- cypherpunks-legacy - lists.cpunks.org

Re: telco's vs x-phones
by Brian D Williams 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

In a reply to Vipul Ved Prakash, Jim Bell wrote: >Assume 30 cents per meter per fiber for cabled fiber, or about $10 (US) per meter for 36-fiber cable. Siecore plain vanilla 36 fiber singlemode list $ 1.82 a foot, $5.46 a yard >Each fiber pair should be able to handle approximately 1 million >conversations at current data rates, or a total of 18 million >conversations for that 18-pair cable, or 9.5 trillion >conversation-minutes. At current data rates (OC-48 Sonet) 32,256 voice channels per fiber, 580,608 total for the fiber. Off by a factor of roughly 36 at this point. >Multiply this cost by 10 for right of way, trenching, repeaters, >and other auxiliary hardware, or $100 per meter. This is probably >just a ballpark estimate, but... Off by a factor of at least 10 not counting switching equipment. >I've read that estimates show that it would probably be cheaper to >provide cellular-telephone service in China to everyone than to >wire the country up with copper lines. This isn't particularly >surprising. Cell-phones solve the "last few hundred yards/mile or >two" problem quite well. Since nearly all of the actual >connections in a copperline telephone system are >switch-to-individual-phone lines, going cellular saves a bundle of >installation costs. A good point, in Sri Lanka they were having problems with copper bandits cutting down all the cable, till they switched to fiber. The question is can the average citizen of china afford a cell phone and service for what it can be installed. In a reply to me Jim bell wrote: >The long distance companies are not "using local networks," your >customers are...to connect to those long distance companies. And >any payments LD companies make to you are, indeed, a subsidy. >Tell me, how much is this _subsidy_, exactly? Who's using who is a matter of perspective. Q) if you call a dog's tail a "leg" how many legs does a dog have? A) four, calling a tail a leg doesn't make it one. Point? The LD companies pay to use the RBOC's networks, calling it a subsidy doesn't make it one, except maybe to you. If they don't like it, they are free (or soon will be) to build their own, or use someone elses. >As an alternative, the phone company would presumably be entitled >to be served by phone lines, at say $30 per month or so, through >which their customers reach them. $30 per month is $1 per day or >4 cents per hour or about 0.07 cents per minute. 3 cents doesn't >equal 0.07 cents, now does it?!? "Presumably be entitled?" The RBOC's currently charge what regulations allow, if the regs go away, they will charge what the market will pay. >Tell me again how "the local/long distance subsidy was eliminated >at breakup." Tell me another one, daddy... Enhance your calm Jim...... >How has this remaining SUBSIDY dropped over time, assuming it has? >When is it scheduled to drop to zero? The rate has gone down since the regs are changing and competition is increasing. I would be interested in hearing why you think it will ever drop to zero. >First, you need to figure out how to supply ISDN for a REASONABLE >charge, like "no extra charge!" to customers. It's been over 16 >years after I first heard of ISDN. At the time, it seemed like a >wonderful idea...against the 300 baud modems then in use. Against >modern 31K modems that you only have to pay for...ONCE...ISDN >seems mighty lame. >Face it, ISDN used to be a good idea. But it's just barely shown >up the moment it's hit the end of its marketing window. ISDN will >have a marketing lifetime for maybe a couple of more years, and >only then because you can't put more bits through a 3.4 khz >passband. >Not to mention all the bullshit propaganda that claimed that with >ISDN, you wouldn't have to buy any modems. Well, maybe that's >just because they didn't CALL them modems, but they charged way >more for an essentially indistinguishable function. Can you say, >"Fraud"? I knew you could! <sigh> Jim, first you set up the ISDN "Strawman" and then you knock it down. I no more believe that ISDN is the future than you do. Be well! Brian "Zazen? Well it beats sitting around on your ass all day doing nothing."

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Re: Spamming
by Alex F 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

> At 06:09 PM 8/20/96 -0700, Rich Graves wrote: > >On Wed, 21 Aug 1996, Vipul Ved Prakash wrote: > > > >> I don't know if there has been much discussion on the ethics of spamming > >> here? Is spamming free speech? > > > >Yes. > > No. [snip] Freedom of Speech includes freedom FROM speech. IOW, if it starts infringing on your rights, then it stops. Spam is unsolicited, commercial email, and it could possibly be argued that just as the spammer has the right to say whatever it is that he wants, we also have the right not to get his email. This can also get very convoluted. Besides that, it's just impolite. Alex F =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Alex F alexf(a)iss.net Marketing Specialist Internet Security Systems =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

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Remailer chain design docs?
by Michael Wilson 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Would somebody be so kind as to point me at the design documentation for remailers and chain remailers? I feel a need to code, and want to see the design on the current systems before I jump in. Danke, MW

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Republican and Democratic party platforms on technology
by declan＠well.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

============ Date: Wed, 21 Aug 1996 16:35:49 -0500 To: fight-censorship(a)vorlon.mit.edu From: declan(a)well.com (Declan McCullagh) Subject: Republican and Democratic party platforms on technology Sender: owner-fight-censorship(a)vorlon.mit.edu Attached is an excerpt from the GOP's 1996 platform, provided by a Republican Senate staffer. All keystroking errors mine -- this plank doesn't seem to have been nailed into the rnc.org web site yet. While the Republicans certainly are no fast friends of online liberties -- recall Dole cosponsored an "anti-cyberporn" bill worse than the CDA -- they've been moving in the right direction on crypto. This plank shows that as a party, they're starting to take online privacy seriously. Let's see what the Democrats do at their convention. I've attached relevant excerpts from the platform committee's report, but the only coherent theme I found is increased government spending. (Contrast both parties with the Libertarians, which have a sterling commitment to online civil liberties, reflected in the platform approved at their convention last month.) -Declan --- [The rest of the platform is at http://www.rnc.org/hq/platform96/] The 1996 Republican Party Platform Excerpt: Science, Technology, and Innovation in the 21st Century Our goal is to empower the American people by using the benefits of advanced science to improve their quality of life without undue restraint from government. Our bottom line is more jobs, better jobs, and a higher standard of living for the families of America. We believe the marketplace, not bureaucrats, can determine which technologies best meet the needs of the public. [...] The communications revolution empowers individuals, enhances health care, opens up opportunity for rural areas, and strengthens families and institutions. A Dole-led Congress passed the Telecommunications Act of 1996 to promote the full and open competition and freedom of choice in the telecommunications marketplace. In contrast, the Clinton-Gore Administration repeatedly defended big-government regulation. This micromanagement of the Information Age is contrary to America's Information Super Highway. We support the broadest access to telecommunications networks and services, based upon marketplace capabilties. ***The Internet today is the most staggering example of how the Information Age can and will enhance the lives of Americans everywhere. To further this explosion of new-found freedoms and opportunities, privacy, through secured communications, has never been more important. Bob Dole and the Republican Party will promote policies that ensure that the U.S. remains the world leader in science, technology, and innovation.*** [Emphasis mine. --Declan] --- http://www.democrats.org/party/convention/pltdft96-2.html The Report of the Platform Committee to the 1996 Democratic National Convention Today's Democratic Party: Meeting America's Challenges, Protecting America's Values THE 1996 DEMOCRATIC NATIONAL PLATFORM [...] Technology. We know investments in technology drive economic growth, generate new knowledge, create new high-wage jobs, build new industries, and improve our quality of life. In the face of Republican efforts to undermine America's dedication to innovation, President Clinton and the Democratic Party have fought to maintain vital investments in science and technology. We remember that government investment in technology is responsible for the computer, for jet aircraft, and for the Internet -- no investments have ever paid off better, in jobs, in opportunity, or in growth. [...] Technology in the classroom. We must bring the 21st century into every classroom in America. There is a vast realm of knowledge waiting for our children to tap into. Computers are powerful tools to teach students to read better, write better, and understand math. President Clinton and Vice President Gore understand that technological literacy is essential to success in the new economy. The only way to achieve that for every student is to give them all access to a computer, good software, trained teachers, and the Internet -- and President Clinton and Vice President Gore have launched a partnership with high-tech companies, schools, state, and local governments to wire every classroom and library to the Information Superhighway by the year 2000. [...] The Clinton Administration is working to put wanted lists of parents who owe child support in the post office and on the Internet. President Clinton and Democrats in Congress insisted that the toughest possible child support enforcement be part of the new welfare reform plan -- including the President's plan to deny drivers licenses and professional licenses to people who do not pay their child support. ###

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Ruritania
by Censored Girls Anonymous 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

The Legend of Ruritania There was once a far away land called Ruritania, and in this land there was a strange phenomenon -- all the trees that grew there were transparent. In the old days, the people had lived in mud huts. But now, high-tech wood technology had been developed, and in this new age of wood, everyone in Ruritania found that their homes were all 100% see through. Now, until this point, no one ever thought of allowing the police to spy on someone's home. But the new technology made this tempting. This being a civilized country, however, warrants were required to use binoculars and watch someone in their home. The police, taking advantage of this, would get warrants to use binoculars and peer in to see what was going on. Occasionally, they would use binoculars without a warrant, but everyone pretended that this didn't happen. One day, a smart man invented paint -- and the people found that if they painted their houses, suddenly the police couldn't watch all their actions at will. Things would go back to the way they were in the old age -- completely private. Indignant, the state decided to try to require that all homes have video cameras installed into every nook and cranny. "After all", they said, "with this new 'paint' development, crime could run rampant. Installing video cameras doesn't mean that the police get any new capability -- they are just keeping the old one." A wise man pointed out that citizens were not obligated to make the lives of the police easy, that the police had survived all through the mud hut age without being able to watch the citizens at will, and that Ruritania was a civilized country where not everything that was expedient was permitted. For instance, in a neighboring country, it had been discovered that torture was an extremely effective way to solve crimes. Ruritania had banned this practice long ago, in spite of its expedience. Indeed, "why have warrants at all", he asked, "if we are interested only in expedience?" A famous paint technologist, Dorothy Quisling, intervened however. She noted that people might take photographs of children masturbating should this new paint technology be widely deployed without safeguards, and the law was passed. Soon it was discovered that some citizens were covering their mouths while speaking to each other, thus preventing the police from reading their lips through the video cameras. This had to be prevented, the police said. After all, it was preventing them from conducting their lawful surveillance. The wise man pointed out that the police had never before been allowed to listen in on people's homes, but Dorothy Quisling pointed out that people might use this new invention of covering their mouths with veils to discuss the kidnapping and mutilation of children. Now, no one in the legislature wanted to be accused of being in favor of mutilating children, but then again, no one wanted to interfere in people's rights to wear what they liked, so a compromise was reached whereby all homes had to have microphones installed in each room to accompany the video cameras. The wise man lamented few if any child mutilations had ever been solved by the old lip reading technology, but it was too late -- the new law was passed and microphones were installed everywhere. However, soon it was discovered that this was insufficient to prevent citizens from hiding information from the authorities, because some of them would cleverly speak in languages that the police could not understand. So, another new law was proposed to force all citizens to speak at all times only in Ruritanian, and, for good measure, to require that they speak clearly and distinctly near the microphones. "After all", Dorothy Quisling pointed out, "they might be using the opportunity to speak in private to mask terrorist activities!" Terrorism struck terror into everyone's hearts, and they rejoiced at the brilliance of this new law. Meanwhile, the wise man talked one evening to his friends on how all of this was making a sham of the constitution of Ruritania, of which all Ruritanians were proud. "Why", he asked, "are we obligated to sacrifice all our freedom and privacy to make the lives of the police easier? There isn't any real evidence that this makes any big dent in crime, anyway! All it does is make our privacy forfeit to the state!" However, the wise man made the mistake of saying this, as the new law required, in Ruritanian, clearly and distinctly, and near a microphone. Soon, the newly formed Ruritanian Secret Police arrived and took him off, and got him to confess to crimes by torturing him. Torture was, after all, far more efficient than the old methods, and had been recently instituted to stop the recent wave of people thinking obscene thoughts about tomatoes, which Dorothy Quisling noted was one of the major problems of the new age of plenty and joy. Member Internet Society - Certified BETSI Programmer - Webmistress *********************************************************************** Carol Anne Braddock (cab8) carolann(a)censored.org 206.42.112.96 My Homepage The Cyberdoc *********************************************************************** ------------------ PGP.ZIP Part [017/713] ------------------- M8H,),S$8G>&.WP(8IRA`-M['+`Q%&_C"">5-F%LX@<_Q$;*P'',Q$Z/AA[8M MF=O0H+*%(-S%&>S%+FS&<LS%3(Q&#W1"<]2%`H^;,]^1C$'HBN8PX$4SYAU^ MPGD<Q0ZLA0D+,`MCT!LA**4M[-JPAK9F?40!AJ,CW"'%DR#:'9?Q)3[%<DQ` ------------------------------------------------------------- for next chunk to export --> http://dcs.ex.ac.uk/~aba/export/

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Any CPs in D.C.?
by Lucky Green 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

I will be in D.C. through Saturday. I'd like to meet some Cypherpunks that feel like getting to know what Lucky looks like :-) If you are in D.C., give me a call at my hotel. (202) 682-0111 x440 --Lucky

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The full Monica: Novel new 'service'/Collectors' issue - New interface tomorrow
by STUFFED NEWS DAILY 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Today is the last day using the current interface. After much research we designed a new front end along the lines of what many of you had been asking for. And it's turned out to be super-fast too. That's tomorrow's issue. But for today, here's what you also get! + 30+ FREE HI-RES JPEGS + PAGE 2 'SPREAD': A GORGEOUS GAL + RAUNCHY RECIPE: CRAFTY COOK + LA WINDSKY: AMAZING MODEL + KEEP IT IN THE FAMILY: STRANGE ENCOUNTER + CLINTON CONDOMS: YES IT'S TRUE + ASS-PIRIN: SEX AND DRUGS + WILD THUMBNAILS: 10 FREE PICS + SEXY STORY: "THE GROUPIE" + THE VERY BEST OF EUREKA! - YOUR FAVORITE SITES + SEXY SURPRISE THUMBS: 10 MORE FREE PICS + FOOD FOR SEX: FASCINATING FEATURE + MEGA THUMBNAIL ORGY: ANOTHER 10 FREE PICS + ULTRA HI-RES POSTER PIC: SAVE IT, PRINT IT + LOADS AND LOADS MORE STUFF: CHECK IT OUT! - Have fun! ----> http://stuffed.net/98/9/9/ <---- Welcome to today's issue of Stuffed. To read it you should click on the URL above. If it is not made clickable by your email program you will need to use your mouse to highlight the URL, copy it and then paste it into your browser (then press Return). This email is never sent unsolicited. Stuffed is the supplement for the Eureka newsletter you subscribed to. Full instructions on unsubscribing are in every issue of Eureka! ----> http://stuffed.net/98/9/9/ <----

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No Subject
by Bovine Remailer 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

The Postal service is working on a new postage method, 2 key signature, which will be unique to each "postal unit" ( stamp ) the signature will be logged when you buy the stamps....No more anon. snail mail...... Just thought you'd like to know !

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Re: Republican and Democratic party platforms on technology
by tcmay＠got.net 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 9:59 PM 8/21/96, Declan McCullagh wrote: >While the Republicans certainly are no fast friends of online liberties -- >recall Dole cosponsored an "anti-cyberporn" bill worse than the CDA -- >they've been moving in the right direction on crypto. This plank shows that >as a party, they're starting to take online privacy seriously. I think we all know just how long such a taking online privacy seriously committment would last...about two or three briefings from the FBI, CIA, NSA, and DIA. Maybe Dole would get the infamous "If you only knew what we know" briefing, maybe he already has had it (and is just cynically supporting "online privacy" because it's a way to contrast himself with Clinton). Sure, the rhetoric might be slightly different under a Dole presidency. The focus would be on "halting the spread of abortion information on the Net" and "plotting by Communists using unbreakable cryptography." >(Contrast both parties with the Libertarians, which have a sterling >commitment to online civil liberties, reflected in the platform approved at >their convention last month.) I certainly plan to vote for Harry Browne, their candidate, even if voting only encourages the process. I first read Browne's stuff back in 1973, and, a few years later, his wonderful and "Zen Calvinist" (my term) book, "How I Found Freedom in an Unfree World," which I still recommend to people. As far as I'm concerned, Browne is the strongest candidate ever fielded by the Libertarian Party. Not that it will matter. Ralph Nader will probably get more votes than Browne. The answer lies in technology, not the ballot box. --Tim May -- [This Bible excerpt awaiting review under the U.S. Communications Decency Act of 1996] And then Lot said, "I have some mighty fine young virgin daughters. Why don't you boys just come on in and fuck them right here in my house - I'll just watch!"....Later, up in the mountains, the younger daughter said: "Dad's getting old. I say we should fuck him before he's too old to fuck." So the two daughters got him drunk and screwed him all that night. Sure enough, Dad got them pregnant, and had an incestuous bastard son....Onan really hated the idea of doing his brother's wife and getting her pregnant while his brother got all the credit, so he pulled out before he came....Remember, it's not a good idea to have sex with your sister, your brother, your parents, your pet dog, or the farm animals, unless of course God tells you to. [excerpts from the Old Testament, Modern Vernacular Translation, TCM, 1996]

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www.usdoj.gov http://156.46.199.41/
by jfricker＠vertexgroup.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

a mirror of the hack is at http://156.46.199.41/

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