July 2018 - cypherpunks-legacy

[Dewayne-Net] Wireless access for all? Google plan would
by Dewayne Hendricks 06 Jul '18

06 Jul '18

offer free Internet throughout SF Reply-To: dewayne(a)warpspeed.com Wireless access for all? Google plan would offer free Internet throughout SF - Verne Kopytoff and Ryan Kim, Chronicle Staff Writers Friday, September 30, 2005 Google Inc. has proposed to blanket San Francisco with free wireless Internet access, placing a marquee name behind Mayor Gavin Newsom's effort to get all residents online whether they are at home, in a park or in a cafe. The offer by the Mountain View search engine was one of many competing bids received by the city before its deadline Friday. Officials will now review the submissions and make a decision about which, if any, of the candidates get the green light for so-called Wi- Fi service. In joining the competition, Google is showing yet another sign of its boundless ambition. In the past few months, the company has released a succession of new products including instant messaging and telephone service that take it further from its search engine roots. The proposal furthers existing speculation that Google intends to create a free national Wi-Fi network. If so, it could pose a serious challenge to existing Internet service providers, such as SBC-Yahoo, Earthlink, Comcast and America Online, which charge subscriptions for wire connections. "This is a great opportunity to provide a community service to the Bay Area," said Chris Sacca, who oversaw Google's wireless Internet bid in San Francisco. "This furthers the goal of providing access to all residents and visitors on as wide a scale as possible." Mayor Newsom unveiled a goal of a free, city-wide Wi-Fi network last year as part of his state of the city address. Since then, officials have been weighing how to carry out despite a tight budget, finally asking for proposals from over the summer. As part of its proposal, Google said it could do the job without charge to either the city or residents. Google is a neophyte in wireless Internet access. It's experience is limited to tests at a gym and cafe near its headquarters and at Bryant Park, in New York City. Separately, Google sponsors free Wi-Fi service in San Francisco's Union Square in conjunction with a local start-up, Feeva. Competitors who submitted responses to the city's request for comments said Google's proposal is not entirely surprising. But they questioned the company's ability to follow through on its plans. Donald Berryman, EVP and president of municipal networks for Earthlink, questioned if Google had the know-how to be an Internet service provider. He said providing the deal for free is also not sustainable in the long run. "We've looked into free service and we haven't found a model where free works," said Berryman. "At some point free becomes less sustainable because there's no way to upgrade service and the networks when no one's paying for it." Chuck Haas, CEO of MetroFi, which runs two wi-fi networks in Cupertino and Santa Clara, wondered if Google would be meet the city's goals for coverage. But he said the idea of free service is not entirely far-fetched. He said his company submitted a proposal in which wireless broadband would be free across San Francisco but would be paid for with ads and would have no technical support or services for users. For $19.99 a month, subscribers would get enhanced service with no ads and customer support. "I believe we'll have enough people that want full security and customer support with no ads that we could make money," Haas said. "But no matter who the city chooses, I don't think the city will have to pay for this network." SBC spokesman John Britton said his company encourages competition, but feels that governments should seek greater investment from private companies to increase broadband service. He said in San Francisco's case, the city is already served by SBC and enjoys more than 400 free wi-fi hotspots, more than any other in the country. "We feel there is already widespread broadband available today," Britton said. Vince Vasquez, a policy fellow with the Pacific Research Institute, which receives funding from SBC, said there has never been a company willing to volunteer this kind of a network. But even if it's free, it might represent too much involvement by the city in a sector that should left to private industries, he said. "Our concern is with public money and publicly controlled internet access," said Vasquez. "We take a lot of caution about how government should intervene in the market." URL: <http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/c/a/2005/10/01/ GOOGLE.TMP> Weblog at: <http://weblog.warpspeed.com> ------------------------------------- You are subscribed as eugen(a)leitl.org To manage your subscription, go to http://v2.listbox.com/member/?listname=ip Archives at: http://www.interesting-people.org/archives/interesting-people/ ----- End forwarded message ----- -- Eugen* Leitl <a href="http://leitl.org">leitl</a> ______________________________________________________________ ICBM: 48.07100, 11.36820 http://www.leitl.org 8B29F6BE: 099D 78BA 2FD3 B014 B08A 7779 75B0 2443 8B29 F6BE [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type application/pgp-signature which had a name of signature.asc]

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[IP] Wireless access for all? Google plan would offer free Internet
by David Farber 06 Jul '18

06 Jul '18

throughout SF X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.734) Reply-To: dave(a)farber.net Begin forwarded message:

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[liberationtech] What's up with mesh?
by Sascha Meinrath 06 Jul '18

06 Jul '18

Hi all, I'd originally planned to stay out of the discussion, but given a lot of the questions that were posed to the list, thought I'd jump in. Below are some quick answers and links to primary sources on various facets of the discussion. Generally speaking, mesh wireless has been both widely successful and little understood. Between 2000-2003, my development team worked with MIT Roofnet on first-generation open source mesh Wi-Fi. Roofnet was a prototype network, as was the work we did as part of the cuwireless initiative (which became the CUWiN Foundation). Neither network offered service level guarantees since both technologies were highly experimental -- thus, while Steve Weis's experience was quite correct, it is based on technologies from a decade ago. As for OLPC mesh, it was doomed from the start. I still remember when we first got a shipment of OLPC boards -- CUWiN was part of the original mesh development team -- and realized that they'd used a Marvel chipset, which had no open source driver. When we requested the necessary reference docs, we were told that they were proprietary information -- so open source developers couldn't develop for OLPC. Soon afterward, other developers ran into the same problem -- a fairly good write-up of the problem is available at: http://www.cmosnetworks.com/OLPC-MarvellIssue-MyWriteUpOfTheSituation.html As for Shervin Pishevar's OpenMesh initiative -- I do hope it works out, but haven't yet seen any meaningful information about the technologies they're implementing. While Shervin has gotten a good amount of press, I do worry since I haven't found any technical specifications, repositories, or an active developer community behind the initiative. Matt Van Hoven's link to the Detroit Digital Justice Coalition's mesh initiative (http://detroitdjc.org/wireless-mesh) is actually one of the collaborations that OTI has helped coordinate and implement. We'll be expanding the network this summer and during the Allied Media Conference (happening this week -- http://alliedmedia.org) so for anyone who wants to see these technologies for themselves, we'll be running some hands-on workshops this week. Shaddi Hasan rightfully points out that "management overhead is much higher than most expect" -- one of the key deliverables for the State Department supported work we're undertaking is to improve auto-configuration on these systems. One of the key problems isn't whether the technologies work (they do), but that they're not very accessible to non-techies. Our broad goal is to get as close to zero-conf (zero configuration) as possible. That said, community wireless networks are _extremely_ large-scale -- from thousands of nodes covering Athens, Greece (http://awmn.net) to multi-layered mesh in Vienna, Austria (https://map.funkfeuer.at/wien) to hybrid mesh/hub-and-spoke regional networks covering the Djursland region of Denmark (http://djurslands.net) to the 13,000+ node network of networks throughout the Catalonia region of Spain (http://guifi.net) The folks running all of these networks are good friends, so if folks have questions for them, I'm happy to make intros. As I wrote two years ago, open source mesh has been doing 80+ mbps over multi-KM links for quite some time (http://www.saschameinrath.com/2009/june/12/open_source_802_11n_big_breakthr…) thus the throughput problem isn't usually the mesh itself, it's the Internet uplink. Griffin Boyce points out the importance of Intranet communications -- which is exactly right! The mesh networks we built in Urbana, IL did exactly this and we've been calling for this type of technology for years now (see, for example, http://newamerica.net/publications/policy/rise_intranet_era) The NYT didn't really cover the technologies involved in our work, but the ad-hoc mesh wireless we've been building is, in fact, an Intranet -- thus, Internet connectivity, while useful, isn't needed for network participants to communicate with one-another. Charles Wyble has also pointed out that Atheros is currently by far the front-runner for open source mesh wireless. Their recent sale to Qualcomm has left a lot of us quite concerned for the future of their relative openness, however. For those looking closely at the NYT "Internet-in-a-suitcase" picture, you'll see several piece of Ubiquiti gear -- they are, in fact, pretty amazing gear for the price point. Once the FreedomBox Foundation gets their tech functioning, that will be another really useful resource within a community Intranet as well. Meanwhile, other key groups that we've been working with around the globe include the Serval Project (http://www.servalproject.org) Gnu Radio (http://gnuradio.org) and the OpenBTS initiative (http://openbts.sourceforge.net) FunkFeuer (http://funkfeuer.at) and the OLSR crew (http://www.olsr.org) of course -- the Tor Project (http://www.torproject.org) etc. -- all of whom have folks who are working with us on Commotion (http://tech.chambana.net/projects/commotion) Happy to answer any follow-up questions folks have, --Sascha Meinrath Director, Open Technology Initiative New America Foundation _______________________________________________ liberationtech mailing list liberationtech(a)lists.stanford.edu Should you need to change your subscription options, please go to: https://mailman.stanford.edu/mailman/listinfo/liberationtech If you would like to receive a daily digest, click "yes" (once you click above) next to "would you like to receive list mail batched in a daily digest?" You will need the user name and password you receive from the list moderator in monthly reminders. Should you need immediate assistance, please contact the list moderator. Please don't forget to follow us on http://twitter.com/#!/Liberationtech ----- End forwarded message ----- -- Eugen* Leitl <a href="http://leitl.org">leitl</a> http://leitl.org ______________________________________________________________ ICBM: 48.07100, 11.36820 http://www.ativel.com http://postbiota.org 8B29F6BE: 099D 78BA 2FD3 B014 B08A 7779 75B0 2443 8B29 F6BE

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[tor-dev] questions about parallel Tor circuits en masse & adoption drivers
by Simon 06 Jul '18

06 Jul '18

Hello, I'm interesting in discussing the development aspects of using Tor as a massively distributed anonymous file server where blocks (e.g. 4KB) of a particular file (e.g. even several GB in size) might be redundantly distributed on very many hidden service nodes (e.g. a unique 4KB block of a file redundantly duplicated on ~ x hidden nodes from y million total hidden service nodes) and access to the file would be high through-put because very many (e.g. cable bandwidth / 4KB, e.g. 50 Mbps is 6.25 MB/s or 1600 * 4KB blocks per second) concurrent but high latency Tor circuits. Thus each Tor circuit would still be the usual high latency, but very many Tor circuits in parallel would deliver fantastic through-put. What if Tor could handle several rolling window bundles of e.g. 1,600 parallel Tor circuits which request one small block of info from 1,600 unique hidden service nodes? Does Tor parallelized, high bandwidth file sharing already exist? Does Tor already handle a massively parallelized number of Tor circuits, on the scale of thousands or tens of thousands of Tor circuits? Is many concurrent Tor circuits desirable? Who is working on it? Would using Tor as a massively distributed anonymous file server dramatically increase the number of Tor nodes (due to file sharing being more desirable than anonymity) and therefore make the entire Tor system more resilient to attack due to high growth and orders of magnitude more nodes? Is such an expansion -- on the back of a new functional focal point; i.e. not anonymity -- politically desirable for the Tor project? Thanks, Simon Experienced network programming enthusiast from Vancouver, Canada _______________________________________________ tor-dev mailing list tor-dev(a)lists.torproject.org https://lists.torproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/tor-dev ----- End forwarded message ----- -- Eugen* Leitl <a href="http://leitl.org">leitl</a> http://leitl.org ______________________________________________________________ ICBM: 48.07100, 11.36820 http://www.ativel.com http://postbiota.org 8B29F6BE: 099D 78BA 2FD3 B014 B08A 7779 75B0 2443 8B29 F6BE

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New Tor distribution for testing: Tor Browser Bundle
by Steven J. Murdoch 06 Jul '18

06 Jul '18

Recently I have been working on creating a distribution of Tor which includes a pre-configured browser -- the Tor Browser Bundle. It is intended for being run off an USB flash drive, but will probably also be helpful to users who want an easy-to-setup packaging of Tor. More information and download links can be found here: http://torbrowser.torproject.org/ The bundle contains Firefox, Tor, Vidalia, Polipo and Torbutton. No installation is needed (just unpack the contents). All the components are automatically started by one double-click. The bundle is new, and contains development versions of Tor, Vidalia and Torbutton, so should be considered a testing release. I do hope it will be useful, and I'd appreciate comments, suggestions, and bug reports. Thanks, Steven. -- w: http://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/users/sjm217/ ----- End forwarded message ----- -- Eugen* Leitl <a href="http://leitl.org">leitl</a> http://leitl.org ______________________________________________________________ ICBM: 48.07100, 11.36820 http://www.ativel.com http://postbiota.org 8B29F6BE: 099D 78BA 2FD3 B014 B08A 7779 75B0 2443 8B29 F6BE

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Re: panix.com hijacked
by Christopher L. Morrow 06 Jul '18

06 Jul '18

On Sun, 16 Jan 2005 Valdis.Kletnieks(a)vt.edu wrote: > On Sun, 16 Jan 2005 01:32:46 EST, Henry Yen said: > > > from panix shell hosts motd: > > > > . panix.net usable as panix.com (marcotte) Sat Jan 15 10:44:57 2005 > > So let's see.. the users will see this when they log into shell.panix.net > (since shell.panix.com is borked).. Somehow, that doesn't seem to help much.. > and the hijackers could be, potentially, running a box pretending to be shell.panix.com, gathering userids and passwds :( --- end forwarded text -- ----------------- R. A. Hettinga <mailto: rah(a)ibuc.com> The Internet Bearer Underwriting Corporation <http://www.ibuc.com/> 44 Farquhar Street, Boston, MA 02131 USA "... however it may deserve respect for its usefulness and antiquity, [predicting the end of the world] has not been found agreeable to experience." -- Edward Gibbon, 'Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire'

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New Tor distribution for testing: Tor Browser Bundle
by Steven J. Murdoch 06 Jul '18

06 Jul '18

Recently I have been working on creating a distribution of Tor which includes a pre-configured browser -- the Tor Browser Bundle. It is intended for being run off an USB flash drive, but will probably also be helpful to users who want an easy-to-setup packaging of Tor. More information and download links can be found here: http://torbrowser.torproject.org/ The bundle contains Firefox, Tor, Vidalia, Polipo and Torbutton. No installation is needed (just unpack the contents). All the components are automatically started by one double-click. The bundle is new, and contains development versions of Tor, Vidalia and Torbutton, so should be considered a testing release. I do hope it will be useful, and I'd appreciate comments, suggestions, and bug reports. Thanks, Steven. -- w: http://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/users/sjm217/ ----- End forwarded message ----- -- Eugen* Leitl <a href="http://leitl.org">leitl</a> http://leitl.org ______________________________________________________________ ICBM: 48.07100, 11.36820 http://www.ativel.com http://postbiota.org 8B29F6BE: 099D 78BA 2FD3 B014 B08A 7779 75B0 2443 8B29 F6BE

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Re: panix.com hijacked
by Christopher L. Morrow 06 Jul '18

06 Jul '18

On Sun, 16 Jan 2005 Valdis.Kletnieks(a)vt.edu wrote: > On Sun, 16 Jan 2005 01:32:46 EST, Henry Yen said: > > > from panix shell hosts motd: > > > > . panix.net usable as panix.com (marcotte) Sat Jan 15 10:44:57 2005 > > So let's see.. the users will see this when they log into shell.panix.net > (since shell.panix.com is borked).. Somehow, that doesn't seem to help much.. > and the hijackers could be, potentially, running a box pretending to be shell.panix.com, gathering userids and passwds :( --- end forwarded text -- ----------------- R. A. Hettinga <mailto: rah(a)ibuc.com> The Internet Bearer Underwriting Corporation <http://www.ibuc.com/> 44 Farquhar Street, Boston, MA 02131 USA "... however it may deserve respect for its usefulness and antiquity, [predicting the end of the world] has not been found agreeable to experience." -- Edward Gibbon, 'Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire'

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[IP] Bush declares war on freedom of the press
by David Farber 06 Jul '18

06 Jul '18

-----Original Message----- From: "Glenn Tenney" <gt_IP060107(a)think.org> To: "Dave Farber" <dave(a)farber.net> Sent: 3/10/06 13:41 Subject: Bush declares war on freedom of the press (for IP if you wish) http://www.capitolhillblue.com/blog/2006/03/bush_declares_war_on_freedom_o.… ml Bush declares war on freedom of the press March 6, 2006 07:44 AM / The Rant . By DOUG THOMPSON Using many of the questionable surveillance and monitoring techniques that brought both questions and criticism to his administration, President George W. Bush has launched a war against reporters who write stories unfavorable to his actions and is planning to prosecute journalists to make examples of them in his "war on terrorism." Bush recently directed Attorney General Alberto Gonzales to use "whatever means at your disposal" to wiretap, follow, harass and investigate journalists who have published stories about the administration's illegal use of warrantless wiretaps, use of faulty intelligence and anything else he deems "detrimental to the war on terror." Reporters for The New York Times, which along with Capitol Hill Blue revealed use of the National Security Agency to monitor phone calls and emails of Americans, say FBI agents have interviewed them and criminal prosecutors at the Justice Department admit they are laying "the groundwork for a grand jury that could lead to criminal charges," CIA Director Porter Goss told Congress recently that "it is my aim and it is my hope that we will witness a grand jury investigation with reporters present being asked to reveal who is leaking this information. I believe the safety of this nation and the people of this country deserve nothing less." As part of the investigation, the Justice Department, Department of Homeland Security and the National Security Agency are wiretapping reporters' phones, following journalists on a daily basis, searching their homes and offices under a USA Patriot Act provision that allows "secret and undisclosed searches" and pouring over financial and travel records of hundreds of Washington-based reporters. Spokesmen for the Justice Department and Department of Homeland Security admit there are "ongoing investigations" regarding publication of stories "involving threats to national security" but will not reveal what those investigations include. In addition to using the USA Patriot Act to pry into the lives of journalists, the Justice Department has also dusted off a pre-World War I law to prosecute people who receive classified information, although the law was aimed at military personnel not civilians. "This is the first administration that I can remember, including Nixon's, that said we need to think about a law that would put journalists who print national security things up in front of grand juries and put them in jail if they don't reveal their sources," says David Gergen, who served as President Regan's director of communication and also worked in the Nixon and Ford White Houses. Political scientist George Harleigh, who worked in the Nixon administration, says such use of federal law enforcement authority was illegal when Nixon tried it and still so today. "We're talking about a basic violation of the Constitutional guarantee of a free press as well as a violation of the rights of privacy of American citizens," Harleigh says. "I had hoped we would have learned our lessons from the Nixon era. Sadly, it appears we have not." In recent weeks, the FBI has issued hundreds of "National Security Letters," directing employers, banks, credit card companies, libraries and other entities to turn over records on reporters. Under the USA Patriot Act, those who must turn over the records are also prohibited from revealing they have done so to the subject of the federal probes. "The significance of this cannot be overstated," says prominent New York litigator Glenn Greenwald. "In essence, while the President sits in the White House undisturbed after proudly announcing that he has been breaking the law and will continue to do so, his slavish political appointees at the Justice Department are using the mammoth law enforcement powers of the federal government to find and criminally prosecute those who brought this illegal conduct to light. "This flamboyant use of the forces of criminal prosecution to threaten whistle-blowers and intimidate journalists are nothing more than the naked tactics of street thugs and authoritarian juntas." Just how widespread, and uncontrolled, this latest government assault has become hit close to home last week when one of the FBI's National Security Letters arrived at the company that hosts the servers for this web site, Capitol Hill Blue. The letter demanded traffic data, payment records and other information about the web site along with information on me, the publisher. Now that's a problem. I own the company that hosts Capitol Hill Blue. So, in effect, the feds want me to turn over information on myself and not tell myself that I'm doing it. You'd think they'd know better. I turned the letter over to my lawyer and told him to send the following message to the feds: Fuck you. Strong letter to follow. ------------------------------------- You are subscribed as eugen(a)leitl.org To manage your subscription, go to http://v2.listbox.com/member/?listname=ip Archives at: http://www.interesting-people.org/archives/interesting-people/ ----- End forwarded message ----- -- Eugen* Leitl <a href="http://leitl.org">leitl</a> http://leitl.org ______________________________________________________________ ICBM: 48.07100, 11.36820 http://www.ativel.com 8B29F6BE: 099D 78BA 2FD3 B014 B08A 7779 75B0 2443 8B29 F6BE [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type application/pgp-signature which had a name of signature.asc]

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Re: [p2p-hackers] what would you like to see most in a p2p social network?
by Renato Figueiredo 06 Jul '18

06 Jul '18

David, In addition to STUN, we also have a decentralized mechanism to select 1-hop relays in the overlay when NAT traversal fails. We have done simulation-based studies and our empirical evidence from the deployed SocialVPN/Brunet systems is that these approaches work pretty well, but we don't have a study of the system "in the wild" with large numbers of real users behind NATs. We are planning to reach to a reasonably large number of users to use the software to collect this among other kinds of data; any suggestions/ideas on how to reach out to potential users for an experiment would be welcome. Thanks! --rf On Tue, Jan 18, 2011 at 2:58 AM, David Barrett <dbarrett(a)quinthar.com>wrote: > Oh, is it possible to connect to the SocialVPN overlay on PlanetLab via > the Internet? Neat! As for the STUN approach, that sounds about right > -- have you measured the actual success rate of peers attempting to > connect with it? I know a few people on the list (including me) have > spent *A LOT* of energy on this topic, and it's really freakin' hard, > but super awesome. > > -david > > On 01/17/2011 11:49 PM, Pierre St Juste wrote: > > Here's some explanation about distributed NAT traversal. > > > > We currently run a structured P2P overlay on Planetlab, when you run > > SocialVPN you join that structured overlay, we usually have about 500 - > > 600 nodes running. If node A wants to connect to node B, the following > > happens: > > > > 1 - node A sends a ConnectToMe (CTM) message to node B by using node B's > > P2P address (160-bit randomly chosen address). > > > > 2 - The CTM message contains node A's public IP and UDP port. > > > > 3 - Node B replies through the overlay with his public IP and UDP port > > and simultaneous sends a UDP packet to node A's public IP and port. > > > > 4. When node A receives the reply with node B's IP and UDP port, node A > > sends a UDP packet to node B's public IP and UDP port. > > > > 5. If you have a friendly NAT (not symmetric), then node A's packet will > > make it to node B's machine since node B has already sent a packet to > > that IP and port. > > > > We call it a distributed STUN server because the Brunet P2P library > > allows for discovery of one's public IP address and port and it also > > provides an all-to-all messaging layer needed to signal the start of UDP > > hole punching. > > > > As we all know, direct P2P communication is not always possible, in this > > case, a node that is reachable by both parties is chosen as the relay > > nodes and peers communicate through that. > > > > Finally our NAT traversal is a bit slower than regular STUN because the > > initial message is routed through a structured overlay that takes log(N) > > hops on average, but you may have dropped UDP packets and retries, so it > > may take milliseconds or a few seconds to set up direct P2P connection. > > > > These papers explain in more detail > > > > http://byron.acis.ufl.edu/papers/ipdps06ipop.pdf > > > > http://byron.acis.ufl.edu/papers/hpdc145-ganguly.pdf > > > > http://byron.acis.ufl.edu/papers/cops08.pdf > > > > Hope this helps. I encourage anyone interesting to download SocialVPN > > and try it out, there is windows installer and debian package. It > > currently works with GoogleChat or by emailing each other your P2P > address. > > > > On Tue, Jan 18, 2011 at 12:49 AM, David Barrett <dbarrett(a)quinthar.com > > <mailto:dbarrett@quinthar.com>> wrote: > > > > Wow, this looks really fantastic. I hadn't followed its progress but > it > > sounds like it's come a long way really fast. I'd love to hear more > > about its distributed STUN service and NAT traversal. Do you have > any > > data on its effectiveness, perhaps expressed as the likelihood that > two > > arbitrary nodes will be able to connect directly via the internet? > Is > > there a TURN or other relay service available as a fallback? Thanks! > > > > -david > > > > On 01/17/2011 08:13 PM, Pierre St Juste wrote: > > > I would like to point out the SocialVPN project > > > > > > http://socialvpn.org > > > > > > It is basically a P2P VPN which creates direct encrypted tunnels > to > > > friends. It currently uses the XMPP protocol for friend discovery > and > > > public key exchange. This VPN thus creates a social graph where > edges > > > are IP links. This infrastructure can be used as an enabler for > many > > > other social services. Here are a few examples > > > > > > 1 - Instead of using Skype, you can use Ekiga with Avahi, Avahi > > > extension for Ekiga will discover online friends through > > multicast over > > > the social virtual private network, you can then place SIP call > > directly > > > over IP link. > > > > > > 2. For instant messaging, you can use Empathy or Pidgin with > > > Bonjour/Avahi support, as concept as above. > > > > > > 3. For video stream, you can stream a video over HTTP or RTP > > using VLC > > > and your friends can connect directly. > > > > > > 4. For social networking, you can run a wordpress blog locally > > and have > > > your friends connect to that, or you can write an social > networking > > > application that communicates with friends over SocialVPN using > > Berkeley > > > sockets API instead of having to deal with building P2P library > that > > > deals with NAT traversal, peer search and so on. > > > > > > 5. All data sent between peers is encrypted and authenticated, > > basically > > > the same idea behind IPSec if you support PKI certificate > exchanges. > > > > > > One of the hardest thing about building social P2P systems is > having > > > with a user-friendly way to bootstrap these social links (or > > Darknets). > > > SocialVPN makes that step trivial so that developers can focus > > more on > > > making cool apps versus figuring out how to traverse NATs. > > > > > > I hope this helps. > > > > > > On Mon, 2011-01-17 at 18:57 -0800, David Barrett wrote: > > >> I'd suggest first figuring out why someone would pick a P2P > social > > >> network over Facebook, from a perspective of legitimate > > functionality > > >> rather than just privacy (which as Facebook has demonstrated, > > isn't a > > >> killer feature). I'd suggest really emphasizing the fact that > with > > >> P2P-Book, there is no "uploading" photos or videos: you can > > share entire > > >> folders of files, videos, documents, or whatever and their > instantly > > >> available to your friends -- without first uploading them > > somewhere else. > > >> > > >> Furthermore, emphasize that you're not sharing *copies* of the > > videos, > > >> songs, and photos -- you're sharing the originals: change the > > original > > >> (crop, reorient, touch up, tag with metadata, etc) and its > > automatically > > >> updated. > > >> > > >> -david > > >> > > >> On 01/17/2011 12:51 PM, Jan DomaEski wrote: > > >>> Hey Michael, > > >>> > > >>> Thanks for the comments, they're helpful. > > >>> > > >>> A lot of this boils down to having two (or more) 'sides' of > > self. One > > >>> for general public, others for the rest; this is doable. > > >>> > > >>> Grudge-friendly and jackboot resistant, in ideal world, comes > > with the > > >>> 'distributed' and 'secure+encrypted'. But sure, seems to have > > been lost > > >>> in the implementation of at least one social network i can > > think of. > > >>> > > >>> As to the grandmother compatibility, at least to me, this is not > > >>> absolutely essential at first. > > >>> > > >>> Cherio, Jan > > >>> > > >>> 2011/1/16 Michael Rogers<m--(a)gmx.com > > <mailto:m--@gmx.com><mailto:m--@gmx.com <mailto:m--@gmx.com>>> > > >>> > > >>> Hi Jan, > > >>> > > >>> Here's a quick list of features I'd like to see in any > > social network > > >>> (not just P2P ones): > > >>> > > >>> * Grandmother-compatible. It should be possible to be > > friends with my > > >>> grandmother without her seeing the photo of the time I did > > that thing > > >>> with the grapes. > > >>> > > >>> * Alcohol-compatible. There should be something as easy to > > remember as > > >>> an email address that I can give to random people I > > befriend while > > >>> drunk. And if they look me up the next day, there should > > be a polite way > > >>> of not responding. > > >>> > > >>> * Schoolproof. People should not be able to find my > > profile just because > > >>> we went to school together 20 years ago. Similarly, people > > should not be > > >>> able to find my profile just because I applied for a job > > at their > > >>> company (or at least, they shouldn't be able to see the > > photo of the > > >>> thing with the grapes). > > >>> > > >>> * Grudge-friendly. It should be possible to move my data > > from one > > >>> provider to another when the current provider accuses me > > of lacking > > >>> integrity because I don't want my grandmother to see the > > photo etc etc. > > >>> > > >>> * Jackboot-resistant. The Tunisian government should not > > be able to > > >>> steal my password by setting up a fake login page. > > >>> > > >>> Cheers, > > >>> Michael > > >>> > > >>> On 15/01/11 20:35, Jan DomaEski wrote: > > >>> > Hello everybody out there interested in p2p social > networking, > > >>> > > > >>> > I'm doing a (free) p2p social network (just a hobby, wonbt > > be big and > > >>> > professional like diaspora). It has been in the works since > > >>> summer, and > > >>> > begins to get some shape. I'd like any feedback on things > people > > >>> > like/dislike in the idea of a p2p social network and how this > is > > >>> solved > > >>> > by the little toy. > > >>> > > > >>> > I've currently written it in java, netty handles the > networking, > > >>> Qt is > > >>> > used for GUI. Some yml for configs and db4o for storage. > > Non-blocking > > >>> > xml (XMPP) parser is a missing puzzle. The app has been run > > only on a > > >>> > single machine, but it's already practical and I'd like to > > know what > > >>> > features most people would want. Any suggestions are > > welcome, but I > > >>> > wonbt promise Ibll implement them :] > > >>> > > > >>> > Two demos (the top one is new) below, gitorious and blog > > links inside > > >>> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0rAwCsYt16w > > >>> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K1dujrhGvBQ > > >>> > > > >>> > Jan (jan.domanski(a)new.ox.ac.uk > > <mailto:jan.domanski@new.ox.ac.uk><mailto:jan.domanski@new.ox.ac.uk > > <mailto:jan.domanski@new.ox.ac.uk>> > > >>> <mailto:jan.domanski@new.ox.ac.uk > > <mailto:jan.domanski@new.ox.ac.uk><mailto:jan.domanski@new.ox.ac.uk > > <mailto:jan.domanski@new.ox.ac.uk>>>) > > >>> > > > >>> > PS. Yes - it's all my own work and done as a scientist not a > > >>> programmer, > > >>> > which has terrible implications for code ;) > > >>> > > > >>> > > > >>> > > > >>> > _______________________________________________ > > >>> > p2p-hackers mailing list > > >>> > p2p-hackers(a)lists.zooko.com > > <mailto:p2p-hackers@lists.zooko.com><mailto: > p2p-hackers(a)lists.zooko.com > > <mailto:p2p-hackers@lists.zooko.com>> > > >>> > http://lists.zooko.com/mailman/listinfo/p2p-hackers > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> _______________________________________________ > > >>> p2p-hackers mailing list > > >>> p2p-hackers(a)lists.zooko.com <mailto:p2p-hackers@lists.zooko.com > > > > >>> http://lists.zooko.com/mailman/listinfo/p2p-hackers > > >> _______________________________________________ > > >> p2p-hackers mailing list > > >> p2p-hackers(a)lists.zooko.com <mailto:p2p-hackers@lists.zooko.com> > > >> http://lists.zooko.com/mailman/listinfo/p2p-hackers > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > p2p-hackers mailing list > > > p2p-hackers(a)lists.zooko.com <mailto:p2p-hackers@lists.zooko.com> > > > http://lists.zooko.com/mailman/listinfo/p2p-hackers > > _______________________________________________ > > p2p-hackers mailing list > > p2p-hackers(a)lists.zooko.com <mailto:p2p-hackers@lists.zooko.com> > > http://lists.zooko.com/mailman/listinfo/p2p-hackers > > > > > > > > > > -- > > Pierre St Juste > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > p2p-hackers mailing list > > p2p-hackers(a)lists.zooko.com > > http://lists.zooko.com/mailman/listinfo/p2p-hackers > _______________________________________________ > p2p-hackers mailing list > p2p-hackers(a)lists.zooko.com > http://lists.zooko.com/mailman/listinfo/p2p-hackers > -- Dr. Renato J. Figueiredo Associate Professor ACIS Lab - ECE - University of Florida UF Site Director, Center for Autonomic Computing http://byron.acis.ufl.edu ph: 352-392-6430 _______________________________________________ p2p-hackers mailing list p2p-hackers(a)lists.zooko.com http://lists.zooko.com/mailman/listinfo/p2p-hackers ----- End forwarded message ----- -- Eugen* Leitl <a href="http://leitl.org">leitl</a> http://leitl.org ______________________________________________________________ ICBM: 48.07100, 11.36820 http://www.ativel.com http://postbiota.org 8B29F6BE: 099D 78BA 2FD3 B014 B08A 7779 75B0 2443 8B29 F6BE

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