December 2003 - cypherpunks-legacy

Re: PHONE PRIVACY: real-time billing with digital postage
by swc＠uc1.ucsu.edu 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

I am presently looking into leasing fiber plant to set up a secure net with some of the attributes Nick Szabo mentions. Without enhancements to his scheme, however, I do not see how my cuso tomers can be sure that I am not recording traffic routine g, even if I claim that I am not. Furthermore, what is to prevent third parties from taping my ping my trunks and decoding the signalling which is used to direct the route switching? ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Stuart W. Card, Consultant, Card & Associates -- Research & Development Box 153 RR 1 Newport Rd Utica NY 13502 315-735-1717 / FAX -8469 swc(a)uc1.ucsu.edu or cards(a)top.cis.syr.edu "Who is John Galt?"

1 0

Criminal GIF's "Offshore" Data Haven
by anonymous＠extropia.wimsey.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Charles Morgan said: Look around there everywhere In fcat those are not so bad L8r Charles Charles and anyone else who has examples of these "criminal GIF's" please send copies to a good home WhiteBeard 77308D <pool0(a)extropia.wimsey.com> As you might expect from "pool0", this is a pool address; all messages received at this address are remailed to a "pool" of subscribers, including WhiteBeard. Please encrypt your "criminal GIF's" with public key Type bits/keyID Date User ID pub 1024/77308D 1993/08/05 WhiteBeard 77308D <pool0(a)extropia.wimsey.com> -----BEGIN PGP PUBLIC KEY BLOCK----- Version: 2.3 mQCNAixg1V4AAAEEAK7+65Tb+IlceOkXbYr8KegFqJBsATfvHn0jWDhLomU1Bu9a N4QnUA7O7EA4klVjOkvFsizN+Ex94aAzSeEr2YEKA08wdCcDnOupTy5sGRcvJL3i e17y3/HS5zRq9bUrw/zVFWnF5XFaa0WXqEJF0mKNmIhQoUS0GWSPDqT/dzCNAAUT tC5XaGl0ZUJlYXJkIDc3MzA4RCAgPHBvb2wwQGV4dHJvcGlhLndpbXNleS5jb20+ =KKxu -----END PGP PUBLIC KEY BLOCK----- Note that the pool0 remailer does NOT attempt to conceal the identity of the SENDER. If you don't want your own identity attached to your message or file, send it through a remailer. Also, of course, you probably want to encrypt but NOT sign with PGP. WhiteBeard is also looking for the "politically incorrect" (and illegal outside the USA) program "Concentration Camp Commander". WhiteBeard will keep your "criminal GIF's" safely encrypted on diskettes. Should your own copies ever be lost or confiscated, just send WhiteBeard a call for help and he will send your GIF's (and any others he's collected you might want) to your anonymous remailer address. WhiteBeard already has a small collection of "interesting" GIF's dealing with beastiality and scatological domination. If you want a free sample, send WhiteBeard a request with an anonymous return address and pseudonymous public key. Please feel free to post this announcement to other mailing lists and newsgroups.

1 0

PHON PRIVACY
by Matthew J Miszewski 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Our favorite Corporate entity, McDonald's, actually attempted a play on Mr. Szabo's idea. Here in Wisconsin, a while back, they distributed 3 minutedsErase they distributed 3 minutedsErase Erase Erase Select Mail Erase Erase Erase Extract/Mail Extract/Mail Help Erase ______________________________________________________________________________ "This new technology (the printing press) threatened the Crown, which shuddered at the thought of widespread dissemination of works advocating religious heresy and political upheaval. The Crown's solution to the problem was a system of regulation designed to control this "dangerous" art." -From my Copyright Law Text (refrencing the Statute of Anne - the first Copyright Statute) (c)1993 ______________________/___________________________________mjmiski(a)macc.wisc.edu

1 0

oops
by Matthew J Miszewski 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Anyways. As i was saying.... McDonalds distributed 3 minute long distance cards that came with your favorite value meal. Completely anonymous when used from a payphone, and the same service as regular LD. --Matt ______________________________________________________________________________ "This new technology (the printing press) threatened the Crown, which shuddered at the thought of widespread dissemination of works advocating religious heresy and political upheaval. The Crown's solution to the problem was a system of regulation designed to control this "dangerous" art." -From my Copyright Law Text (refrencing the Statute of Anne - the first Copyright Statute) (c)1993 ______________________/___________________________________mjmiski(a)macc.wisc.edu

1 0

The rubber and the road
by ferguson＠icm1.icp.net 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Grady, If this is a silly question, then chastise me later -- but when do you actually appear in court? I noticed PRZ's statement dated 12 Oct. Does your appearance fall shortly? Cheers and Support.

1 0

PHONE PRIVACY
by Sandy 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ SANDY SANDFORT Reply to: ssandfort(a)attmail.com . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Punksters, Ron McCoy asked about the 1-900 number I posted some time ago. The number is 1-900-STOPPER. Though I originally mentioned STOPPER, I would recommend that the better solution is to use a pre-paid calling card. Several companies offer them, including AT&T (buy them at AT&T Phone Stores) and Western Union (buy them at authorized Western Union agents). They both charge you about sixty cents per minute for US domestic calls (more for overseas). They come in various denominations ($5, $10, $20, etc.) To use them, you dial a special 800 number. When you get a beep, you dial in the card's unique serial number. When you get a second dial tone, you dial the area code and phone number you wish to call. Depending upon the card you have, there will be some method for determining how much time/money you have left after each call. Since I have not yet found out whether or not the issuers retain *your* phone number (captured by ANI), or for how long, it would be prudent to use the cards at payphones for any highly sensitive communications. S a n d y >>>>>> Please send e-mail to: ssandfort(a)attmail.com <<<<<< ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

1 0

[META] [LIST] Let the market decide
by paul＠poboy.b17c.ingr.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

I write this in the hope that it'll finish off the list/newsgroup discussion and with the fear that it will make it worse. "Let the market decide." If you feel that a newsgroup is the right way to go, then start one. If it offers something valuable to current cypherpunks subscribers, they'll read it. Likewise with alternate mailing lists. If you want a crypto-politics list, start one. If it offers valuable material, people will subscribe. Do not presume to dictate to the folks like Eric and Tim who created, and have since nurtured, this list. Build a better mousetrap, and all that. -Paul -- Paul Robichaux, KD4JZG | "Change the world for a better tomorrow. But perobich(a)ingr.com | watch your ass today." - aaron(a)halcyon.com Intergraph Federal Systems | Be a cryptography user- ask me how.

1 0

Bank of the Internet
by Mike Ingle 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

"arthurc(a)crl.com" "Arthur Chandler" wrote: > It jarred me to see someone so blithely planning to enter into the world >of international finance from an essentially "outsider" frame of >reference. As impressed as I was by the range and depth of Eric's >understanding of the technical aspects of encryption, I have the feeling >that setting up such a revolutionary scheme -- which would threaten both >traditional banking enterprises and the governments that monitor and tax >them -- is bound to encounter opposition much more massive and >sophisticated than he indicated. > To be fair, he could only talk about the high points of his plans in >the context of the afternoon talk. But I kept having flashbacks to the1960s >and 70s, when counterculture groups laid intricate plans to overwhelm or >endrun "the system." > Put bluntly, any plans to enter international finance without a >substantial component aimed at lining up political and traditional >financial clout seems to me to be doomed to the dustbin of visionary >schemes. After the smoke clears, we are far more likely to see Chase >Manhattan with a platoon of hired cryptologists than EFF or Cypherpunks >wheeling and dealing on a global scale. The reason such "counterculture" plans didn't work is because they are hard to do. They are a pain. People may talk about them, but they aren't that anxious to actually "live underground." They are also hard to coordinate. It is easier to just get a job and live a normal life. Even with PGP, more people talk about it than use it on a regular basis. I've even been flamed for sending people PGP messages, even when those people promote their PGP keys in their .sigs! All we have to do is make it technically easy. We are tool makers. Make the tools and it will happen. As for opposition from governments and the banking establishment, governments are right now being held hostage by capital. If they don't do what capital wants, capital gets up and leaves. East Germany used the Berlin Wall to contain its capital. When the wall came down, the capital left. The forces against us may seem overwhelming, but we have one huge advantage. They are limited to a specific region, or at least to one country. International collaboration is difficult and slow for those who enforce the status quo. Data crosses borders with impunity, and short of cutting all the wires and turning a country into Albania, there isn't much the governments can do about it. --- MikeIngle(a)delphi.com

1 0

Virtual City (tm) and Virtual Capitalism (fwd)
by szabo＠netcom.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Arthur Chandler: > Any system of monetary exchange that would involve manipulating quotas, > or translating them into a kind of tradeable commodity would, I think, be > vigorously resisted by most MOO wizards. Great! One of the main strengths of Virtual City seems to be to that its gets rid of the fascist heirarchy of "wizards", the virtual equivalent of factory managers in the old Soviet Union. (Caveat: these are just my impressions of the V.C. project, I'm not personally involved in it). Also the quote is "information _wants to_ be free", not "should be". Alas, it is easy to bottle up information by restricting it to small cliques of wizards. On the other hand, many of the world-wiser wizards may be able to use their MUD building skills to become Virtual City tycoons. There are probably plenty of wizards pissed off by politically-dominated MUDs, where access to resources has increasingly become a function of sharing beers with the "god" and less a function of contribution to the MUD. Wizards who are better MUD builders than beer buddies have incentive to jump ship and carve themselves out nice niches in a free-enterprise MUD. I suspect Virtual City, and net commerce in general, will evolve to where people buy and sell some information as services, and exchange other information freely. The distinguishing feature between valuable services and free information will likely be that services will be hard to copy, the end result of obscure, logically deep computations, providing information unique to each customer order or dependent on hard-to-duplicate phyiscal hardware. Freely copyable information typically will be sellable only a few times, and even then the sale price will depend on it being hot/unique news, uniquely valuable to a specific customer or temporary situation, or conveniently located. Old news, educational material, etc. will be free, barring fascist patent/copyright enforcement, but the customers will often pay for more convenient methods of distribution (eg smart filter services). Content _per se_ will want to be free, so one will not be able to generate revenue simply based on popularity of content. Content generation will not pay and will not dominate the economy. A good example is the distinction between the freely copyable GNU and X-Windows, and the for-pay consultation, customization, porting, help desks, etc. that have sprung up around them. Most of the effort goes into the latter: since people like to make a living, most of the economic effort will go into services rather than the exchange of free information. As bandwidth becomes cheaper the free info exchange will expand, but the incentive for creation is limited to self-sacrificing efforts or side-effects of government or consulting businesses or corporate charity (eg GNU, X, PGP). I look forward to something like Virtual City providing a free-market alternative to the heirarchical control of information (crypto key authorities, Unix file permissions model, MUD Wizard model, ad nauseum); I do not see it replacing the GNU free software model. Nick Szabo szabo(a)netcom.com

1 0

Cypherpunks Cause
by DON_HENSON＠delphi.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

ferguson(a)icm1.icp.net writes: --> > >There is no cypherpunks cause. Neither is there a cypherpunks > >movement. Get these delusions out of your head. There is, however, > >cypherpunks software. > > > >I repeat, the cause and movement are in your own head. > > <-- > > If there is no cypherpunks cause or movement, please let me know What the hell are you talking about? <-- Well, I thought I was pretty clear in the first place so if you don't know what I am talking about, I guess I don't know either. Don Henson PGP key on server or on request

1 0