December 2003 - cypherpunks-legacy

Re: y2k/gary north delusions (fwd)
by Jim Choate 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Forwarded message: > Date: Fri, 04 Dec 1998 20:22:18 -0500 > From: Michal Hohensee <mah248(a)nyu.edu> > Subject: Re: y2k/gary north delusions > You cannot sustain a modern city without a working sewer system. > Remember what cities were like in the middle ages? I believe some > historians refer to them as "population sinks" for the surrounding > countryside. Not for a lack of wealth or commerce, but for a lack of > sanitation. Paris and London had populations of over a million each and didn't have a sewer system. It was traditional for people to throw their chamber pots out into the street along with the offal from the various animals. The reality is that the folks who support the various systems would have them no manual over-ride within 24 - 48 hours so the worst case scenario won't happen. Countries that aren't automated won't notice the difference and the city services that are won't be down more than a week. ____________________________________________________________________ Technology cannot make us other than what we are. James P. Hogan The Armadillo Group ,::////;::-. James Choate Austin, Tx /:'///// ``::>/|/ ravage(a)ssz.com www.ssz.com .', |||| `/( e\ 512-451-7087 -====~~mm-'`-```-mm --'- --------------------------------------------------------------------

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Re: y2k/gary north delusions (fwd)
by Jim Choate 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Forwarded message: > Subject: Re: y2k/gary north delusions > Date: Fri, 4 Dec 1998 17:40:59 -0600 (CST) > From: ichudov(a)algebra.com (Igor Chudov @ home) > Well... The answer is that there is much less washing needed for > survival than it is needed for day to day civilized American life. True, you don't have to water your grass and wash your car. > For instance, I change my shirts every day. If shit hits the fan, > you can wear a shirt for two weeks. Similar story is with other > clothes. You won't do that sort of stuff for long. A couple of months at best before you get skin infections and then it's down-hill from there. It's pretty much a bogus point though since none of the systems like power, water, and sewer won't be down more than a week at most. ____________________________________________________________________ Technology cannot make us other than what we are. James P. Hogan The Armadillo Group ,::////;::-. James Choate Austin, Tx /:'///// ``::>/|/ ravage(a)ssz.com www.ssz.com .', |||| `/( e\ 512-451-7087 -====~~mm-'`-```-mm --'- --------------------------------------------------------------------

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Re: y2k/gary north delusions (fwd)
by Jim Choate 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Forwarded message: > Subject: Re: y2k/gary north delusions (fwd) > Date: Fri, 4 Dec 1998 18:46:17 -0600 (CST) > From: ichudov(a)Algebra.Com (Igor Chudov @ home) > > Paris and London had populations of over a million each and didn't have a > > sewer system. It was traditional for people to throw their chamber pots out > > into the street along with the offal from the various animals. > > Guess why they had those devastating epidemics. True enough, but that sort of stuff takes more than a week or two. The various cities could go around setting up port-a-potties and latrines in parks with plastic liners for easy removal, etc. It isn't nearly the civilization shaking event some would make of it. ____________________________________________________________________ Technology cannot make us other than what we are. James P. Hogan The Armadillo Group ,::////;::-. James Choate Austin, Tx /:'///// ``::>/|/ ravage(a)ssz.com www.ssz.com .', |||| `/( e\ 512-451-7087 -====~~mm-'`-```-mm --'- --------------------------------------------------------------------

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.
by Anonymous 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

... > A few rules of thumb result from even cursory examination > of the likely environment: > ... > 5. Ultimately, the only way the remailers will provide > what might be described as Pretty Good Security will > be when we have software that maintains a regular > or random rate of messages to and from the remailer > cloud, a stream into which the meaningful messages > can be inserted with no visible change in traffic. > Until then, the best we can do is try to keep traffic > levels up, and to send and receive frequently enough > to frustrate end-to-end traffic analysis. Well, the existing remailer net doesn't make "Pretty Good" anonymity very feasible. I'd think something based on the general idea behind Crowds. (Furthermore, most remailer structures still can't erase some other security concerns -- 1: remailers acutally can be hacked or physically compromised 2: clients really can be screwed 3: etc. To help solve the first, you'd want a two-box setup doing remailing, with the security-critical stuff loaded on a box not directly connected to the Net with something 140-1ish to make tampering harder, a secure OS, etc. -- or, of course, you can scrap all that to get really big remailer count. To help solve the second problem, there needs to be a better web-of-trust setup -- that is, one which applies to code as well as keys. Those who wish to verify code get a .sig-verifying program from a trusted source then use a WoT to authenticate various facets of the program necessary for security. A solution to the third problem is expected RSN.) > > 6. Don't send anything that can have grave consequences. Remember the consequences to an adversary who uses its secret decoder ring, though: the more plausible it becomes that a certain source is being used for intelligence-gathering, the more likely it is that that source will promptly begin to run dry as the spied-upon realize that Something Got Broke. My advice, however, agrees with that of the other Anonymous. That is, unless you've really thought things out, think of an remailed message as merely .sigless, not anonymous. > > 7. Take names. Always take names. Some day... > > FUDBusterMonger > > It Ain't FUD til I SAY it's FUD!

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the shit hitting the fan
by Anonymous 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 02:48 PM 12/4/98 -0600, Igor Chudov @ home wrote: >Even flushing toilets is not necessary as anyone can shit outside. > >I am speaking out of personal experiences, living with water outages >while we were in the Russian countryside. It was no big deal, period. Moron. At a low population density you can do anything, burn wood, leaded gas, etc., no problem. LA has 1e7 people who shit about a kilo per day. Compute the volume of that after a week.

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PGP Disk
by Anonymous 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

>Has anyone had the chance to try out the new McAfee PGP disk? >It seems pretty straightforward, allowing for the creation of >encrypted "drives" using the CAST algorithm. Is anyone aware of >any security flaws with it? I'm sure somebody will check if they are bored some day. Where can we find the source code? If the source code isn't available, don't trust it. That's a good general rule.

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What was the quid pro quo for Wassenaar countries?
by John Gilmore 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

I spoke some hours ago with Tatu Ylonen in Finland. His company has confirmation from the Finnish government that the government agreed to a proposal to limit mass-market crypto exports to 56 bits. Perhaps he or someone else from SSH can post more details. So *something* really did happen at the Wassenaar meeting, but we don't know two important things: * What exactly did they agree to? In particular, is public domain -- as opposed to mass market -- crypto controlled? * And what did NSA offer, to convince many countries to directly contradict policies that they had arrived at during year-long public consultations with their own citizens? A carrot? A stick? Blackmail from wiretaps? Access to NSA's wiretap network in return for cooperation? What was the strong motivation for so many countries to go against their own economic and self-determination interests? It was pointed out to me that the Wassenaar Arrangement has no legal effect. Each country has to go back and amend its own local controls. However, I personally saw cases more than a year ago where both Japan and Belgium were restricting bona fide civilian crypto transactions "because Wassenaar requires us to" when in fact it didn't. This development will give these countries much more "cover" to implement draconian policies, under secret arm-twisting from the US. We will have to fight this one in the trenches, in each country. First step is to raise a hue and cry and put each government on the defensive (as they well ought to be). Then let's find out what "deal" they made with the devil. Finally let's see whether, as Perry says, civil rights and political processes work, and the will of the people will actually end up codified in the laws of each country. Or not. John PS: I particularly like Ambassador Aaron's characterization that this new development will help US industry, by censoring foreign crypto publishers in the same way the US government censors US publishers. A giant step forward for freedom and commerce everywhere, eh Mr. Aaron? What an incredibly talented liar, I mean diplomat, he is.

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Re: Vengeance Libertarianism
by Michael Motyka 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

My oh my, The alternative to outright revolution has historically been to pack up and ship out to whatever frontier was in vogue. Dangerous, difficult, but apparently compelling if the home situation sucked badly enough. Potentially very rewarding to the survivors. The historical fate of any frontier has been that as soon as it has become somewat hospitable the shitheads arrive with their carpet bags and make it over into the same fucking thing that everyone ran away from in the first place. The first sign of inFESTERation was often a church, followed by a town hall which filled up quickly enough and shortly thereafter hired a sheriff to enforce the town gun ban and who eventually needed more men... And so the cycle repeats with the virtual frontier we're in right now. It was just fine until "they" came along to "civilize" it. Unfortunately backs are to the wall and there is nowhere else to go because SPACE SUCKS MOOSE ALIENS DRY LIKE BUGS. Top that. they - esRb to civilize - to own, regulate, commercialize and tax esRb - evil, scumsucking, Reptilian bastards I could probably develop some sort of virtual space cowboy allegory here that would go on for (p)ages and involve the painful, bloody death of many an evil villian at the hand of a courageous hero and enough deviant sex ( whinny ) to keep the audience enthralled to the very end. The story could probably be continued until well after the traffic has subsided but what the hell, I like driving 5 mph, it's good for my car's engine, my patience and the bandwidth shortage. m

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Re: Streams, Voice, and Sensitive Dependence
by Michael Motyka 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

> http://www.starium.com > 14.4 modem, awsome sound quality, 2048 bit DH, 3DES. The web site is pretty sparse. No wonder I couldn't find them before - I was looking for "Starion" a while back. I'll call them next week - they're practically local. What's the approximate price? I have another question for you: I thought I was a real whiz kid a few years back when I figured out that by using an agreed upon startup key then using a "random" public/private key pair generated by the SW, two voice stations could exchange a "random" session key. With thumbscrews and the rack you could not get the session key. Even the dreaded rubber hose would fail. The startup key protected the PK. The ultimate security was as good as the PK portion. The conversation was practically pre-shredded. I was bummed when I discovered this had already been patented and was called EKE. Does the Starium phone accomplish this effect? Mike

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Re: y2k/gary north delusions (fwd)
by Jim Choate 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Forwarded message: > Subject: Re: y2k/gary north delusions (fwd) > Date: Fri, 4 Dec 1998 19:21:36 -0600 (CST) > From: ichudov(a)Algebra.Com (Igor Chudov @ home) > > True enough, but that sort of stuff takes more than a week or two. The > > various cities could go around setting up port-a-potties and latrines in > > parks with plastic liners for easy removal, etc. > > > > It isn't nearly the civilization shaking event some would make of it. > > Well, at least shitting is not going to be the hardest part of it. True enough. Power, water, police, fire, etc. will come back pretty quickly if anyone notices it was ever down. The really poor won't notice anything. The most effected would be the wealthy. There will be outbreaks in Compton and similar ilk but by no stretch of the imagination will it become a conflagration. That's the beauty of an armed populace. Even if the police don't respond it'll burn out as the front of rioters thin with increasing radius and the odds go down. I'd bet the delivery of foodstuffs to the store wouldn't slow down one bit. It's possible to run a combine without the GPS. The trucks are driven by people, they're loaded by fork-lifts. And you'll need to hunt long and hard for a commercial freezer with a clock in it. I've never seen a damn that didn't have manual gate controls so flood control and hydro-electric will come back pretty quickly. The actual switch control panel in power plants have manual over-rides everywhere. Ditto for electric power grids. Mass transportation like trains and aircraft will be effected. Individual transportation like cars won't stop. Inconvenient and expensive, you betcha. The decline of western civilization, not hardly. ____________________________________________________________________ Technology cannot make us other than what we are. James P. Hogan The Armadillo Group ,::////;::-. James Choate Austin, Tx /:'///// ``::>/|/ ravage(a)ssz.com www.ssz.com .', |||| `/( e\ 512-451-7087 -====~~mm-'`-```-mm --'- --------------------------------------------------------------------

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the shit hitting the fan (fwd)
by Jim Choate 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Forwarded message: > Date: Sat, 5 Dec 1998 06:00:13 +0100 > From: Anonymous <nobody(a)replay.com> > Subject: the shit hitting the fan > At 02:48 PM 12/4/98 -0600, Igor Chudov @ home wrote: > >Even flushing toilets is not necessary as anyone can shit outside. > > > >I am speaking out of personal experiences, living with water outages > >while we were in the Russian countryside. It was no big deal, period. > > Moron. At a low population density you can do anything, burn wood, leaded > gas, > etc., no problem. > > LA has 1e7 people who shit about a kilo per day. Compute the volume of that > after a week. It's not the raw volume that's critical but rather the percentage of the average personal space per inhabitant versus how much to store a weeks worth. For the average person storing a weeks worth of solid waste in a platic bag with bleach, lye, or similar material is reasonable. I've gone on long duration camping trips of about a weeks length and the storing and portage costs are not excessive (having a boat or horse helps move it around). ____________________________________________________________________ Technology cannot make us other than what we are. James P. Hogan The Armadillo Group ,::////;::-. James Choate Austin, Tx /:'///// ``::>/|/ ravage(a)ssz.com www.ssz.com .', |||| `/( e\ 512-451-7087 -====~~mm-'`-```-mm --'- --------------------------------------------------------------------

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pgp disk
by Anonymous 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 03:05 AM 12/5/98 +0100, Anonymous wrote about some new product: >If the source code isn't available, don't trust it. That's a good general >rule. Where is the source for pgpfone?

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RE: What was the quid pro quo for Wassenaar countries?
by Phillip Hallam-Baker 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

John Gilmore may be right, but remember folks that in Europe we have this thing the Greeks invented called democracy. One of the ideas of democracy is that decisions are not made in secret closed meetings. The interpretation of the US ambassador appears to be based on the assumption that the governmental proceedures of democratic countries are like those of his home country. In fact European governments cannot make law simply by telling the national police force to arrest folk who engage in particular behaviour. The system of checks and balances may be described in the US constitution but it is entrenched in the European polity. The UK does not have a national police force precisely to stop Hooverism. Even directives of the European Commission do not have legal force until the national parliaments enact legislation to implement the directive. One should also remember that the government of the Netherlands has agreed to control the sale and use of narcotics. If their efforts to control cryptography are as dilligent we have nothing to worry about. In addition under the single European act the entire country of Europe is one export zone for crypto control purposes. I fail to see that stopping Brits from exporting crypto to the US changes the equation a great deal. There once was an English king called Canute who attempted to demonstrate to his courtiers that he was fallible and could not order the tide to turn. Perhaps Clinton's courtiers need to learn that they suffer the same limmitation. Phill

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Fwd: Attn. INTERNATIONAL FIREARM COMMUNITY !
by Jean-Francois Avon 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

==================BEGIN FORWARDED MESSAGE================== >Date: Fri, 04 Dec 1998 22:35:56 -0800 >From: Donna Ferolie <donnaferolie(a)sympatico.ca> >Subject: Attn. INTERNATIONAL FIREARM COMMUNITY ! This message has gone out to firearm owners all over the world as well on the cdn-firearm chat and cdn-firearm digest. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ATTENTION INTERNATIONAL FIREARM COMMUNITY This message is specifically dedicated to sport shooters from around the globe. I would like to acknowledge our friends from the U.K, South Africa, Brazil, New Zealand, Australia and the good old U.S.A. I have just sent out idividual messages to all of these countries and some others including Germany, Belgium, Austria, Boliva, Argentina, Aruba Slovakia and Barbados. If your country has not been listed please contact me directly. I am trying to develop a list of countries that are logging onto our open firearms chat line. It is my goal to have firearm owners from every country monitoring and sharing their experiences. Please encourage fellow shooters in your country to come on line and take advantage of this open forum. I fully realize that the primary focus of the Canadian Firearms Chat Line is aimed at Canadian gun laws; however, there is a great deal of pertinent international information that could be shared in this medium and we will all be the beneficiaries if we willfully share our ideas and experiences. I have another strategy up my sleeve regarding rallying the international firearm community prior to the final outcome of the United Nations firearms workshops in the year 2000; therefore it is paramount that we maintain frequent global communications. I will be exploring some of my ideas with the NRA and the Sporting Shooters Association of Australia in the new year and floating some draft strategies for open discussion. Moreover, I fully intend on attending most of the United Nations firearm workshops therefore having everyone connected to one open forum would assist me in getting this information out all of you in a quick concise manner. I've had a few myopic individuals ask me why I should be so concerned about gun control in other countries ? As far as I am concerned we should all be concerned -VERY concerned ! When one of our sister countries falls we should all feel their pain and learn something valuable, because we may be next. We cannot for a minute forget about the draconian laws rammed down the throats of other Commonwealth countries in particular or any free-thinking society. Can we really delude ourselves into thinking that it couldn't happen here- don t kid yourself, as I write, the erosion of our rights is going down the same path as Australians are treading, faster than we care to admit, and we all should instinctively know it? How would Canadians like to have all of their semis and pump shotguns and rifles declared illegal and confiscated overnight by a communist-leaning, bleeding heart liberal government- think about it !! It is important for Canadians to realize that countries all over the world feel no different that we do. They feel just as vulnerable and thus are seeking guidance and support. We are in an excellent position to offer assistance to each other via this open forum. I truly believe we can learn from each others mistakes and triumphs. Perhaps if we can tap into this universal intelligence on a continuous basis we could overtake the mighty Goliath. If time permits I would like to post the names of all anti-firearm NGO's and their meetings which are going on simultaneously all over the world as we speak. I think it is high time that we banded together as one solid global unit in an effort to effectively launch a counter attack against those that take glee in the gradual erosion of our civil rights and liberties. A frequent complaint about this type of forum is the problem of receiving an excessive number of messages, but I believe the rewards associated with this hassle far out weigh the inconvenience. I care very much that our friends in South Africa are now subject to new guns laws. I am sickened by what has transpired in Australia and the U.K. I want the world to know how crime has escalated in Brazil and yet they live under the most stringent gun control laws. As a point of interest the " boys from Brazil " will be preparing a written paper outlining this very fact which I will present on their behalf to the anti-gun Brazilian delegation at the next U.N workshop in Vienna in the latter part of Jan/99. In conclusion, if you are interested in banding together as one strong universal voice, then get your friends connected to this open chat /and or digest. Let us not lose focus of our own battle at home, but let us not turn a blind eye to our global neighbours struggles. I understand that English is a problem for some of you, but we are understanding and we willing to work through any language barriers. So please do NOT feel uncomfortable to communicate with us - we d love to hear what has transpired in your country ! Remember, repeated blows to the lower extremities will eventually cause the giant to fall ! You can subscribe to the Canadian Firearms Digest and the Firearms Chat line by 1) Subcribe to the cdn chat & cdn digest ( separately ) 2) e-mailing the following address for both chat & digest: <majordomo(a)sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca> 3) Leave the subject section blank 4) Write in the body of the message subscribe cdn-firearm chat end subcribe cdn-firearm digest end Remember when you are subscribing to the chat is separate from the digest. Please feel free to contact me anytime at the following: donnaferolie(a)sympatico.ca Donna Ferolie Keep up the fight! Donna Ferolie Canada ===================END FORWARDED MESSAGE===================

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Re: Netsurfer Digest: Vol. 04, #35
by Robert Hettinga 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 4:14 AM -0500 on 12/5/98, editor-bounce(a)netsurf.com wrote: > Secret Netsurfing... for a Fee > > You meet such nice people in this job. People like Cyber Promotions, who >believe the way to a great Web site is not content, originality, or >design, but an "aggressive marketing campaign every week" - it sells spam. >For a fee, Cyber Promotions will send out up to 50,000 messages at a time >through untraceable remailers and silent servers. This delightful >organization also bring us - as expected, for a fee - Ultimate Anonymity, >under the guise of the old-style anonymity sites which campaigned to the >death against censorship and government interference (remember Penet?). >Anyone with $14 can use this site to post anonymously in newsgroups, send >unlimited quantities of untraceable e-mail (with attachments), and >generally pollute the bandwidth. There may be genuine privacy campaigners >using the site, if they can squeeze in between all the amateur porn >merchants.... <http://www.ultimate-anonymity.com/> >http://www.ultimate-anonymity.com/ ----------------- Robert A. Hettinga <mailto: rah(a)philodox.com> Philodox Financial Technology Evangelism <http://www.philodox.com/> 44 Farquhar Street, Boston, MA 02131 USA "... however it may deserve respect for its usefulness and antiquity, [predicting the end of the world] has not been found agreeable to experience." -- Edward Gibbon, 'Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire'

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Greg Taylor: preliminary Wassenaar details from three countries
by John Gilmore 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

[Greg graciously allowed me to repost this. --gnu] Date: Sat, 05 Dec 1998 15:22:53 +1000 From: Greg Taylor <gtaylor(a)efa.org.au> Hi John, You wrote: >I have not found a single confirmation of the Aarons statement that >the 33 Wassenaar countries have agreed to change the exemption for >mass market crypto software. (The NY Times and Reuters stories both >quote Ambassador Aarons.) I think Aarons must have an advanced degree in spin doctoring, but nevertheless information about new restrictions on mass market software has also come from 3 independent well-placed sources. >From the UK crypto list: ================= Just talked to Dirk Weicke, Senior Adviser to Wassenaar Organisation. Tel:+43 1 516360) No written details will be issued until next week, but gist is: *) No alteration to question of whether Wassenaar covers intangible exports. Up to signatory states to interpret and legislate. *) mass-market software, symmetric key length limited to 56-bits *) software generally available, but with other restrictive tests on end-user re-configurability, symmetric key length limited to 64-bits *) Assymetric key lengths (not sure how relates to above) limited to: RSA & Digital logarithm: 512 bits Elliptic curve : 112 bits ===================== And here's a view from David Jones (EFC), from the GILC list: ===================== - There is "some relaxation" for restrictions on symmetric methods using key lengths of 56 bits or less. Stronger crypto would require an export license. - There is no restriction on mass-market software using symmetric methods and a key length of 64 bits or less. Stronger mass-market crypto would require an export license. - "Public Domain Software is not restricted" [If this is really true, this is still an important loophole.] - There is not yet any clear information about the status of "intangible goods", like crypto software on a web site, or sent by email, as opposed to "tangible goods", like software on a floppy disk or CD-ROM. - The restrictions on mass-market software greater than 64 bits is "for public safety" reasons and will last for 2 years, after which it will be reviewed. ============================= Yesterday I got the Australian government interpretation from Robbie Costmeyer in Canberra. Costmeyer is the Defence bureaucrat responsible for approving export licenses. I was told that Wassenaar had now agreed that the General Software Note waiver no longer applied to Category 5/2 items (i.e. crypto) on the controlled goods list. It has always been the view of Defence Signals Directorate here that it was an oversight that crypto software came under the GSN. That reason was used to justify Australia's going one step further than required under the original Wassenaar Arrangement and disallowing exemptions to the export licensing rules. A few other countries do the same (USA, New Zealand, France, Russia). Canberra thus views the latest change as the correction of an oversight. Clearly there is a difference of interpretation here regarding public domain software (compare the Canadian view above). This question needs further investigation. The Australian view is that the latest Wassenaar changes are a relaxation of the previous rules. And they're right, when compared with the previous rules applying here. Australia will now move to amend the Defence Strategic Goods List (DSGL) to allow exemptions for small key lengths as decribed above. For other countries, the effects remain to be seen. We'll just have to wait for more information to filter out. Greg

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17 Dec '03

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ZDNet and ZDTV Forums Update
by ZDNet Announce 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ This is the second message from ZD to all the members of our message boards. It contains information and tips about a coming transition to new software. You will receive just one or two more of these messages in the coming week. ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ When you go to the ZDNet or ZDTV forums on Tuesday, Dec. 8, you will find the new Deja News software in place. You will see some differences in the way the message boards operate, so you may need to experiment a little. If you are very familiar with our current forum features, it will take some time to become comfortable with the new system. We apologize for the inconvenience this causes and are trying to make the switch as painless as possible. We'll have dozens of sysops online answering your questions every day. We also will update the on-line help files frequently to highlight key differences between the current software, called Podium, and the new version. Below are some advance hints for everyone making the switch to Deja News. You can try these features out in now our Test Forum at http://f5.dejanews.com/frames/test.html ** Messages that you have not yet read appear in bold. ** That's how Deja News tells you which posts are new since you last visited. Once you open and read a message, the bolding goes away. You have the option to Mark Thread As Read, and an entire set of messages will lose their boldness. In addition, you can Mark All As Read, and every message in that forum will become un-bold. ** When you leave a forum and come back later, messages that you read previously are not displayed. ** You can see these already-read messages by clicking the Show All button. Here's the tricky part: If you read all the messages in a thread and then someone adds another, the entire thread will be displayed and most messages will not be bold. Just the new message that you have not yet read will appear with bolded text. (In our current message board software, messages that you had already read remain hidden when a new message is added.) ** On Tuesday, some messages that you have read will be marked as unread. ** We will migrate all the messages currently in Podium over to the new Deja News software. However, we cannot keep track of which messages every user has read. As a result, all messages will be marked initially as unread. You can easily take care of this by doing one of two things: 1) Use the Mark All As Read found at the top of the new message board. This approach is fastest, but it might make you overlook some messages you really do want to read. 2) Use the Mark Thread As Read text link found at the beginning of each thread. This approach is a more selective way to get up-to-date, but it takes a bit more time. ** You can Expand or Collapse the entire thread list. ** The thread list shows all the individual "conversations" happening in the message board. The default setting shows you just the starting topic in each thread. If you want to see a detailed list of all the replies to that initial message, just click the Expand button. To shrink your threads list again, click the Collapse button. Collapse and Expand are basically toggle buttons. Show All and Show Unread are also toggle buttons, and they oper- ated independently of the Collapse and Expand controls. ** Your browser's reload button works in the forums. ** In Podium, when you hit reload in your browser, your forum display settings would disappear. In the upcoming Deja News software, your settings are preserved. So go ahead and hit reload to see if new messages have been added while you are online -- it works! ** Give Search a try. ** The Deja News fast search capability will help you track down messages easily. You can look across all the forums or in just one, for any text in a message. If you choose Mark All As Read but want to locate an earlier message, use the Search function. Thanks for taking the time to read this note. I hope these tips give you some insight into the new software and make the switch smoother. We're adding user-suggested info to our help file with the launch of the new forums next week, so keep those comments and ideas coming! We look forward to seeing you in the new forums, and we are glad to have you as a part of the ZD Community. Wendy Frankwich ZD Community Central http://chkpt.zdnet.com/chkpt/zdn11204/www.zdnet.com http://chkpt.zdnet.com/chkpt/zdn11204/www.zdtv.com _______________________________________________________________________ To be removed from this list, simply reply to this message with "unsubscribe" as your subject.

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[Fwd: y2k/gary north delusions]
by Soren 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

To: Igor Chudov <ichudov(a)algebra.com> Subject: Re: y2k/gary north delusions From: Soren <sorens(a)workmail.com> Date: Sat, 05 Dec 1998 08:29:23 -0500 References: <199812042341.RAA18742(a)manifold.algebra.com> Igor Chudov @ home wrote: > > > Well... The answer is that there is much less washing needed for > survival than it is needed for day to day civilized American life. > > For instance, I change my shirts every day. If shit hits the fan, > you can wear a shirt for two weeks. Similar story is with other > clothes. This is a good one. What about the other half of American life (the uncivilized?). You know, the americans who live in those old refrigerator cartons? The ones that nobody sees? I think they get more than 2 weeks out of their shirts. The sad fact is that city brats haven't got the faintest idea what survival is all about (you mean I have to *walk* to the supermarket?). It was in the 1890's when Queen Victoria issued an edict that forced all the english to 'bathe at least once a year'. Sit back and enjoy the carnival.

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Re: What was the quid pro quo for Wassenaar countries?
by HyperReal-Anon 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

"Phillip Hallam-Baker" <hallam(a)ai.mit.edu> writes John Gilmore may be right, but remember folks that in Europe we have this thing the Greeks invented called democracy. One of the ideas of democracy is that decisions are not made in secret closed meetings. Yes, and people democratically demand government enforcement of the majority will, something made more difficult if the subjects have strong cryptography. As Donn Parker observed several years ago, strong cryptography is inconsistent with democracy. (Published in Scientific American --- reference on request.) John Gilmore <gnu(a)toad.com> writes Some countries actually seem to care what their citizens think about their crypto laws, unlike the shining example of democracy, the USSA. And when we educate the citizens, they tend to make the right choices. Let's keep trying. But don't educate them too much, or they will understand that cryptography can set people free, and if people were free there would be no political government, and if there were no political government their social security checks would stop coming, along with all their other government ``benefits''.

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a strategy
by bill payne 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

I just read the most recent AFTER MONTHS of nothing happening. http://jya.com/a6e.htm Love it. Can you possibly get suspected terrorists on your landlord's case?

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Frequent Asked Questions Re: $9.99 to build your own
by promo124＠hotmail.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

(FAQ) Frequent Asked Questions --CABLE TV DESCRAMBLER (do not hit the reply button, this message is generated automatically for those interested in the product. You'll receive this message only once) Hello!!! =) "Thank you for requesting more information about the Cable Television Descrambler. I've been asked so many good questions that I left unanswered in my first letter. For that reason, I have put together this Question & Answer letter. I apologize in advance for not being able to answer each of your questions personally. The response has been overwhelming. " Q: Will the descrambler on Fiber, TCI, Jarrod and satellite systems? A: The answer is YES. In respect to satellite, you just get MORE stuff! Q: Do I need a converter box? A: This plan works with or without a converter box. Specific instructions are included in my plans for each! Q: Where can I find the 75pf-100pf variable capacitor, Radio Shack doesnt have it? A: Many Radio Shacks do have it. However, you have two other options. 1st call a radio speciality supply store in your area that is listed in the yellow pages. 2nd you can order the capacitor from me. If needed I will mail you as many as you need for the price (s) below. Im not trying to make a profit out of it, just want to help you. Ill wrap it carefully and send it to you only if you send me a self addressed #10 size padded envelope, with 64c postage affixed. 1-10 75pf - 100pf variable capacitor $12.99 ea. 20-Up ................ $ 10 ea. Q: Can the cable company detect that I have the box? A: No, the signal descrambles right at the box and does not move back through the line. Q: Do I have to alter my existing cable system, television or VCR? A: The answer is no. Q: Does this work with my remote control? A: The answer is no. It's a manual kind of thing... but very easy. Have your spouse or significant other get off the couch to do the deed! Q: Can you email me the plans? A: No, the plans come with an easy to follow picture guide. Q: Does this work everywhere across the country? A: I have friends in four states and one in England and Brasil that use the same parts and the same plans and they are all successful. Q: Is this deal guaranteed? A: Yes, if you are unhappy for any reason I will refund your money. Q: Is this a rip off or a scam? A: No, if it were Id charge $50.00 or more for the plans. Be sure I not going to damn myself to hell by ripping you off for a measly $9.99 or so. Q: When I order, when will I get my stuff? A: I mail out all orders within 24 hours of receiving it... IF YOU SUPPLY A SELF ADDRESSED, STAMPED RETURN ENVELOPE WITH 55 CENTS POSTAGE AFFIXED. Q: Again, How much does it cost to get the instructions plans and the easy to follow diagrams? A:To order a set of the instructions send $9.99 by cash, check or money order payable to: RMS Enterprises Send to: 50 Lexington Ave, Suite 209 / New York City, NY 10010. Q: Can you give me a list of the parts again? A: Yes. 1 - Radio Shack mini box (part #270-235) 1 - Œ watt resistor 2.2K - 2.4K ohm (part #271-1325) 1- 75pf-100pf variable capacitor (special order) 2 - F61a chassis-type connectors (part #278-212) 12" no. 12 solid copper wire 12" RG59 coaxial cable Q: I lost your address, could you give it to me again. A: 50 Lexington Ave, Suite 209 / New York City, NY 10010 USA Q: How can I pay for this? A: Check, Money Order or Cash. Sorry, no credit cards accepted. I look forward to your order. Raul Mendez Enterprises (RMS Enterprises) Kindest Personal Regards, Raul Mendez

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..
by Anonymous 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

> > (Furthermore, most remailer structures still can't erase some other security > > concerns -- > > 1: remailers acutally can be hacked or physically compromised > > 2: clients really can be screwed > > 3: etc. > > > > To help solve the first, you'd want a two-box setup doing remailing, with the > > security-critical stuff loaded on a box not directly connected to the Net with > > something 140-1ish to make tampering harder, a secure OS, etc. -- or, of > > course, you can scrap all that to get really big remailer count. > > As long as you do not see the box and do not control its manufacture, > I see no reason why you should have ny more trust in it. Well, you shouldn't have complete trust -- a tamper-resistant net could be compromised, too -- but there's a good reason to have more trust in it than in the existing one. More on that after a parenthetical remark. (This brings up the "hardware web-of-trust" issue; you can set up such a web with trusted spot-checkers and statistical/cryptographic means of assuring the user that the box works as advertised, if your threat model demands it. There's more about it in the "Beyond Class (A1)" section of the Orange Book, although the section's use to Cypherpunk types is limited because it's written without any thought to, say, doing things cheaply or having a decentralized setup.) The tamper-resistance simply means that if the mailer was set up secure, it's not going to become compromised. Instead of having to trust that one of the remailer operators is currently honest and has always done all the necessary homework to ensure the system was safe, you have to trust that this entity was honest and diligent when the remailer was set up (unless, of course, you think the tamper-resistance was circumvented); if the operator is bribed after the remailer's set up and the public key is published, there's no way to suddenly and invisibly make messages traceable, as there is in a "normal" Mixmaster remailer. (This is because, given the normal assumptions about crypto strength, it takes the remailer's private key to process a Mixmaster-like packet and that key is generated by and stays within the tamper-resistant box) My predictions about the biggest attacks on a tamper-resistant remailer net: 1: traffic analysis. Until the net structure is overhauled, this will always be possible. 2: propagation and exploitation of faulty server software. Related to the whole web-of-trust issue. 3: direct attacks on specific clients. Again, no web of trust. 4: creation of bad remailers and attempts to shut down good ones. More messages could be traced in a world with 6 good and 47 bad remailers than in one with 9 good and 3 bad. 5: direct attacks on new remailers 6: attempts to make an operator feign a catastrophe and set up a new, compromised remailer. Users, however, would know that the new key not signed by an old one means that they must now trust that the remailer was not compromised before the publication of the new key. 7: attacks on tamper resistance ... n: attacks on crypto n+1: etc.

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pgp disk
by HyperReal-Anon 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

>At 03:05 AM 12/5/98 +0100, Anonymous wrote about some new product: >>If the source code isn't available, don't trust it. That's a good general >>rule. > > >Where is the source for pgpfone? Good question. That's why I wouldn't use it either. (I haven't had reason to use it, so 'll take Anonymous's word that source isn't available.) If people want to release software like this, they need a better argument for its security than "Trust us, it's secure." Considering that there is no net loss when developers of such a product release source code so that people can look it over and compile it themselves, I don't have any reason to trust such software. Aren't McAfee and PGP Inc. members of KRAP and promoting Big Brother Inside? I've lost track.

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No Subject
by Anonymous 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Sorry for all the questions but I've been away from crypto for a while and I'm looking for the best encryption program for exchanging email between Unix and Windows folks. I hope these questions are appropriate here. What do people generally think about S/MIME ? Is it well designed (strong and extendable) ? Is it convenient because its available in the popular email clients ? Is the most annoying thing about it that you have to pay for the keys ? Is there a way to self-sign keys ? SSLeay ? Are most people still using PGP ? If IDEA and MD5 (and PGP2.6.2) are not strong enough anymore, what are the Unix folks using ? Does the source for PGP5/6 compile to any target besides Windoze ? Thanks

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(fwd) Markus Kuhn on eternity
by Adam Back 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Markus Kuhn (on ukcrypto) discussing his PhD project: the design of an eternity file system with a distributed administration function system controlled via a cryptographically enforced digital constitution. Comments to follow. Adam ====================================================================== To: ukcrypto(a)maillist.ox.ac.uk Subject: Re: intangible definitions are hard to pin down Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1998 16:28:21 +0000 From: Markus Kuhn <Markus.Kuhn(a)cl.cam.ac.uk> Ben Laurie wrote on 1998-11-19 12:22 UTC: > Ross Anderson wrote: > > It will get worse. One of my students is developing a file system that > > can be spread over a WAN, so that for example you can force all file > > modifications in directory foo to be backed up automatially using a > > kind of RCS at a server in America. Useful stuff - real businesses are > > much more interested in backup and disaster recovery than they are in > > crypto (and spend a couple of orders of magnitude more money). But how > > does this sort of system interact with export control? > > Cool - is this going to be open source? Of course. > Presumably, even though, as you > say, businesses are less interested in crypto, it will, nevertheless, > use crypto for data protection and user authentication? Of course. The main research aspect of this project is the joint administration of such distributed archives. For spam protection, you still need people who decide, which files are allowed on the distributed server infrastructure, and which are not. This administration is so far the weak link in the Eternity Service concept, because whoever decides that something is not spam takes over some responsibility for the content, and is therefore subject to legal power of national powers. The distributed administration in my system will be controlled via a sort of cryptographically enforced digital constitution (written in a tiny special purpose functional programming language) that determines administrative rights in a freely configurable way for a distributed server architecture (allowing elections, votes, vetoes, impeachment, updates to the constitution, etc.). This way, no single person will be responsible for the maintenance of such international software repositories, but a (usually international) group of democratically controlled volunteers does this. This way, US people can easily contribute to the administration of such distributed archives without having to share any legal responsibility for the fact that the archive also contains export controlled software, because the majority of administrators and not some single citizen alone has decided which files are allowed to use server space. The goal of this project is of course not primarily to by-pass export controls. It will hopefully advance the state-of-the-art of how we use the Internet to distribute information to a point where classical export control laws and national control of Internet content in general are led completely ad absurdum, without enabling at the same time the wide distribution and robust long-term storage of commonly considered despicable material such as child pornography, instructions for building weapons of mass destruction, or unwanted commercial advertising. In fact, by providing easy to configure governmental mechanisms comparable to those national governments are based on for software repositories, we distribute the responsibility in a cryptographically enforced way over the thousands or millions of users of such archives, effectively bypassing any control of national governments, without the negative aspects of complete anarchy (spam). To avoid misunderstandings: the ultimate idea is not to just by-pass national laws, but to offer a productive and democratic alternative technical means for controlling online resources, because the classical options of either national legislation and complete anarchy both have serious problems. Markus (Ross' student, who tries to get a PhD for developing a theoretical foundation and practical implementation of global-scale jointly administrated file spaces) -- Markus G. Kuhn, Computer Laboratory, University of Cambridge, UK Email: mkuhn at acm.org, WWW: <http://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/~mgk25/>

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Wei Dei's "b-money" protocol
by Adam Back 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Wei Dei recently announced (on cypherpunks) his "b-money, a new protocol for monetary exchange and contract enforcement for pseudonyms". Below is the text of his proposal. Comments to follow. Adam ====================================================================== http://www.eskimo.com/~weidai/bmoney.txt ====================================================================== I am fascinated by Tim May's crypto-anarchy. Unlike the communities traditionally associated with the word "anarchy", in a crypto-anarchy the government is not temporarily destroyed but permanently forbidden and permanently unnecessary. It's a community where the threat of violence is impotent because violence is impossible, and violence is impossible because its participants cannot be linked to their true names or physical locations. Until now it's not clear, even theoretically, how such a community could operate. A community is defined by the cooperation of its participants, and efficient cooperation requires a medium of exchange (money) and a way to enforce contracts. Traditionally these services have been provided by the government or government sponsored institutions and only to legal entities. In this article I describe a protocol by which these services can be provided to and by untraceable entities. I will actually describe two protocols. The first one is impractical, because it makes heavy use of a synchronous and unjammable anonymous broadcast channel. However it will motivate the second, more practical protocol. In both cases I will assume the existence of an untraceable network, where senders and receivers are identified only by digital pseudonyms (i.e. public keys) and every messages is signed by its sender and encrypted to its receiver. In the first protocol, every participant maintains a (seperate) database of how much money belongs to each pseudonym. These accounts collectively define the ownership of money, and how these accounts are updated is the subject of this protocol. 1. The creation of money. Anyone can create money by broadcasting the solution to a previously unsolved computational problem. The only conditions are that it must be easy to determine how much computing effort it took to solve the problem and the solution must otherwise have no value, either practical or intellectual. The number of monetary units created is equal to the cost of the computing effort in terms of a standard basket of commodities. For example if a problem takes 100 hours to solve on the computer that solves it most economically, and it takes 3 standard baskets to purchase 100 hours of computing time on that computer on the open market, then upon the broadcast of the solution to that problem everyone credits the broadcaster's account by 3 units. 2. The transfer of money. If Alice (owner of pseudonym K_A) wishes to transfer X units of money to Bob (owner of pseudonym K_B), she broadcasts the message "I give X units of money to K_B" signed by K_A. Upon the broadcast of this message, everyone debits K_A's account by X units and credits K_B's account by X units, unless this would create a negative balance in K_A's account in which case the message is ignored. 3. The effecting of contracts. A valid contract must include a maximum reparation in case of default for each participant party to it. It should also include a party who will perform arbitration should there be a dispute. All parties to a contract including the arbitrator must broadcast their signatures of it before it becomes effective. Upon the broadcast of the contract and all signatures, every participant debits the account of each party by the amount of his maximum reparation and credits a special account identified by a secure hash of the contract by the sum the maximum reparations. The contract becomes effective if the debits succeed for every party without producing a negative balance, otherwise the contract is ignored and the accounts are rolled back. A sample contract might look like this: K_A agrees to send K_B the solution to problem P before 0:0:0 1/1/2000. K_B agrees to pay K_A 100 MU (monetary units) before 0:0:0 1/1/2000. K_C agrees to perform arbitration in case of dispute. K_A agrees to pay a maximum of 1000 MU in case of default. K_B agrees to pay a maximum of 200 MU in case of default. K_C agrees to pay a maximum of 500 MU in case of default. 4. The conclusion of contracts. If a contract concludes without dispute, each party broadcasts a signed message "The contract with SHA-1 hash H concludes without reparations." or possibly "The contract with SHA-1 hash H concludes with the following reparations: ..." Upon the broadcast of all signatures, every participant credits the account of each party by the amount of his maximum reparation, removes the contract account, then credits or debits the account of each party according to the reparation schedule if there is one. 5. The enforcement of contracts. If the parties to a contract cannot agree on an appropriate conclusion even with the help of the arbitrator, each party broadcasts a suggested reparation/fine schedule and any arguments or evidence in his favor. Each participant makes a determination as to the actual reparations and/or fines, and modifies his accounts accordingly. In the second protocol, the accounts of who has how much money are kept by a subset of the participants (called servers from now on) instead of everyone. These servers are linked by a Usenet-style broadcast channel. The format of transaction messages broadcasted on this channel remain the same as in the first protocol, but the affected participants of each transaction should verify that the message has been received and successfully processed by a randomly selected subset of the servers. Since the servers must be trusted to a degree, some mechanism is needed to keep them honest. Each server is required to deposit a certain amount of money in a special account to be used as potential fines or rewards for proof of misconduct. Also, each server must periodically publish and commit to its current money creation and money ownership databases. Each participant should verify that his own account balances are correct and that the sum of the account balances is not greater than the total amount of money created. This prevents the servers, even in total collusion, from permanently and costlessly expanding the money supply. New servers can also use the published databases to synchronize with existing servers. The protocol proposed in this article allows untraceable pseudonymous entities to cooperate with each other more efficiently, by providing them with a medium of exchange and a method of enforcing contracts. The protocol can probably be made more efficient and secure, but I hope this is a step toward making crypto-anarchy a practical as well as theoretical possibility. ======================================================================

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RE: What was the quid pro quo for Wassenaar countries?
by Vivek Vaidya 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

>John Gilmore may be right, but remember folks that in Europe we have >this thing the Greeks invented called democracy. One of the ideas of >democracy is that decisions are not made in secret closed meetings. Would you really call the EU protocols a democracy? rule by the unelected technocrats? And Europes history of not making decisions in secret closed meetings is hardly commendable. Excepting perhaps the swiss. >The interpretation of the US ambassador appears to be based on the >assumption that the governmental proceedures of democratic countries >are like those of his home country. In fact European governments >cannot make law simply by telling the national police force to >arrest folk who engage in particular behaviour. Now my understanding of european law is, of course, limited. But in France wasn't there that case of some rapper been arrested for insulting the police? And in Germany you can strip the constitutional rights of citizens who engage in treasonous behaviour ( could this include cryptography? if connected with neo-nazis almost certainly right? ) >The system of checks and balances may be described in the US >constitution but it is entrenched in the European polity. The UK >does not have a national police force precisely to stop Hooverism. > >Even directives of the European Commission do not have legal force >until the national parliaments enact legislation to implement the >directive. What about those airline accords where the EU took its member states to court over cabotage agreements. I'm sure there are ways to sneak these things through. >One should also remember that the government of the Netherlands has agreed >to control the sale and use of narcotics. If their efforts to control >cryptography are as dilligent we have nothing to worry about. > >In addition under the single European act the entire country of Europe is >one export zone for crypto control purposes. I fail to see that stopping >Brits from exporting crypto to the US changes the equation a great deal. > > >There once was an English king called Canute who attempted to demonstrate >to his courtiers that he was fallible and could not order the tide to >turn. Perhaps Clinton's courtiers need to learn that they suffer the same >limmitation. I'm afraid that that may not be the point. The primary objective of the arms control laws ( which are the ones being used as references in this case ) is to prevent advanced weapons technology from spreading to the third world. Now Europe, America, Japan, and other first world countries are all capable of developing high level crypto indiginously. The less advanced countries on the earth are forced to import it from these countries. What the passage of this law will do is prevent this export ( example: the Netherlands, as you pointed out has not cracked down on its internal narcotics trade. However it doesn't permit exporting narcotics. Similarly this agreement will probably freeze exports of high level crypto by all the signatory countries, in the same way that america no longer permits high level crypto exports. ) The end result being the NSA should able to read India and Chinas communications without irritations. Vivek Vaidya ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

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DoJ investigates CIA [CNN]
by Jim Choate 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Forwarded message: > X-within-URL: http://www.cnn.com/US/9812/05/cia.hughes.ap/ > JUSTICE INVESTIGATING CIA FOR POSSIBLE CRIMINAL VIOLATIONS > > CIA Graphic December 5, 1998 > Web posted at: 1:38 p.m. EST (1838 GMT) > > WASHINGTON (AP) -- The Justice Department is conducting an > obstruction-of-justice investigation of CIA officials who passed along > to a satellite contractor sensitive information about a Senate > investigation into technology transfers to China. > > Government officials reached late Friday said the criminal > investigation centers on information passed by the intelligence agency > to Hughes Electronics Corp., maker of both commercial and spy > satellite systems. > > At issue is whether that information compromised a Senate Intelligence > Committee investigation into allegations that Hughes and other U.S. > companies violated federal export laws by sharing restricted > technology with China as part of commercial satellite export deals. [text deleted] ____________________________________________________________________ If I can put in one word what has always infuriated me in any person, any group, any movement, or any nation, it is: bullying Howard Zinn The Armadillo Group ,::////;::-. James Choate Austin, Tx /:'///// ``::>/|/ ravage(a)ssz.com www.ssz.com .', |||| `/( e\ 512-451-7087 -====~~mm-'`-```-mm --'- --------------------------------------------------------------------

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(eternity) democracy is a bad idea on the net too! (fwd)
by Jim Choate 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Forwarded message: > Date: Sat, 5 Dec 1998 20:26:51 GMT > From: Adam Back <aba(a)dcs.ex.ac.uk> > Subject: (eternity) democracy is a bad idea on the net too! > Markus Kuhn wrote: > > The main research aspect of this project is the joint administration of > > such distributed archives. For spam protection, you still need people > > who decide, which files are allowed on the distributed server > > infrastructure, and which are not. > > I think a better deciding factor of which files remain and which don't > is hard, anonymous ecash. Allow the author, or server to charge for > storage, and charge for access. Allow readers to contribute ecash to > the continued existance of a data. Throw the lot together and let > profit maximisation sort the rest out. There is some window for abuse in this method. It allows a well endowed entity to bias the information available. There is also the question of data degredation, in the sense of worth, over time versus the archival/historical worth of the data. Two major negatives to a free-market approach that are never discussed. ____________________________________________________________________ If I can put in one word what has always infuriated me in any person, any group, any movement, or any nation, it is: bullying Howard Zinn The Armadillo Group ,::////;::-. James Choate Austin, Tx /:'///// ``::>/|/ ravage(a)ssz.com www.ssz.com .', |||| `/( e\ 512-451-7087 -====~~mm-'`-```-mm --'- --------------------------------------------------------------------

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Freebie, Freebie - How to get heavy traffic to your web site!
by BannerExplode＠usa.net 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

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eternity using politics rather than economics
by Ryan Lackey 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

When I was working on Eternity DDS stuff, I basically came to the same conclusion as Adam -- without anonymous bearer cash, you can't do a workable eternity implementation. It's an open question whether you could issue bearer cash backed in Eternity-units. That was my original plan, but it seems you would still want to have gold-units to trade for Eternity units. The problems of guaranteeing quality of service in exchange for Eternity units are complicated but tractable, but having a separate scheme for auditing performance. Where I think "political" schemes would be particularly beneficial is in sharing administrative control over a virtual corporation, etc. While those who believe Coase would believe corporations will devolve into individuals or even autonomous agents, it might be a worthwhile tool during the transition. As far as I can tell, having a good Eternity implementation is still blocked on getting a reasonable electronic cash system. There are some people in Anguilla...

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RE: What was the quid pro quo for Wassenaar countries?
by Matthew James Gering 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

> The end result being the NSA should able to read India and Chinas > communications without irritations. You think India won't be able to develop strong encryption indigenously?! You obviously haven't been keeping up with the times. One word...Bangalore. Despite the export rhetoric, the real and intended affect it to prevent widespread *domestic* use. By making the market much smaller (domestic) only, creating FUD, there are less crypto suppliers and much higher costs. Matt

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Re: the shit hitting the fan (fwd)
by Anonymous 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

>It's during times like these that you learn more about your fellow >c'punks than you need to ... You're correct. I had no clue that the Cypherpunks were such a shitty group. >On Fri, 4 Dec 1998, Jim Choate wrote: > >> Forwarded message: >> >> > Date: Sat, 5 Dec 1998 06:00:13 +0100 >> > From: Anonymous <nobody(a)replay.com> >> > Subject: the shit hitting the fan >> >> > LA has 1e7 people who shit about a kilo per day. Compute the volume of that >> > after a week. >> >> It's not the raw volume that's critical but rather the percentage of the >> average personal space per inhabitant versus how much to store a weeks >> worth. For the average person storing a weeks worth of solid waste in a >> platic bag with bleach, lye, or similar material is reasonable. >> >> I've gone on long duration camping trips of about a weeks length and the >> storing and portage costs are not excessive (having a boat or horse helps >> move it around). FlushMonger

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Re: the shit hitting the fan (fwd)
by Jim Choate 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Forwarded message: > Date: Sat, 5 Dec 1998 18:13:03 -0500 (EST) > From: Rabid Wombat <wombat(a)mcfeely.bsfs.org> > Subject: Re: the shit hitting the fan (fwd) > It's during times like these that you learn more about your fellow > c'punks than you need to ... > On Fri, 4 Dec 1998, Jim Choate wrote: > > > Forwarded message: > > I've gone on long duration camping trips of about a weeks length and the > > storing and portage costs are not excessive (having a boat or horse helps > > move it around). It's not my choice, it's the law (for many national and state parks). You've got to pach your pets if you take them along as well. ____________________________________________________________________ If I can put in one word what has always infuriated me in any person, any group, any movement, or any nation, it is: bullying Howard Zinn The Armadillo Group ,::////;::-. James Choate Austin, Tx /:'///// ``::>/|/ ravage(a)ssz.com www.ssz.com .', |||| `/( e\ 512-451-7087 -====~~mm-'`-```-mm --'- --------------------------------------------------------------------

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explanation of public key cryptography
by ichudov＠Algebra.COM 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

My friend needs a website with explanations of PK cryptography and related interesting protocols. I have Schneier's book but she lives far from me and the book is too long for her to read. Any suggestions for something on the Web? thanks igor

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...
by Anonymous 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

> My friend needs a website with explanations of PK cryptography > and related interesting protocols. I have Schneier's book but she > lives far from me and the book is too long for her to read. > > Any suggestions for something on the Web? This does not fully explain the protocols, but an explanation of RSA is available at John Young's Cryptome. http://jya.com/whprsa.htm Download it, though, because it was one of the files relating to Bill Payne which will most likely be deleted when he gets his own web page up as promised. Diffie-Hellman and NSA's Key Exchange Algorithm need no URLs -- Diffie-Hellman was designed by Whitfield Diffie and Martin Hellman, and its publication sparked public-key cryptography (and received a standing ovation when presented). The Key Exchange Algorithm (KEA) is an NSA "type II" algorithm used in the Defense Messaging System. It was kept classified until recently. Schneier mentions in his CRYPTO-GRAM newsletter that problems with making tamper-resistant hardware carrying the algorithm may have led to its release. The devices are named A and B. Brackets represent a value's "owner." Diffie-Hellman: Both: Retrieve public values g and p. A: Chooses a random secret value x[A]. Calculates X[A]=g^x[A] mod p. Sends X[A] to B. B: Chooses a random secret value x[B]. Calculates X[B]=g^x[A] mod p. Sends X[B] to A. A: Raises value received from B to the x[A] power and uses this to calculate the key. B: Raises value received from A to the x[B] power and uses this to calculate the key. KEA: (this is a modified version of an old post to Cypherpunks) Constants: p: 1024-bit prime modulus q: 160-bit prime divisor of p-1 g: 1024-bit base Secret user-dependent values: x: 160-bit random key r: 160-bit random key Public user-dependent values: Y: g^x mod p R: g^r mod p z(x, y) represents KEA threshing. 1 A->B: Y[a] 2 B->A: Y[b] 3 A->B: R[a] 4 B->A: R[b] 5 A : (Y[b])^q mod p = 1? If not, stop; (R[b])^q mod p = 1? If not, stop; Are Y[b] and R[b] between 1 and p? If not, stop. 6 B : (Y[a])^q mod p = 1? If not, stop; (R[a])^q mod p = 1? If not, stop; Are Y[a] and R[a] between 1 and p? If not, stop. 7 A : t[ab]=(Y[b])^r[a] mod p; u[ab]=(R[b])^x[a] mod p 8 B : t[ab]=(R[a])^x[b] mod p; u[ab]=(Y[a])^r[b] mod p 9 A : (t[ab]+u[ab]) mod p = 0? If so, stop; if not, Key=z(t[ab],u[ab]) 10 B : (t[ab]+u[ab]) mod p = 0? If so, stop; if not, Key=z(t[ab],u[ab]) Zero-Knowledge Protocols: http://www.tcm.hut.fi/Opinnot/Tik-110.501/1995/zeroknowledge.html RSA Data Security's RSA Labs on protocols: http://www.rsa.com/rsalabs/faq/html/7.html > > thanks > > igor

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[Fwd: y2k/gary north delusions]
by Soren 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

William J. Hartwell dropped this in my mailbox ... To: Soren <sorens(a)workmail.com> Subject: Re: y2k/gary north delusions From: "William J.Hartwell" <billh(a)ibag.com> Date: Sat, 05 Dec 1998 14:21:32 -0700 In-Reply-To: <366958DF.FBF816FC(a)workmail.com> References: <199812050047.SAA19462(a)manifold.algebra.com><36694C23.B4CB9509(a)nyu.edu> <toilet talk trimmed out> > >That's the fun part, figuring out how it could all be made to work. > >Unfortunately it's more likely that the sheeple will cry out for guvmint >intervention to continue the flow of goodies, to which the western world >has become addicted. > >IMHO, the military will be brought in to dig the latrines. Hoarders will >be strung up for not redistributing their wealth in approved socialist >style. Rewards will be posted for informing on a neighbor who is (may >be) a hoarder (5% of the take?). Related to this... have you folks seen this thread going around some of the y2k preparedness groups? "..... its illegal to store more than 30 days of food ?....." These folks are refering to some info on a web page related to executive orders. http://www.millennium-ark.net/News_Files/INFO_Files/EOs.html This one I think needs some FUD busting...and no one does that better than you guys! -- William J. Hartwell (602)987-8436 Queencreek, Az. billh(a)ibag.com billh(a)interdem.com billh(a)hartwell.net

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No Subject
by times＠caxton.newsint.co.uk 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Dear Reader, We are happy to provide feedback about The Times/Sunday Times website, in the first of an occasional series of news briefs . . . Investment boosts access speed The site is determined to make continual improvements for its readers. Significant extra cash is being channelled into making it the fastest, easiest navigated and most innovative publishing site on the web. Recent months have brought enormous increases in traffic, and you may have noticed the odd download or access delay. We are concerned about this just as you are, so have increased our bandwidth significantly. We already have much better access speeds. But our investment doesn't stop there: we will soon add increased server capacity, so we can provide a range of exciting new features in the next few months. Thank you for your continued commitment to The Times & The Sunday Times site. We welcome all comments or suggestions to webmaster(a)the-times.co.uk The Times & The Sunday Times site launches "News First" The UK's first extensive consumer newspaper-based rolling news and preview service went live on November 26. The free service includes headline news tickers on the registration and home pages and bulletins on the 10 main breaking stories from 7am-10pm GMT, followed by previews of news and features from the following day's offline edition. News headlines are backed both by paragraph-sized bulletins and links to relevant stories on the day's newspaper site. Best wishes, Mike Murphy Managing Editor News International Internet Publishing (The Times and The Sunday Times online)

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Financial disclosure panic?
by Robert Hettinga 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

--- begin forwarded text X-Sender: kerry@phalse MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Sat, 5 Dec 1998 21:16:35 -0500 Reply-To: Law & Policy of Computer Communications <CYBERIA-L(a)LISTSERV.AOL.COM> Sender: Law & Policy of Computer Communications <CYBERIA-L(a)LISTSERV.AOL.COM> From: Kerry Zero <kerry(a)2600.COM> Subject: Financial disclosure panic? To: CYBERIA-L(a)LISTSERV.AOL.COM I am the webmaster for kevinmitnick.com, the internet source of information on the legal and media injustices that have been committed against Kevin Mitnick (a computer hacker arrested in 1995 who has remained in prison, pre-trial, with no chance at bail for nearly 4 years now, despite the fact that the charges against him are relatively mild in comparison to some other convicted hackers). In a hearing Wednesday my name was brought up by the judge, Mariana Pfaelzer, because she had received notification that I had requested her financial disclosure reports, a request I had assumed logical, considering the large number of companies that are claimed as victims in Mitnick's case. I have been doing a lot of research on the Mitnick case during the past few months, and this was one part of that research, ordering what I thought were publicly available records, and which I understood were not meant for dissemination -- I never published them or disclosed them to the public (above all, I would never have published this information on the web, although that was not even the issue, as the judge had no idea who I was, and she was not even aware on Wednesday that I am also Kevin's site webmaster). Apparently the judge was not at all happy simply that someone on Mitnick's side of the fence had even researched this. I suppose she'd have been happier if it had been the prosecution, although obviously that wouldn't have helped me find the facts I needed to know :) I was told by different sources (present in the courtroom) that the judge reacted as though infuriated at my request, and she put the government on notice that "if anything happened" -- and left the sentence uncompleted. Now I am left wondering what the potential legal ramifications of this incident could possibly be. I did nothing illegal, although in the judge's eyes, apparently it was immoral or otherwise not right. I can't understand why -- my only guess is that she (Judge Pfaelzer) has so firmly bought the belief that Kevin Mitnick is an extremely dangerous hacker (though nothing he has done, and nothing in the charges, indicates this) that she simply fears any actions those of us innocently researching his case might take. The information I requested, as I understood it, was private, and not for publication, but it is openly available to the public by request; one does not have to be a lawyer to request it. I am not a lawyer; far from it; and I'm not a computer-cracker either -- I'm a female programmer in my 20s and I write online course software for a university. This seemingly (to me) bizarre incident has me blown away completely. The financial disclosure information is not even detailed enough as to allow one to estimate income or any other personal information about the judge, and so I'm having trouble understanding what any possible misuses of this information could be (and I don't really want to know, at this point! :) although obviously I never intended anything to come of the information in any way, unless it was directly relevant to the case. If there had been a conflict of interest with Judge Pfalezer, it would be very significant to Mitnick's case. At any rate, I'm uncertain as to what I should fear from the government -- if anything. If one of the corporations listed in the judge's statement happens to go bankrupt, will I be investigated? It seems ridiculous to me, but I have been warned that I may be investigated, and the government prosecutor now has a copy of the request I made, which apparently so infuriated the judge. To me, it seems that this court may believe everyone involved in Mitnick's "cause" is dangerous, although even Kevin himself has never been accused of committing harm to a person or to a computer -- he is basically accused of copying software. There have, however, been several particularly damaging false "facts" printed in the media about him, such as that he stole credit card numbers and that he broke into NORAD as a teenager -- neither of which ever appeared in any charges against Kevin, and both were proven to be untrue, but not before being printed on the front page of the NY Times, unfortunately. I suppose it's not my place to speculate, but I wonder how Kevin can possibly get a fair case with this type of paranoia against him and his supporters, if indeed it is paranoia... perhaps it is only my own ignorance of the law, and this happens all the time. I just wondered if any of you had any thoughts. I've been following this list for a while and have found it very educational. thanks, kerry(a)2600.com --- end forwarded text ----------------- Robert A. Hettinga <mailto: rah(a)philodox.com> Philodox Financial Technology Evangelism <http://www.philodox.com/> 44 Farquhar Street, Boston, MA 02131 USA "... however it may deserve respect for its usefulness and antiquity, [predicting the end of the world] has not been found agreeable to experience." -- Edward Gibbon, 'Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire'

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*** Holiday Cash ***
by wilfrido1＠aol.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Date: December 5, 1998 THIS IS IT FOLKS!! This is THE LETTER you've been READING about in the NEWS lately. Due to the popularity of this letter on the Internet, a major nightly news program recently devoted an entire show to the investigation of the program described below, to see if it really can make people money. If you saw it, you know that their conclusion was that while most people did not make the $55,000, as discussed in the plan, EVERYONE who followed the instructions was able to make 100 to 160 times their money at the VERY LEAST. The show also investigated whether or not the program was legal. Their findings proved once and for all that there are absolutely no laws prohibiting the participation in the program. "This is one of the most exciting opportunities with the MOST income potential on the internet today!" - - 48 Hours. Hi, my name is Susan. After I saw this letter aired on the news program, I decided to get some of my skeptical questions answered. Question #1 - Does it really work? Until I try it, I can only go on the testimony of people I don't know, so I will only know if I try it. I've never done this type of thing, but I decided it was time to try something. If I keep doing what I am doing I'll keep getting what I've got. Besides, people 70 years old have been surveyed and they have consistently said that the 2 regrets they have had in their lives were that: 1) They wish they had spent more time with their families. and 2) They wish they had taken more chances Upon hearing this again, and hearing what the media said about it, I decided that at age 42, I was going to take a small chance and see what would come of it. Question #2 - Is it legal? - Yes, (Refer to title 18, Section 1302 & 1342 of the U.S. Postal and Lottery Laws) This opportunity isn't much of a risk and could turn out to actually be a bit of fun. Bottom Line; The risk is only $20 and time on the Internet. The following is a copy of the letter that the media was referring to: $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ This is a LEGAL, MONEYMAKING PHENOMENON. PRINT this letter, READ the directions, THEN READ IT AGAIN ! ! ! You are about to embark on the most profitable and unique program you may ever see! Many times over, it has demonstrated and proven its ability to generate large amounts of cash! This program is showing fantastic appeal with a huge and ever-growing on-line population desirous of additional income. This ia a legitimate, LEGAL, moneymaking opportunity. It does not require you to come in personal contact with people, do any hard work, and best of all, you never have to leave the house, except to get the mail and go to the bank! This truly is that lucky break you've been waiting for! Simply follow the easy instructions in this letter, and your financial dreams can come true! When followed correctly, this electronic, multi- level marketing program WORKS! Thousands of people have used this program to: - Raise capital to start their own businesses - Pay off debts - Buy homes, cars, etc., - Even retire! This is your chance, Don't pass it up! ------------------------------------------------------ OVERVIEW OF THIS EXTRAORDINARY ELECTRONIC MULTI-LEVEL MARKETING PROGRAM ------------------------------------------------------ Basically, this is what we do: We send thousands of people a product for which they paid us $5.00 US. The product costs next to nothing to produce. We then e-mail the product back to them. As with all multi-level businesses, we build our business by recruiting new partners and selling our products. Every state in the U.S. allows you to recruit new multi-level business online (via your computer). The products in this program are a series of four business and financial reports costing $5.00 each. Each order you receive is to include: * $5.00 cash United States Currency * The name and number of the report they are ordering * The e-mail address where you will e-mail them the report they ordered. To fill each order, you simply e-mail the product to the buyer. THAT'S IT! The $5.00 is yours! This is the EASIEST electronic multi-level marketing business anywhere! FOLLOW THE INSTRUCTIONS TO THE LETTER AND BE PREPARED TO REAP THE STAGGERING BENEFITS! +++++++++ I N S T R U C T I O N S ++++++++ This is what you MUST do: 1. Order all 4 reports shown on the list below (you can't sell them if you don't order them). * For each report, send $5.00 CASH, the NAME & NUMBER OF THE RPORT YOU ARE ORDERING, YOUR E-MAIL ADDRESS, and YOUR RETURN POSTAL ADDRESS (in case of a problem) to the person whose name appears on the list next to the report. * When you place your order, make sure you order each of the four reports. You will need all four reports so that you can save them on your computer and resell them. * Within a few days you are to receive, via e-mail, each of the four reports. Save them on your computer so they will be accessible for you to send to the thousands of people who will order them from you. 2. IMPORTANT -- DO NOT alter the names of the people who are listed next to each report, or their sequence on the list, in any way other than as instructed below in steps "a" through "d".If you do, you will lose out on the majority of your profits. Once you understand the way this works, you'll also see how it doesn't work if you change it. Remember that this method has been tested, and if you alter it, it will not work. a. Look below for the listing of available reports. b. After you've ordered the four reports, replace the name and address under REPORT #1 with your name and address, moving the one that was there down to REPORT #2. c. Move the name and address that was under REPORT #2 down to REPORT #3. d. Move the name and address that was under REPORT #3 down to REPORT #4. e. The name and address that was under REPORT #4 is removed from the list and has NO DOUBT collected large sums of cash! Please make sure you copy everyone's name and address ACCURATELY! ! ! (Please be sure to specify the country to which payment is to be made. For instance: U.S.A. if mailing from another country.) 3. Take this entire letter, including the modified list of names, and save it to your computer. Make NO changes to the instruction portion of this letter. 4. Now you're ready to start an advertising campaign on the WORLDWIDE WEB! Advertising on the WEB can be very, very inexpensive, and there are HUNDREDS of FREE places to advertise. Another avenue, which you could use for advertising, is e-mail lists. You can buy these lists for as little as $20/2,000 addresses or you can pay someone to take care of it for you. BE SURE TO START YOUR AD CAMPAIGN IMMEDIATELY! 5. For every $5.00 you receive, all you must do is e-mail them the report they ordered. THAT'S IT! ALWAYS PROVIDE SAME-DAY SERVICE ON ALL ORDERS! This will help guarantee that the e-mail THEY send out, with YOUR name and address on it, will be prompt because they can't advertise until they receive the report! To grow fast be prompt and courteous. --------------------------------------------------------- AVAILABLE REPORTS *Order Each REPORT by NUMBER and NAME* Notes: - ALWAYS SEND $5 CASH FOR EACH REPORT - ALWAYS SEND YOUR ORDER VIA THE QUICKEST DELIVERY - Make sure the cash is concealed by wrapping it in at least two sheets of paper - On one of those sheets of paper, include: (a) the number & name of the report you are ordering, (b) your e-mail address, and (c) your postal address. _____________________________________________________ REPORT #1 "HOW TO MAKE $250,000 THROUGH MULTI-LEVEL SALES" ORDER REPORT #1 FROM: P. Green General Delivery Port Tobacco, MD 20677 U.S.A. _____________________________________________________ REPORT #2 "MAJOR CORPORATIONS AND MULTI-LEVEL SALES" ORDER REPORT #2 FROM: Inter-Line Systems PO Box 175 Milford, NJ 08848 ______________________________________________________ REPORT #3 "SOURCES FOR THE BEST MAILING LISTS" ORDER REPORT #3 FROM: Galactic Whispers PO Box 291 Pittstown, NJ 08867 ______________________________________________________ REPORT #4 "EVALUATING MULTI-LEVEL SALES PLANS" ORDER REPORT #4 FROM: DEM 3 Tallyho Lane Bow, NH 03304 ______________________________________________________ ------------------------------------------------------ HERE'S HOW THIS AMAZING PLAN WILL MAKE YOU $MONEY$ ------------------------------------------------------ Let's say you decide to start small just to see how well it works. Assume your goal is to get 10 people to participate on your first level. (Placing a lot of FREE ads on the internet will EASILY get a larger response.) Also assume that everyone else in YOUR ORGANIZATION gets ONLY 10 downline members. Follow this example to achieve the STAGGERING results below. 1st level - - your 10 members with $5 .. . . . . .$50 2nd level - - 10 members from those 10 ($5 x 100) . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .$500 3rd level - - 10 members from those 100 ($5 x 1,000) . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .$5,000 4th level - - 10 members from those 1,000 ($5 x 10,000) . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . $50,000 THIS TOTALS - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - $55,550 Remember friends, this assumes that the prople who participate only recruit 10 people each. Think for a moment what would happen if they got 20 people to participate! Lots of people get 100s of participants! THINK ABOUT IT! Your cost to participate in this is practically nothing (surely you can afford $20). You obviously already have an internet connection and e-mail is FREE! ! ! REPORT #3 shows you the most productive methods for bulk e-mailing and purchasing e-mail lists. Some list & bulk e-mail vendors even work on trade! About 50,000 new people get online every month ****TIPS FOR SUCCESS**** * TREAT THIS AS YOUR BUSINESS! BE PROMPT, professional, and follow the directions accurately. * Send for the four reports IMMEDIATELY so you will have them when the orders start coming in because: When you receive a $5 order, you MUST send out the requested product/report to comply with the U.S. Postal & Lottery Laws, Title 18, Sections 1302 and 1341 or Title 18, Section 3005 in the U.S. Code also Code of Federal Regs. vol.. 16, Sections 255 and 436, which state that "a product or service must be exhanged for money received." * ALWAYS PROVIDE SAME-DAY SERVICE ON THE ORDERS YOU RECEIVE. * Be patient and persistent with this program. If you follow the instructions exactly, the results WILL undoubtedly be SUCCESSFUL! * ABOVE ALL, HAVE FAITH IN YOURSELF AND KNOW YOU WILL SUCCEED! ***********YOUR SUCCESS GUIDELINE************* Follow these guildelines to help assure your success: If you don't receive 10 to 20 orders for REPORT #1 within two weeks, continue advertising until you do. Then, a couple of weeks later you should receive at least 50 orders for REPORT #2. If you don't, continue advertising until you do. Once you have received 50 or more orders for REPORT #2, YOU CAN RELAX, because the system is already working for you, and the cash can continue to roll in! THIS IS IMPORTANT TO REMEMBER: Every time your name is moved down on the list, you are placed in front of a DIFFERENT report. You can KEEP TRACK of your PROGRESS by watching which report people are ordering from you. If you want to generate more income, send another batch of e-mails and start the whole process again! There is no limit to the income you will generate from this business! Note To U.S. Paticipants: If you need help with starting a business, registering a business name, how income tax is handled, etc., contact your local office of the Small Business Administration (a Federal agency) for free help and answers to questions. Also, the Internal Revenue Service offers free help via telephone and free seminars about business taxes. If you have any question of the legality of this letter contact the Office of Associate Director for Marketing Practices Federal Trade Commission Bureau of Consumer Protection in Washington, DC. ****** T E S T I M O N I A L S ******* This program does work, but you must follow it EXACTLY! Especially the rule of not trying to place your name in a different position, it won't work and you'll lose a lot of potential income. I'm living proof that it works. It really is a great opportunity to make relatively easy money, with little cost to you. If you do choose to participate, follow the program exactly. Sean McLaughlin, Jackson, Ms. The main reason for this letter is to convince you that this system is honest, lawful, extremely profitable, and is a way to get a large amount of money in a short time. I was approached several times before I checked this out. I joined just to see what one could expect in return for the minimal effort and money required. To my astonishment, I received $36,470.00 in the first 19 weeks, with money still coming in. Phillip A. Brown, Esq. I had received this program before. I deleted it, but later I wondered if I shouldn't have given it a try. Of course, I had no idea who to contact to get another copy, so I had to wait until I was e-mailed another program . . . 11 months passed then it came . . . I didn't delete this one! . . . I made more than $41,000 on the first try!! D. Wilburn, Muncie, In. This is my third time to participate in this plan. We have quit our jobs, and will soon buy a home on the beach and live off the interest on our money. The only way on earth that this plan will work for you is if you do it. For your sake, and for your family's sake don't pass up this golden opportunity. Good luck and happy spendiong! Charles Fairchild, Spokance, Wa. I am nearing the $90,000 mark from this program. I have used several forms of advertisement. I used regular mail and bulk e-mail. The regular mail that I used was very expensive for two reasons. I purchased a very select list of names and the postage. The third time I sent e-mails out, I did so in the quantity of 1 million. So, after 3 times participating in this program I am almost at the $90,000 mark. That isn't too bad. I hope the same success for you. Raymond McCormick, New Canna, Ct. ------------------------------------------------------ You have great potential for extra earnings that is available at your fingertips! You have unlimited access to wealth, but you must be willing to take that first step! The Media ALREADY PROVED That ! ! ! You could be making an obscene amount of money! I have given you the information, materials, and opportunity to become financially better off. IT IS UP TO YOU NOW! - THINK ABOUT IT - Your risk is only $20.? HOW MUCH DO YOU SPEND ON LOTTO TICKETS - for NO RETURN? ORDER YOUR REPORTS TODAY AND GET STARTED ON YOUR ROAD TO FINANCIAL FREEDOM! ! ! :)

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Re: PGP Disk
by Anonymous 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

> Has anyone had the chance to try out the new McAfee PGP disk? > It seems pretty straightforward, allowing for the creation of > encrypted "drives" using the CAST algorithm. Is anyone aware of > any security flaws with it? Make sure you get the latest version. The version released in May or June had a bug in it (bug was only in the Windows version, the Mac is OK). The new version re-encrypts old PGP disks to fix the problem.

1 0

Vengeance Libertarianism
by Albert P. Franco, II 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Tim must be having a "bad hair" day. He actually mentioned sending people to Labor Camps. That sounds so UN-Libertarian, I have to chuckle. I'm chuckling because I wouldn't want to think you actually believe in this very Hitleresque rant. Or is some FED spoofing Tim and sending "threatening" material in his name? In which case...lock and load, Tim. They're coming to get you! APF >and, have drifted into the camp I will dub "the vengeance >libertarians." Summarized, roughly, as: > >"You've stolen my property, you've imprisoned my friends, you've passed >laws making us all criminals, you've started wars to enrich your >military-industrial complex friends, and you're corrupt bastards. You can >forget about some kind of "libertarian amnesty." It's going to be payback >time, with at least hundreds of thousands of statist judges, politicians, >cops, soldiers, and other such persons going to the gallows. Payback time. >Welfare recipients are going to have to pay back all that they have stolen, >with compounded interest. Out of their pockets, or while in labor camps. >Payback time." > > >--Tim May >

3 2

Commerce Hacked?
by John Young 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Since some time after the Department of Commerce issued the recent press release on Wassenaar the site (www.doc.gov) has not been accessible, at least not from here. The press release section of the International Trade Administration (www.ita.doc.gov) David Aaron's org, for a while had a notice that updating was being done and the site would be fixed shortly. Then the ITA site disappeared, along with the main DoC site. We spoke with a public affairs rep at DoC before this happened and to inquire when the department would issue detailed information to flesh out the press release. I said there was a furor over Aaron's spin, and much skepticism of its validity. She said she would check and call back but hasn't. Wonder if the site was hacked, from the outside or inside.

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e$: Cryptography -- The Steel Rails of Digital Commerce
by Robert Hettinga 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Lots of sensible people on cypherpunks have made an excellent point before, but Nelson Minar has said it quite succinctly in the message below, with an outstanding example from Sun, in the post that I'm including here from Perry Metzger's cryptography list. The point it this: There is only one, and completely acceptable, solution to this whole crypto-exportabilty mess: don't export anything. That is, make *only* strong crypto, make it inside your country, and let crypto folks in other countries take care of themselves. The permiability of national borders to the internet will get your actual cryptography overseas if it's novel and useful, and, if you use crypto plugged into your software, like Sun does with Java, then you'll sell more of that software because it *requires* strong cryptography, other people's or not. Geodesic, recursive software auctions with digital bearer-settled cash will eventually make all of this, including intellectual property issues, moot someday :-), but, in the meantime, simply obeying the laws on crypto export will work marvellously. Even in a post- "Adult Action" world, where all laws are enforceable everywhere, obeying them all, will, paradoxically, work just fine, as we'll see in a bit. Of course, all this makes the crypto *import*/arbitrage market, where C2NET made their first million, a mostly diminishing one, whether Wassenaar works or not. Certainly it's not a large enough market to renounce your citizenship for, as one member of their firm has done. This whole export-control tactic will eventually fail, and when crypto is unregulated, either by the market or by law itself, some crypto-fugitives will still be locked out of the largest economies in the world, especially if, however temporary the tactic and doomed to failure it is, nation-states actually criminalize crypto-arbitrage itself. Again, it's not laws, it's technology, which is the solution to this silly, and fairly theocratic, dispute about criminalizing the export of cryptography. Remember the e$yllogism: Strong cryptography is essential to digital commerce. In fact, strong financial cryptography is utterly necessary *and* sufficient for digital commerce. Thus, no strong cryptography, no digital commerce. Since all commerce will have a digital, and thus cryptographic, component soon enough, cryptographic regulation is, like Carl Ellison's analogy of church doctrine forbidding peasants from shooting nobility, fairly useless. Especially since nation-states can't help but allow the use of strong cryptography to facilitate commerce, in the same way that they can't help but allow the use of steel in their railroads. So, I say unto all ye crypto-peasants out there, obey the Doctrine of Crypto-Prohibition, on pain of the loss of your immortal soul. That is, make and use the strongest cryptography that your microprocessors can handle, and, like the peasant who, in confession, admits the shooting of a knight, obey dogma and don't export cryptography: it will "export" itself, like all good ideas do. Cryptography, like the technology of gunpowder -- or better, steel -- is not optional. Cheers, Robert Hettinga - --- begin forwarded text MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Sat, 5 Dec 1998 18:47:25 -0500 (EST) From: nelson(a)media.mit.edu (Nelson Minar) To: Raph Levien <raph(a)acm.org> Cc: cryptography(a)c2.net Subject: Re: Wassenaar vs. CipherSaber Sender: owner-cryptography(a)c2.net >I'm spending more and more of my time these days in the free software >community (not all that big a leap for a cypherpunk). I'm seeing the >"crypto integration" problem all over the place. This is an issue of serious concern; it's really holding up the adoption of encryption, particularly at the TCP/IP level. An interesting model for how to get around the US regulations is what Sun is doing with Java. Java 1.2 ships with pretty much everything you need for strong, composable cryptography - big numbers, a key management framework, digital signatures. But they're following the letter of the US export regulations. Sun has defined the Java Cryptographic Extensions, a decent API for doing encryption. Bcause they are a US company they only ship a JCE implementation to people in the US. But they've made it about as easy as possible for folks outside the US to implement their own drop-in replacements. One interesting choice they've made is that, as near as I can tell, they aren't even bothering to ship a 40/56 bit crippled version. If you want crypto at all, you have to use Sun's JCE or get a non-US alternative. So you can only get real crypto, not some useless junk. I think that's probably the right idea - don't cave in to the US regulations, just follow them the minimum you have to and make sure it's easy for people outside the US to reimplement the parts you are not allowed to ship. I guess we have to wait and see how much Wassenaar complicates things. nelson(a)media.mit.edu . . . . . . . . http://www.media.mit.edu/~nelson/ - --- end forwarded text -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: PGP for Personal Privacy 5.5.5 iQEVAwUBNmqVrcUCGwxmWcHhAQE0zwgAqVUrB7Vu1NVqNHaGHeRTHUB9Z2li7x/m 5eMYUdKu8I3696LCC9CApwHi2vGW39jh0/dUR26+utNQ6MaJEyCrpjA7WpSvaqBQ XGrEPjEN58KQAlGydmjpxxL4ukX606dTKndiTPz5ujRGo1EtshRkB+2NmnUZOYZN +ECDrOylPFkDLDMqLGwqzY9zU79xZMvyIVQvpT2onUzfx3LgyjjC2/ZQbvJmOSsD vk14KbsyL6UEwyaH8FqUZWG/qGgQSALJsLpregApq0QHWl15+rEd+TvqWnyPvDKL cIIz3Cyo0QlwYFQWhg6JiPWRB+GQxaDaMS7QQqZeBqUSJclnVdJH+w== =gpAa -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- ----------------- Robert A. Hettinga <mailto: rah(a)philodox.com> Philodox Financial Technology Evangelism <http://www.philodox.com/> 44 Farquhar Street, Boston, MA 02131 USA "... however it may deserve respect for its usefulness and antiquity, [predicting the end of the world] has not been found agreeable to experience." -- Edward Gibbon, 'Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire'

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by urbr4kan＠rto.dec.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

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China executes pager smugglers [CNN]
by Jim Choate 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Forwarded message: > X-within-URL: http://www.cnn.com/WORLD/asiapcf/9812/06/china.execution.ap/ > CHINA EXECUTES TWO FOR SMUGGLING COMPUTERS, PAGERS > > December 6, 1998 > Web posted at: 6:17 a.m. EDT (0617 GMT) > > BEIJING, China (AP) -- In the midst of a sweeping crackdown on illegal > imports, China said Sunday that it has executed a computer executive > and an office worker for smuggling computers, pagers and other > electronic goods into the country. > > The deaths come as China carries out a campaign to enforce trade > barriers that shield its industries from foreign competition in an > attempt to quash a multibillion-dollar market for illegally imported > products. [text deleted] ____________________________________________________________________ If I can put in one word what has always infuriated me in any person, any group, any movement, or any nation, it is: bullying Howard Zinn The Armadillo Group ,::////;::-. James Choate Austin, Tx /:'///// ``::>/|/ ravage(a)ssz.com www.ssz.com .', |||| `/( e\ 512-451-7087 -====~~mm-'`-```-mm --'- --------------------------------------------------------------------

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Re: (eternity) democracy is a bad idea on the net too! (fwd)
by Jim Choate 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Forwarded message: > Date: Sun, 06 Dec 1998 01:07:38 -0800 > From: Bill Stewart <bill.stewart(a)pobox.com> > Subject: Re: (eternity) democracy is a bad idea on the net too! (fwd) > At 02:47 PM 12/5/98 -0600, Jim Choate wrote, not in this order: > > Two major negatives to a free-market approach that are never discussed. > > >There is also the question of data degredation, in the sense of worth, > >over time versus the archival/historical worth of the data. > > Huh? We talk about this all the time. How much does data storage cost, > and how long is the information useful to readers and writers, And you drop it at that point. No, you do not adequately discuss the ramification of the economic nor of the social and historic motives to drive the long-term archiving of all data in the network. The current Eternity model is brittle in several ways. The problem is the current economic model that all its supporters are wedded to. If that model changes and takes on the range of responsibilities (some of them outside a simple profit/cost approach) that such a service should carry it would work. I made reference to a couple of these in my responce to Adam so I won't reitterate them here. ____________________________________________________________________ If I can put in one word what has always infuriated me in any person, any group, any movement, or any nation, it is: bullying Howard Zinn The Armadillo Group ,::////;::-. James Choate Austin, Tx /:'///// ``::>/|/ ravage(a)ssz.com www.ssz.com .', |||| `/( e\ 512-451-7087 -====~~mm-'`-```-mm --'- --------------------------------------------------------------------

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Re: (eternity) cost metrics (fwd)
by Jim Choate 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Forwarded message: > Date: Sun, 6 Dec 1998 00:26:19 GMT > From: Adam Back <aba(a)dcs.ex.ac.uk> > Subject: Re: (eternity) cost metrics > Jim Choate writes: > > Adam Back <aba(a)dcs.ex.ac.uk> wrote: > > > I think a better deciding factor of which files remain and which don't > > > is hard, anonymous ecash. [...] > > > > There is some window for abuse in this method. It allows a well endowed > > entity to bias the information available. > > The alternatives, such as say one vote per person have problems too. I'll agree that any system that relies on charging the originator of the information, versus the user of the information, is flawed in this way. Does your local grocery store charge the truck that delivers its tomato's? Does a book publisher ask that the potential author pay for the book run and advertising? Does the newspaper charge their reporters to put their articles in the paper? > Cash allows you to measure the scale. No, it allows a mechanism in the short-term for the Eternity market to be manipulated by parties with a political interest and large buckets of cash. > So straight cash seems I think to be a good metric. The point of the cash is to provide a motivation to keep Eternity up, NOT a measure of the worth of any specfic piece of information from the perspective of the server operator, it's the users of that data that define it's worth. That worth can and probably will have many facets that can't be reflected in simple dollars and by definition outside the keen of the Eternity networks current worth estimation model. In the majority of cases the Eternity operator won't have a clue as to the actual market worth of some data. There is also the issue of information worth collapse once the data is available off the Eternity network that hasn't been touched. This works to the negative of the Eternity networks long-term goal. For example, let's say a whistle-blower comes in with some juicy info. The Eternity server network, through some mechanism that I've never seen sufficiently described, determine that the originator must pay some amount of money to post it. The data gets posted and users grab it over the next few days. Then once it's available in the alternate channels (eg printed on a webpage of a newspaper) the future market potential for the Eternity servers goes through the floor. This motivates the Eternity network to over-value the worth of data which further keeps folks out. > Note also my earlier comment that I view an important eternity > objective to be preventing negative votes on data availability. You > can only disseminate more, say contradictory, information not remove > information. Well, considering that Eternity doesn't do anything regarding archiving and long-term storage there really isn't a worry here. All that's required is to keep the price up until the window of relevance is gone. Then back out, the price drops back to it's original cost but now that it's relevance is gone it slowly (or not) fades away. Depending on the particular nature of the > You can attempt to disseminate more copies (make > available with higher redundancy, and fund faster download) perhaps, > but this does not drown out the other information. Actualy this is a complete change of track and irrelevant. The POINT is that if there is a piece of information that I want to keep out of the hands of others I simply go to server after server and ask for a copy. This activity raises the price. Since I've got lots of cash and I want that document to be expensive I continue to buy copies further inflating the price. > If you worry that mega-corp M will buy all available space at a > premium, there is an easy solution: Straw man, if the Eternity servers have a clue as M Corp. buys more space the server operators buy more drives to sell since their now in the data space business and not the information brokering business. Hence M Corp. has distracted the Eternity services from their primary operations. So a workable strategy for M Corp. would be to inflate the price on the data they want to hide as well as continue to dump monies into the Eternity network buying space. Then at some point they abruptly stop their support and the Eternity services collapse because they've now grown to such an extent they can't survive without this artificial market manipulation. So the Eternity servers go down, further obfuscating the original information that M Corp wanted to hide. The Eternity model also completely ignores the consequences of such a manipulation in regards the re-building of a new service after the collapse. The amount of trust that potential users have will be low further increasing the difficulty of keeping the servers operating long-term. Because the Eternity network relies only on the immediate short-term worth of data it is brittle. > > There is also the question of data degredation, in the sense of > > worth, over time versus the archival/historical worth of the > > data. > > As long as people are interested to keep the data around in low > priority low access speed storage they will pay for this to happen. > > If they don't care -- well they don't care. People who do care can > fund it, and evangelize to others on the merits of doing this. No one > has any special right to force others to pay for keeping junk around > for the sheer historical sake of completeness of it. So, a primary ideal of the Eternity service is that as long as the data has a worth below some level they'll drop it. This is one of the reasons that a long-term service like this won't work. It isn't reliable because I can't come back 50 or a 100 years from now to get a piece of data unless there is sufficient interest by other parties to access it as well. This is short-sighted and limits the use of Eternity. ____________________________________________________________________ If I can put in one word what has always infuriated me in any person, any group, any movement, or any nation, it is: bullying Howard Zinn The Armadillo Group ,::////;::-. James Choate Austin, Tx /:'///// ``::>/|/ ravage(a)ssz.com www.ssz.com .', |||| `/( e\ 512-451-7087 -====~~mm-'`-```-mm --'- --------------------------------------------------------------------

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17 Dec '03

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