- cypherpunks-legacy - lists.cpunks.org

Re: Matchbook reminders for EFF / Cypherpunk members
by dante＠microsoft.com 07 Jul '93

07 Jul '93

John Gilmore said: | |At a friend's house I found a matchbook printed up by NORML. It |serves to advertise the organization, as well as providing information |useful during legal troubles. | |It got me thinking about matchbooks or wallet cards as a good way to |make people aware of us. (Matchbooks work better when your |organization is concerned with smokables...) Someone mentioned a few |weeks ago that we need to have a wallet-sized card that reminds people |of their rights when they get into hassles. Experience has shown that |we forget and bungle it, without a reminder. Good idea. FYI, the ACLU also provides these wallet-sized cards to anyone who asks, and they are invaluable. Read them _before_ you get arrested.

1 0

Matchbook reminders for EFF / Cypherpunk members
by gnu 07 Jul '93

07 Jul '93

At a friend's house I found a matchbook printed up by NORML. It serves to advertise the organization, as well as providing information useful during legal troubles. It got me thinking about matchbooks or wallet cards as a good way to make people aware of us. (Matchbooks work better when your organization is concerned with smokables...) Someone mentioned a few weeks ago that we need to have a wallet-sized card that reminds people of their rights when they get into hassles. Experience has shown that we forget and bungle it, without a reminder. The NORML front cover says: Cypherpunk version (strawman): NORML CYPHERPUNKS National Organization Teaching, Learning, for the Reform of and Deploying Marijuana Laws Cryptographic Protection ------------------ 1636 R. St., N.W. Washington, DC 20009 spectron, cleveland, oh <- whoever makes the matches The spine: 900-97-NORML cypherpunks(a)toad.com The back: Before you rat, Big Brother's listenin' before you squeal, Big Sister's watchin'. before you snitch, Don't get cold feet, or cut a deal.. Use cryptographic stockin's. Call NORML. 900-97-NORML ...etc... (2.95 per minute You must be 18 or older to call) The inside: * NEVER CONSENT TO A Something very similar SEARCH (even with nothing to hide) * NEVER ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS (without an attorney) * CALL AN ATTORNEY IM- MEDIATELY (or call NORML) 900-97-NORML EFF's phone number? (2.95 per minute You must be 18 or older to call) NOTE: The live option is available only from 9 a.m. to 6 p.m., EST, M-F. A tract I cut out of a gay newspaper some years ago is in my wallet now; its advice is: SILENCE = GOLDEN ACT-UP/New York's clip-and-save guide to police intimidation The following guidelines were formulated by legal advisors to ACT UP/NY, but they apply to all gay men and lesbians and activists. 1. You do not have to talk to the police or FBI or any other investigators. You do not have to talk to them whether they come to your house, on the street, if you've been arrested, or even if you are in jail. Only a court or a grand jury has legal authority to compel testimony. 2. You don't have to let the police or FBI into your home or office unless they show you an arrest or search warrant which authorizes them to enter that SPECIFIC place. 3. If they do present a warrant, you do not have to tell them anything other than your name and address. You have a right to observe what they do. 4. Make written notes, including the agents' names, agency and badge numbers. Try to have other people present as witnesses and have them make written notes, too. 5. Anything you do say to any law enforcement officer may be used against you and other people. 6. If you do give the FBI or police information, it may mean that you will have to testify to the same information at a trial or before a grand jury. 7. Lying to an FBI agent or other federal investigators is a crime. 8. The best advice, if the FBI or police try to question you or to enter your home or office without a warrant, is to JUST SAY NO! Law enforcement agents have a job to do and they are highly skilled at it. Attempting to "outwit" them is very risky. YOU CAN NEVER TELL HOW A SEEMINGLY HARMLESS BIT OF INFORMATION CAN HELP THEM HURT YOU OR ANOTHER ACT UP MEMBER. 9. The investigators may threaten you with a grand jury subpoena if you don't give them information. But you may get one anyway, and anything you've already told them will be the basis for more detailed questioning under oath. 10. They may try to threaten or intimidate you by pretending to have information about you ("We know what you've been doing, but if you cooperate it will be all right.") If you are concerned about this, tell them you will consider talking to them with your lawyer present. 11. If you are nervous about simply refusing to talk, you may find it easier to tell them to contact your lawyer. Once a lawyer is involved, the agents usually pull back since they have lost their power to intimidate. If you are taken into police custory, once you request an attorney, they MUST cease questioning until your lawyer is present. But remember, you don't have to answer their questions, even if they keep asking.

1 0

Subscribe
by jota＠iguana.inesc.pt 07 Jul '93

07 Jul '93

subscribe -- * "Deitaram-se. Blimunda era virgem. Que idade tens, perguntou Baltasar, e *Blimunda respondeu, Dezanove anos, mas ja' enta~o se tornara muito mais *velha." - Jose' Saramago, "Memorial do Convento" **************************************************** jota(a)mujave.inesc.pt * * ...jotinha meu amor... INFOFREE * i got pgp, ask me NO MORE ! (U2,SBS-L) * 9431006 <- noy my password dancing and laughing

1 0

"Let's kill all the lawyers..."
by tcmay＠netcom.com 06 Jul '93

06 Jul '93

"What do you call the killing of those lawyers in San Francisco last week?" Answer (you knew this was coming): "A good start." The discussion of free speech and political correctness is apparently not welcome by some on this list. I guess the usual religious debates about which mail reader is better are what we're supposed to talk about. Well, I'm a member of this list, too, and issues of censorship and free speech are more interesting to me--and to some others, I suspect--than the intricacies of "MH." To each their own. Learn to use your "delete" key. (I agree that discussions of libertarianism vs. liberalism, etc., are the bane of the Net, and that we have been fortunate in avoiding the usual pitched battles between these camps on this List. My comments about censorship of speech, photos, etc., were not intended to provoke such a political battle.) Ironically, even as I type this, I am watching CNN and a special report on a "trial balloon" to ban anti-lawyer remarks! Seriously! Harvey Saferstein, President of the California State Bar, is explaining how "hate speech" laws can and should be used to limit the bashing of lawyers, the portrayal of them as good targets (he cited the lawyer being the first to be eaten in "Jurassic Park" as an example of the "atmosphere of hate" surrounding lawyers), and "inciting to violence." He specifically cited the killings in San Francisco last week as a reason to classify such speech as a "hate crime." No word on whether Shakespeare's "First, let's kill all the lawyers" would've gotten him 10-20 in the Tower of London. What is happening to free speech? What has happened to "Sir, I disagree with what you say, but I defend to the death your right to say it."? Now of course such a law is not likely to pass, or be upheld. (Saferstein is actually not lobbying for a _new_ law, but for extension through the judicial system of existing "hate crime" laws to included any "class-related" jokes and insults. A move other groups are already trying.) In a way, I am cheering this, as it can only end up trivializing and undermining the whole concept of "hate crimes" and "hate speech." Real crimes, including trespass to burn crosses on people's lawns, and the like, can and _should_ be prosecuted, but not "hate" crimes. (If such laws were applied uniformly, instead of just against so-called "white rights" groups, then most "minority" organizations, which preach hatred of "honkeys" and "hets," would be shut down.) As John Gilmore pointed out a few years back, most of us are breaking laws every day. If the government can attach penalties based on our political views, then dissidents can be targeted selectively and given sentences based on their alleged "hate crimes." (Imagine how the Black Panthers or Malcolm X could have been harassed even more aggressively if their "hate" could have been used to increase punishments for otherwise minor crimes? That they were harassed, 20 and 30 years ago, is beside the point. Folks who advocate "hate crime" laws should reflect carefully on how such laws may someday be used against them.) -Tim May -- Timothy C. May | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money, tcmay(a)netcom.com | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero 408-688-5409 | knowledge, reputations, information markets, W.A.S.T.E.: Aptos, CA | black markets, collapse of governments. Higher Power: 2^756839 | Public Key: by arrangement Note: I put time and money into writing this posting. I hope you enjoy it.

1 0

Complete ignorance of any sort of reality on May's part (was We are
by jet＠netcom.com 06 Jul '93

06 Jul '93

Timothy C. May writes: > degrading to women, objectifies them, etc. (ironically, unless of course it > is "made by and for wimmin," a loophole added by Andrea Dworkin and her > supporters after they discovered their anti-porn crusade in Canada and > elsewhere would put an end to Lesbian porn mags like "Yellow Silk"!). This is complete and utter nonsense. Tim May has no clue as to what he talks about. What's worse, it smells of homophobia. In no particular order: - Dworkin has never called for the banning of porn. I've read most of her books, and she even goes out of her way to say she's not calling for any sort of censorship. She *does* push for 'victim compenstation'-style legislation. (How this sort of legislation interacts with constitutional rights is beyond my keen, save a few decisions I've read about 19th century property rights in Louisiana. :-) - I've heard Dworkin come down just has hard on lesbigay porn, if not harder than, as she does on het porn. Her old housemate John Stoltenberg (sp?) is as noxious as she is on this point. - "Yellow Silk" is not a lesbian porn mag. It's a very lame het softcore mag. If you'd like to see *real* lesbian porn (some of which pisses off a fair portition of the feminist and lesbian communities) find "On Our Backs" (started by Susie Bright), "Venus Infers" (started by Pat Califia, women-only SM), or "Girljock" (sort of a preppie/athelete/lesbian (not dyke :-) porn mag). - Last I heard, there was no need to capitalize 'lesbian'. None of the dykes/lesbians I know capitalize it, unless it starts a sentence. Residents of Lesbos (the true 'Lesbians') might disagree, however. Tired of white het male computer geeks talking nonsense about anyone who threatens their place in the power structure, -- jet(a)netcom.com -- J. Eric Townsend -- '92 R100R: "CLACKER" "Either what you've said is so vague that it's meaningless or I disagreee with you completely." -- Tom Maddox

4 3

wired covers
by Tyler Yip - UnixWeenie 06 Jul '93

06 Jul '93

In Chico, California, the two book stores large enough to have Wired have Mitch Kapor (Tower Books) and Peter Gabriel (Readmore Books). I might go pick up the other cover. :)

1 0

Wired cover
by stub23 06 Jul '93

06 Jul '93

well on mindvox the cover decision was announced a bit before the magazine came out and there was a huge guessing contest over who was going to be on the cover with some damn creative ideas but anyhow... although if i were to guess, i would say taht peter gabriel is on the cover of my issue, but on the inside it says cover: mitch kapor so i got confused dunno what mitch kapor looks like... also to note la and sf have different covers from what i ahve heard

1 0

Re: (fwd) GIFs--Now it can be told
by Michael Ross 06 Jul '93

06 Jul '93

Tim, That was very manipulative, and did not achieve much. It has also very little to do with the subject of this mailing list. If anything, you discouraged at least one person I know who became genuinely interested in encryption and PGP as a result of your post. If you had posted an actual David Hamilton photo, even encrypted, you would have put yourself forward, perhaps even bravely, as a test case. You then would really have had a point to argue, having taken a stand. As it turns out, you hid behind a pretty lame scheme, the only object of which seems to have been to make a fool out of as many people as possible. This is not how you accomplish constructive change, Tim. People resent being made to feel stupid, and they certainly will _not_ listen to what you have to say if you are belittling them. I happen to agree with those points you deigned to make in a straightforward manner. But you hid them so well behind trickery that they will go unnoticed. Learn to deal with people, and you'll see they are willing to listen to reasonable arguments. If your parents didn't give you enough attention as a child, don't take it out on the world by trying to get some here... Learn to work _with_ people, not _against_ people, lest within ten years you'll be walking into office buildings with automatic weapons strapped to your body and shooting lawyers... ;) Michael

3 2

Looking for biblio re commercialization of encryption
by gnu 06 Jul '93

06 Jul '93

------- Start of forwarded message ------- From: Kibbee=Streetman%ACIS.1037%DSRD.K25(a)VINES.ORNL.GOV To: eff(a)eff.org Subject: References for Crypto Study Date: Wed, 23 Jun 93 15:27:26 EDT Dear Sir -- I am working on a project for NIST to develop an annotated bibliography on issues in the commercialization of encryption technology. Can you provide me with any references to EFF publications dealing with export, Clipper/Capstone, privacy, etc. ? I already have copies of the material presented at the CSS&PAB meeting at NIST but would like to have anything else that might be available. Thank you for your help! Kibbee D. Streetman (kds(a)ornl.gov) 1099 Commerce Park Oak Ridge, TN 37830 (615)574-9952 ------- End of Forwarded Message

1 0

We are Becoming Politically Correct Sheep
by tcmay＠netcom.com 06 Jul '93

06 Jul '93

Perry Metzger writes, about the reaction to the "junk bits" file I posted in a controversial new group, "alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.children": >Michael Ross says: >> Tim, >> >> That was very manipulative, and did not achieve much. > >I wholely disagree. Tim's post to alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.children >was a valuable exercise even given its limitations. > Of course I agree with Perry, though I also respect the others who have posted disagreements (sometimes strong!) here on this List or in the various newsgroups...that's what free speech is all about. Bear in mind that most of the "Cypherpunks agenda," to the extent we can identify it, is likely to provoke ordinary citizens into _outrage_. Talk of anonymous mail, digital money, money laundering, information markets, data havens, undermining authority, transnationalism, and all the rest (insert your favorite idea) is not exactly mainstream. While I don't personally care for the "kiddie porn" I've seen (the David Hamilton photos of young girls and the occasional Mapplethorpe photos in news reports), the issues raised in this area are of great importance. (I don't plan to argue for or against these images in this forum, though.) If we back down every time a censor screams "Illegal!," then very few of our agenda items will ever see the light of day. So long as physical violence or coercion is not involved, I see no reason to restrict the activities of others. I completely reject the concept of "class-based crimes," such as: - conventional erotica and pornography should be banned because it is degrading to women, objectifies them, etc. (ironically, unless of course it is "made by and for wimmin," a loophole added by Andrea Dworkin and her supporters after they discovered their anti-porn crusade in Canada and elsewhere would put an end to Lesbian porn mags like "Yellow Silk"!). - I put "child porn" in this category because only the actual coercion of children--if it is happening--should be stopped. (And even this is confusing, as coercion of children happens all the time--we call it "parenting.") A mere image carries no proof that this coercion has happened, for the many reasons I have cited and others have cited (e.g., the child may have willingly participated, the "child" may be 18 and merely look 15, the images may have come from other countries where the customs and laws are different, the image may have been computer-generated or morphed, and so on). - "racist jokes" are being targeted for elimination in many of the Usenet groups, by halting the carrying of "offensive" newsgroups. Legal purists will of course note that this is not "censorship" in the legal/government sense. IMHO, the English language needs a new term for something between the one extreme of government censorship and the other extreme of personal choice, perhaps something like "institutional censorship." Being a free market sort of person, I have no problems with, say, Apple Computer deciding not to carry "alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.children" or "rec.humor.funny.cripples," but it still a _form_ of "institutional censorship." [especially when they are acting so as to head off legal action, as I describe below] - read the "academic freedom" group (I forget the exact title...search for "acad-free" in your newsreader) and you'll see that more and more universities are using the "sexual harassment" laws/codes to stop certain newsgroups, to halt the distribution of sexually oriented images, and to take disciplinary action against students (mostly male) who have put GIFs on their computers or workstations (apparently female students who walk past an office in which female models are used as startup screens have decided they are being "sexually assaulted" or "harassed"). [An important point to make here is that many of these institutions are taking actions largely because they fear that if they don't, the plaintiffs will take their case to the _government_ legal system, perhaps by suing the university for "condoning an atmosphere hostile to womym and other people of color." <insert smileys here, lest I be sued for insulting colored people> If there was no threat of ultimate legal action, much of this "institutional censorship" would vanish, and people could just concentrate on doing their jobs, with or without calendars of "Miss Usenet" gracing their walls.] - discussion of ways to undermine the State, via crypto anarchy and strong crypography, are likely to be targets of future crackdowns. Sedition laws, conspiracy laws, RICO, etc. How long before speaking on these matters earns a warning letter from your university or your company? [Again, I think it's the "big stick" of ultimate government action that spurs these univeristy and company policies. Apple fears being shut down for having "involvement" with a terrorist plot, Emory University fears being sued for millions of dollars for "conspiring" to degrade wimmin of color, etc.) - how long before "rec.guns" is no longer carried at many sites, as they fear having their universities or companies linked to discussions of "assault weapons" and "cop-killer bullets"? [Prediction: Many companies and universities, under pressure from the Feds, will block groups in which encrypted files are posted. After all, if one encrypts, one must have something to hide, and that could expose the university to legal action from some group that feels aggrieved.] So, free speech is under assault across the country. The tort system is being abused to stifle dissentinting views (and lest you think I am only a capitalist, only a free marketeer, the use of "SLAPP suits"--"Strategic Lawsuits Against Public Participation"--by corporations or real estate developers to threaten those who dare to publicly speak against their projects is a travesty, a travesty that the courts have only recently begun to correct). We are becoming a nation of sheep, fearing the midnight raid, the knock on the door. We fear that if we tell a joke, someone will glare at us and threaten to sue us _and_ our company! And so companies are adopting "speech codes" and other such baggage of the Orwell's totalitarian state. Political correctness is extending its tendrils into nearly every aspect of life in America. Time to fight back. -Tim May -- Timothy C. May | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money, tcmay(a)netcom.com | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero 408-688-5409 | knowledge, reputations, information markets, W.A.S.T.E.: Aptos, CA | black markets, collapse of governments. Higher Power: 2^756839 | Public Key: by arrangement Note: I put time and money into writing this posting. I hope you enjoy it.

1 0