December 2003 - cypherpunks-legacy

Bobby Ray Inman wants ciphers restricted!
by tcmay＠netcom.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Here's another one of those apparent "trial balloons," this time from an influential former Director of the NSA. As DIRNSA, Admiral Inman was the one who in the late 1970s proposed restrictions on the use of public key cryptography, at least according to Bamford in "The Puzzle Palace." Inman later was in the CIA, then MCC in Austin, and is now involved in venture capital in various ways. I believe his VC firm invested in Cylink, one of the four partners in Public Key Partners (the others being RSADSI, Stanford, and MIT). (Paranoids like us might look for links to Mykotronx....) Enough speculation for now. Here's the item: From: howard(a)hal.com (Howard Gayle) Newsgroups: talk.politics.crypto,alt.politics.libertarian,comp.org.eff.talk,alt.privacy.clipper Subject: von Mises Inst. Free Market article on Clipper Date: 19 Sep 1993 16:29:34 GMT Message-ID: <27i1de$edv(a)hal.com> Reply-To: howard(a)hal.com (Howard Gayle) Summary: Government subsidies imply government control. Keywords: Bobby Ray Inman, NSA, registration, EFF The September 1993 issue of "The Free Market" has an article by Gary McGath about Clipper. "The Free Market" is a monthly non-technical newsletter from the Ludwig von Mises Institute. Gary McGath is the publisher of the "Thomas Paine Review." Here's a quote: "Bobby Ray Inman, former director of the NSA, has even proposed `a registry of institutions which can legally use ciphers,' as he explained in his recent book. `If you get somebody using one who isn't registered, then you go after him.'" McGath also mentions the EFF: "The Electronic Frontier Foundation, which opposes the Clipper, still applauds legislation to subsidize network access. But by inviting the government to build their `highway,' EFF is inviting in the traffic cops. "The only way to keep our communications free of governmental intrusion is to keep them free of governmental involvement." -- Howard Gayle HAL Computer Systems, Inc. 1315 Dell Avenue Campbell, California 95008 USA howard(a)hal.com Phone: +1 408 379 7000 extension 1080 FAX : +1 408 379 5022 --

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Statement from Zimmermann on PGP investigation
by Philip Zimmermann 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Some of you may have received my Internet message of a couple of days ago about the ongoing U.S. Customs investigation of the exportation of PGP, which has now progressed to the level of Federal Grand Jury subpoenas. This earlier message was intended by me for distribution to a very small group of friends who previously communicated their concern about me and the investigation and asked to be kept informed. I did not send the message to anyone outside this group. Unfortunately, I did not adequately assert my desire that the message not be further disseminated. It appears that the message has gone completely public. This was not my intention. My lawyer, Phil Dubois, has been in touch with the Assistant U.S. Attorney (William Keane) assigned to the investigation. We have no reason to believe that Mr. Keane is anything other than a professional and reasonable person. He made it clear that no decision has been made regarding any prosecution of anyone for any offense in this matter. Such decisions will not be made for some time, perhaps several months. Mr. Keane also made clear his willingness to listen to us (me and my lawyer) before making any decision. It appears that both Mr. Keane's mind and the lines of communication are open. My fear is that public dissemination of my message will close the lines of communication and put Mr. Keane into an irretrievably adversarial position. Such a result would not serve any of our interests. My lawyer tells me that nothing irritates a prosecutor more than being the subject of what he perceives to be an orchestrated publicity campaign. He also tells me that his nightmares involve FOAs (Friends Of the Accused), invariably people with good intentions, doing things on their own. I understand that the issues involved in this investigation are of the greatest importance and transcend my personal interests. Even so, I would rather not turn an investigation into a full-scale federal prosecution. I ask that everyone keep in mind that the government's resources are limitless and that mine are not. Speaking of resources, many of you have offered help, and I am grateful. Those wishing to contribute financially or otherwise should contact either me or Philip L. Dubois, Esq., at dubois(a)csn.org or by phone at 303-444-3885 or by mail at 2305 Broadway, Boulder, CO, 80304. Mr. Dubois has just got on the Internet and is still learning how to use it. Donated funds will be kept in a trust account, and all contributions will be accounted for. If this whole thing somehow goes away with money left in the account, the balance will be refunded to contributors in proportion to the amounts of their contributions. This message can be widely circulated on public forums. Philip Zimmermann prz(a)acm.org 303 541-0140

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Re: more deranged lunatic ravings -- just delete 'em!
by an36440＠anon.penet.fi 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

>First off, 'we' ARE involved. This case is IMPORTANT, and can have far- >reaching consequences for us. This reminds me of the old story that starts >out 'they came and got the Jews, and I said nothing because I wasn't a Jew...'. Funny thing about some people on this list and alt.conspiracy, the first line of defense to accusations of hysteria is often "Look at what happened to the Jews...". The Jews didn't have professionals employed to fight for their side of the argument, didn't have the justice system to provide a legal framework within which both sides must maneuver, didn't have a lot of what prz, et al., have. >The attorneys and other experts looking at this case apparantly don't share >your lack of enthuasism. Even in the very early stages, the groundwork that You make my case. "The attorneys". What exactly are YOU doing with all your yammering, besides making a loud noise? ------------------------------------------------------------------------- To find out more about the anon service, send mail to help(a)anon.penet.fi. Due to the double-blind, any mail replies to this message will be anonymized, and an anonymous id will be allocated automatically. You have been warned. Please report any problems, inappropriate use etc. to admin(a)anon.penet.fi.

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Re: more deranged lunatic ravings -- just delete 'em!
by doug＠netcom.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

erc(a)apple.com said: >Nope. That's not the point, and you know it. The point being (and I'm not >even sure why I'm bothering to explain this to you - you're intelligent) >this case has the potential to affect ALL of us, not just the participants >in the case. True. But the question is, specifically what are you suggesting "all of us" do right now? When I say specifically, I mean for instance not just "find out information about XYZ" like you said before, I mean the "and then what?" part as well. Most of us will probably do our best to learn whatever we can rather than ignoring the situation. But *then* what? What's your suggestion? >Well, scratching my crotch and looking important HAD crossed my mind. :) Besides that, I mean. :-) Doug

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What can we do in the next few days?
by tcmay＠netcom.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Lots of flames lately about "lunatic ravings" and what Cypherpunks can or can't do to help in the next few days. Here's my take on the situation: * Keep current, read all the various groups covering this. * Add articles and comments whenever you have something to say. Your argument might help one of the lawyers make his case. (One of "our" lawyers, one hopes.) Hal Finney's article this morning falls squarely into this category. We may have few lawyers amongst us, but we can contribute comments and background items that the lawyers may find useful. Not much time left before the grand jury convenes on Wednesday, but time to help after that. I agree of course with the sentiment that "Cypherpunks write code," or at least write text on semi-technical topics, and agree with the current focus of our group on stuff like remailers, digital cash, data havens, and the like. The EFF, CPSR, and ACLU are already focussed on issues of legal cases, privacy laws, etc., and are staffed with mostly lawyers and legal-background folks. We fill a niche they cannot fill. * Phil Karn and others have written about DES implementations that are already described, published, etc., both inside and outside the U.S. This may help with the precedent issue, namely, establishing that DES is already widely available (in case this is an important issue). In particular, see the messages a few days back about compiling a list of published DES (and IDEA, too) codings. Add to the list if you can. Cypherpunks can help on this, if they have some experience with DES, IDEA, and the like. Perhaps after the indictment (I'm guessing there'll be one) we can find out from the lawyers if our backgrounds in hacking and crypto can be tapped to help in the defense. --Tim May -- .......................................................................... Timothy C. May | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money, tcmay(a)netcom.com | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero 408-688-5409 | knowledge, reputations, information markets, W.A.S.T.E.: Aptos, CA | black markets, collapse of governments. Higher Power: 2^756839 | Public Key: PGP and MailSafe available. Note: I put time and money into writing this posting. I hope you enjoy it.

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Cypherbusts, etc.
by Alan E. Mason 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

I just heard about the grand jury BS going down around PGP, etc, via the EFF forum on the Well and would like to do whatever I can to support the defense effort (when it comes) etc. I am a writer with some small access to local media and a big interest in the outcome of this test of our 1st amendment rights. I would also like to get on your "mailing list" if you have one. Mail should be sent to vznquest(a)netcom.com Thanks, and keep up the good work! Alan Mason

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(fwd) New Intel Slogan
by erc＠wetware.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Path: khijol!wetware!iggy.GW.Vitalink.COM!pacbell.com!ames!agate!howland.reston.ans.net!europa.eng.gtefsd.com!uunet!uunet.ca!wildcan!news2.uunet.ca!xenitec!looking!funny-request Message-ID: <S5d6.528(a)clarinet.com> Date: Sat, 18 Sep 93 19:30:02 EDT Newsgroups: rec.humor.funny Subject: New Intel Slogan From: shah(a)santur.nuo.dec.com (Amitabh Shah) Keywords: topical, smirk, original Approved: funny(a)clarinet.com Lines: 17 [This is original.] In view of the recent burglaries at computer warehouses in the Silicon Valley, where the burglars have stolen Intel's x86 processor chips, Intel has decided to use a new corporate slogan. The idea for this slogan is based on the theft-resistant stickers seen on the windows of cars in NYC. All stores carrying/manufacturing PCs made with Intel's processors, as well as the PCs themselves will now bear a sticker that says: "No Intel Inside". -- Selected by Maddi Hausmann. MAIL your joke (jokes ONLY) to funny(a)clarinet.com. Please! No copyrighted stuff. Also no "mouse balls," dyslexic agnostics, Iraqi driver's ed, Administratium, strings in bar or bell-ringer jokes. -- Ed Carp, N7EKG erc(a)apple.com 510/659-9560 anon-0001(a)khijol.uucp If you want magic, let go of your armor. Magic is so much stronger than steel! -- Richard Bach, "The Bridge Across Forever"

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re: more deranged lunatic ravings ...
by Tiffany Lee Brown 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

The recent flood of rantmail between Perry Metzger, E. Carp, etc., started as an interesting and relevant argument but has degenerated to the point of annoyance. The former suggested calming down and writing some code - perhaps he could go off and do just that, rather than wasting his time (and ours) trying to keep folx from encouraging others to engage in personal investigation of an issue which concerns them. If you think writing code's the only thing to do - go do it. If you think getting people riled up about the situation is important - go do it. Yammering at each other ain't gonna make the world a safer and more private place. -magdalen

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Re: Definition of "Zero Knowledge" (fwd)
by frc%bwnmr4＠harvard.harvard.edu 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Forwarded message: > From frc Sun Sep 19 20:22:47 1993 > Subject: Re: Definition of "Zero Knowledge" > To: erc(a)apple.com > Date: Sun, 19 Sep 93 20:22:47 EDT > In-Reply-To: <m0oeGCo-00021LC@khijol>; from "Ed Carp" at Sep 18, 93 9:16 pm > > Thanks for the definition (but I knew that, anyway). Sorru I wasn't clear - > > what I was looking for was examples of how zero-knowledge proof techniques > > could make source code impenetrable. > > Source would be nice, too... ;) > Check out a product called C-Shroud by ??Gimpel Software... > I think it does this.. or at least tries.... > FRC I meant to send this across the list, and not just to erc. Here's it is for everyone else. FRC

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Re: Definition of "Zero Knowledge"
by doug＠netcom.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

bill(a)twwells.com (T. William Wells) said: >Got a good reference for ZPT? Something that the mathematically >inclined, who wants just the facts, all the facts, and none of >the BS that passes for explanations and which usually obscures >more than it clarifies? In the current context, the best reference that I know of is to the methodology of Goedel's Theorem rather than to ZPT; it has each of the properties that I mentioned except for the ZPT operations, which can be added in a conceptually straightforward way. The most readable in depth treatment of that that I know of is "Goedel's Proof" by Ernest Nagel and James R. Newman, c. 1958 and still in print as a cheap paperback. If someone has good ZPT references that would be interesting too; I've lost the stuff I used to have on that. Doug

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