December 2003 - cypherpunks-legacy

Re: Leaving the Country
by kentborg＠world.std.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

frissell(a)panix.com writes: >All the New England States including Taxachussets have State Liquor Stores. Nope. As a many year Mass resident I have never seen a state liquor store in the state. Sure, plenty across the border in New Hampster, but not in MA. One of New Hampster's big tax sources is nasty property taxes. Nice regressive taxes on wealth (both taxing wealth and regressive taxes annoy me), to support a state which does its best to not exist. -kb, the Kent who is currently in California where I can buy booze on *Sunday*, and at a *grocery* store. Cool! -- Kent Borg +1 (617) 776-6899 kentborg(a)world.std.com kentborg(a)aol.com Proud to claim 32:00 hours of TV viewing so far in 1994!

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Re: ID card from hell
by frissell＠panix.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 12:29 PM 7/15/94 -0700, Timothy C. May wrote: >Not addressed in Duncan's essay was my chief concern: The "National >Benefits Card" is required to get license plate tags. (And maybe other >things, like car and home insurance, etc.) This can't be required because corporations and other legal entities can own cars and these entities can, in turn, be owned by non-resident foreigners. Funny story. A couple of weeks ago, I rented a car from (a major car rental agency) in a NE state. They gave it to me for a week. It had Florida plates. The registration expired at the end of June, three days into my week-long rental. I drove an "unregistered" car with the permission (albeit unknowing) of a major corporation for 4 days. Also hard to break the Clean Team/Dirty Team technique where one family member owns the cars and the others drive. Same with property ownership. If demand develops, I expect that some enterprising members of the "underclass" will be able to rent their identities or rights to conduct transactions to those who need them. Government penalties won't faze them. >If I fail to pay, I lose my car insurance (which makes me ripe for a >"deep pockets" lawsuit by anyone who gets into an accident with me). >Lots of other implications. Very real implications. It is *much* easier to protect your assets from a private party than from the government. Private parties usually can't afford to sue you in the Cook Islands to try and break your Foreign Asset Protection Trust. >I continue to see great dangers here, in tying a national ID card to >transactions we are essentially unable to avoid in this society: >driving, insurance (and let's not argue insurance...I mean it is >unavoidable in the sense of legal issues, torts, etc.), border >crossings, etc. Tim, I sense that you suffer from the great American Insurance Addiction. The belief that it is possible to eliminate all risk if you pay massive amounts of money to an insurance company. This tends not to work. It leads to mandatory insurance laws that lead to exploding insurance costs that lead to system collapse. Judgment proofing oneself is cheaper. >Now how will one file taxes without such a card if one is made >mandatory for interactions with the government? Saying "taxes are not >collectable" is not an adequate answer. They may not be collectible >for street punks and others who inhabit the underground economy, but >they sure are for folks like me. If you fail to include your SS# on your tax form but it is otherwise complete and they have their dough, they don't prosecute. Remember "Have Spacesuit, Will Travel" in which our hero's father kept his money in several cookie jars including one labeled "Uncle Sam" and then once a year emptied that one out and sent it to the government: IRS Agent: But you have to fill out a tax form Taxpayer: The government can't even require that you be able to read and write. In 1993, the IRS referred approximately 350 cases to the Justice Department for criminal prosecution. Out of 20 million tax evaders that's a pretty blunt sword. Note that the current ID requirements under the 1986 Immigration Act have had the sole effect of *dropping* the price of an SS Card and a California Driver's License on the streets of East LA from circa $50 to circa $20 (due to economies of scale presumably). More technically advanced ID will merely encourage people to become self employed (a good thing in any case). Germany has much tighter ID requirements than we do. Illegals there work through contract employment firms that accept the risk for profit. On the subject of border controls. The DDR tried machine guns, barbed wire, and concrete as border controls. It worked for less than 30 years and "that was then this is now." Things move faster these days. Even with anti-foreigner hysteria, Germany, France, and the Benelux countries recently eliminated crossing controls. The others in the EU "inner 9" should follow soon. NAFTA should reduce ours as well. Note BTW that Mexican vehicles (including trucks) will get ease of entry in a couple of years. Good place to register your car? As more countries become "developed" and world real income doubles and doubles again (with shorter doubling times) travel for all purposes will explode. It will make current travel rates (the highest in history) look insignificant. Swamping is bound to occur. Since we've established that direct application of force will have to be increasingly rare (cost factors) that leaves control freaks with only denial of service to fall back on. Since DOS leaves unfilled demands (if the service denied is something people actually want) it will create its own market opportunity. Markets have become *much* more efficient at this sort of arbitrage these days. Note that those denied credit cards because of bad credit suddenly have dozens of secured credit cards to choose from. Tim has claimed that the government will get markets to reject willing customers who have money to spend because they lack their 'US Card'. That runs counter to the entire history of markets. People will find a way to buy what they want. DOS attacks will just leave people increasingly outside the government system where some of us want to see them in any case. DCF "What is the first thing a 'Rocket Scientist' Derivative Designer says when he's told that Chairman Gonzales of the House Banking Committee is out to crush derivatives. 'Gee, you mean to tell me that I'll have to charge another couple a hundred thou to design a new derivative to eliminate the new regs? No rest for the weary.'"

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Re: Rappin. with Jesus
by DAVESPARKS＠delphi.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

> Did I tell you I got to talk to Jesus face to face yesterday? Yup, I ran > into him at the store. No, this was different than Elvis! Honest! He > even gave me his card! He was a very nice person, and very helpful. Oh, > did I mention. His last name was Guardado. <g> I've often wondered that the "H" in "Jesus H. Christ" stands for, too! <g> > (Don't tell anybody I listen to KIFM -- the local jazz station -- 98.1!) I also won't tell anyone the TITLE of this message, which implies that the Almighty might actually enjoy rap "music". > Well I went to the zoo to see you. Errr. I went to the primate exhibit You been readin' Darwin again? What's the name of his book? "The Origin of Feces", or something like that? <g,d,r> Best kept in the "reading room", anyway...

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Re: National ID cards are just the driver's licenses...
by frissell＠panix.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 09:59 PM 7/15/94 -0700, sameer wrote: > Keep in mind though.. Tim says this often and I agree with >him. The splinter lists have *not* had much traffic. I created the >remailer-operators list, and there hasn't been much traffic. I wasn't >surprised, but I thought I may as well start it. (Whenever I do any >remailer hacking and/or changes I *will* [I think I have, as well] >post to the remailer-operators list.. I still encourage others to do >the same.) A Hardcore Privacy list could well get more "crossover" action than a list for a Cypherpunks-specific topic. DCF "Note that the future capability to conduct a wide range of financial transactions electronically will allow anyone on earth to wake up in the morning and say 'I guess I'll become a bank today.' A bank is just a network node running a particular flavor of server software."

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Please ignore the previous message
by DAVESPARKS＠delphi.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Please ignore my previous message. It was intended for an individual, and I sent it to the Cypherpunks list by mistake. :-( /--------------+------------------------------------\ | | Internet: davesparks(a)delphi.com | | Dave Sparks | Fidonet: Dave Sparks @ 1:207/212 | | | BBS: (909) 353-9821 - 14.4K | \--------------+------------------------------------/

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What's apropos to this list (was Re: Leaving the Country)
by tim werner 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

>From: tcmay(a)netcom.com (Timothy C. May) >Date: Fri, 15 Jul 1994 10:50:49 -0700 (PDT) > >I'll respond briefly here to the points both Sandy S. and Duncan F. >make. Cypherpunks who are interested exclusively in RSA keylengths or >in PGP Shells will not find this interesting. In my view, discussion >of tax policies and the implications of crypto has a role on this >list. I agree. I believe that discussions of privacy issues belong on this list as well. If I have to subscribe to a separate list to keep up with means of privacy-protection so be it, but I'd rather not have to. tw

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Card Playing Protocol
by John Young 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Responding to msg by kentborg(a)world.std.com (Kent Borg) on Sat, 16 Jul 4:8 AM >Grrr. I *hate* reality. A good beginning to changing it. >Comments? (You too Tim.) I like your original notion of card-playing as a way to build a taste for crypto by non-cryptoids (like me). It parallels political and economic chance and the use of crypto to hide info from foes and competitors. Putting crypto into public play like this will help teach protection from economic security mongers and toadies. Your idea shows that c'punks chefs continue to cook tastier fare than the alt. and talk. fora elsewhere. It feeds my interest in c'punks: the peripheral discussions, sometimes crypto-related, enhance the main dish.

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Factoring
by L. Todd Masco 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

jamesd(a)netcom.com (James A. Donald) writes: > n is the number of bits, and factoring can be done in considerably less > than 2^(n/2) > > When discussing complexity it is usual to use a measure of problem > size that corresponds to the physical size of the answer or > the question. > > Thus thus if you are factoring a 1024 bit number, n is 1024, not > 2^1024 Ah. Thank you -- it's amazing the number of obviously wrong answers I received to my question, all of them taking an authoritative tone (from "your algorithm doesn't work" (it does) to "your algorithm takes enormous amounts of memory" (in fact, it takes 3n)). Makes one realize (again) how sceptical one must be towards answers received on the 'net, "even" from cypherpunks. [This isn't to slam anyone, just to suggest that people take a little more time to think before hitting the 'r' key.] -- L. Todd Masco | Bibliobytes books on computer, on any UNIX host with e-mail cactus(a)bb.com | "Information wants to be free, but authors want to be paid."

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Factoring
by L. Todd Masco 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

I'm confused on a point, and I hope someone will clarify. Factoring keeps being described as a 2^(n/2) problem, yet AFAIK (I wrote the code to do it the other morning before breakfast), it's doable in linear (O(n)) time. What gives? (The algorithm I'm thinking of is: /* Algorithm: To factor the number n, start with n boxes, each with one "marble." Remove last box, put it's marble in box #1. If all boxes have the same number of marbles, the number is factored. If not, remove last box. Put marble in box #2. Compare. Etc. possible optimizations: div by each prime l for a quicker starting point. (2,3...) */ factor(int target) { int place = target; int smallest = 0; int load = 1; while (place>1) { place--; /* N-1 boxes. */ smallest+=load; /* Next box in line gets the marble */ if (place <= smallest ) { load++; if (place == smallest) printf(" Factor: %d by %d\n",place,load); smallest = smallest-place; } } } -- L. Todd Masco | Bibliobytes books on computer, on any UNIX host with e-mail cactus(a)bb.com | "Information wants to be free, but authors want to be paid."

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CPP: Card Playing Protocol
by kentborg＠world.std.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Having reread pages 78-81, I guess pagers, usenet, and slow email are pretty much out. I looks like I am going to have to track down the proceedings from Crypto 85, 86, and 87. (Still in print? Expensive??) All the main sources seem to be in them. Though all the applicable literature talks of playing poker, it seems more general and politically wiser to talk about playing cards. Besides, "PPP" is already in big-time circulation meaning "Point-to-Point Protocol", "PP" for "Poker Protocol" is only two letters--of course verboten. "PGP" for "Pretty Good Poker" would only get Phil's lawyers after me. That leaves "CPP", for a nice wholesome card game. -kb, the Kent who might actually do it -- Kent Borg +1 (617) 776-6899 kentborg(a)world.std.com kentborg(a)aol.com Proud to claim 32:00 hours of TV viewing so far in 1994!

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