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Interesting item from Nwlibertarians@teleport.com
by jim bell 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

>Date: Mon, 20 Jan 1997 17:44:32 -0800 (PST) >From: James Ogle <joogle(a)netcom.com> >Subject: NWLibs> LP: Browne's Vote Annulled, Chudov Still PM >To: Jack Dean <JackDean(a)webworldinc.com> >cc: usa-par(a)netcom.com, ichudov(a)algebra.com, rjschundler(a)aol.com, > nwlibertarians(a)teleport.com, brockman(a)netcom.com >Sender: owner-nwlibertarians(a)teleport.com >Reply-To: nwlibertarians(a)teleport.com > > >To: Jack Dean >Cc: Usa-par(a)netcom.com Listserver Members and Other Libertarians > >It turns out that according to Jack Dean, a campaign worker with the Harry >Browne in '96 campaign, the eballot vote for Igor Chudov (Libertarian - >OK) cast from HarryBrowne@HarryBrowne'96.com address, which was forwarded >to Mr. Jack Dean by me, was a fake - so the two votes are shaved off the >Chudov total. Can anyone speak with better authority on Browne then >Mr. Jack Dean, and say the Browne did cast the vote? On a positive >note however, Tim Ladd (Pot - CA) has agreed to list Mr. Chudov as his >first choice, so Mr. Chudov stays as PM for the time being with five votes. > >The new vote totals are shown below. > >BTW, a special welcome to the usa-par(a)netcom.com list to Evan Colletti >(Pot - NV), who joins the list from Reno NV, as a founder of the NV-PAR >and the Nevada Pot Party. > > --James Ogle > >On Mon, 20 Jan 1997, Jack Dean wrote: > >> >> You wrote: >> >> >Jack, i just received this email from Mr. Harry Browne. Will you >> >please confirm with him that he did indeed cast the vote? >> >> No, he didn't. It appears to be a faked e-mail message. I'll be >> investigating how it was done. >> >> Sorry. >> >> Jack >> >> >> ************************************************************************** >> J. Harris Dean | voice & fax> 714/870-5585 >> 2217 Vista del Sol | pager with voice mail> 714/935-3638 >> Fullerton, CA 92831 | e-mail> JackDean(a)webworldinc.com >> ************************************************************************** >> "LIBERTY is something you cannot have, unless you are >> willing to give it to others." - William Allen White > >---------------------------------------------------Votes for PM of USA PAR > > > ====**** ************************** ****==== > ====*** * THE 3RD USA PARLIAMENT * ***==== > ====== ************************** ====== > > Igor Chudov Taoiseach > >----------------------------------------------------------------------------- >For Immediate Release January 20, 1997 > > RESULTS OF VOTING FOR TAOISEACH > > Vote For # Of Vote For >MP Vote For PM Secretary Seats Rules >------------------------------------------------------------------------- >Monty Truitt 1 Monty Truitt 1 James Ogle > 2 James Ogle 2 Monty Truitt > 3 Donald Duck 3 Micky Mouse 1 no >Daniel Brockman 1 Valerie Madriaga 1 James Ogle > 2 Igor Chudov > 3 Mike Bogatirev > 4 Zachary Quest 2 yes >Mike Robinson 1 Daniel Brockman 1 James Ogle > 2 Steve Michael 2 Mike Robinson > 3 Mike Robinson 1 yes >Nathan Brown 1 John Mayer 1 James Ogle > 2 Michael Banon 1 yes >Patrick Seats 1 Patrick Seats 1 James Ogle > 2 Daniel Brockman 2 Gary Swing 1 yes >Kerby Hensley 1 Locke Heemstra 1 James Ogle 1 >Jack Clayton 1 Steve Michael 1 James Ogle > 2 Jack Clayton 1 yes >Igor Chudov 1 Daniel Brockman 1 James Ogle > 2 Igor Chudov 1 yes* >James Ogle 1 Daniel Brockman 1 James Ogle > 2 Igor Chudov > 3 Nathan Brown > 4 Zachary Quest 2 yes >Bruce Daniels 1 Daniel Brockman 1 Gary Swing 8 yes >Gorden Hartman 1 Daniel Brockman 2 James Ogle 3 yes >John Mayer 1 Steve Michael 1 James Ogle 1 yes >Mike Bogatirev 1 Daniel Brockman 1 James Ogle 2 abstain >Gene Marsee' 1 Valerie Madriaga 1 James Ogle 1 abstain >Locke Heemstra 1 Lock Heemstra 1 James Ogle > 2 Daniel Brockman 1 yes >Shirley Bradshaw 1 Bruce Daniels 1 James Ogle > 2 Valerie Madriaga 1 >Lloyd Llewellyn 1 Igor Chudov 1 >Eli Rozicki 1 Nathon Brown 1 >Laura Booth 1 Nathan Brown 1 James Ogle 1 yes >Ann Atkerson 1 Newt Gingrich 1 James Ogle 1 >Steve Duby 1 Steve Duby 1 James Ogle > 2 Nathan Brown > 3 John Mayer > 4 Laura Booth 1 >Greg Farley 1 Nathan Brown 1 James Ogle 1 >Tim Ladd 1 Igor Chudov 1 James Ogle > 2 Nathan Brown >------------------------------------------------------------------------ >Total 35 > > >*Voted yes on rules and other rules, and wrote in "Create USA PAR Web Page". > >Results As Of 1/20/97 > >Daniel Brockman (17 votes) Declines To Stand >Igor Chudov Elected Prime Minister - 5 votes >James Ogle Elected Secretary - 25 votes >Rules Approved - 23 votes > >--James Ogle, secretary > USA Parliament > > > Jim Bell jimbell(a)pacifier.com

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RE: Disseminating public-key crypto source code
by John Lehmann (SSASyd) 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

> >I've written a few Perl routines for public-key cryptography. I'd >like to freely disseminate the source code (starting with ElGamal) to >as many people as I can, > >It's my understanding that there are two orthogonal restrictions: > > 1) ITAResque: I can't give code to non-U.S. citizens. > 2) PKPesque: Using public-key crypto is an infringement, > although disseminating/possessing the source > code is not. > >While I'm sure these are oversimplifications, it would seem that I can >release my source code over the Internet provided I install a simple >verification mechanism (cf. MIT's PGP distribution) to ensure that >only people claiming to be U.S. citizens have access privileges. > >Am I correct? If so, why aren't more people doing this? > People do do this, but if you are using RSA or other methods patented in the US, you might want to look at them. Is the concept of PK cryptography patented? And of course you are familiar with Bernstein v DoS... [http://www.eff.org/pub/Legal/Cases/Bernstein_v_DoS/HTML/bernstein_961218 _pressrel.html] >The plaintiff in the case, Daniel J. Bernstein, Research Assistant Professor at >the University of Illinois at Chicago, developed an "encryption >algorithm" (a recipe or set of instructions) that he wanted to publish in printed >journals as well as on the Internet. Bernstein sued the >government, claiming that the government's requirements that he register as an >arms dealer and seek government permission before publication >was a violation of his First Amendment right of free speech. This is required by >the Arms Export Control Act and its implementing regulations, >the International Traffic in Arms Regulations. > >In the first phase of this litigation, the government argued that since Bernstein's >ideas were expressed, in part, in computer language (source >code), they were not protected by the First Amendment. On April 15, 1996, >Judge Patel rejected that argument and held for the first time that >computer source code is protected speech for purposes of the First >Amendment. ...here Perl has the advantage of being a scripting language, and so by default comes as source, though if you had written the routines in a scripting langauge like Python, you might find it easier to convince a judge that it was in fact human readable... -- John "BTW IANAL" Lehmann

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Re: Take it to sci.math
by proff＠suburbia.net 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

> >and > > > >4) This bullshit is extremely annoying to those of us who has some real > > training in math, even more so than the regular bullshit on this list. Perhaps your 'real training in math' could show itself and put an end to the discussion.

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Re: GSM technology
by azur＠netcom.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

>Steve Shear <azur(a)netcom.com> writes: >> [very useful explanation of GSM TDMA, and the new HSCSD] > >64 kbit/s tied to ISDN is very nice technology. > >> ENCRYPTED GSM LINKS >> If the GSM phone includes a data port, as some already do, just connect >> your laptop, dial your ISP and 'push' the encrypted traffic over that link >> (e.g., using TCP/IP and PGPfone). > >This would obviously be possible, but to my mind reduces the appeal of >the system. Not every one has a laptop. [snip] Retrofitting the stonger encryption (e.g., IDEA) to some existing GSM phones may be practical (as I've discussed in previous postings), but unless the service providers support the stonger crypto (seems very unlikely at the moment)parties at the other end of the line will need an Eric Blossom-like device or a laptop running PGPfone. I can see no way around this. > >Also, the cell phone tarriffs may be higher if you need higher >bandwidth to get the software only voice codec implementations in >PGPfone to produce equivalent full-duplex voice quality to that >expected from a digital mobile phone. I may be wrong, but the faster laptops are already able to support the GSM codes and rates in PGPfone (or could). However, most of the service providers may only be offering 9.6kb/s GSM data links at this time, and this would surely impact voice quality. If or when 28.8kb/s data is common via GSM voice links via PGPfone should be better than the default GSM coded voice. --Steve PGP Fingerprint: FE 90 1A 95 9D EA 8D 61 81 2E CC A9 A4 4A FB A9 --------------------------------------------------------------------- Steve Schear (N7ZEZ) | Internet: azur(a)netcom.com Lamarr Labs | Voice: 1-702-658-2654 7075 West Gowan Road | Fax: 1-702-658-2673 Suite 2148 | Las Vegas, NV 89129 | --------------------------------------------------------------------- Internet, electronic currency and wireless development 1935 will go down in history! For the first time a civilized nation has full gun registration! Our streets will be safer, our police more efficient, and the world will follow our lead in the future! --Adolf Hitler

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Re: GSM technology
by Steve Schear 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

>Steve Shear <azur(a)netcom.com> writes: >> [very useful explanation of GSM TDMA, and the new HSCSD] > >64 kbit/s tied to ISDN is very nice technology. > >> ENCRYPTED GSM LINKS >> If the GSM phone includes a data port, as some already do, just connect >> your laptop, dial your ISP and 'push' the encrypted traffic over that link >> (e.g., using TCP/IP and PGPfone). > >This would obviously be possible, but to my mind reduces the appeal of >the system. Not every one has a laptop. [snip] Retrofitting the stonger encryption (e.g., IDEA) to some existing GSM phones may be practical (as I've discussed in previous postings), but unless the service providers support the stonger crypto (seems very unlikely at the moment)parties at the other end of the line will need an Eric Blossom-like device or a laptop running PGPfone. I can see no way around this. > >Also, the cell phone tarriffs may be higher if you need higher >bandwidth to get the software only voice codec implementations in >PGPfone to produce equivalent full-duplex voice quality to that >expected from a digital mobile phone. I may be wrong, but the faster laptops are already able to support the GSM codes and rates in PGPfone (or could). However, most of the service providers may only be offering 9.6kb/s GSM data links at this time, and this would surely impact voice quality. If or when 28.8kb/s data is common via GSM voice links via PGPfone should be better than the default GSM coded voice. --Steve PGP Fingerprint: FE 90 1A 95 9D EA 8D 61 81 2E CC A9 A4 4A FB A9 --------------------------------------------------------------------- Steve Schear (N7ZEZ) | Internet: azur(a)netcom.com Lamarr Labs | Voice: 1-702-658-2654 7075 West Gowan Road | Fax: 1-702-658-2673 Suite 2148 | Las Vegas, NV 89129 | --------------------------------------------------------------------- Internet, electronic currency and wireless development 1935 will go down in history! For the first time a civilized nation has full gun registration! Our streets will be safer, our police more efficient, and the world will follow our lead in the future! --Adolf Hitler

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Re: Take it to sci.math
by Toto 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Blanc Weber wrote: > And as everyone on this list acutely knows, neither math, science, nor > politics has anything to do with crypto. I agree. Let's stick to discussions of crack-crypto Ebonics, and child-crypto PigLatin. Toto

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Re: GSM technology
by Toto 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Lucky Green wrote: > > At 09:43 AM 1/20/97 -0500, Nurdane Oksas wrote: > > Does anyone use ADSL lines? or are they still very expensive? > > I just had a very interesting talk with somebody from Northern Telecom (Canada's Phone Company). NorTel has apparently skipped ISDN and is now deploying ADSL. Some areas already have access to ADSL at, can you believe this, $60/month. SaskTel also offers this type of access, at around the same price. As long as they had a monopoly on the citizens of the province, they gouged people in the boondocks $ 6.00/hr for basic access to the InterNet. Now that they have competition, and need to have competitive rates to stay in business, they are acting like they are the consumer's best friend, instead of rip-off shitheads. Toto

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RE: GSM technology
by Blake Coverett 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Lucky wrote: > I just had a very interesting talk with somebody from Northern Telecom (Canada's Phone Company). NorTel has apparently skipped ISDN and > is now deploying ADSL. Some areas already have access to ADSL at, can you believe this, $60/month. NorTel isn't exactly Canada's phone company. NorTel manufactures telecom equipment. It is however 51% owned by BCE, which owns or has controlling interest in Bell Canada and several of the regional carriers as well a huge mess of other telco stuff. ISDN is available fairly widely in my area of the country, but I'm not aware of an commercially available ADSL UUNET Canada has been conducting ADSL trials in a couple of cities, but that's all I've heard of thus far. regards, -Blake (who would love to be proved wrong as the price sounds great)

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Re: GSM technology
by Asgaard 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

On Fri, 17 Jan 1997, Adam Back wrote: > into the data port. You can't fit the laptop and GSM phone > combination into your shirt pocket. What are you going to use for a With a reasonably sized shirt pocket you can fit a Nokia 9000 Communicator into it: a combination of GSM phone and 386 computer, with 6 MB storage (OS and default applications use 4 of those) and 2 MB RAM. It runs fax, SMS (Short Messages Services), a Terminal, SMTP, IMAP4, MIME1, WWW and telnet. The operative system is GEOS (tm) 3.0. I guess it's not very programmable though (and there is no PGPhone implementation for GEOS) and data speed is only 9600 bps. And there is probably no connection between the mic/speaker and the computer. But it's only 173 x 64 x 38 mm, and perhaps the next generation of such devices might be interesting for reengineering into secure end-to-end crypto phenes? Asgaard

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Re: UNS_top
by Toto 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

John Young wrote: > Governments in China, Burma and > Singapore have already tried to discipline this on-line activity with > minimal success. Do you have any pointers to information in regard to this, or are you just being a goddamn tease? Toto

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