August 1993 - cypherpunks-legacy

Re: Another BBS Seizure in Hartford
by Reply to: hahn＠lds.loral.com 30 Aug '93

30 Aug '93

So this fellow was arrested because one of his BBS clients posted the bomb recipes on his BBS? This makes for a viable means of destroying somebody else's means of info distribution. Say XYZ-BBS attracts clients who are interested in some political viewpoint that I oppose. I would subscribe, pretending to share their interests, then post bomb recipes. I could facilitate my treachery even further by making a call to the appropriate authorities, warning them of a political terrorism conspiracy. XYZ-BBS is destroyed. If I then inform the press, I can also publicly impeach the entire group. BTW, you don't need _The Anarchist's Cookbook_ to make a bomb. I have a US Gubment (DOD special forces) book that provides enough recipes to produce mountains of mayhem. And you can find most of the materials you need in stores that would be present in any small town. What law would it violate to post what the gubment has already published? __ | (V) | "Tiger gotta hunt. Bird gotta fly. | (^ (`> | Man gotta sit and wonder why, why, why. | ((\\__/ ) | Tiger gotta sleep. Bird gotta land. | (\\< ) der Nethahn | Man gotta tell himself he understand." | \< ) | | ( / | Kurt Vonnegut Jr. | | | | ^ |

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unsubscribe
by Mandrake＠f1.n8012.z86.toadnet.org 30 Aug '93

30 Aug '93

unsubscribe

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Re: Apple planning to use Clipper chip?
by collins＠newton.apple.com 30 Aug '93

30 Aug '93

I do not, in any capacity, speak for Apple. But... >Apple even discussed the >pricing and said that if the Clipper/Skipjack chip could be sold to >them for less than $30, they could "design it into every Mac." Based on long experience with Macs and Mac software (system and otherwise), I think this is highly unlikely. 1. Apple has a history of following the 'software only' approach in general. 2. Apple loudly and often touts compatability across its entire line. 3. 3rd party Mac developers have little incentive to write software with mass appeal (e.g., communications software) but limited applicability (because of hardware requirements). 4. If the software isn't pre-installed in your system, then unless it comes from Microsoft, such a 'questionable' standard is probably avoidable. 5. Therefore, for a standard to emerge on the Mac... 1) Apple would have to begin producing machines that contained this chip; 2) Apple would have to produce special system software, explicitly for this class of machines, that used this chip; 3) Apple would have to produce compelling end-user communications software that used clipper services on this class of machines and either didn't run at all on earlier hardware, or didn't use clipper technology. It is unlikely that a 3rd party would do it, or have any impact if it did. But Apples history is scalable software that runs on every machine (ala QuickTime). If Apple wanted to introduce privacy enhancement technology in its system, it seems economically and historically more probable that it would simply license RSA/DES/etc technology and roll in a software only service. This is my opinion, based solely on my nine years of experience as Macintosh developer. To paraphrase Columbo: "It's my experience, sir, that people rarely do things they don't *usually* do." ...which may sound obvious, but then you *saw* the killer do it in the first 10 minutes... Scott Collins | "Few people realize what tremendous power there | is in one of these things." -- Willy Wonka ......................|................................................ BUSINESS. voice:408.862.0540 fax:974.6094 collins(a)newton.apple.com Apple Computer, Inc. 1 Infinite Loop, MS 301-2C Cupertino, CA 95014 ....................................................................... PERSONAL. voice/fax:408.257.1746 1024:669687 catalyst(a)netcom.com

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EXE Encryptor
by Douglas Sinclair 30 Aug '93

30 Aug '93

Development of the EXE encrypting package that s_duck(a)pinetree.org and I were working on has effectivly stalled. We were unable to wedge DOS at the right level to virtualize an .exe file. Sorry for getting your hopes up. If anyone wishes to continue the project, please ask s_duck for the existing code. -- PGP 2.3a Key by finger

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Stego for Stegosaurs
by tcmay＠netcom.com 30 Aug '93

30 Aug '93

> Some of you have asked for more details about the interception of > encrypted digital dinosaurs. Alas, I don't know much more than I .. > S a n d y Frankly, I'm surprised no one has pointed out the obvious solution, so I guess I'll have to. Spielberg and Company clearly needed to protect their transmissions using the "Stego" program of Romana Machado. By packing the real content of the "Jurassic Park" communications into MPEG transmissions of "Barney," the circle would be completed. Just my least significant bit. -Tim -- .......................................................................... Timothy C. May | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money, tcmay(a)netcom.com | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero 408-688-5409 | knowledge, reputations, information markets, W.A.S.T.E.: Aptos, CA | black markets, collapse of governments. Higher Power: 2^756839 | Public Key: PGP and MailSafe available. Note: I put time and money into writing this posting. I hope you enjoy it.

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JURASSIC CRYPTO
by Sandy 30 Aug '93

30 Aug '93

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ SANDY SANDFORT Reply to: ssandfort(a)attmail.com . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Punksters, Some of you have asked for more details about the interception of encrypted digital dinosaurs. Alas, I don't know much more than I posted. The Cypherpunk in question is still out of the country, to the best of my knowledge. I have no contact information for him. When he gets in touch with me again, I'll suggest he post something about how the satellite feed was compromised. To me, the most important facts are that it could be done and that it was done, not how it was done. (Flame away, technoids.) S a n d y >>>>>> Please send e-mail to: ssandfort(a)attmail.com <<<<<< ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

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Privacy issues and how to sell them
by Jamie Jamison 30 Aug '93

30 Aug '93

>From reading the group it seems to me that there is a need for two styles of data encryption. One style would be something similar to DES, it would be a standard cypher and would be used for encrypting items such as the files on your hard disk. The other would be a public key cypher and would be used for communicating between individuals. Now, as far as selling these two concepts goes one thing that might help is to point out the fact that not only is the government untrustworthy, in the sense that they abuse their power, but that they're also incompetent. Americans have an unfortunate tendency, at least in my eyes to, buy into catch-phrases such as "law and order" or "national security" in a completely uncritical fashion. However Americans also mistrust, and rightfully so, the competence of the government, so perhaps we should point out that since the government can't keep its own secrets very well that it obviously can't keep the secrets of 250 million citizens very well either, which is what the government would be attempting to do if SkipJack/Clipper/Capstone were made the national standard for encryption. Jamie Jamison WITH STANDARD DISCLAIMER

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Talked to Phil Zimmermann....
by tcmay＠netcom.com 30 Aug '93

30 Aug '93

Cypherians, Phil Zimmermann was at our "Extropians Fifth Anniversary Party" in the Santa Cruz mountains yesterday and last night; Extropians are another mailing list/group, of course, but there is a substantial overlap between the groups. Several items of potential interest: 1. RSA did not know of the ViaCrypt deal until after it was signed last Sunday. ViaCrypt's license allows it to put whatever it wants around the RSA core....it has picked PGP as the wrapper. RSA can't really object to this, provided the RSA core is as the contract with ViaCrypt specifies. 2. Phil will carefully inspect the code, including the RSA part, and is confident no funny business is planned by ViaCrypt or anyone else. (I have to trust Phil on this matter more than any "panel" or the like....after all, he wanted to put trapdoors in, he could in the existing PGP--though of course this is highly unlikely to have been put in in the first place and to have remained undiscovered all this time.) 3. There's a bunch of confusing--to me--stuff about U.S. versions, European/foreign versions, what can and can't be exported and imported, the ITAR (International Traffic in Arms Regulations), and so on. Basically, there may be separate European versions, possibly using different code. Triple DES may be used in some versions (don't ask me for details....I'm not sure of the tradeoffs between DES and IDEA...perhaps the deal to use IDEA doesn't fit with a commercial version of PGP). 4. I showed Phil the MacPGP 2.3 program on my PowerBook 170. The "help" system especially impressed him (it does me, too). He is not closely connected with Zig F.'s Macintosh development. 5. Integrating PGP with mailers--the "elm" and MIME ideas that keep surfacing--is still being debated. Running PGP on a machine outside one's own control is always dangerous, but, let's face it, is how _many_ people are already using PGP and how many of the future corporate customers will be likely to use it. (The PGP secret key will then be found scattered around in backups, on other disks, etc. Even the manually-entered passphrase is *not sufficient*, as many systems have "scrypt" and similar keystroke-capture programs automatically recording all keystrokes. Even my Macintoshes capture all keystrokes ("Last Resort," "Thunder 7, etc., have such utilities). This is an unresolved issue! (Talk of using smartcards, RSA cards, Newton-like PDAs, etc., is one approach, but this moves away from ease of use by requiring specialized hardware.) 6. Ease of use remains a problem. Phil mentioned again that he sends a routine form letter out to all those who send him encrypted e-mail explaining that it may take him several days to get around to reading their messages...he has to do the same multi-step procedure of downloading to his local PC, quitting, saving the file, starting PGP, and so on. (Phil has never run PGP on a machine outside his control.) 7. Phil also wanted to talk about the political issues of RSA vs. PGP, about my concerns some months back that the battle for strong crypto would not be won with explicitly illegal programs, etc. I told him I thought the ViaCrypt deal was a nearly perfect solution to these concerns: individuals and corporations can now safely use PGP without the fear of asset forfeiture or criminal prosecution should a zealous prosecutor decide to "make an example" of them. A legal version of PGP is the goal many of us were seeking. A major win. I congratulate Phil for pulling this off. 8. Perhaps most ironically, David Sternlight (the neural net AI automatic posting program I mentioned a few days ago) has asked to be a beta site for the ViaCrypt program! Sternlight blesses ViaCrypt...the mind boggles. (To be fair to Sternlight--something many people may flame me for :-} --he never argued for a ban on crypto, or for restrictions, only that a "legal" or "unencumbered" version be used. Hence his involvement with RIPEM.) That's what I remember. The party started at 2 p.m. at the mountain-top home of Mark Desilets and lasted 'til well after 3 a.m....and may still be going. I didn't count, but there were probably at least a hundred people, including a dozen or more Cypherpunks. A real blast. -Tim May -- .......................................................................... Timothy C. May | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money, tcmay(a)netcom.com | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero 408-688-5409 | knowledge, reputations, information markets, W.A.S.T.E.: Aptos, CA | black markets, collapse of governments. Higher Power: 2^756839 | Public Key: PGP and MailSafe available. Note: I put time and money into writing this posting. I hope you enjoy it.

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no ftpd on soda.berkeley.edu ?
by Liam David Gray 30 Aug '93

30 Aug '93

Has anyone else tried to ftp soda in the past 2 days or so? I've been unable to establish a connection. I assume whoever maintains the Cypherpunks archive on this machine (is it Eric H.?) might be able to find out: Is there any ftpd running on it at the moment, and what's the expected downtime? Thanks. - Liam Gray lg2g+(a)andrew.cmu.edu

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Re: CACM article "Clipping Clipper"
by ferguson＠fiber.sprintlink.net 30 Aug '93

30 Aug '93

On Sun, 29 Aug 1993 13:14:01 GMT, Lance J. Hoffman <hoffman(a)seas.gwu.edu> wrote - > Several people have asked me to post this for > those who do not get Communications > of the Association for Computing Machinery. > So here it is, reprinted with > permission from Communications of the ACM, > September 1993, volume 36, number 9. I would like to (firstly) extend my personal thanks to you for posting the article in sci.crypt, and (secondly) for expressing your opposition to the "key-escrow" initiative. I, and I am sure many others, appreciate your viewpoints on the entire fiasco and stand alongside you in opposition of this threat to personal freedom and privacy in the dawning new age of information. Your paper is well-written and presents the facts in a succint and indisputable fashion. I look forward to the seeing the issue in print, and any counter-point articles which may also appear in this issue. Cheers, _____________________________________________________________________________ Paul Ferguson Mindbank Consulting Group ferguson(a)fiber.sprintlink.net Fairfax, Virginia USA ferguson(a)icm1.icp.net

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