December 2003 - cypherpunks-legacy

Re: Orthogonality and Disaster Recovery (fwd)
by Jim Choate 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Forwarded message: > Date: Sun, 26 Oct 1997 18:03:16 -0800 > From: David Sternlight <david(a)sternlight.com> > Subject: Re: Orthogonality and Disaster Recovery > > Do all E-Mail vendors need to be cryptologist?? > > If the client's e-mail is to be secure, yes. But let's be accurate here. I absolute agree we need to be accurate. To that end, it is not the applications that need security but rather the network and session layers. > > Do all cryptologist need > > to be application vendors?? Obviously not. > > Now that IS nonsensical because cryptology is a wide and deep art only a small > part of which has to do with mail applications themselves. In contrast, mail > applications to be secure must use encryption. There's some very muddy > thinking going on in your post. He said 'application vendors', not just mail. Pay attention to the details of the argument and quit trying to change the subject without specificaly noteing the change, otherwise known as a strawman. His muddy thinking doesn't stand alone. > > PGP is a tool much like a > > database is. The majority of vendors who develop apps that require a > > database do not go out and write their own, rather they use a database > > engine that is suited to their needs. > > Except for the occasional password protection, databases don't need encryption > to the extent e-mail does. I work everyday with the NSA, CIA, Dod, Army, SAIC, all the phone companies, many of the major banks, Intel, Human Genome Project, etc. Every one of these folks would disagree with you. In fact it was one of the motivating factors behind Tivoli comming out with their new Security Management application because vendors required us to move away from our custom databases and toward industry standards (Oracle, Sybase, Informix, DB2, DBMX, etc.) *AND* at the same time requiring a better security mechanism than the existing one we use (DES & Kerberos based). The reality of the market does not support your thesis. > You miss the point here. And you miss the many worked examples. RSA is selling > lots and lots of toolkits for lots and lots of money for in-line integration > into applications, not for pre- and post-processing. The former is the way to > go; the latter a kludge until something better comes along. Are they involved with the new Cryptographic Standard projects of the government and Tivoli - IBM? I don't think so, at least I still haven't seen them involved in any of the work I have had access to so far; much to my own personal disappointment. ____________________________________________________________________ | | | The financial policy of the welfare state requires that there | | be no way for the owners of wealth to protect themselves. | | | | -Alan Greenspan- | | | | _____ The Armadillo Group | | ,::////;::-. Austin, Tx. USA | | /:'///// ``::>/|/ http://www.ssz.com/ | | .', |||| `/( e\ | | -====~~mm-'`-```-mm --'- Jim Choate | | ravage(a)ssz.com | | 512-451-7087 | |____________________________________________________________________|

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Webdeals! Less than wolesale
by SHOP＠netsteward.cm 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

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Re: Orthogonal (fwd)
by Jim Choate 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Forwarded message: > Date: Sun, 26 Oct 1997 19:13:12 -0800 > From: Kent Crispin <kent(a)bywater.songbird.com> > Subject: Re: Orthogonal (fwd) > > > I do believe the use of the term this way was inspired by the > > > notion of a 'basis' in a vector space -- a set of orthogonal > > > vectors that span the space, ideally, unit vectors. > > > > Can you better define the term 'basis'? > > This is basic linear algebra: > > V a vector space -- the set of all (s1,s2,s3,...,sn), where si is an > element of the set of reals. Actualy si (scalars) can be rational, real, or complex. It is also possible to use more general structures such as fields. [1] Note that complex numbers numbers may be used, in other words a vector can be used to multiply another vector. > A set of vectors {v1,v2,...,vm} in V is A vector of vectors, and you haven't even really defined vector yet...:( > linearly independent if there is no set of scalars {c1,c2,...,cm} with > at least one non-zero element such that sum(ci*vi) == 0 Are you saying: (c1*v1)+(c2*v2)+...+(cn*vn) <> 0 where at least one ci is <>0, is some sort of test for membership in a vector space? What about, (1/c1*v1)+(-1/c2*v2)+(0*v3)...+(0*vn) = 0, 1 -1 if so it should be clear that except for the case of c=0 there is always a way to take two, which is clearly more than one, of the scalars and cause the sum to be zero. Now if you have a single non-zero scalar multiplier then it seems reasonable that you can create such a structure that is always <>0. > A set of > vectors S spans In other words 'are expressible in'? > a vector space V iff every element of V can be expressed > as a linear combination of the elements of S. ^^^^^^^^^^^ Need to better define this one. The operations that are applicable to a vector space are: [1] 1. Associative law of addition: (x+y)+z = x+(y+z) 2. Commutative law of addition: x+y=y+x 3. Existance of zero: x+0=x for all x in V 4. Existance of inverses: x+(-x)=0 5. Associative law of multiplication: a(bx)=(ab)x 6. Unital law: 1*x=x 7. First distributive law: a(x+y)=(a*x)+(a*y) 8. Second distributive law: (a+b)*x=(a*x)+(b*x) where x is of the form 'asubn(x^n)+bsubn-1(x^n-1)+...+asub1x+asub0' This is a remarkably circular definition to present. In clearer wording; The set of vectors S is expressible in a vector space V iff S is contained in V. While this may be a requirement or test for membership in a vector space (as used below) it doesn't qualify as a definition. > Finally, a basis for > V is a linearly independent set of vectors in V that spans V. A > space is finite dimensioned if it has a finite set for a basis. The ^^^ set of what? > standard basis (or natural basis) for a vector space of dimension n > is th set of vectors > > (1,0,0,...0) > (0,1,0,...0) > (0,0,1,...0) In other words, any 'vector' can be expressed as the sum of the multiplication of unit elements by some set of scalars. Is this definition something you just wrote or would you be so kind as to give the reference if it isn't. This definition uses 'basis', doesn't define it. You can't use a term to define the term, it's called circular reasoning. My question still stands, can you please better define 'basis'. Or is your claim that basis is simply a way of stating 'elements of unit magnitude'? Furthermore, a definition of vector space has nothing to do with orthogonal measurement systems, it does have to do with polynomials. It just so happens that this sort of geometry shares the same sort of rules, that doesn't make them the same thing. There is nothing in your description, in particular the nifty little (*,*,*,...*)'s that implies any sort of measurement system based on line-segment axis that are 90 degrees apart, merely that there is more than one variable (ie x,y,z,...a) involved. Vector space - a vector space is a set of objects or elements that can be added together and multiplied by numbers (the result being an element of the set), in such a way that the usual rules of calculations hold. [1] ____________________________________________________________________ | | | The financial policy of the welfare state requires that there | | be no way for the owners of wealth to protect themselves. | | | | -Alan Greenspan- | | | | _____ The Armadillo Group | | ,::////;::-. Austin, Tx. USA | | /:'///// ``::>/|/ http://www.ssz.com/ | | .', |||| `/( e\ | | -====~~mm-'`-```-mm --'- Jim Choate | | ravage(a)ssz.com | | 512-451-7087 | |____________________________________________________________________| [1] The VNR Concise Encyclopedia of Mathematics Gellert, Kustner, Hellwich, Kastner ISBN 0-442-22646-2 17.3 Vector spaces pp. 362 [Hallowen Trivia] 'Dracula' is a word derived from 'dracul' meaning dragon and was given to Vlad Tepish, whose name means 'son of the devil', he was further known as Vlad the Impaler because he would impale people on poles and place them along the roads in Transylvania. When he died in 1496 his head was impaled on a stick as well.

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Re: poverty traps (Re: Sa (fwd)
by Jim Choate 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Forwarded message: > Subject: Re: poverty traps (Re: Sa (fwd) > Date: Sun, 26 Oct 1997 23:40:15 -0600 (CST) > From: ichudov(a)algebra.com (Igor Chudov @ home) > Jim Choate wrote: > > > Food: $600/month (generous) > > > > Hell, I'm single and come close to this and food costs in Texas are a LOT > > lower than in New York. Though I do eat out at lunch every weekday. And no, > > I don't go partying regularly at all. Way too busy with work (>16hrs/day > > 5 days a week & 16-20 on weekends) to do that other than a couple of times a > > month. I went to the store today and bought enough food for 4 days and it > > cost me $30. So that comes to something like $250 - $300 for me not counting > > lunches, and that's for just a single person. Multiply that for 6 and the > > numbers are considerably higher. > > Oh my Gawd! And I thought I was spending too much on food! I guess the > prices in OK are the same as in TX. >From the times I have been in Oklahoma (my family is ensconced along the Red River - Murphies, Joneses, Peoples, etc.) I would say the costs are about the same. ____________________________________________________________________ | | | The financial policy of the welfare state requires that there | | be no way for the owners of wealth to protect themselves. | | | | -Alan Greenspan- | | | | _____ The Armadillo Group | | ,::////;::-. Austin, Tx. USA | | /:'///// ``::>/|/ http://www.ssz.com/ | | .', |||| `/( e\ | | -====~~mm-'`-```-mm --'- Jim Choate | | ravage(a)ssz.com | | 512-451-7087 | |____________________________________________________________________|

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DoS
by Robert A. Hayden 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

This was forwarded to me in house. Just FYI. ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Mon, 27 Oct 1997 09:38:28 -0600 From: Chris Silker <csilker(a)means.net> MCI RELEASES FREE DENIAL OF SERVICE TRACKER SECURITY TOOL MCI has released an interesting piece of software called the Denial of Service Tracker (DoS). The security program helps track the source of denial of service attacks, which aim to overload a target computer system to the point that it's unusable for anything else. According to MCU, the DoS Tracker works against SYN, ICMP flood, bandwidth saturation, and concentrated source attacks, and is currently being modified to detect other DoS-based attacks, including a new attack called the Smurf. The info, a free download, and all the technical information is at the site. A must have for sysops. <http://www.security.mci.net/dostracker> =-=-=-=-=-= Robert Hayden rhayden(a)means.net UIN: 3937211 IP Network Administrator http://rhayden.means.net MEANS Telcom (612) 230-4416

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PGP 5.5 available outside US
by Lucky Green 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

It seems that unknown Cypherpunks have yet again shown their disrespect of US export laws by exporting the latest version of PGP. The Windows version of PGP 5.5 is now available for your downloading pleasure at ftp://ftp.replay.com/pub/crypto/incoming/PGP55.zip PGP 5.5 features superior LDAP keyserver integration, multiple signature categories, and automatic decryption (set Preferences -> Email -> Automatically Decrypt). "You heard the rumors. Now try it yourself." :-) -- Lucky Green <shamrock(a)cypherpunks.to> PGP encrypted email preferred. "Tonga? Where the hell is Tonga? They have Cypherpunks there?"

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Mmphmmphmmmph! (WAS Re: I Broke PGP!!!)
by bureau42 Anonymous Remailer 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

That was the sound of me eating crow. Although I am a closet reader of the True Story of the Internet series I am generally perturbed by the many of the inane Truthmonger posts to the list. I had decided several days ago to make a small apology to Truthmonger for some of my more emotional attacks on him (or her) but I put it off and put it off. I decided not to put it off after reading the following: Six wrote: > Bonus Question: "Who is TruthMonger #1?" > Bonus Answer: "He's Randall Farmer's best friend." That is _exactly_ what I thought when I read Randalls whining post about how Truthmongers rudeness might necessitate Randall instituting security and identity procedures that would enable others to verify whether a digitally signed message was indeed from himself. When I saw Tokoyo Rose echoing my thoughts then I thought I should take the trouble to point out what I myself learned from Truthmonger. [Although I am not certain if it is the same one.] I made the mistake of informing several people that the exercise that was suggested in Epiloge 5? of Infowar was bullshit but when I tried it it spit out my secret key like a hot damn much to my surprise. So I owe Truthmonger an apology but it will not be a public one. [Very few of you would know me anyway since I am mostly a list lurker.] The reason I will not make a public apology is because I also had PGP spit out the secret keys of my boss and coworkers. Although I am not a bad person in general possession of these keys is making me begin to think like Truthmonger. I will probably just test whether I can indeed password break them and use them to decipher a few files and then erase my copy of them. [Maybe.] [Maybe I should make my .sig line "Beware of Truthmonger inside!"] I did a search for the post that Tokoyo Rose talked about Truthmongers nephew adding things to Truthmongers email and found: > Also, as a 'teaser', I would like to announce to one and all that > the quickly closing saga of 'InfoWar' will include an epilogue > chapter titled, "I Broke PGP," written by myself. > Believe it or not, I speak the truth, although not in a way that > it direct and obvious. > If you think I am bullshiting, then stop washing your asshole, > starting today, because if you can show me I am wrong, I will kiss > your ugly, hairy ass. > > Love and Kisses, > TruthMangler After looking at other posts that have Truthmangler in them instead of Truthmonger I think that it might be a sign that the nephew is messing with them since they seem to have things inserted in them which appear to come more from a childs mind than Truthmongers. [If that is possible.] (;>) I would be interested in finding out if other people have been able to get secret keys using the method described in the Infowar book. We are using PGP 2.6.3i. I wonder about other versions. Croweatingmonger

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re: Hlep
by nobody＠REPLAY.COM 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Misty Ed the incredible talking horse.

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Re: Singaporean control freaks & CMR (Re: puff pieces vs tough crypto issues)
by Blanc 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Harish Pillay wrote: >I don't think the "micro management" is at it's worst in Singapore - not by >a long shot. It is true that the Singapore government tries to do so and >in a lot of what they attempt, they somehow come out smelling roses. But >they have goofed up royally as well. ................................................................... If you don't mind my asking in front of everybody, how do you stand it, living there? Do you get very frustrated (it sounds as though you might), and want to leave for Anguilla? Do you remind yourself not to litter with those gum wrappers you're not supposed to have anyway, what do you think when you're being incentivized to find a sexual partner and produce children, or to Do This and Not do That or risk painful punishments? Do co-workers become critical of each other's petty "crimes", do you feel opressed all around, or is it not as bad as it seems from here? .. Blanc

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Re: poverty traps (Re: Sa
by Blanc 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

harka(a)nycmetro.com wrote: >Further it is a social issue of importance also for Cypherpunks. >Obviously we don't want governments "taking care of people", but >desire individual freedom, self-determination and independence >instead. However, as proven such things are possible in the "free >market" only to a limited degree, i.e not applicable by default to >everybody, IMHO. [. . .] >If anybody _does_ have a solution, that enables _all_ people >(regardless of background) to become truly free and also provides a >realistic way to achieve that (for everybody), then I'll be more >than happy to listen and to adjust my own perspective. .................................................. The concept of a free market is not that it will "make you" free, nor that it shall "provide you" ("you" being any one engaged in the exchange of goods/services) with a perfect life, free of worry and the work of thought and decision-making, creating the "perfect life" solution for everybody. A free market doesn't "do things" for a person in spite of themselves. In a free market scenario it is intended that any individual will be a free agent - free from government interferance, free from government compulsion - to create their *own* life's "solution", satisfactory to themselves (regardless of whether it agrees with, or is at variance to, any one else's standards of living). It is intended that an individual will be left to their own devices, to seek out the methods which they themselves calculate will lead to the achievement of their own goals, according to their own vision of success - that is, not the government's vision of success, nor the vision of their neighbor, or of their mother-in-law, or anyone else who wants to shape one's life for them and tell one what to do with it and how (no, Jim Choate, I am not discriminating against Mothers-in-law, I'm just using them as a stereotypical example of an interfering busy-body. Don't worry about it.). It is way too easy to say that if you don't like something (like working for a certain employer) you should change employers (easier to say than done). But the real aim of this argument is against the attitude of tolerance, of tolerating the unacceptable or uncomfortable; it is that when a person finds themselves seemingly trapped, they should not merely suffer the circumstance (or worse, whine about it to everyone within earshot), but should rather orient themselves towards finding a creative solution and never cease searching for a way out. Because nothing is created or advanced into improvement by merely tolerating the intolerable, by just "taking what was given", or from continuing to bear up under low standards of functioning. The "free market " is not for the purpose of freeing everyone from the work of solving their own problems; the idea is to leave them free to negotiate with others on the terms of their interactive business arrangements (you know - work/pay, hours/compensation, overtime/stock options, your place/my place, etc. Ideally, that is. As everyone knows, we do not live in a "pure" free-market economy, therefore these negotiations are presently all regulated, to force everyone into a standardized success & happiness). There are many obstacles to overcome in an imperfect world, in an imperfect society, in an imperfect economy, under imperfect governments, not to mention all the competition. It is very discouraging and sometimes you want to hug your Teddy Bear for comfort [ :>) ]. But sometimes the first, and largest, obstacle to overcome is one's own pessimism and negativity against mustering up the courage and creativity to "push the envelope". This fatalism is what is being criticized. .. Blanc

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