- cypherpunks-legacy - lists.cpunks.org

Re: Nose against the grindstone
by nobody＠pmantis.berkeley.edu 27 Jul '93

27 Jul '93

X-Really-From: Dave Mandl (dmandl(a)lehman.com) > From: paul(a)poboy.b17c.ingr.com (Paul Robichaux) > > I assume everyone saw the message from Philip Mulivor here asking for our > input on the issues related to anonymity and newsgathering. As of > Friday afternoon, I was the only one to respond. > > I can't help but think that we are being dissolute in discussing > T-shirts, coffee mugs, et al when a *REAL* *LIVE* *JOURNALIST* came to > the list asking for information and got almost zero response. > > If we're looking at shirts which will raise people's awareness and > provoke questions, that's great. Many of the slogans and designs, > though, will be indecipherable to anyone who's not _already_ a > cypherpunk. If these shirts are just a membership badge, like a DoD # > in *.motorcycles, then IMNSHO we're wasting our time. > > -Paul I considered (for a couple of seconds) responding to P.M.'s request, but then decided against it. I'm sure he's a nice guy, but I generally don't trust mainstream journalists too much and don't go out of my way to talk to them. People may have actually made a decision not to talk to him, so I wouldn't assume it's "apathy" or anything like that. (I'm sensitive about this because people are always accusing anti-voting anarchists of "apathy," and that gets us hopping mad.) On the subject of the T-shirts: I agree that they should not be too, er, cryptic. They shouldn't be just a way for us to pat ourselves on the back and be in-group-ish, but a way to spread the word. I also think we should try to accommodate the different political views in the group (which are not all that different anyway) by avoiding use of the American flag, references to Jefferson, etc. We should stick to issues we all agree on, which there are plenty of: Anti-Big Brother, Anti-NSA/CIA/FBI, pro-privacy, libertarianism (capital or small "L"), freedom of information, etc. --Dave.

2 1

Nose against the grindstone
by paul＠poboy.b17c.ingr.com 27 Jul '93

27 Jul '93

I assume everyone saw the message from Philip Mulivor here asking for our input on the issues related to anonymity and newsgathering. As of Friday afternoon, I was the only one to respond. I can't help but think that we are being dissolute in discussing T-shirts, coffee mugs, et al when a *REAL* *LIVE* *JOURNALIST* came to the list asking for information and got almost zero response. If we're looking at shirts which will raise people's awareness and provoke questions, that's great. Many of the slogans and designs, though, will be indecipherable to anyone who's not _already_ a cypherpunk. If these shirts are just a membership badge, like a DoD # in *.motorcycles, then IMNSHO we're wasting our time. -Paul -- Paul Robichaux, KD4JZG | "An interesting mistake... I wish I knew what perobich(a)ingr.com | led you to make it." Intergraph Federal Systems | "I make a lot of them. It's how I learn." (but not their opinion) | - A. Jablokov, _A Deeper Sea_

2 1

Re: T-SHIRTS
by wcs＠anchor.ho.att.com 27 Jul '93

27 Jul '93

||ugh writes: > I could deal with a cool logo (hey, I could even do the logo) on a > black poloshirt. Obviously the logo should also be in black, with details in black for contrast :-) Alternatively, a snow-crashy pattern of white noise would have more entropy. Someone suggested buttons; they are pretty cheap to make, and it's easy to do individualized versions using a laser printer, if you want them with your own keys or fingerprints on them.... Bill # Bill Stewart wcs(a)anchor.ho.att.com +1-908-949-0705 Fax-4876 # AT&T Bell Labs, Room 4M-312, Crawfords Corner Rd, Holmdel, NJ 07733-3030 # rot-13 public key available upon request

2 1

Re: Tee-shirt
by mdavis＠pro-sol.cts.com 27 Jul '93

27 Jul '93

Harry Shapiro <habs(a)panix.com> writes: >Orwell was wrong > > 1994 Orwell was probably right, but some editor went in and changed the title to 1984. If only Orwell had PGP back then... :-) /\/\ Morgan Davis Group (619/670-0563) / /__\ Internet: mdavis(a)pro-sol.cts.com

1 0

oodles of Cypherpunk T-shirt ideas
by L. Detweiler 27 Jul '93

27 Jul '93

Hello, I've been following the T-shirt & cypherpunk meanderings. Fun! A few ideas: - as for graphic designs, it is amazingly easy to get absolutely stunning graphics from raytracers & fractal image generators. I would suggest chrome or glass letterings on checkerboard planes stretching to infinity (does anyone know of sites for 3d letter geometries?) - the merchandising could be potentially lucrative, esp. if the designs are beautiful and inspiring and interesting to people that have no connections to the group directly. I suggest that a cypherpunk fund be set up for some modest percentage of profits for group projects, such as meetings or mailings or whatever. sellers should indicate how much they will donate. If you think the fund would be mismanaged (money has a tendency to warp people), feel free to donate nothing! - In some ways the shirts should be very broadly appealing, if they are then many non-cyberpunks will buy them and our message will spread like a virus! Here are a lot of brainstormed ideas for mottos. If anyone makes fantastic profit from them I get a share :) A long time ago (in cyberspatial terms), I suggested `Cypherpunks do it secretly!' for T shirts, so I've had plenty of time to think! - Cypherpunks: The Cyberspatial Colonialists - We the Cypherpunks, In Order to Form a More Perfect Cyberspace - Give Me Privacy or Give Me Stealth - I Regret that I have but One Life to Live in Cyberspace - I Regret that I have but One Tshirt for the Cypherpunks - Ask *not* what the NSA can do for you; ask what you can do to the NSA! - Clip the Clipper (picture of crushed/exploding chip under hammered, clenched fist) - NSA with circle/red line through it - Stop the Spooks! circle/red line through spy figure - Cypherpunks: Guerrila Cryptologists. Picture of rambo-like figure wielding a sword like a pen. Maybe PGP themes here. - Cypherpunks vs. National Spooks Anonymous (jab at NSA). The idea here would be to mimic/parody a t-shirt for a big sporting event. - Cypherpunks with variation on Markoff's quote: no more self-consciously ornery group in all of cyberspace! - Picture of Jefferson with caption Grade A Cypherpunk (I kind of like this one) - Key Escrow: Good Enough for Sternlight & Denning (a real inside joke) - Key Escrow: as Safe as a (Government-Insured) Savings and Loan - Key Escrow: As American as Violating the Constitution - Key Escrow: Big Brother is Listening - Clipper: U.S. Social Insecurity - Key Escrow: Lock It Up and Throw Away the Key - Key Escrow: Lock It Up and Give Away the Key - Picture of a lock & key. Cypherpunks: the Key to the Codes. - How about a variation on the $20 bill design with Jefferson on it but other pictures elsewhere on the bill. Maybe text all in those computer-type fonts. Digital Cash. In Cryptography We Trust (a bit pagan, but oh well). Legal tender for all debts, public and private. - Cypherpunks: Patriotic Cyberspatial Citizens. Picture of U.S. flag flapping with digital variations. Maybe computer screens in the place of stars? - Cypherpunks: The New World Order. - Has anyone seen any endangered bureacrats? (another real inside joke) - How about some quotes from the Steve Jackson trial where the judge really hammered at T. Foley? - Operation SunDevil: Exactly as Planned - ``If it had gone off exactly as planned, everything would have been perfect'' (FBI quote on the Waco raid, but works for Steve Jackson, Clipper, etc.) - `I'm not sure if people should have been involved' (Paraphrase, Denning) - `We haven't had problems with encryption yet but if we do there's going to be a lot of dead bodies lying around' (Paraphrase, FBI) - April 16th, 1993: a Day that will Live in Infamy - National Security: the root password to the constitution (tx. Ferguson) - Clipper: Only A Chip Away at Your Privacy - Big Brother is watching YOU (picture of those pointing Uncle Sam pictures, dressed like a spy?) - Cryptography is like Nitroglycerin. Or the question, what's the difference between cryptography and nitroglycerin? (No answer!) Picture of exploding chip on rear? - Cypherpunks: the Big Mother of Big Brother (could be misconstrued) - Cypherpunks: { Someone, Anyone, Everyone } Other than Big Brother - We have Nothing to Lose but our Freedom - Caveat Encryptor (anti Clipper picture) - Cypherpunks: The Bug Bashers, or The Debuggers (this would cover both wiretapping and programming). - { NSA, FBI, Wiretapping, Clipper }: as American as J. Edgar Hoover (hehe). - Cypherpunks: The Patriots Without a Country but With a Computer - Cypherpunks: Assaulting the Putrid Palace (picture of crumbling castle? beseiged?) - Cypherpunks: Cryptographic { Revolutionaries, subversives } - Save Cyberspace - Nuke the NSA (bad pun on other stickers) - Cypherpunks: Largely EFFective - ``We are taking a great step toward a society where privacy is the realm only of the rich'' (paraphrase, W. Diffie). - Nothing is Sacred in Cyberspace - Privacy: Worth Protecting - Cryptography: Digital Draperies - Cryptography: The Fences of Cyberspace (Good Fences make Good Neighbors). - Front: Attention! Recruiting Professional Voyeurs! Back: send resume to [address of NSA] (picture of depraved lecher looking through keyhole?) - Practice Safe Sends. Cypherpunks. (PGP theme) - Cypherpunks: the Cyberspatial Entrepreneurs. - I Pledge Allegiance to Cyberspace - I Pledge Disobedience to the NSA - NSA: Safe From the Democratic Process (jab at aloofness from accountability) - Cryptography for the Unwashed Masses - Public Key Cryptography: Recipe for Revolution - Cypherpunks: Founding Fathers of Netocracy (Modemocracy) - NSA: The Abuses Are Behind { Us, It } - NSA: Behind Us All The Way - NSA: Still Hot Stuff after the Cold War (back: why is that, anyway?) - NSA: Keeping Up with the Joneses - NSA: Alive as the Soviet Union - NSA: Frozen in Time - NSA: Making It and Breaking It - The Cypherpunks say, `No Such Agency!'. - NSA: worst of the TLAs (really inside: three letter acronyms) - NSA: Thanks to Your Taxes, State of the Art in Privacy Deprivation - Cypherpunks: rebels with a cause (from Wired article?) - Front: Old Spooks Never Die. Back: has anyone seen Jack Kevorkian around? - NSA: official gov't agency for exterminating boogeymen. Call [x] - NSA: The Government's Closet. (Picture of closet with skeletons) - NSA: In the Dark (picture of dracula in coffin, hiding from sun?) shew, that will do it for *now* :)

2 1

No Subject
by Peter shipley 27 Jul '93

27 Jul '93

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- >I could really go for a stylized, >gold thread, "CYPHERPUNKS" on a black polo shirt. Anyone else >interested? I am intrested but I would like to see a the design first, can you MIME mail me the image of postscript -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.3 iQBVAgUBLFRXXHynuL1gkffFAQGqsgH9EPxWkSaDK2sZXcvg/SLo3digsmOhFG/y n3k7YgkvjPyCRzl6IrlZnTvX+Y8Wvw2a2ms+nrTUMdxhPoGYb0BSww== =Ri8/ -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

1 0

Tee-shirt
by Harry Shapiro 27 Jul '93

27 Jul '93

How about: Orwell was wrong 1994 (1994 in big bold large san serif typeface) -- Harry S. Hawk habs(a)extropy.org Electronic Communications Officer, Extropy Institute Inc. List Administrator of the Extropy Institute Mailing List Private Communication for the Extropian Community since 1991

1 0

Re: T-Shirts
by Paul Goggin 27 Jul '93

27 Jul '93

With the various T-Shirt proposals flying, I would not mind having more than 1 design myself. The Oxford-variety, dressy, a more classic look, while a t-shirt with big brother or keys more for the street. You can count me in for both varieties if someone has the gumption to really put them together. Paul -- R O All Comments Copyright by | Technofetisht A N Paul S. Goggin (1993) | Cypher, Cyber, Chaos V Information Broker | Ergoflux, Interzone E chaos(a)aql.gatech.edu | Carpe Diem: Stop the Clipper wiretap chip Finger account for latest _Phrack_ | Public Key: PGP and RIPEM available For anonymous communication:---> anonymus+4744(a)charcoal.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Title 18 USC 2511 and 18 USC 2703 Protected -- Monitoring Absolutely Forbidden

4 3

Re: Cypherpunks T-Shirt
by baumbach＠atmel.com 27 Jul '93

27 Jul '93

A custom one color t-shirt can be had for $27.60. 2 @ $15.90 each. 4 @ $10.10 each. 12 @ $6.20 each. This is not silkscreening, it is fabric dye based laser printer toner. You can actually do all this on your own laser printer, but the cost above is for a finished product. The company sells supplies or will do it all for you. You might want to ask for a sample of their product before ordering anything. They also publish a magazine: Flash The premier Journal of Desktop Printing The ad as seen in their magazine follows: Transfer Services We can reproduce photographs, drawings, artwork or computer graphics on a variety of products using our Transfer Toner technology. We will color separate your photos or artwork to create full color transfers. The prices below are for projects where you provide us with camera ready artwork. Design sizes are shown in parenthesis after item names. Larger designs can often be accomodated with one or more Additional Designs. Designs may be placed on the back, front, sleeve, cuff, & pocket. To use the chart below, simply match the product you want to the quantity you are ordering for the base price of the first color. Next, add in the cost per item for each additional color. For full color photos & artwork add three more colors for a total of four. To receive these low prices artwork must be camera ready. Single color items should be in black ink on bright white paper. Multicolor items should be in their respective colors on one composite page. High contrast images will give the best results. We also accept images on 3.5" Mac & PC disks in the follwing formats: ReadySetGo, TIFF, MacDraw, MacPaint, Illustrator, & PjotoShop. Files should be print erady and clearly labeled. Include any special fonts as outlines. Be sure to keep a backup of all artwork. We attempt to return all originals, but can not be responsible for their loss or damage. Our artists can create or modify a design at the rate of $45/hr billed by the quarter-hour. Simple jobs like curved text might be 15 minutes. Full scale mockups are available at the Q1 pricing and are 75% deductible against orders placed within 30-days of Q12 for that same item. Per Piece Costs: Quantity 1 Qty2 Qty4 Qty12 T-Shirt (10.7"x8") $27.60 $15.90 $10.10 $6.20 Sweat Shirt (10.7"x8") $33.50 $21.90 $16.00 $12.20 Additional Colors $2.00 $1.75 $1.50 $0.75 Other items and costs, but I'm getting tired of typing. BlackLightning Inc. Riddle Pond Rd. West Topsham, VT 05086 1-800-252-2599 (802)439-6463 Fax ------------------------------------ The magazine seems to have separated from the toner company. For what it's worth, the masthead has CIS:[73130,1734]. I think that's a Compuserve address, and offhand I don't know how to send mail to one, yet I know it's possible. The 2 companies probably have employees in common. I have never actually done business with this company, but from reading their magazine I have a good feeling about them. I considered going into the t-shirt printing business using this companies products, but for now I am still a wage slave. Peter Baumbach baumbach(a)bass.sco.atmel.com ;-)

2 1

TEST: please ignore
by hughes 27 Jul '93

27 Jul '93

Please ignore this message. Eric

1 0