December 2003 - cypherpunks-legacy

L. Detweiler is a CyberAngel
by Richard Charles Graves 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

ROTFL. From http://snyside.sunnyside.com/cpsr/nii/cyber-rights/Library/Announcements/Cy… Special mention must go to an ongoing debate about anonymous remailers, which was an area where we were less informed. Thanks to an154280(a)anon.penet.fi for lots of very helpful suggestions. For those of you interested in the debate about anonymity we have two suggestions: firstly we have a HUGE FAQ on "Identity, Privacy and Anonymity on the InterNet", written by L.Detweiler, and if any of you want it, please write to us and ask for it (WARNING it is 138k!) Secondly you can write to help(a)anon.penet.fi for their FAQ on their anonymous service, which is also very educational.

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Re: L. Detweiler is a CyberAngel
by E. ALLEN SMITH 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

From: IN%"llurch(a)networking.stanford.edu" "Richard Charles Graves" 3-MAY-1996 17:30:30.47 >Subject: L. Detweiler is a CyberAngel >ROTFL. From >http://snyside.sunnyside.com/cpsr/nii/cyber-rights/Library/Announcements/Cy… >Special mention must go to an ongoing debate about anonymous remailers, which >was an area where we were less informed. Thanks to an154280(a)anon.penet.fi >for lots of very helpful suggestions. For those of you interested in the >debate about anonymity we have two suggestions: firstly we have a HUGE FAQ >on "Identity, Privacy and Anonymity on the InterNet", written by L.Detweiler, >and if any of you want it, please write to us and ask for it (WARNING it is >138k!) Secondly you can write to help(a)anon.penet.fi for their FAQ on their >anonymous service, which is also very educational. I had noticed that earlier, yes... see why I think they know less about the Net than even _I_ do? -Allen

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Re: CryptoAnarchy: Late Comments.
by mkj＠october.segno.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

I'm amazed at the long thread my naive "CypherAnarchy" question generated -- not to mention the astonishing range of perspectives, spanning from the unusual to the bizarre. (Yes, that was a joke.) I haven't joined in much up to now, simply because it has taken me some time to digest it all. But now that the thread seems to be winding down, I have extracted a couple of interesting points for additional comments. "Snow" discusses nations without borders, then asks: > Are these the deep waters you refer to? In part, yes. But I think the possible definitions of "nation" and "government" are diffusing even more broadly than you suggest. A paragraph which I edited from my original message went something like: "Suppose a large multinational company finds a way to increase profits by cutting labor costs. To what extent does this resemble a global 'tax increase' on the world population?" A line of thought which (skipping over a lot of boring intermediate stuff) led me eventually to the questions, "What are taxes?" and "What is wealth?" Clearly, when the government exacts payment of taxes from us, it is more than just a screwy method of recycling used currency! Taxation, to oversimplify quite a bit, is essentially compelled labor. But it is even more than that. Taxes must be paid in dollars, and the U.S. government maintains tight and detailed controls over what types of labor and value can be converted into dollars, by whom, and how. Therefore taxation is also compelled *behavior*. It keeps us locked into roles which government has significant power to shape. In fact, due in part to tax policies, important traditional American lifestyle values such as "being independent" and "living off the land" have become damn near impossible today (while "normal" forms of employment frequently entail the waiver of important Constitutional rights). Once taxation is seen as compelled behavior, it is natural to ask how many other legal controls on behavior might have the effect, at least in part, of a sort of hidden tax. The military draft? Seizures of property in criminal cases? Obviously. But what about regulations on industry? Suppose Congress passes a bill which consolidates some segment of the military industry. Or suppose a government reserves to itself some of the most profitable lines of business, such as drugs and gambling. To what extent do these actions resemble taxes? My point being, there is more than one way to skin a cat, and clearly more than one way to increase government wealth. Cryptography may be able to hide value transactions when they take the symbolic form of money, but can crypto hide value in all its phases? If not, then crypto will change only the forms, not the essence, of taxation. It cannot shield us, for example, from outright forced labor (such as compulsory military service) or increased criminal penalties, etc. A final thought: Just as TV is in the business of selling eyes and ears to advertisers, the U.S. government has long been involved in some activities which might, to the cynical eye (such as my own), resemble the selling of "exploitation rights" over its population to the highest bidders. Note that such a strategy could do a complete end-run around any tax collection problems caused by cryptography! "Snow" also wrote: > Fine. So change the tactics. Instead of "Rising Up", simply use an > ages old an respected solution. Take out the leaders. Note, I am > _not_ suggesting Mr. Bells assination politics, rather, given a > violent revolution, or the beginings of one, shorten it by taking > those who make the policies you disagree with. But who the hell ARE the real leaders, and how are we supposed to find them? Hint: I don't think they're the people on TV! Politicians today aren't leaders, they are the heads of an unseen Gorgon: If you cut one politician down, two identical copies will spring forth in that same place! --- mkj

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SF South Bay: So WhoWhere wants to meet with people interested in online privacy and security...
by Rich Graves 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

The people who run www.whowhere.com (a knockoff on the excellent www.four11.com, with a database partly based on a script they wrote to extract addresses from okra.ucr.edu) want to discuss how they can serve the Internet community better while protecting privacy. I suggested "shut down your site and become cloistered monks," but they didn't find that consistent with their business plan. So they suggested we do lunch early next week. Either Monday or Tuesday would work, and we'd be meeting in downtown Palo Alto. Anybody else interested in coming? For a good demonstration of why WhoWhere? is not necessarily the greatest thing since spice racks, look up "Louis Freeh," "Fuck You," "Asshole," "System Privileged User," and "Stephen Hawking." I keep telling them that they'd better remove this last, but they don't consider it a priority. -rich http://www-leland.stanford.edu/~llurch/ P.S. Yes, I just resubscribed. I just love you too much to stay away. P.P.S. If anyone wants to carpool from the Palo Alto vicinity to Joe & Cindy's beach volleyball shindig this Sunday with an alleged FUCKING STATIST CAPITALIST SOCIALIST NAZI J*W ANARCHIST, send me a note.

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Known Arms Traffickers
by Vincent Cate 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

I have added a checkbox to my arms-trafficker page so that if you want to be added to a list of "Known Arms Traffickers" you can be. The URL is: http://online.offshore.com.ai/arms-trafficker/ The page that says: "Click here to become an International Arms Trafficker" -- Vince

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Re: Why I dislike Java. (was Re: "Scruffies" vs. "Neats")
by E. ALLEN SMITH 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

From: "Perry E. Metzger" <perry(a)piermont.com> >It certainly makes me feel more comfortable. The problem I have is >that I expect that increasingly pages will arise for which information >can only be extracted with the use of Java. Some flunky from some desk >will will come up and scream "what do you mean I can't get a copy of >Foo Corporation's merger press release because we won't run some >program! Thats bullshit! Do you know how much money the risk arb desk >pulls in, you twit! This must never happen again! Fix it immediately!" Might I suggest setting up another computer with Java enabled, and _without_ the critical applications? Somehow, I think they can afford an extra computer for each desk - it wouldn't have to be a high-capability one. That would also cure having to have Netscape and other high-network-access programs on the same computers as the critical applications. (Of course, some of the critical applications may also need to access the Internet... but they probably wouldn't need http capability.) Of course, feel free to tell me that I don't know what I'm talking about. -Allen

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No Subject
by Ecafe Mixmaster Remailer 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

> From: Brian D Williams <talon57(a)well.com> > Date: Thu, 2 May 1996 11:16:35 -0700 > > >From cypherpunks-errors(a)toad.com Tue Apr 30 23:58:28 1996 > >Date: Wed, 1 May 1996 00:52:03 -0500 (CDT) > >From: snow <snow(a)smoke.suba.com> > >To: "Perry E. Metzger" <perry(a)piermont.com> > >cc: "L. Detweiler" <vznuri(a)netcom.com>, cypherpunks(a)toad.com > ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > >Subject: Re: Why I dislike Java. (was Re: "Scruffies" vs. "Neats") > >MIME-Version: 1.0 > >Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII > >Sender: owner-cypherpunks(a)toad.com > >Precedence: bulk > > Game, set, match...... No, probably done intentionally. Note the lower-case snow...

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Re: Why I dislike Java. (was Re: "Scruffies" vs. "Neats")
by frantz＠netcom.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 9:03 AM 5/3/96 -0400, Perry E. Metzger wrote: >... The problem I have is >that I expect that increasingly pages will arise for which information >can only be extracted with the use of Java. Some flunky from some desk >will will come up and scream "what do you mean I can't get a copy of >Foo Corporation's merger press release because we won't run some >program! Thats bullshit! Do you know how much money the risk arb desk >pulls in, you twit! This must never happen again! Fix it immediately!" Unfortunately the market decided that function and price were more important than security. (I know, I spent 10 years developing and trying to sell an OS with strong security features.) The only thing I can suggest to you is, spend the bucks, desk real estate, confusion etc. and have two machines; a secure/reliable one and an insecure/unreliable one. Make sure OS manufacturers like Apple and Microsoft know that you want to be able to disable the build in Java they have announced. You may be able to develop a way of transferring the clipboard between the machines so the dancing Java displayed economic numbers can be easily and safely transferred to the secure machine's analysis program. Regards - Bill ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Bill Frantz | The CDA means | Periwinkle -- Computer Consulting (408)356-8506 | lost jobs and | 16345 Englewood Ave. frantz(a)netcom.com | dead teenagers | Los Gatos, CA 95032, USA

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Re: Sen. Patrick Leahy's PGP key now avail.
by tcmay＠got.net 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 9:36 PM 5/2/96, Will Rodger wrote: >Wanna write the good Senator on the occasion of his newest bill? His pub >key's out there. (URL is http://bs.mit.edu:8001/pks-commands.html#submit/ >) Why does anyone need his public key to communicate with Senator Leahy? If it's for sender-anonymity, this does not do it, though other tools (remailers) do. Unless the information is "secret," why bother? It adds extra time at his office's end (you don't think Leahy types in his password to PGP do you?), and it accomplishes little. >From a personal viewpoint, I'm glad my key is no longer very accessible. I used to get PGP-encrypted messages which had no earthly reason to be encrypted, except that people apparently wanted to practice their PGP skills. (For those who sent me items that had a reason to be encrypted, you know who you are and you know this comment does not apply to you.) --Tim May Boycott "Big Brother Inside" software! We got computers, we're tapping phone lines, we know that that ain't allowed. ---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---- Timothy C. May | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money, tcmay(a)got.net 408-728-0152 | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero W.A.S.T.E.: Corralitos, CA | knowledge, reputations, information markets, Licensed Ontologist | black markets, collapse of governments. "National borders aren't even speed bumps on the information superhighway."

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An interesting front end for the replay remailer
by Rich Graves 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

These folks' politics don't make much sense to me (but I gather that they really, really don't like Jehova's Witnesses); it's their setting up an "alternative" front end for the replay remailer that caught my interest. http://www.nano.no/~telemark/anon.html One could say that this makes a case for PGP-signing web pages, but on the other hand, the remailers don't and shouldn't care about content, so who cares if someone "misappropriates" a remailer. What are they "taking" anyway? -rich

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