December 2003 - cypherpunks-legacy

Re: Fighting the cybercensor
by jim bell 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 09:40 PM 1/27/97 -0500, Phillip M. Hallam-Baker wrote: > > >jim bell <jimbell(a)pacifier.com> wrote in article <5ch9f2$cuu(a)life.ai.mit.edu>... > >> Look, I've proposed what I consider to be a remarkably consistent method to >> prevent the kind of political tyranny that you criticize, and I don't see >> any recognition of this fact. > >Thats because its a whacko solution that has no credibility >or consistency. "I love you too! B^) … [View More] Question: What is a "whacko solution"? Why do you believe AP qualifies? Can you list any other "solutions" which are, indeed, "solutions" which are NOT "whacko" by your definition? (I'm trying to determine whether or not you even agree that there is a problem!) Let me pose an issue here by counterexample: Suppose there was a plantation, containing a master and his slaves. You are told that the slaves are "unhappy". (They're unhappy because they're slaves!!!) That's a "problem." Okay, let me propose that there are at least two broad "solutions" to this "problem": First, change the working conditions just enough to make the slaves acceptably happy. Or, second, eliminate the slavery altogether. Both are "solutions". The first, obviously, is only a "solution" from the stanpoint of the master. The second appears to be only a "solution" from the standpoint of the slaves, since the master obviously doesn't want to lose his slaves! Could you legitimately call the second solution a "whacko solution"? (It would be, from the limited standpoint of the master.) How about the first? That's the problem with using such a poorly-defined term as "whacko" to describe anything, particularly when many people don't agree. And here's a question: What do you mean by "credibility"? I've explained it in enough detail to convince a rather substantial number of intelligent people that it is likely to be possible, and to some it sounds like it is desireable. >If anyone tried to set up such a market and a price went out >on any of the heads of state fantasized about Mr Bell would be >dead as a doornail in a week. A claim which doesn't disprove the functionality of AP one whit. In fact, quite the opposite: If AP was, indeed, non-functional, then nobody would bother with me at all. The fact that you think they would shows that you believe AP threatens SOMEBODY. This means that your arguments, as minimal as they are, are internally contradictory. They simply don't hold together. Jim Bell jimbell(a)pacifier.com [View Less]

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Re: Getting into MIT is impossible
by Erp 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

> I noted with some interest, but little surprise, that the guy claiming MIT > required a 4.0 GPA and a 1600 combined SAT score could barely spell, and > had major problems making a coherent point. Methinks this is why MIT > rejected him, not his lack of a "1600." ... Not to point out something obvious about this but the person who wrote this did not have "guts" enough or, just likes his privacy a bit more than the average person, to come out and write this non-anonymously. But … [View More]

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Re:re : Best Computer School?
by iamme 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

what about purdue and caltech ? anyone has Carnegie Mellon University (C.M.U.) in Pittsburgh www ? he he man > From owner-cypherpunks(a)toad.com Wed Jan 29 14:57 SGT 1997 > Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 20:23:53 -0500 > From: Matthew Toth <mst114(a)psu.edu> > To: SpyKing <spyking(a)thecodex.com> > Cc: cypherpunks(a)toad.com > Subject: Re: Best Computer School? > > MIT is one the best schools in the country for C.S. > Close behind is Carnegie … [View More]

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Re: News report RE:RSA Data Security Conference, pointer
by Declan McCullagh 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

I don't think CNET has any idea what they're talking about. Perhaps they mean the Burns bill? I was over at Burns' office yesterday, and Pro-CODE hasn't been reintroduced yet -- they're looking for more co-sponsors -- so that's not even correct. *shrug* I have a report on this at netlynews.com in the Afterword section, BTW. -Declan On Wed, 29 Jan 1997 aaron(a)herringn.com wrote: > Report on RSA data security conference. Mentions 'Legislation in Congress > could ban mandatory key … [View More]

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Re: Fighting the cybercensor
by Dr.Dimitri Vulis KOTM 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

"Phillip M. Hallam-Baker" <hallam(a)ai.mit.edu> writes: > The Cold War was not won by the arms race, it was won in > Eastern Europe which was never a major participant. The main > instrument that won it was West German TV which broadcast > pictures of supermarkets with full shelves into the homes > of East Germans every night. The viewers could see that it > was not mere propaganda and their relatives confirmed the > fact. As a result the East German guards on the … [View More]

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Re: Last nail for US crypto export policy?
by Michael Froomkin - U.Miami School of Law 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

On Wed, 29 Jan 1997 f_estema(a)alcor.concordia.ca wrote: [stuff] > > Incidentally, I remind you of the results of the moot court that was held > at one of the CFP conferences, where a GAK case was tried in front of > real federal judges by real lawyers. Our side lost. > Um. Actually the real judges didn't render an opinion (in public) since they might have to rule for real someday and would probably be conflicted out if they had ruled on the merits in a mock trial. The … [View More]

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DES challenge status?
by Ben Byer 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- What exactly is the status of RSA's DES contest? I understand that at least two of the smaller contests have already been cracked, but I haven't seen much beyond theoretical discussion on the list on the topic of the DES contest. What work has been started on this contest? I am aware of Peter Trei's excellent deskr software for win32, but at the moment it chokes on RSA's real contest data as distributed. Has anybody yet worked on porting a version to x86 … [View More]

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Re: New export controls to include code signing applications
by pgut001＠cs.auckland.ac.nz 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

The Men in Black made Lucky Green <shamrock(a)netcom.com> write: >[Listing specific software prohibited from export] >"c.2. "Software" to certify "software" controlled by 5D002.c.1; " > >And, btw, virus checkers are also prohibited from export. Makes you wonder. > >"c.3. "Software" designed or modified to protect against malicious computer >damage, e.g., viruses;" > >That includes every firewall product, every virus checker, every data security >product, … [View More]

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Re: libsln.htm -- Is Libel a Crime?
by jim bell 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 11:20 AM 1/29/97 -0500, aga wrote: >On Tue, 28 Jan 1997, jim bell wrote: >> One obvious problem with the LACK of a criminal libel statute, from the >> standpoint of the "government-controlling-class," or "the bigshots," is that >> it's impossible to sue (and collect from) a (comparatively) poor person for >> defaming him...but it's still possible to put him in jail. Civil libel is, >> therefore, essentially useless to a government agent as a means of … [View More]

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Re: Fighting the cybercensor
by jim bell 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 10:41 AM 1/29/97 -0800, Sean Roach wrote: >At 09:40 PM 1/27/97 -0500, Phillip M. Hallam-Baker wrote: >>Thats because its a whacko solution that has no credibility >>or consistency. >> >>If anyone tried to set up such a market and a price went out >>on any of the heads of state fantasized about Mr Bell would be >>dead as a doornail in a week. >> >So you're saying that the system would work. Mr. bell would be targeted, a >price on his head, … [View More]

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Re: RC5-12/32/5 contest solved
by jim bell 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 09:37 PM 1/28/97 -0800, stewarts(a)ix.netcom.com wrote: >Any bets on whether the $5000 RC5-12/32/6 contest will be solved >before the www.rsa.com contest status web page is updated? :-) > >Or how long before someone in the government starts talking about >how 56 bits takes 65,000 times as long to solve as 40 bits, >which is 26 years for a whole building full of computers, >and even 48 bits ought to take a month and a half for a whole >building full of computers (or … [View More]

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RE: Internet, Countries, Nationalism, etc.
by blanc 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

From: P.J. Westerhof >Franconics... Or Lesbonics of course, ................................................................. le femme fatale .. Blanc

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[IMPORTANT] E-Cash
by mixmaster＠remail.obscura.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

When Timmy C[ocksucker] May's mother gave birth to him after fucking with a bunch of sailors, she didn't know who the father was but decided to tell him that he was a Russian as the Russian sailor was the one who satisfied her the most. /\_./o__ Timmy C[ocksucker] May (/^/(_^^' ._.(_.)_

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Re: libsln.htm -- Is Libel a Crime?
by jim bell 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 11:20 AM 1/29/97 -0500, aga wrote: >On Tue, 28 Jan 1997, jim bell wrote: >> One obvious problem with the LACK of a criminal libel statute, from the >> standpoint of the "government-controlling-class," or "the bigshots," is that >> it's impossible to sue (and collect from) a (comparatively) poor person for >> defaming him...but it's still possible to put him in jail. Civil libel is, >> therefore, essentially useless to a government agent as a means of … [View More]

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Re: Fighting the cybercensor
by jim bell 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 10:41 AM 1/29/97 -0800, Sean Roach wrote: >At 09:40 PM 1/27/97 -0500, Phillip M. Hallam-Baker wrote: >>Thats because its a whacko solution that has no credibility >>or consistency. >> >>If anyone tried to set up such a market and a price went out >>on any of the heads of state fantasized about Mr Bell would be >>dead as a doornail in a week. >> >So you're saying that the system would work. Mr. bell would be targeted, a >price on his head, … [View More]

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No Subject
by sales 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

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RE: Internet, Countries, Nationalism, etc.
by blanc 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

From: P.J. Westerhof >Franconics... Or Lesbonics of course, ................................................................. le femme fatale .. Blanc

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Re: RC5-12/32/5 contest solved
by jim bell 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 09:37 PM 1/28/97 -0800, stewarts(a)ix.netcom.com wrote: >Any bets on whether the $5000 RC5-12/32/6 contest will be solved >before the www.rsa.com contest status web page is updated? :-) > >Or how long before someone in the government starts talking about >how 56 bits takes 65,000 times as long to solve as 40 bits, >which is 26 years for a whole building full of computers, >and even 48 bits ought to take a month and a half for a whole >building full of computers (or … [View More]

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A comment on the censorship policy
by nobody＠REPLAY.COM 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

I cannot understand how some of my (accurate) criticisms of Sandfort's censorhip polices---some in direct response to his own self-serving posts declaring himself not to be a flamer himself---are not making it to the "New and Improved Censored List," while inane posts from Toto, Thorn, and someone named "Nurdane Oksas" are appearing. (Oksas has the especially annoying habit of quoting entire posts and then appending a one-line piece of completely list-irrelevant fluff. Also, engaging in lovey-… [View More]

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The Politics of Export Restrictions
by Rick Hornbeck 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Is it possible the unreasonable crypto export restrictions are simply being imposed at this time for the purpose of making Al Gore look good when he runs for President in 2000? In other words, his campaign could include promises to retract existing crypto export restrictions established by his predecessor. The campaign would be accompanied by slogans and rhetoric such as "export crypto, not jobs" and the crypto/high-tech community would support Gore and the Democratic party in droves.

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Re: Passphrase security
by nobody＠huge.cajones.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Deadwood Vilest K"arcinogen"OfTheMonth is so vile because rancid semen is dripping from all of his orifices. ^ ^ (o o) Deadwood Vilest K"arcinogen"OfTheMonth ( ) \___/ !_!

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Re: Fighting the cybercensor
by ichudov＠algebra.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

jim bell wrote: > Exactly correct. I will be killed by AP, my own invention. (however, I > will be killed for merely DESCRIBING it, not only if I started the first > instance of it.) Before I'd published the first part of AP, I knew and > accepted what was going to happen. See AP part 7, at the end, quoted here: > See, Phill, I was right. igor

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A comment on the censorship policy
by Anonymous 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

I cannot understand how some of my (accurate) criticisms of Sandfort's censorhip polices---some in direct response to his own self-serving posts declaring himself not to be a flamer himself---are not making it to the "New and Improved Censored List," while inane posts from Toto, Thorn, and someone named "Nurdane Oksas" are appearing. (Oksas has the especially annoying habit of quoting entire posts and then appending a one-line piece of completely list-irrelevant fluff. Also, engaging in lovey-… [View More]

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Re: The Politics of Export Restrictions
by Greg Broiles 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 09:44 PM 1/29/97 -0800, Rick Hornbeck wrote: >Is it possible the unreasonable crypto export restrictions are simply being >imposed at this time for the purpose of making Al Gore look good when he >runs for President in 2000? I suppose it's plausible, but it's an opportunity open to both candidates, and more plausibly (because of lack of collaboration) to the Republicans - e.g., Dan Quayle and the "Crypto Freedom For Americans" platform, promising to rescue Silicon Valley from … [View More]

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The Politics of Export Restrictions
by Rick Hornbeck 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Is it possible the unreasonable crypto export restrictions are simply being imposed at this time for the purpose of making Al Gore look good when he runs for President in 2000? In other words, his campaign could include promises to retract existing crypto export restrictions established by his predecessor. The campaign would be accompanied by slogans and rhetoric such as "export crypto, not jobs" and the crypto/high-tech community would support Gore and the Democratic party in droves.

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Re: Altavista
by Leonid S Knyshov 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Isn't it the future of internet advertising? I mean its just like Juno's and other companies, the only ads shown to customers are those that are relevant to their needs as submitted. Like do a search for web promotion and you are gonna get ads of various services etc. It is highly unlikely that detailed logs are kept since Alta-vista gets overwhelming number of hits. The way I go around all these ads is that I use Internet Fast Find by symantec and I love it, I purchased it after evaluating … [View More]

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Re: Sovreign Right of Lawful Access
by jim bell 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 10:11 PM 1/28/97 -0600, Mike McNally wrote: >Somebody wrote: >> >> This morning at the RSA keynote, David Aaron, the US Crypto >> ambassador quoted the "Sovreign Right of Lawful Access" as >> something that goverments were determined to preserve. > >Speaking as a private indiwidual, and not as a drone in the employ >of IBM (don't get me started on the "but wait, key recovery *isn't* >the same as key escrow" hoo-ha), that dude scared the piss out of &… [View More]

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Best Computer School?
by Hal Abelson 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Rick Osborne <osborne(a)gateway.grumman.com> writes: The only thing I didn't have that the next MIT applicant had was money. I made the mistake of letting them know that I was dirt poor and would need full aid/grants/etc, and to quote "The Great Escape" it was "Zzzt! To the Russian front!" Just to set the record straight, MIT's admissions is need-blind. Lots of things go into our admissions decisions, but whether or not an applicant needs financial aid is not one of them. … [View More]

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Best Computer School?
by Hal Abelson 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Rick Osborne <osborne(a)gateway.grumman.com> writes: The only thing I didn't have that the next MIT applicant had was money. I made the mistake of letting them know that I was dirt poor and would need full aid/grants/etc, and to quote "The Great Escape" it was "Zzzt! To the Russian front!" Just to set the record straight, MIT's admissions is need-blind. Lots of things go into our admissions decisions, but whether or not an applicant needs financial aid is not one of them. … [View More]

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Re: Sovreign Right of Lawful Access
by jim bell 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 10:11 PM 1/28/97 -0600, Mike McNally wrote: >Somebody wrote: >> >> This morning at the RSA keynote, David Aaron, the US Crypto >> ambassador quoted the "Sovreign Right of Lawful Access" as >> something that goverments were determined to preserve. > >Speaking as a private indiwidual, and not as a drone in the employ >of IBM (don't get me started on the "but wait, key recovery *isn't* >the same as key escrow" hoo-ha), that dude scared the piss out of &… [View More]

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Re: The Politics of Export Restrictions
by Greg Broiles 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 09:44 PM 1/29/97 -0800, Rick Hornbeck wrote: >Is it possible the unreasonable crypto export restrictions are simply being >imposed at this time for the purpose of making Al Gore look good when he >runs for President in 2000? I suppose it's plausible, but it's an opportunity open to both candidates, and more plausibly (because of lack of collaboration) to the Republicans - e.g., Dan Quayle and the "Crypto Freedom For Americans" platform, promising to rescue Silicon Valley from … [View More]

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Re: DES challenge status?
by Anil Das 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Ben Byer wrote: >=20 > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- >=20 > What exactly is the status of RSA's DES contest? I understand that at > least two of the smaller contests have already been cracked, but I > haven't seen much beyond theoretical discussion on the list on the > topic of the DES contest. >=20 =09Two? The only publicized solution so far is the RC5/32/12/5 solution from Ian Goldberg at Berkeley (and independently from Germano Caronni at ETH Z=FCrich). =09Are … [View More]

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Best Computer School?
by Hal Abelson 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Rick Osborne <osborne(a)gateway.grumman.com> writes: The only thing I didn't have that the next MIT applicant had was money. I made the mistake of letting them know that I was dirt poor and would need full aid/grants/etc, and to quote "The Great Escape" it was "Zzzt! To the Russian front!" Just to set the record straight, MIT's admissions is need-blind. Lots of things go into our admissions decisions, but whether or not an applicant needs financial aid is not one of them. … [View More]

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Re: Sovreign Right of Lawful Access
by Mike McNally 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

jim bell wrote: > > I see no reason to believe that the advent of telephone technology > in the late 1800's should have retroactively re-written the US > Constitution ... This point, unfortunately, seems to be lost in the woods. At the panel discussions in this conference, so many people used phrases like "... law enforcement doing what they need to do..." on *both* sides of the GAK fence. "Need" to do? Well, they might "need" to do lots of things under their own view of … [View More]

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Re: FBI=LIE
by Dale Thorn 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Adam Shostack wrote: > http://www.nytimes.com/yr/mo/day/news/washpol/fbi-lab.html > Login cypherpunks, password cypherpunks. > WASHINGTON -- For decades the FBI's reputation as a crime-fighting > agency has rested heavily on its high-tech forensic laboratory, which > could solve baffling crimes from a speck of blood, a sliver of paint > or the thinnest filament of human hair. > But an investigation by the Justice Department's inspector > general has put the … [View More]

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Re: Fighting the cybercensor
by Dale Thorn 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Sean Roach wrote: > At 08:15 PM 1/28/97 -0800, Steve Schear wrote: > >I think a hole in your thinking is to assume that the assasins have no > >motive other than financial gain. I would submit that there are those that > >have the skills, training and a political agenda coherent with the > >wagerers, lacking only the financial incentive to make the risks > >acceptable. These wetworkers won't consider accepting the bribe of the > >rich/powerful > This … [View More]

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Re: Rejection policy of the Cypherpunks mailing list
by Dale Thorn 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

aga wrote: > On Tue, 28 Jan 1997, Dale Thorn wrote: > > aga wrote: > > > On Tue, 28 Jan 1997, Dale Thorn wrote: > > > > > > But seriously, I was just telling the folks over the weekend, if I > > > > > > had my hand on the button, a lot of people would die very quickly. > > > > > > As in The Day The Earth Stood Still, a single act of aggression would > > > > > > suffice to be immediately terminated. > &… [View More]gt; > No trial, huh? > > Good question. The law we have right now already assumes that there > > are situations where a criminal will not go peacefully, if at all. > > In some countries (years ago?) such as England, bobbies were known > > to not carry firearms for ordinary street duty. Am I right? But > > here in the USA, that would be unthinkable. > > So my proposal doesn't eliminate the responsibility portion of law > > enforcement. I'd say, if a target were eliminated thru negligence, > > malfeasance, or other wrongdoing under "color of law" or whatever, > > let the courts handle that as they do now. > Just who is doing the eliminating? > > My suggestion would give the law enforcers the ability to dispense > > the first level of justice expeditiously, which they cannot accomplish > > now due to all of the red tape and the corrupt legal system (lawyers > > specialize in getting chronic offenders off, particularly "traffic" > > offenses). By transferring a major portion of the bureaucracy to > > the pencil pushers, we can free up the street cops to do what they > > do best, namely bust or eliminate criminals. > Cops can never be trusted to "dispense justice," and half of the > cops are themselves criminals in what they do. Most cops steal > evidence and lie like crazy in Court. All they want is a conviction, > and it mattters not how it is obtained. All true. But I'm not suggesting the creation of anything new here. Cops already carry guns and kill people. All I'm suggesting is that they be empowered to kill when: 1) The crime is aggression against another person or persons; 2) The evidence is so solid (recorded?) that the officer (who risks being prosecuted if he kills unjustifiably) can carry out the enforcement without undue apprehension; 3) These things are reviewed by the elected representatives of the people, to make sure there's no hanky-panky going on. > > I dare say that the downside of this is much less pleasant than the > > virtual anarchy (in the bad sense) we suffer now. If the police get > > out of control, A.P. will arrive just in time to plug a few of those > > holes, so to speak. Ideally, future robotics should be able to > > provide something like Gort (sp?) to take the place of human officers, > > given advances in the kind of pattern matching needed to deter > > aggression and the like. Those who don't make it past the robots, > > well, the rest of us can learn to behave, and we'll be much better > > off when we do. > > I would trust robots more than humanoids. The Gort (sp?) robot is a perfect example, and I don't think it's all that many years away. [View Less]

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Re: Cats Out of Bags
by tmcghan＠gill-simpson.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

According to Duncan Frissell <frissell(a)panix.com> > "In an interview Tuesday, [David L.] Aaron [the Feds' Crypto Ambassador] disputed the {snip} > "When I talk to other governments," he said, "they still don't feel... ===(mis)quoted, paraphrased, and enhanced from current news reports=== The Clinton administration's newly named point man on encryption policy is citing international support for U.S. policies limiting use of encryption and called for industry cooperation. … [View More]Speaking to the RSA Data Security Conference in San Francisco, David Aaron said that U.S. allies support the concept of lawful access by governments and the use of key recovery mechanisms. The White House's continued restrictions on encryption have been unpopular in the cryptography community and among major U.S. corporations and high tech companies because of the business disadvantage vis a vis foreign firms. Aaron alleges that U.S. trading partners have misgivings about the U.S. government's decision in October to allow 'moderately strong' 56-bit encryption, to be exported, under controlled circumstances, but were willing to cooperate on the policy. "As far as I can see, the international encryption market will not be a free-wheeling affair," he said, adding companies should consider that lawful access and key escrow capabilities may become "a growthe industry" In his speech, Aaron also listed cases where the U.S. government said encryption was used in terrorist plots, drug dealing, child pornography and espionage, adding the White House, "in no way seeks to expand law enforcement powers nor reduce the privacy of individuals." Independent experts strongly disagreed with Aaron's characterization of the international posture following his address here, and leading U.S. legislators said they would continue to push for further reform of the restrictions. "I just don't think it will work," Sen. Conrad Burns, a Montana Republican who has been behind the legislative effort to promote use of stronger levels of encryption, said of the White House encryption policy. "I think if bad people want to do bad things to good people, they certainly won't want to file their key (with any law enforcement authorities)," Burns said in a satellite conference. Marc Rotenberg, director of the Washington, D.C.-based Electronic Privacy Information Center, rebutted Aaron's suggestion that Washington has broad international support for its concept of lawful access by governments to the keys to encrypted files and communications. Rotenberg said at the recent Organization of Economic Cooperation and Development (OECD) meetings on encryption policy, that was not the case, nor were a number of countries pushing for stronger controls, as Aaron said they had been. Germany, Australia, Japan and Canada all are advancing competing cryptography capabilities, according to Rotenberg. Thomas M. McGhan tmcghan(a)gill-simpson.com http://www.gill-simpson.com voice: (410) 467-3335 fax: (410) 235-6961 pagenet: (410) 716-1342 cellular: (410) 241-9113 ICBM: 39.395N 76.469W [View Less]

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encrypt_3.html
by Lynx_User＠linux.nycmetro.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Reuters New Media [ Yahoo | Write Us | Search | Info ] [ Index | News | World | Biz | Tech | Politic | Sport | Scoreboard | Entertain | Health ] _________________________________________________________________ Previous Story: Kodak To Buy Wang Software Business Next … [View More]Story: Netscape Counts On User Upgrades In 1997 _________________________________________________________________ Wednesday January 29 3:26 PM EST U.S. Encryption Envoy Seeks Industry Cooperation SAN FRANCISCO - The Clinton administration's newly named point man on encryption policy is citing international support for U.S. policies limiting use of encryption and called for industry cooperation. Ambassador David Aaron, special envoy for cryptography, said on a speech to the RSA Data Security Conference in San Francisco that U.S. allies support the concept of lawful access by governments and the use of key recovery mechanisms. Key recovery would involve storing encoding keys in escrow so authorities could get access to them to unscramble data in an emergency, such as to uncover criminal activity. The White House's continued restrictions on encryption have been unpopular in the cryptography community and among major U.S. corporations and high tech companies, which argue the limitations put U.S. business at a disadvantage. Aaron said some U.S. trading partners have misgivings about the U.S. government's decision in October to relax U.S. export controls to allow export of moderately strong 56-bit encryption, but were willing to cooperate on the policy. "As far as I can see, the international encryption market will not be a free-wheeling affair," he said, adding companies should consider that lawful access and key escrow capabilities may become "a growing international requirement." In his speech, Aaron also listed cases where the U.S. government said encryption was used in terrorist plots, drug dealing, child pornography and espionage, adding the White House, "in no way seeks to expand law enforcement powers nor reduce the privacy of individuals." But some independent experts who monitor cryptography policy disagreed with Aaron's characterization of the international posture following his address here, and leading U.S. legislators said they would continue to push the White House to further liberalize the restrictions. "I just don't think it will work," Sen. Conrad Burns, a Montana Republican who has been behind the legislative effort to promote use of stronger levels of encryption, said of the White House encryption policy. "I think if bad people want to do bad things to good people, they certainly won't want to file their key (with any law enforcement authorities)," he told conference attendees over a satellite linkup. Burns appeared in the linkup with three legislative colleagues to stress that together they would push to put "get the administration out in front of the cryptography curve." Marc Rotenberg, director of the Washington, D.C.-based Electronic Privacy Information Center, rebutted Aaron's suggestion that Washington has broad international support for its concept of lawful access by governments to the keys to encrypted files and communications. Rotenberg said at the recent Organization of Economic Cooperation and Development (OECD) meetings on encryption policy, that was not the case, nor were a number of countries pushing for stronger controls, as Aaron said they had been. In fact, countries such as Japan, Germany, Australia and Canada all have competing cryptography capabilities they are promoting, he added. The OECD guidelines are due to be published next month. Copyright, Reuters Ltd. All rights reserved _________________________________________________________________ Earlier Related Stories * Encryption Export Bill Backed In Senate - Wed Jan 29 9:54 am _________________________________________________________________ ________________________ ___________ Help _________________________________________________________________ Previous Story: Kodak To Buy Wang Software Business Next Story: Netscape Counts On User Upgrades In 1997 _________________________________________________________________ [ Index | News | World | Biz | Tech | Politic | Sport | Scoreboard | Entertain | Health ] _________________________________________________________________ Reuters Limited Questions or Comments [View Less]

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KOW_tow
by John Young 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

1-28-97: "New Crypto Engines From Trusted Information Systems Allow Easy International Use of Strong Encryption " By supporting any application that calls for the use of algorithms such as DES, Triple-DES, or 128-bit RC2 or RC4, "this product will allow Windows users to use encryption as easily as they use a mouse. Previously, if developers wanted to use encryption in their products, they had to consider writing two different versions, dealing with changing export regulations,… [View More]

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Re: The Politics of Export Restrictions
by Declan McCullagh 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Agreed. It's the Republicans who are the most adamantly pro-crypto. They'd love to use it as a noose to hang Gore in 2000. If Gore switches positions -- which I think unlikely -- it'll just be another area where both parties agree. A minor point: since Gore has been the chief crypto-critic of this administration, if he switched he'd leave himself open to charges of waffling. Then again, some administration officials tell me they expect this debate to be resolved within a year, so go figure. -… [View More]

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Re: Cats Out of Bags
by tmcghan＠gill-simpson.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

According to Duncan Frissell <frissell(a)panix.com> > "In an interview Tuesday, [David L.] Aaron [the Feds' Crypto Ambassador] disputed the {snip} > "When I talk to other governments," he said, "they still don't feel... ===(mis)quoted, paraphrased, and enhanced from current news reports=== The Clinton administration's newly named point man on encryption policy is citing international support for U.S. policies limiting use of encryption and called for industry cooperation. … [View More]Speaking to the RSA Data Security Conference in San Francisco, David Aaron said that U.S. allies support the concept of lawful access by governments and the use of key recovery mechanisms. The White House's continued restrictions on encryption have been unpopular in the cryptography community and among major U.S. corporations and high tech companies because of the business disadvantage vis a vis foreign firms. Aaron alleges that U.S. trading partners have misgivings about the U.S. government's decision in October to allow 'moderately strong' 56-bit encryption, to be exported, under controlled circumstances, but were willing to cooperate on the policy. "As far as I can see, the international encryption market will not be a free-wheeling affair," he said, adding companies should consider that lawful access and key escrow capabilities may become "a growthe industry" In his speech, Aaron also listed cases where the U.S. government said encryption was used in terrorist plots, drug dealing, child pornography and espionage, adding the White House, "in no way seeks to expand law enforcement powers nor reduce the privacy of individuals." Independent experts strongly disagreed with Aaron's characterization of the international posture following his address here, and leading U.S. legislators said they would continue to push for further reform of the restrictions. "I just don't think it will work," Sen. Conrad Burns, a Montana Republican who has been behind the legislative effort to promote use of stronger levels of encryption, said of the White House encryption policy. "I think if bad people want to do bad things to good people, they certainly won't want to file their key (with any law enforcement authorities)," Burns said in a satellite conference. Marc Rotenberg, director of the Washington, D.C.-based Electronic Privacy Information Center, rebutted Aaron's suggestion that Washington has broad international support for its concept of lawful access by governments to the keys to encrypted files and communications. Rotenberg said at the recent Organization of Economic Cooperation and Development (OECD) meetings on encryption policy, that was not the case, nor were a number of countries pushing for stronger controls, as Aaron said they had been. Germany, Australia, Japan and Canada all are advancing competing cryptography capabilities, according to Rotenberg. Thomas M. McGhan tmcghan(a)gill-simpson.com http://www.gill-simpson.com voice: (410) 467-3335 fax: (410) 235-6961 pagenet: (410) 716-1342 cellular: (410) 241-9113 ICBM: 39.395N 76.469W [View Less]

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cDc GD Update #21-1/97
by Swamp Ratte 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

_ _ ((___)) [ x x ] cDc communications \ / Global Domination Update #21 (' ') January 1st, 1997 (U) Est. 1984 FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE FOR MORE INFORMATION, CONTACT: sratte(a)mindvox.com CDC IS NEW FALLEN SNOW ON A BLEAK DESERT LANDSCAPE cDc communications is tittering with joy on the birth of this shiny new year to make two announcements. We are the proud parents of ten bouncing new articles in the continuing … [View More]saga of the CULT OF THE DEAD COW publication. These feisty little rugrats will put a smile on the face and a Brussels sprout in the stomach with their hearty blend of entertainment and information. We also can now make public our "Good Times" virus hoax. The Good Times meme was launched by cDc to prove the gullibility of self-proclaimed "experts" on the Internet. Any chickenhead would see through the Good Times virus message as the merest wisp of smoke that it is, while the so-called experts ran around in circles, beside themselves in self-induced panic. Therefore, CULT OF THE DEAD COW claims FULL responsibility for the waves of nausea and unrest that have spread from AOL to CompuServe to Prodigy by the actions of egotistical 'experts' who roam the Information Superhighway like squeegee men, seeking to wring a buck or two from the poor souls they confront at every intersection and stoplight on the infobahn. We have far worse to unleash upon you, should you insist upon pontificating and spreading obvious falsehoods. Heed well the motto of the Hell's Angels: "Those who know, don't tell. Those who tell, don't know." We'd also like to take this opportunity to quell a nasty rumor: cDc has NOT been bought-out over the past few months to ANYONE. cDc, as always is 100% independently owned and operated and has no outside sponsors. Viacom and Ziff-Davis, puh-leeze. Coming soon: cDc presents AUDIO on the Internet via Tarkin Darklighter's Shockwave site. New releases from Weasel-MX, Gravelheaver, Tha Gates, Superior Products, Grey Man, and Crucified Goat are on the way. Also, The cDc Media List version 3 from Omega... something fresh for the spring '97 fashion season. _ _ the tedium is the message _ _ ((___)) INFORMATION IS JUNK MAIL ((___)) [ x x ] _ [ x x ] \ / _ |_|_ _ _|_ _|_ |_ _ _| _ _. _| _ _ \ / (' ') (_|_|| |_ (_) | |_ | |(/_ (_|(/_(_|(_| (_(_)\_/\_/ (' ') (U) (U) .ooM cDc communications .ooM deal with it NEW RELEASES FOR JANUARY, 1997: deal with it ________________________________/text files\________________________________ 321:"Nineteen Seventy-Seven" by OXblood Ruffin. It was a good year... Star Wars, The Sex Pistols, the Apple II, and the Death of Elvis. And you thought they weren't connected? 322:"Pariah '67" by Matt Brown. It's like _The Wonder Years_ with real blood. Like Diet Coke with real sugar. Who would've thought Paul would grow up to drum for Marilyn Manson? Gosh. 323:"CYBERsitter" by Peacefire. Overprotective parents are being led down the primrose path to potential pathos. This is an important press release from the Peacefire organization concerning their efforts against the makers of the CYBERsitter Internet filtering software. 324:"Painted Stranger" by Weasel Boy. Creepy-as-hell goth fiction. People with monochromatic wardrobes and Victorian affectations, incest, tragic young death, The Beast. You know the drill. Hup hup! 325:"Zen of Skateboarding, Part 3: Flowing Stream" by Thoai Tran. Skate and destroy. Death to false skating. The search for beauty and truth continues. 326:"The Great Southern Fire God" by John Crow. Everything would be great if it weren't for those DAMN YANKEES (nevermind The Nuge, this is _serious bidness_). Will the assembly please rise and join with me in singing "Sweet Home Alabama." 327:"Vulnerabilities in the S/KEY One-Time Password System" by Mudge. All that and a bucket of chicken wings. 328:"Pantslessness" by Mark Buda. I don't know about you, but every time I go outside without pants, the squirrels poke at my BARE-NAKED POSTERIOR with twigs. They ain't got covered rumps neither. Freaks! 329:"Quadro-Pounder" by Drunkfux. He wants lots of meat. Huh-huh. 330:"Happyland Cell Block 90210" by G. Allen Perry. "Where am I?" "You're in a cheap run-down teenage jail, that's where." "Oh my God!" -The Runaways Reading is FUNdamental! _______________________________/ - x X x - \________________________________ Fools better recognize: CULT OF THE DEAD COW is a publication and trademark of cDc communications. Established in 1984, cDc is the largest and oldest organization of the telecommunications underground worldwide, and inventor of the "e-zine." Every issue is produced on an Apple II for genuine old-school flavor. You thirst for our body of work, you know you do. Find it at these fine locations, among others: World Wide Web: //www.l0pht.com/cdc.html FTP/Gopher: cascade.net in pub/cDc Usenet: alt.fan.cult-dead-cow BBS: 806/794-4362 Entry:KILL For further information, contact: Email: sratte(a)mindvox.com Postal: POB 53011, Lubbock, TX, 79453, USA Sincerely, Grandmaster Ratte' cDc/Editor, Fearless Leader, and Pontiff "We're into telecom for the groupies and money." #### By THE NIGHTSTALKER and GRatte'. Copyright (c) 1997 cDc communications. [View Less]

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Re: Last nail for US crypto export policy?
by Bill Stewart 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 10:45 AM 1/29/97 -0500, Dan Geer wrote: >Steve is absolutely right on the money, particularly about the likely >happiness on the government side. I pretty much agree. On the other hand, Ian did a nice job on the radio (NPR, probably was All Things Considered) of pushing the "look, if a college student can break 40 bits in a couple of hours, it's really stupid for the government to limit us like this"; a couple of other people also contributed spin, and it came out pretty strongly … [View More]

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Re: Workaround for filtering/cybersitter
by Pavel Korensky 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Mark Rogaski <wendigo(a)pobox.com> wrote: > If I had experience with Netscape plugins and spare time, I'd > try it myself. But here's my proposed solution. > > A plugin in Netscape intercepts all requests, encrypt the URL > with a pubkey algorithm, encode the string base64, send it as GET input to > a proxy server. > > The proxy server decodes and decrypts the URL, gets the requested page, > and returns it. This beats out URL-based filtering. > > … [View More]

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encrypt_3.html
by Lynx_User＠linux.nycmetro.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Reuters New Media [ Yahoo | Write Us | Search | Info ] [ Index | News | World | Biz | Tech | Politic | Sport | Scoreboard | Entertain | Health ] _________________________________________________________________ Previous Story: Kodak To Buy Wang Software Business Next … [View More]Story: Netscape Counts On User Upgrades In 1997 _________________________________________________________________ Wednesday January 29 3:26 PM EST U.S. Encryption Envoy Seeks Industry Cooperation SAN FRANCISCO - The Clinton administration's newly named point man on encryption policy is citing international support for U.S. policies limiting use of encryption and called for industry cooperation. Ambassador David Aaron, special envoy for cryptography, said on a speech to the RSA Data Security Conference in San Francisco that U.S. allies support the concept of lawful access by governments and the use of key recovery mechanisms. Key recovery would involve storing encoding keys in escrow so authorities could get access to them to unscramble data in an emergency, such as to uncover criminal activity. The White House's continued restrictions on encryption have been unpopular in the cryptography community and among major U.S. corporations and high tech companies, which argue the limitations put U.S. business at a disadvantage. Aaron said some U.S. trading partners have misgivings about the U.S. government's decision in October to relax U.S. export controls to allow export of moderately strong 56-bit encryption, but were willing to cooperate on the policy. "As far as I can see, the international encryption market will not be a free-wheeling affair," he said, adding companies should consider that lawful access and key escrow capabilities may become "a growing international requirement." In his speech, Aaron also listed cases where the U.S. government said encryption was used in terrorist plots, drug dealing, child pornography and espionage, adding the White House, "in no way seeks to expand law enforcement powers nor reduce the privacy of individuals." But some independent experts who monitor cryptography policy disagreed with Aaron's characterization of the international posture following his address here, and leading U.S. legislators said they would continue to push the White House to further liberalize the restrictions. "I just don't think it will work," Sen. Conrad Burns, a Montana Republican who has been behind the legislative effort to promote use of stronger levels of encryption, said of the White House encryption policy. "I think if bad people want to do bad things to good people, they certainly won't want to file their key (with any law enforcement authorities)," he told conference attendees over a satellite linkup. Burns appeared in the linkup with three legislative colleagues to stress that together they would push to put "get the administration out in front of the cryptography curve." Marc Rotenberg, director of the Washington, D.C.-based Electronic Privacy Information Center, rebutted Aaron's suggestion that Washington has broad international support for its concept of lawful access by governments to the keys to encrypted files and communications. Rotenberg said at the recent Organization of Economic Cooperation and Development (OECD) meetings on encryption policy, that was not the case, nor were a number of countries pushing for stronger controls, as Aaron said they had been. In fact, countries such as Japan, Germany, Australia and Canada all have competing cryptography capabilities they are promoting, he added. The OECD guidelines are due to be published next month. Copyright, Reuters Ltd. All rights reserved _________________________________________________________________ Earlier Related Stories * Encryption Export Bill Backed In Senate - Wed Jan 29 9:54 am _________________________________________________________________ ________________________ ___________ Help _________________________________________________________________ Previous Story: Kodak To Buy Wang Software Business Next Story: Netscape Counts On User Upgrades In 1997 _________________________________________________________________ [ Index | News | World | Biz | Tech | Politic | Sport | Scoreboard | Entertain | Health ] _________________________________________________________________ Reuters Limited Questions or Comments [View Less]

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KOW_tow
by John Young 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

1-28-97: "New Crypto Engines From Trusted Information Systems Allow Easy International Use of Strong Encryption " By supporting any application that calls for the use of algorithms such as DES, Triple-DES, or 128-bit RC2 or RC4, "this product will allow Windows users to use encryption as easily as they use a mouse. Previously, if developers wanted to use encryption in their products, they had to consider writing two different versions, dealing with changing export regulations,… [View More]

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Re: OTP security
by paul＠fatmans.demon.co.uk 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

> 1.You've got 16 hardware devices that each generate random noise. > 2.One of the devices fails (or is sabotaged) and emits a predictable stream > (10101...) > 3.The other 15 devices are just fine, and the stream generated by one > device does not effect the stream of another. > 4.You do not know of the (failure/sabotage) until *after* you've generated > your encyrted documents and they are out of your hands. > > So the revamped question is: > How secure are … [View More]

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Re: Sovreign Right of Lawful Access
by tmcghan＠gill-simpson.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

according to the notorious jim bell <jimbell(a)pacifier.com> > {snip} They're getting desperate. "Sovereign Right of Lawful Access" > doesn't state HOW DIFFICULT that "access" is to be. {snip} Just might get a bit more 'difficult', if these demagogues get their grandstand play off.... >Encryption Export Bill Backed In Senate >WASHINGTON - A bipartisan group of U.S. senators has endorsed a bill >to promote U.S. exports of encryption technology by removing … [View More]

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The Politics of Export Restrictions - Clarified
by Rick Hornbeck 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

I agree the strategy would have to be hijack-proof. Something like Gore experiencing a convenient "change of heart" towards the end of this current term and convincing Clinton and the administration to soften crypto export restrictions which would make Gore look like a hero to the high-tech community just in time for the election. Naturally this would have to be carefully scripted but the objective would be to keep the democrats in power. Just a theory. >Return-Path: <owner-… [View More]

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