July 2003 - cypherpunks-legacy

Re: Idea: The ultimate CD/DVD auditing tool (meow)
by Major Variola (ret) 09 Jul '03

09 Jul '03

At 11:45 AM 7/9/03 -0700, Mike Rosing wrote: >On Wed, 9 Jul 2003, Major Variola (ret) wrote: >> Actually I thought humans are insensitive to phase relations, modulo >> inter-aural timing at low frequencies for spatial location. Perhaps >> that >> is what you meant? But spatial location isn't the same as the >> frequency-fetishing >> audiophiles go for. To do that well you need casts of the outer ear >> too. > >No, if you put 2 clicks out that are 10 usec's apart on right and >left, most people can pick out which side came first. 90% of the >time anyway. Yes this is for localization ---clicks are broadband, you need to identify which freq components are used. I still think humans can't discriminate the phase of a tone. In fact, MP3s use this to cut bits. >> You doing owl-type studies on auditory localization? Audio-visual >> mapping >> and plasticity? Making the cats wear funky glasses? > >Yup. they sew coils into their eyes. For humans they use contacts :-) >PETA is definitly a problem :-) Gaak. I was thinking prism-glasses maybe bolted on that translate the vis field. Its ok for undergrads so its ok for cats. After the experiments, the cats will be ok, as I assume they're sufficiently plastic, unless you do brain staining on them. :-( Or your policy is the Tim McVeigh treatment. Cool stuff, though my domestic feline wants to know where you live. PS: have you identified the "can opener sound" brain-center yet? ---- Cats manage biometrics and reputation better than most human systems..

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Re: Idea: The ultimate CD/DVD auditing tool
by Tyler Durden 09 Jul '03

09 Jul '03

"Actually I thought humans are insensitive to phase relations, modulo inter-aural timing at low frequencies for spatial location. Perhaps that is what you meant? But spatial location isn't the same as the frequency-fetishing audiophiles go for." Au contrare...frequency accuracy vs spatial resolution is the classic Uncertainty principal in high end. A real high-end system present the ear with a truly 3-D soundscape...some instruments are clearly in the foreground, some are clearly in the background, and some are even higher than others. With a good recording, the hall ambience is also there. Put a great live recording on a great high-end sound system and "you are there". -TD >From: "Major Variola (ret)" <mv(a)cdc.gov> >To: "cypherpunks(a)lne.com" <cypherpunks(a)lne.com> >Subject: Re: Idea: The ultimate CD/DVD auditing tool >Date: Wed, 09 Jul 2003 10:59:39 -0700 > >At 07:15 PM 7/8/03 -0700, Mike Rosing wrote: > >To produce 65kHz (for cats) my present boss prefers a 1 MHz sample >rate. > >Do cats buy a lot of audiophile equiptment :8=|| > > >The human hearing system is capable of noticing phase relations at >100kHz > >rates. > >Actually I thought humans are insensitive to phase relations, modulo >inter-aural timing at low frequencies for spatial location. Perhaps >that >is what you meant? But spatial location isn't the same as the >frequency-fetishing >audiophiles go for. To do that well you need casts of the outer ear >too. > >You doing owl-type studies on auditory localization? Audio-visual >mapping >and plasticity? Making the cats wear funky glasses? _________________________________________________________________ STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail

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Re: Idea: The ultimate CD/DVD auditing tool
by Major Variola (ret) 09 Jul '03

09 Jul '03

At 07:15 PM 7/8/03 -0700, Mike Rosing wrote: >To produce 65kHz (for cats) my present boss prefers a 1 MHz sample rate. Do cats buy a lot of audiophile equiptment :8=|| >The human hearing system is capable of noticing phase relations at 100kHz >rates. Actually I thought humans are insensitive to phase relations, modulo inter-aural timing at low frequencies for spatial location. Perhaps that is what you meant? But spatial location isn't the same as the frequency-fetishing audiophiles go for. To do that well you need casts of the outer ear too. You doing owl-type studies on auditory localization? Audio-visual mapping and plasticity? Making the cats wear funky glasses?

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Re: [CI] Re: Finding collision resistant hash functions
by Major Variola (ret) 09 Jul '03

09 Jul '03

At 02:59 AM 7/9/03 -0700, Sarad AV wrote: >hi, >> MV: >>There's nothing gained by >> increasing >> the input entropy (compressing > >I was looking for such a compression function such >that the chances of collision in the message digest >obtained by hashing these 2^80 messages is collision >free or very low probability of collision or in other >words I dont want the birthday attack to work on it. > >If i hash 2^80 messages they should be equidistibuted >in such a manner that it does not affect the security >of the algorithm. Again, unless you know something about the distribution of your input AND their interaction with your chosen hash function, you gain nothing by remapping (compression or otherwise) your input. And again, a good hash function will disperse your input randomly, regardless of its clustering. So pick a crypto-like hash function (which guarantees random dispersion) and use it. You can't do better unless you "cheat" and know your input before you pick a hash function. And picking pathological inputs (to cause collisions) will be hard. e.g., hash=0 while (input) hash = hash ^ DES( input, fixed_key ) return hash The only reason to compress would be to cut down the number of DES operations, useful only if compression is cheaper than DES.

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Grey-World
by Steve Schear 09 Jul '03

09 Jul '03

An excellent site for those interested in tunneling, covert channels, network related steganographic methods developments. http://gray-world.net/ "There is no protection or safety in anticipatory servility." Craig Spencer

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Re: Genetic engineering [was: RE: DNA of relative indicts man, cuckol ding ignored]
by John Kozubik 09 Jul '03

09 Jul '03

On Mon, 7 Jul 2003, Trei, Peter wrote: > Its when we get to 'fixes' to behaviour and personality > that things start to get very hairy. I fear that those in > power will use genetic engineering as they have used > every other tool at their disposal - weapons, states, > laws, and governments - to maintain their position at > the expense of the overall welfare of the species, by > allowing improvements only to their own descendents, > while requiring changes to those out of power which > make it harder for them to change their status. > > One scenario: > > "Mr & Mrs Smith: The No Child Should Fear Act of > 2015 requires that your proposed son have the > 'bullying' gene deleted if he is to attend publicly > funded schools. This is similar to the old requirements > for vaccination - we don't want your son to endanger > other children, do we? I have long believed that the constitution of the United States (through an ammendment) should include protection against involuntary mental tampering. It should, for instance, be a constitutional right for a child not to take their Ritalin, or for an insane man not to take his meds in order to stand trial (a recent court case whose outcome I do not know). Along this line, perhaps a more general anti-tampering ammendment could include protection against the coercion that you describe above. I feel that no parent should be forced to alter their child in any way - before or after the birth. ----- John Kozubik - john(a)kozubik.com - http://www.kozubik.com

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Re: Idea: The ultimate CD/DVD auditing tool
by Major Variola (ret) 09 Jul '03

09 Jul '03

At 02:55 PM 7/8/03 -0400, Billy wrote: >On Tue, Jul 08, 2003 at 01:26:46PM -0400, Trei, Peter wrote: >> While the ear can't hear above 22KHz, signal above that *can* >> effect the perceived sound, by heterodyne effects. For example, >> if you play a single tone of 28KHz, or a single tone of 30 KHz, >> you can't hear them. Play them together, however, and you >> *can* hear a beat frequency of 2KHz. > >Bullshit detector buzzing. >Is this *really* true? Have you tried it? I haven't, but it does ring true. You'd get 2 Khz as well as other intermodulation products. Standard EE stuff. You've read about the company trying to sell highly localized speakers? They modulate two intense ultrasound beams, and the air does the nonlinear mixing where they meet. In the audiophile, lower-intensity case, the ears' nonlinearity would do it. Interesting info, Peter.

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News: Wal-Mart cancels 'smart-shelf' trial (fwd)
by Jim Choate 09 Jul '03

09 Jul '03

http://zdnet.com.com/2100-1103_2-1023934.html -- ____________________________________________________________________ We are all interested in the future for that is where you and I are going to spend the rest of our lives. Criswell, "Plan 9 from Outer Space" ravage(a)ssz.com jchoate(a)open-forge.org www.ssz.com www.open-forge.org --------------------------------------------------------------------

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The Register - We've found the perfect solution to spam (fwd)
by Jim Choate 09 Jul '03

09 Jul '03

http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/55/31638.html -- ____________________________________________________________________ We are all interested in the future for that is where you and I are going to spend the rest of our lives. Criswell, "Plan 9 from Outer Space" ravage(a)ssz.com jchoate(a)open-forge.org www.ssz.com www.open-forge.org --------------------------------------------------------------------

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Re: [CI] Re: Finding collision resistant hash functions
by Major Variola (ret) 09 Jul '03

09 Jul '03

At 11:18 PM 7/7/03 -0700, Sarad AV wrote: >Lets say we are using SHA-1 and i hash 2^80 >messages.What I am looking for is a compression >function such that the chances of collision in the >message digest obtained by hashing these 2^80 messages >is collision free or very low probability of >collision.How do we make such a compression function? You don't need one with a good hash function. Consider a hash made out of a block cipher digesting the input. A block cipher has the property that any one bit difference in input will change half the output bits on average. There's nothing gained by increasing the input entropy (compressing).

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