December 2003 - cypherpunks-legacy

NEW
by express＠capella.net 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

THE FOX FIRES HAVE STARTED BURNING! http://www.mlmers-ad-net.com/FoxTeam/Fox FREE WEB PAGE AND CHECKS SENT OUT DAILY! Let it begin, John

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American Cyber Mall
by rgwjr 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

AMERICAN CYBER MALL http://www.usacm.com FREE WEB PAGE CONTEST, WEEKLY DRAWING !!! Visit the American Cyber Mall http://www.usacm.com and you can register to win a FREE web page with FREE 12 months hosting !!! Just our way of say thanks for visiting our new award winning cyber mall. American Cyber Mall http://www.usacm.com TO BE REMOVED FROM LIST REPLY WITH SUBJECT = REMOVE

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Sandy is God...Listen to Him!
by nobody＠replay.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Don't understand all this issue about Sandy and John filtering the list. Don't we want order and control? We need Sandy to decide whether our articles should be read by others. Sandy is our spokesman, our leader, our navigator. When he founded the Cypherpunks group, he wanted ``order and control, ``and now he has been forced to re-assume control of the group to put controls in place. Hey, if Sandy and John say we have to stick to certain topics, well, dammit, they are in control and we have to do what they want. Sandy and John are our leaders. Forget this stuff about the Cypherpunks list being a group seperate from toad.com. Forget this idea that John is just the host of the list...he is actually the co-controlled. And we'd better pay attention. Why didn't Sandy and John just announce a new filtered list, like Blossom has? Why make their control the default for the whole list, with the the unfiltered list harder to subscribe to and eventually to go away completely? Good questions! Ask not the reasons for God's decissions. This is Sandy's list, and John's machine, and if they say they know best what is a flame and what is not, I say we should just take our medicine and learn to love their wise decisions. If they say we can only write flames if they approve, OK. If they say we must only write about libertarian topics, OK. If they reject our messages without explanation, OK. Sandy is our Leader. And anyone who doesn't respect our Leader should just leave. Bye -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.2 07dTgUBMs4Q8hvikii9febJAQEbrAQAmgwAeqSsi2qIkqakNRPCpwCwNnYudNop zyxE2LueC+WuhugtLeyDDet+WgefE9X84F4qxn/QVB+tJAGbZzfCPO24shelX21k mk80oevKqzcfAAzbB4tMtXe5gl6+zykExXjsx4J/KjMNPL0QAE490uvnKqus/a2H 0l2AU9k/Kp8= =ix2B -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

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Re: The Upcoming DES Challenge
by Liz Taylor 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

There is nothing unglamorous about a known plaintext attack, if the plaintext is choosen carefully. I don't know anything about bank ATMs and the protocols they use, but I presume the PIN is stored on the card single DES encrypted. If this is so, anyone can take an ATM card, attack it to recover the key and then use that key to recover the PIN for any stolen ATM card of that bank (or that branch). Hopefully, the ciphertext/plaintext pair that RSA announces will be a real target like this, with the actual key disabled. Once the key is recovered, the press can then claim that ATM cards are not safe any longer. On a related note, do you think the key will first be recovered by a hardware device or by the Great Internet DES Key Search? Hardware is much faster, but no such device exists in the private/amateur sector now. Estimates are that it will take 10 months to actually build such a device. Opinions?

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Re: Thoughts on moderation
by Douglas Barnes 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Goodness knows most people who are fully engaged in a mailing list get involved in an unproductive discussion or argument from time to time. My main assertion about Sandy is that although he has his likes and dislikes (and is not shy about sharing them) I can't see him bouncing messages just because someone was disagreeing with him. There might be someone who is less opinionated, but I think that you need to find someone who cares enough about a subject to be interested in moderating it (one antonym of "opinionated" is "dispassionate" -- think about it.) The only way to tell if Sandy will be fair _as a moderator_ is to give him a chance. Years of knowing him as a friend, and four months of sharing an office indicate that while he's stubborn and opinionated, he's also extremely fairminded, and will not bounce for content he disagrees with. He also has a broad concept (some might argue too broad) of acceptable list topics, but since we're looking primarily to screen out the worst dreck & outright spam, he seems like a logical choice as moderator. I don't see this move as censorship of any sort -- cleaning the Augean stables is more like it. I am profoundly tired of wading through completely worthless and vapid trash accusing Tim and John of various sexual perversions. (Note that if the writers actually knew these folks, they'd at least be able to write better or more interesting libel.) At 10:35 PM 1/6/97 -0800, you wrote: >Douglas Barnes wrote: >> 1) I've known Sandy for a couple of years, and I trust him to >> use good judgement as a moderator. It will be important to >> develop guidelines so that the job can be rotated, but it's also >> important that the moderator be someone who doesn't have any >> major axe to grind. Sandy has his personal likes and dislikes, >> but I don't think he'll ever stoop to tossing out opinions that >> he disagrees with. > >Wishful thinking, Doug. Sandy will take an emotional (non-objective) >position on an issue, and argue it beyond any reasonable limit. I wish >I had all his replies to things I've said - you'd see what I mean. > >Not to promote anyone who I might not be a friend of, but, there are >people on this list who are "well respected" who are light-years ahead >of Sandy in areas that are important for a list moderator. > >Maybe Gilmore should have publicly announced for a moderator, and then >let the subscribers pick.... > >

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$2500 for a class c.
by faried nawaz 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

------- Blind-Carbon-Copy To: hungry(a)hungry.com Cc: chris(a)uidaho.edu, people(a)kuoi.sub.uidaho.edu Subject: $2500 for a class c. Date: Tue, 07 Jan 1997 15:19:25 PST Message-ID: <7130.852679165(a)bear.cs.uidaho.edu> From: faried nawaz <nawaz921(a)bear.cs.uidaho.edu> (two messages follow) From: gjohnson(a)dream.season.com (Reality is a point of view) Subject: IP allocation goes fee based soon?! Newsgroups: ba.internet Date: 6 Jan 1997 16:08:04 GMT Organization: season.com [205.179.33.0] Path: news.uidaho.edu!newsfeed.orst.edu!newshub.tc.umn.edu!spool.mu.edu!newspump.sol.net!howland.erols.net!agate!news.ucsc.edu!news.scruz.net!gjohnson Lines: 18 Message-ID: <slrn5d28r9.34.gjohnson(a)dream.season.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: 205.179.33.42 Xref: news.uidaho.edu ba.internet:12066 Take a look at http://rs.internic.net/arin for a quiet bombshell, especially Section 2.3. A Class C block for $2,500? If you think that isn't funny there are a few people that agree with you in threads elsewhere. Try a dejanews search on $2500 Class C. You might also want to take a peek at http://www.iahc.org for news about a commentary period that ends in the next few days. - -- Gary Johnson "Wahoo." gjohnson(a)season.com Remember why... later in the thread -- From: davidm(a)them.com (David Mandala) Subject: Re: IP allocation goes fee based soon?! Newsgroups: ba.internet Date: Tue, 07 Jan 97 19:10:07 GMT Organization: Them Productions Path: news.uidaho.edu!newsfeed.orst.edu!news.uoregon.edu!marlin.ucsf.edu!overload.lbl.gov!agate!spool.mu.edu!newspump.sol.net!howland.erols.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news-xfer.netaxs.com!news.texas.net!news1.best.com!nntp1.best.com!davidm Lines: 32 Message-ID: <5au72j$rnn(a)nntp1.best.com> References: <slrn5d28r9.34.gjohnson(a)dream.season.com> <e3mca8.3mx(a)oriole.sbay.org> <southernE3MJxJ.FKq(a)netcom.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: davidm.vip.best.com X-Newsreader: News Xpress 2.0 Beta #2 Xref: news.uidaho.edu ba.internet:12120 I've since heard that their contract run out in 1998, now since they have gone from a small nothing company to a widly known disaster, if follows that they are making money hand over fist. So before the contract opens we need to make enough noise with the goverment that the contract is NOT relet to them but rather to open bid, or to a true non profit alliance of Internet professionals to provide the service at cost (which in reality is quite small). Only we can make the difference. In article <southernE3MJxJ.FKq(a)netcom.com>, southern(a)netcom.com (Shawn) wrote: >In article <e3mca8.3mx(a)oriole.sbay.org>, George Bonser wrote: >: Billions and Billions of IP addresses are right around the corner >: and they are going to use the current shortage to set a precedent >: (sp?) of charging $2500 per block of 256? That would put them in a >: position to make an absolute KILLING when IPv6 comes out. > ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > >Give that man a ceegar. > >That is, I believe, the point. > >All, of course, at $50/year per domain name. > >With that kind of income, they might give Microsoft a run for their >money as being one of the most profitable computer companies in the >world. <tounge FIRMLY in cheek> :-) > >Shawn /************************************************************* David Mandala Them Productions San Francisco, CA Internet: davidm(a)them.com CIS: 74156,221 AOL: dism *************************************************************/ faried - -- i don't hate people. | my other car is a cdr why, some of my closest | linux, the ms-dos of the nineties friends are people. | <zorgo> cable and internet.. who needs a life? -- stevi(a)aa.net | http://www.hungry.com/~fn/ ------- End of Blind-Carbon-Copy

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Re: The Upcoming DES Challenge
by sameer 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

> There is nothing unglamorous about a known plaintext attack, if the > plaintext is choosen carefully. I don't know anything about bank ATMs > and the protocols they use, but I presume the PIN is stored on the card > single DES encrypted. If this is so, anyone can take an ATM card, attack it > to recover the key and then use that key to recover the PIN for any stolen > ATM card of that bank (or that branch). Hopefully, the ciphertext/plaintext > pair that RSA announces will be a real target like this, with the actual key > disabled. Once the key is recovered, the press can then claim that ATM > cards are not safe any longer. Stolen ATM cards are actually not that valuable. They have fixed limits and require physical presence to exploit. Try swift/forex/etc. secret des keys.. those are valuable. -- Sameer Parekh Voice: 510-986-8770 President FAX: 510-986-8777 C2Net C2Net is having a party: http://www.c2.net/party/ http://www.c2.net/ sameer(a)c2.net

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Re: [CRYPTO] Quadratic residues
by miner 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 02:37 PM 1/7/97 -0500, Anonymous wrote: >Timothy May's family tree goes straight up. All of his >ancestors were siblings, to dumb to recognize each other in the >dark. > > /\ o-/\ Timothy May > ///\|/\\\ > / /|\ \ Counting the days till I don't have to see anymore of these, certainly a product of one of the 3 people already in my killfile. Thank you John and Sandy in advance

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RE: Thoughts on moderation
by Blanc Weber 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

From: Douglas Barnes I don't see this move as censorship of any sort -- cleaning the Augean stables is more like it. I am profoundly tired of wading through completely worthless and vapid trash accusing Tim and John of various sexual perversions. .................................................. So what about determining the lowest parameter of tolerance for style & content - how low you can go before your messages are transferred to the "flames" division? Then, for instance, Uni could say to Dale: "you will find my detailed retort to your deluded accusations on the other list" (which Dale would, of course, go over there and read <g>). In any case, everyone would know what that sensitive, low point of intolerance is such that if they descend to it they will be sifted out and recategorized. .. Blanc

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About ICF(International Cryptography Framework)
by Starr 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Has anyone heard anything or been paying attention to the development of the ICF(International Cryptography Framework) standard. This seems to be an attempt of the US Gov and a FEW of our favorite corps to completely control cryptography standards as well as to have the keys to all cryptographical content. The only information I've found so far is on HP's website http://www.dmo.hp.com/gsy/security/icf/main.html I've also managed to get a hold of Ray Bamford (ray_bamford(a)hp.com)at HP who seems to have some PR role in this wool over the eyes attempt. It seems to be just another (souped-up, in disguise attempt at the clipper chip except on an International basis). When I spoke to him he told me that the only information that has been issued is what you seen in the technical paper, and that the info they have is extremely exclusive, even if you are a legitimate company working on cryptography issues, etc. Check it out...I would definitely like to hear your opinions as well as if any of you have more information on this subject(newsgroups, mail lists, etc). -spanky

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