nOTh/cGwvITnSR3TdzclVpR0+pr3YYQdkG j35pZ93cRp46pIhaD4AQ0X3neQjPEV2l9JrKJ2L2 4Eto77muLU+n+EF8nNrcbcSAMw1Vtdttyl1600R9x

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Re: US developing untraceable weapons
by Tyler Durden 13 Oct '02

13 Oct '02

Well, there was also some other details left out by that article. A "100kW beam" doesn't tell you very much if you don't know the beam diameter. A 1310nm telecom laser can cause serious eye damage with 10mW, but that's 10mW into, say 38 um^2. But it ain't going to do nothing to enemy aircraft located at a distance. A 100kW laser might easily have a smaller energy density depending on the diameter. In addition, there's the problem of focusing that thing through turbulence, but turbulence through certain wavelength windows may not be a problem. >From: Steve Schear <schear(a)lvcm.com> >To: cypherpunks(a)lne.com >Subject: Re: US developing untraceable weapons >Date: Sat, 12 Oct 2002 17:28:03 -0700 > >At 12:10 PM 10/11/2002 -0700, "Major Variola (ret)" <mv(a)cdc.gov> wrote: >>Theres no huge explosion associated with its employment, there are no >>pieces and >>parts left behind that someone can analyze to say, this came from the >>United States, >>explains an unnamed Lockheed Martin official quoted in Aviation Week and >>Space >>Technology in July. The damage is localized, and it is hard to tell >>where it came from >>and when it happened. It is all pretty mysterious. > >The only energy sources I can think of that is portable enough to go in a >jet are a generator running of the main/aux jet engine or a chemical >pumping. > >Unless the DoD has found a practical new chemical reaction, other than the >Fluorine/Deuterium they used for decades on various shipboard project such >as MIRACL, the plane would be easily identified and targeted by the >fluorescing the chemical plume with LIDAR. > >Assuming a laser efficiency of 5% an electric source would have to provide >over 2 MW of continuous power (from Star Wars test results, I assume a >pulsed laser is inadequate for causing damage in combat situations) to >supply a 100KW beam. The most efficient generators I'm aware are capable >of producing about 2-4 HP/lb. 2 MW equates to about 2700 HP or about 650 - >1300 lbs. Assuming the laser isn't too terribly heavy or aerodynamically >cumbersome the entire package could be carried aboard a fighter. > >steve > > >"War is just a racket ... something that is not what it seems to the >majority of people. Only a small group knows what its about. It is >conducted for the benefit of the very few at the expense of the masses." >--- Major General Smedley Butler, 1933 _________________________________________________________________ Join the worlds largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com

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by wholsaler_inkjet_3144l41＠hotbot.com 12 Oct '02

12 Oct '02

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