December 2003 - cypherpunks-legacy

Will Rodger of Inter@ctive Week on ISP-TV Monday Night
by ISP-TV Main Contact 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

*** ISP-TV Program Announcement: Will Rodger Interview *** *** Monday, Oct. 14 *** *** 9:00 PM ET *** Will Rodger, Washington Bureau Chief of Inter@ctive Week, will be the guest on this week's "Real Time" interview series. Rodger has written many articles on Telecom policy, as well as exclusive stories on Clipper III and the appeal of the CDA to the Supreme Court. This video interview can be viewed on the ISP-TV main CU-SeeMe reflector at IP 205.197.247.33, or other ISP-TV affiliate reflectors listed at http://www.digex.net/isptv/members.html See URL http://www.digex.net/isptv for more information about the ISP-TV Network To obtain Enhanced CU-SeeMe software, go to: http://goliath.wpine.com/cudownload.htm

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[Noise] Re: Missionaries (was: "Mormon Asshole?" re: GAK)
by Alan Olsen 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 11:08 PM 10/8/96 -0700, Paul S. Penrod wrote: >On Tue, 8 Oct 1996, Stephen Humble wrote: >> Biblical creationism is "wrong": there's ample evidence that the Earth >> is *much* more than 6000 years old. Yet lots of seemingly rational >> people believe biblical creationism. >> > >The "evidence" is based upon the belief that such techniques as carbon >dating and statistical radio active half life bearing rocks give an >accurate measurement of time as we know it. Geologically speaking, we are >just pissing in the fan to see which way it blows and calling it good. >And, considering the number of text books and egos to be restrung if it >was ever conclusively proven wrong would be devastating to say the least to >the current crop of scientists. I suggest you take your beliefs to talk.origins. I am sure that there are a great number of people who will be willing to explain just *WHY* creationism is no longer accepted as a rational belief. The current line of thought in evolutionary science is not just a whim or "pissing in the wind", it is based on WHAT WORKS. Creationists have spent alot of time making claims as to why the earth was created by God, but none of them has come up with the slightest shread of EVIDENCE as to it actually being done that way. What passes for "Creation Science" is alot of nitpicking about evolutionary theory. (As if somehow "disproving" evolution will somehow "prove" creationism.) Most of the so-called "proofs" for Creationism are based on ignorance of what evolutionary theory actually consists of. I suggest that you actually read the talk.origins FAQs. They might teach you something about real science instead of that pretend science you have been getting at church. As for what this whole thread has to do with crypto, i have no idea... --- | "Remember: You can't have BSDM without BSD." - alan(a)ctrl-alt-del.com | |"The moral PGP Diffie taught Zimmermann unites all| Disclaimer: | | mankind free in one-key-steganography-privacy!" | Ignore the man | |`finger -l alano(a)teleport.com` for PGP 2.6.2 key | behind the keyboard.| | http://www.teleport.com/~alano/ | alano(a)teleport.com |

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another MMF?
by Matthew Sheppard 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

A friend of mine got this in the mail, pretty sure the from addr is broken. The Audio Tape will be a must for cpunk parties. ------- Start of forwarded message ------- From: Lsat(a)Lsat.com Date: Tue, 08 Oct 1996 03:04:16 PDT Subject: Your ACCOUNT... ARE YOU NUTS?????? Your provider for Internet Services is ripping you OFF! The Internet was designed to be FREE!! PLEASE PLEASE let us show you where/how you can get it free! Please Read Below. JUST FOR READING THIS YOU WILL GET A FREE EMAIL ACCOUNT!!!!!! - --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- NEVER EVER pay for Internet Access AGAIN!!! E-V-E-R! This Amazing Course on Audio Tape teaches you STEP by STEP your Internet Service Provider 1doesn't want you to know! * How to get FREE DIAL-UP PPP Internet Access! * How to Surf the Web,Newsgroups,and EMAIL Anonymously/Untraceable! * Where you can get FREE Email Remailing! * Where you can get FREE Email Addresses! * Where you can get FREE Access to SMTP (Outgoing email)! * Where you can get FREE Access to News Servers! * Where you can get FREE Web Pages! * How to get FREE Internet Tools for Email, News, WWW, Etc.! * How to get free accounts on BBS's! * How to Manipulate your IP Address! * MUCH MUCH More!!! No matter where you live we guarantee you will get FREE internet access legally and anonymously! O N L Y ------> $24.95 Delivered (WORLDWIDE) Act NOW supplies are in Limited Supply! FAST SERVICE!!! - ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- BONUS BONUS BONUS BONUS BONUS BONUS BONUS BONUS BONUS BONUS As an added BONUS! We will show you how you can make phone calls that are not traceable back to you - 100% Legal! Very handy for those important calls you don't want anyone to find out about! But you absolutely M U S T respond within 10 DAYS A N D IF you respond within 10 days we will include a FREE EMAIL ACCOUNT in your selected name! Full Details and password will be included BONUS BONUS BONUS BONUS BONUS BONUS BONUS BONUS BONUS BONUS - --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ORDER FORM - Print out and mail Price Each Sub-Total _____ Total # of Courses 24.95 ___________ 1 Free Email Account (Within 10 Days) 0.00 0.00 Handling (Email Only) ___________ Shipping (Add. courses +1.00) ___________ Sales Tax (CA residents 7.75%) ___________ Order total US $___________ PAYMENT BY: ___ Check ___ Money Order - US FUNDS only! LSAT Productions PO Box 2747-453 Dept. E140A2-1007-1-1 Huntington Beach, CA 92648 USA SHIP TO: ______________________________ ____________________________ Name Phone Number ______________________________ ____________________________ Address Email Address ______________________________ Be sure to write address exactly City, State, Zip as it should be written on a mail piece. ______________________________ ____________________________ Country Email Alias you want WE ACCEPT US FUNDS ONLY! Please make checks payable to -> LSAT *** If you would like ONLY a FREE EMAIL ACCOUNT - Respond WITHIN 10 Days - Fill out the form completely. (US) $1.00 Handling + SASE - (INTERNATIONAL) - $2.50 Handling. ------- End of forwarded message ------- --Matt

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Re: Anonymous E-mail
by Bill Stewart 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 12:26 PM 10/8/96 -0700, Eric Murray <ericm(a)lne.com> wrote: >someone with slightly less scruples than I, and a little more time, and >their own domain name & server, might consider writing a small >program to create a few thousand accounts. Then sign them up with PINmail. >Every email address that's registered to PINmail gets you $5, right? Netscape didn't find www.PINmail.com for me, but I assume that it probably costs money to sign up for pinmail. If it's even $6, you won't win by creating a few thousand accounts for the $5 commission :-) > [privacy risks] Of course, anywhere you have a concentration of email, especially where there's bait like a promise of privacy, you have to wonder about security risks. Besides PINmail, there's www.mailmasher.com (which has a strong privacy policy), www.hotmail.com (which wants more information and may do advertising or something), and there are the big services like AOL, Compu$erve, and Prodigy. What would happen if Sameer and Lance gave in to the Dark Side? What would happen if ATTMail were taken over by TPC? Risks happen - deal with it. Darth .... (OK, so nobody but AT&T ever really used ATTMail :-) We still own the Death Star. # Thanks; Bill # Bill Stewart, +1-415-442-2215 stewarts(a)ix.netcom.com # You can get PGP outside the US at ftp.ox.ac.uk Imagine if three million people voted for somebody they _knew_, and the politicians had to count them all.

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Re: PGPW263.ZIP -- PGP Compiled for Windows
by John Anonymous MacDonald 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Hello! Need help to locate the above. Have already cjhecked the Replay ftp site, It wasn't there. Anywhere else apart from Lance's place? Thank you. Dekinda

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Re: Binding cryptography - a fraud!
by jim bell 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 03:00 PM 10/9/96 MET, Bert-Jaap Koops wrote: >The text is also available at >http://cwis.kub.nl/~frw/people/koops/binding.htm. > >9 October 1996 >Eric Verheul, everheul(a)ngi.nl >Bert-Jaap Koops, koops(a)kub.nl >Henk van Tilborg, henkvt(a)win.tue.nl >(c) 1996 Eric Verheul, Bert-Jaap Koops, Henk van Tilborg >This message may only be redistributed in its entirety and with >inclusion of the copyright notice. Credit if quoting. > >_Binding Cryptography, a fraud-detectible alternative to key-escrow >proposals_ [stuff deleted] >The idea is that any third party, e.g., a network or service provider, >who has access to components 2, 3 and 4 (but not to any additional >secret information) can: >a. check whether the session keys in components 2 and 3 coincide; >b. not determine any information on the actual session key. > >In this way, fraud is easily detectible: a sender that attempts to >virtually address a session key to the TRP (component 3) that is >different from the real one he uses on the message (or just nonsense) >will be discovered by anyone checking the binding data. If such >checking happens regularly, fraud can be properly discouraged and >punished. I am at the same time dismayed and disgusted at the tendency of some people to want to "detect fraud" on the part of ordinary citizens, as this paper appears to want to do, but says _nothing_ about preventing fraud _by_government. How is the average citizen to know if keys are being given out to government agents for valid reasons? I am further enraged by the last portion of the paragraph above where he says, "fraud can be properly discouraged _and_punished_" Why "punished"? Why call it "fraud"? Why should sending the "wrong" bits become a crime? The US government, for example, has repeatedly claimed that key-escrow systems should be "voluntary." Presumably, except for authoritarian and totalitarian countries, no other country should force their own citizens or others to use any sort of key-escrow/GAK system. Maybe I'm biased: I'm a libertarian who believes that sending the wrong bits shouldn't be considered a crime. The problem we have is with the politicians, NOT primarily the criminals. Giving the government the ability to punish people merely for sending the wrong bits (absent some other, REAL crime) is an enormous step backward. And if they're guilty of a real crime, why bother about the bits? Even if I believed in GAK, which I don't, I don't think governments or anyone else should be able to determine whether the "correct" code is included with the data until and unless the government has a valid warrant, with protections against government fraud, and has received the correct code. That is the only point at which the government (even arguably) has a legitimate reason to know this. Jim Bell jimbell(a)pacifier.com

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IRE founder Doug Kozlay [NEWS]
by Dale Thorn 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

The L.A. Times has run at least 3 major (full- or nearly-full-page) articles on encryption subjects in the last 4 or 5 working days. Tuesday's (8 Oct) article concerns Doug Kozlay, a "former" researcher for NSA. A few excerpts: "Not a dollar (of 2 trillion in govt. payments) goes through unless the electronic key Kozlay invented turns in an electronic lock..." "He (Kozlay) envisions future consumers using electronic cash cards with all the anonymity and easy spending of paper money." "All the new devices he imagines would be protected by IRE's encryption technology." The article goes on to describe how could standardize encryption all across the Internet. IRE has a current contract to encrypt MCI's Internet access service, for $12 million.

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Re: "European Union Bank"
by Duncan Frissell 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 07:06 PM 10/8/96 +0300, Jüri Kaljundi wrote: >According to one offshore magazine European Union Bank is a very bad >choice for Internet banking. What they did was they assigned they named >Lord Mancroft who sits in the UK's House of Lords as chairman of the bank. >Only thing Lord Mancroft himself did not know a thing about it, although >the bank marketing materials had a letter of welcome supposedly from that >prominent person. So he is thinking of taking legal action against the >bank. I have at hand a brochure from "Shorex 96 - The Premier Offshore Exhibition" to be held November 20-22 in London. Day One features a section on "Offshore and the Internet" including a panel "Will the Internet Increase the Market Share of the Offshore Industry?" Featuring "Lord Mancroft, Chairman, European Union Bank, Antigua." I wonder if he'll be there. If we are both there, I'll ask him. DCF "If control measures are so effective, why does everything seem to be more and more out of control?"

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Re: Voice Stress Analysis of Debates?
by vin＠shore.net 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Jim Bell queried the List about potential AP decision-support tools like voice-stress detectors which could identify truth-tellers among politicians and other possible candidates for Mr. Bell's much-debated proposal to cleanse the body politic. One anon C'punker responded with a fine terse summary of VS/PSE tech (along with the surprising news that VS/PSE chips are now available at $89.95 per.) Another, Sandy Sandfort, noted: >The original device was the PSE, the psychological stress >evaluator. It was, as still is, sold by a company called >Dektor. It is located in the DC area (Maryland?) and is run >by a group of ex-spooks. It's been around for 25 years or so. Dektor Counterintelligence is located in Savannah, Ga. The Dektor PSE was developed by Col. Allan Bell (USA, ret.) shortly after he retired from the Army, where -- towards the end of a long career which included, as I recall, a stint in charge of the MI detachment in West Berlin -- he had played "Q," the inventive spy-supply wizard, at the US Army military intelligence headquarters. Dektor's PSE came into some prominence after Col. Bell, then a civilian, showed up with his black box to assist Italian police during their huge investigation of the kidnapping of US Army General James Dozier by the Red Brigades in '82. The fact that Dozier was located and rescued by the Carabinieri commandos after five weeks in captivity -- while Prime Minister Aldo Moro had been murdered by the Red Brigades, eight weeks after his kidnapping in '78 -- led inevitably to stories, probably mythical, that Bell's PSE was a significant factor in the investigation. As Clarke or someone said, any technology sufficiently advanced will be considered magic -- and it is doubtless true that, for many Italians interviewed during the Drozier inquiry, the quiet presence of the diminutive American civilian, with his utterly mysterious "truth-detector," inspired fear and awe. The Legend that came out of Italy was doubtless a factor in Dektor's subsequent success selling the $5K PSE into the corporate and security market. (There was a period where corporate negotiations were sometimes held in a hotel chosen only just before the start of the talks, for fear that one party or the other might have pre-installed a PSE.) In the mid and late '80s, dozens, perhaps hundreds of PIs -- and maybe a few journalists -- were actually running around using tape recorders to interview people, then running back to their hotel rooms to spin the tape for their PSE. All of this was something of a giggle for Allan Bell, a Cold Warrior with a sense of humor who would _love_ this List. Bell offered (when asked) a much more modest description of the potential of the PSE. As I recall, Bell described the PSE as tool which could allow an investigator to identify, with reasonable certainty, the utterly innocent (lumped together, perhaps, with the utter psychotic; those who couldn't themselves separate truth from falsehood)... but which offered only limited utility in sorting the liars from others of various types who might experience stress or tension when faced with an interrogation or interview. The utterly innocent and the utterly psychotic both being relatively uncommon breeds (even among politicians and/or Libertarians,) the PSE never quite made it as a standard tool for criminal justice, or journalistic, inquiries. Bell set up what I always believed to be an elaborate practical joke on the Beltway Bandit Culture when, at the height of the PSE craze, he let Dektor's sales office in suburban D.C. -- Vienna, maybe? -- be used after-hours as the world headquarters/classroom/PR center for the short-lived Mensa University. (MU's president of which was a local PSE distributor, and very much a true believer.) The idea that the very bright might have to be very honest to matriculate intrigued me... but I'll admit I wasn't surprised when MU, quite honestly, collapsed into something of a laughingstock. Suerte, _Vin Vin McLellan +The Privacy Guild+ <vin(a)shore.net> 53 Nichols St., Chelsea, Ma. 02150 USA Tel: (617) 884-5548 <*><*><*><*><*><*><*><*><*>

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Re: Missionaries BLAH BLAH BLAH
by nobody＠cypherpunks.ca 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

:Date: Wed, 09 Oct 1996 09:30:34 -0600 :From: Shawn Willden <swillden(a)cs.weber.edu> :To: Dale Thorn <dthorn(a)gte.net> :Subject: Re: Missionaries :Dale Thorn wrote: :> > Biblical creationism is "wrong": there's ample evidence that the :> > Earth is *much* more than 6000 years old. Yet lots of seemingly :> > rational people believe biblical creationism. :> :> Which years? BLAH BLAH BLAH ;And Christian theology also offers an explanation as to why God would :do such a thing: so that faith is required for belief. : :Logic is of no use in theological discussions.I've dealt with more :than a few. BLAH BLAH BLAH As a Mormon missionary I spent quite a :bit of time discussing :theology with people :-) BLAH BLAH BLAH :Shawn Much better to bash Tim (no offense meant, I like Tim's style--or lack thereof) than this drivel. Makes me want to puke. To quote: "As for what this whole thread has to do with crypto, i have no idea..." BLAH BLAH BLAH

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