December 2003 - cypherpunks-legacy

RE: greed and the internet
by Internaut 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Will you send some references for Internet II and the government hubs? Thx, Internaut ---------- From: Attila T. Hun[SMTP:attila@primenet.com] Sent: Wednesday, January 22, 1997 08.32 PM To: cypherpunks Subject: greed and the internet -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- greed and the internet our network provider (MCI) has been gradually burying our T1 trunk and the effective feed has been reduced to 1200 baud from 1.56 Megabaud; that, and add 20 seconds to 5+ minutes of packet hold, and it is now worthless. they claim they will have increased capacity, but there are no pressing big money commercial interests on this feeder --so when? Problem is not just here --everywhere; the greedy commercial bastards have oversold their network space intentionally as they are bucking for per packet and timed usage charges which are currently prohibited by the FCC and the state PUCs. The FCC is the key since other than the local network, which is burdened with the costs of the trunk, everything is regulated by the FCC which is trying to totally eliminate the state PUCs in the 105th Congress, Newt's mouth not withstanding. The FCC agreed to review the matter, capitulating to big greed interests, which will make the Internet a rich man's toy. $19.95/month plus access charges will increase to thousands of dollars per month; slow networks make toast of the free hours and overtime kills. Without the creative input of the multitude, there will be no content, so why have a net other than for commercial purposes? suites the misinformation cabal just fine. Well, the FCC granted a reprieve --for the moment. but will come up again, and again, until it passes. The Internet will no no longer be the peoples net, and the commercial greedies are establishing a faster, more secure network with controlled access points; leaving the common man's access in the mud, still paying the exorbitant rates on a pay before play basis. That, and it gives control of information to the government --which, as we all know. is 'heavenly white' -above sin. Universities are being bought off with the 'Internet II' proposal which provides super trunks of over 600 Megabaud capacity, a 400 times improvement. All of this feeds into five stategically placed super-hubs where Uncle's shadow government can monitor everything. The Internet was supposed to be our freedom: freedom of information and government in the sunshine, but government is proving it is still bigger, faster, and badder by using draconian rules of illegal regulatory agencies. agencies which are usurping rights limited to the legislative branch. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.3i Charset: latin1 Comment: Encrypted with 2.6.3i. Requires 2.6 or later. iQCVAwUBMubOW704kQrCC2kFAQE0gQQAxrkUhyX5wl+dZ/i6ajMJXAD7f+gpvc6Z CBik+g62RqWrMbOblfLRubhEIWUfK2FQxIBRJ+0cQezCH4IfM1CxbytJ4Cx3BBBs GwHGuhTfLnGVnuCAugguRdNUrd/tXaN47pAVqmg330XvLlTJqha8ODPsi2b+7qst 2z8qbOW0cqo= =M9c5 -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

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RE: greed and the internet
by Internaut 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Will you send some references for Internet II and the government hubs? Thx, Internaut ---------- From: Attila T. Hun[SMTP:attila@primenet.com] Sent: Wednesday, January 22, 1997 08.32 PM To: cypherpunks Subject: greed and the internet -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- greed and the internet our network provider (MCI) has been gradually burying our T1 trunk and the effective feed has been reduced to 1200 baud from 1.56 Megabaud; that, and add 20 seconds to 5+ minutes of packet hold, and it is now worthless. they claim they will have increased capacity, but there are no pressing big money commercial interests on this feeder --so when? Problem is not just here --everywhere; the greedy commercial bastards have oversold their network space intentionally as they are bucking for per packet and timed usage charges which are currently prohibited by the FCC and the state PUCs. The FCC is the key since other than the local network, which is burdened with the costs of the trunk, everything is regulated by the FCC which is trying to totally eliminate the state PUCs in the 105th Congress, Newt's mouth not withstanding. The FCC agreed to review the matter, capitulating to big greed interests, which will make the Internet a rich man's toy. $19.95/month plus access charges will increase to thousands of dollars per month; slow networks make toast of the free hours and overtime kills. Without the creative input of the multitude, there will be no content, so why have a net other than for commercial purposes? suites the misinformation cabal just fine. Well, the FCC granted a reprieve --for the moment. but will come up again, and again, until it passes. The Internet will no no longer be the peoples net, and the commercial greedies are establishing a faster, more secure network with controlled access points; leaving the common man's access in the mud, still paying the exorbitant rates on a pay before play basis. That, and it gives control of information to the government --which, as we all know. is 'heavenly white' -above sin. Universities are being bought off with the 'Internet II' proposal which provides super trunks of over 600 Megabaud capacity, a 400 times improvement. All of this feeds into five stategically placed super-hubs where Uncle's shadow government can monitor everything. The Internet was supposed to be our freedom: freedom of information and government in the sunshine, but government is proving it is still bigger, faster, and badder by using draconian rules of illegal regulatory agencies. agencies which are usurping rights limited to the legislative branch. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.3i Charset: latin1 Comment: Encrypted with 2.6.3i. Requires 2.6 or later. iQCVAwUBMubOW704kQrCC2kFAQE0gQQAxrkUhyX5wl+dZ/i6ajMJXAD7f+gpvc6Z CBik+g62RqWrMbOblfLRubhEIWUfK2FQxIBRJ+0cQezCH4IfM1CxbytJ4Cx3BBBs GwHGuhTfLnGVnuCAugguRdNUrd/tXaN47pAVqmg330XvLlTJqha8ODPsi2b+7qst 2z8qbOW0cqo= =M9c5 -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

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by CV Communications 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

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No Dimitri??
by William H. Geiger III 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- I have noticed that there has not been any post from Dimitri in a couple of days. I am assuming that this means that the list moderation has now started? - -- - ----------------------------------------------------------- William H. Geiger III http://www.amaranth.com/~whgiii Geiger Consulting Cooking With Warp 4.0 Author of E-Secure - PGP Front End for MR/2 Ice PGP & MR/2 the only way for secure e-mail. Finger whgiii(a)amaranth.com for PGP Key and other info - ----------------------------------------------------------- Tag-O-Matic: OS/2: Logic, not magic. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.2 iQCVAwUBMuexAI9Co1n+aLhhAQGcIAQAkEhaPi0bljU274ZXgkjU3rXFmIrUS4dm OEm0CqTH0eGDYHyftEyGdwI8ibKukC9SVpgG8bzgKHP+O4tjXJN+afcVAHbTxaMy uVqxgsvOexUR0tFKVCQ7MySMwCyDudCSbsDgf8Ox2swISwmIOqaxwLrBF5DqDy9w G6JNq5gUruo= =hIV+ -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

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No Dimitri??
by William H. Geiger III 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- I have noticed that there has not been any post from Dimitri in a couple of days. I am assuming that this means that the list moderation has now started? - -- - ----------------------------------------------------------- William H. Geiger III http://www.amaranth.com/~whgiii Geiger Consulting Cooking With Warp 4.0 Author of E-Secure - PGP Front End for MR/2 Ice PGP & MR/2 the only way for secure e-mail. Finger whgiii(a)amaranth.com for PGP Key and other info - ----------------------------------------------------------- Tag-O-Matic: OS/2: Logic, not magic. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.2 iQCVAwUBMuexAI9Co1n+aLhhAQGcIAQAkEhaPi0bljU274ZXgkjU3rXFmIrUS4dm OEm0CqTH0eGDYHyftEyGdwI8ibKukC9SVpgG8bzgKHP+O4tjXJN+afcVAHbTxaMy uVqxgsvOexUR0tFKVCQ7MySMwCyDudCSbsDgf8Ox2swISwmIOqaxwLrBF5DqDy9w G6JNq5gUruo= =hIV+ -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

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Re: Fighting the cybercensor. (fwd)
by Asgaard 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

On Wed, 22 Jan 1997, Jim Choate wrote: >The Web does not equal the Internet, straw man argument. A semantic comment: We here all know that this is right but it's obvious that the language is sliding towards Internet = Web. Most people using tcp/ip email don't think about this as using the Internet. Another list I'm on has recently set up a Hypermail site on the Web, mingling transparently with the list, for those who are overwhelmed by 100 posts a day (it's a proffessional list unrelated to computers per se). When people here about it they say: 'Wow, I didn't know you had access to the list on the Internet too!' It's treated the same on television, in the US as well as here in Sweden, Internet = Web and nothing else. It will be hard for us who have been around for a while, and to fresh computer litterates who know something of what's behind the screen, to relearn the use of the term 'Internet'. But we will eventually have to accept it or become 'dinosaurs', that's the way language evolution works. Asgaard

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Re: Commerical applications (was: Development and validation (fwd)
by Sean Roach 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 05:20 PM 1/23/97 +1100, proff(a)suburbia.net wrote: ... >The catch is that positive votes are inherently more valuable than >negative votes, since to obstruct progress requires a number of votes >equal to the outstanding proposals, but to move forward a proposal only >requires a number of votes equal to the proposal. Blind obstructionism >(and blind advocacy) are uneconomical. That's the point of having >more than one vote to potentially spend on an issue, with potentially >more issues than you can vote on all of them. You will have to pick >you battles carefully if you want to avoid being lost in the noise. > Here you risk the media controlling the vote even better. First they push a tearjerker proposal early in the year to swallow up all of the votes, then they ask for special interest legislation to protect their respective monopolies on grounds of ecology, (one paper means more trees, one TV station means clearer communication, etc.) ... >For reciprocity, it's possible to charge off percentages in the >win/lose case to bias the power concentration: if your side wins, it >costs you one less token then you voted, etc.. Again, initial >bylaws are established through constitution provision: "we have the >power that is being shared, therefore, these are the weights". > ... This prompts people to vote with who they think will win as opposed to how they feel. In this case the media shows numerous charts showing a pending landslide in thier favor. What do you know, everyone voted in favor of the media just to recycle votes. ... >Heh. I was thinking more in terms of its value as a cascade trigger >to increasingly complex social organisms in the Internet implementation >space. Representational democracies (republics, really) came about >because of rate limits on communication. The US could not elect a >president by popular vote because there were no methods of verification, >and communication rates were limited by travel time. Therefore, the >US has an Electoral College. But a side effect of this structure is >a bias for bipartite seperation of interests, instead of seperation >into as many interest groups as it takes to do the job of mapping the >interest space. This bias is not removed because the bipartite >interests have (and must continue to have) the power concentration. >This leads to continued "wasted vote syndrome", where people vote >for the lesser of two evils instead of voting their conscience... an >effect of mass psychology. Similar pressures prevent the polling >times from being changed to opening at 8am EST and closing at 8am EST >to prevent early returns from earlier time zones influencing the >outcome of elections before people in later time zones have even voted. >For example, Ross Perot got almost 20% of the vote in the 1992 >election, but 0% of the electors. He would still have lost, given >the actual values. There is actually a case in US history where the >winner of the electoral vote lost the popular vote... the president >was not chosen by the people, but by the electors. ... Actually, our founding fathers thought that the people were morons, a reasonable assumption since news carried so slowly and most people were more worried about how to survive the winter than how to read. ... >Yep. The reason I went weighted, by the way, was the volunteer >nature of the project. In theory, number of vote tokens spent >should be proportional to willingness to actually volunteer. As >you point out, there could be feedback here as well: for instance, >if a proposal passes, if it is completed, the tokens spent on >the vote could be refunded to those who voted for it. If it dies >on the vine, the tokens could be refunded to those who voted >against it. Being right would give you more license to participate, >and being wrong would not, etc.. Again, a matter for the initial >bylaws. ... Not being right, just agreeing with the concensus. Remember that most of the Germans eventually agreed with Hitler, that did not make them right. By the way, the general populus is still mostly morons. Even with a higher literacy rate. Most of them seem to use it to read the National Enquirer and Hollywood based publications.

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No Dimitri??
by drose＠azstarnet.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

William H. Geiger III wrote: >I have noticed that there has not been any post from Dimitri in a couple of >days. Yup. Ditto Tim May. Fair trade?

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Re: greed and the internet
by Rich Graves 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Internaut wrote: > > Will you send some references for Internet II and the government hubs? There is a www.internet2.edu -rich

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Re: Commerical applications (was: Development and validation (fwd)
by Sean Roach 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 05:20 PM 1/23/97 +1100, proff(a)suburbia.net wrote: ... >The catch is that positive votes are inherently more valuable than >negative votes, since to obstruct progress requires a number of votes >equal to the outstanding proposals, but to move forward a proposal only >requires a number of votes equal to the proposal. Blind obstructionism >(and blind advocacy) are uneconomical. That's the point of having >more than one vote to potentially spend on an issue, with potentially >more issues than you can vote on all of them. You will have to pick >you battles carefully if you want to avoid being lost in the noise. > Here you risk the media controlling the vote even better. First they push a tearjerker proposal early in the year to swallow up all of the votes, then they ask for special interest legislation to protect their respective monopolies on grounds of ecology, (one paper means more trees, one TV station means clearer communication, etc.) ... >For reciprocity, it's possible to charge off percentages in the >win/lose case to bias the power concentration: if your side wins, it >costs you one less token then you voted, etc.. Again, initial >bylaws are established through constitution provision: "we have the >power that is being shared, therefore, these are the weights". > ... This prompts people to vote with who they think will win as opposed to how they feel. In this case the media shows numerous charts showing a pending landslide in thier favor. What do you know, everyone voted in favor of the media just to recycle votes. ... >Heh. I was thinking more in terms of its value as a cascade trigger >to increasingly complex social organisms in the Internet implementation >space. Representational democracies (republics, really) came about >because of rate limits on communication. The US could not elect a >president by popular vote because there were no methods of verification, >and communication rates were limited by travel time. Therefore, the >US has an Electoral College. But a side effect of this structure is >a bias for bipartite seperation of interests, instead of seperation >into as many interest groups as it takes to do the job of mapping the >interest space. This bias is not removed because the bipartite >interests have (and must continue to have) the power concentration. >This leads to continued "wasted vote syndrome", where people vote >for the lesser of two evils instead of voting their conscience... an >effect of mass psychology. Similar pressures prevent the polling >times from being changed to opening at 8am EST and closing at 8am EST >to prevent early returns from earlier time zones influencing the >outcome of elections before people in later time zones have even voted. >For example, Ross Perot got almost 20% of the vote in the 1992 >election, but 0% of the electors. He would still have lost, given >the actual values. There is actually a case in US history where the >winner of the electoral vote lost the popular vote... the president >was not chosen by the people, but by the electors. ... Actually, our founding fathers thought that the people were morons, a reasonable assumption since news carried so slowly and most people were more worried about how to survive the winter than how to read. ... >Yep. The reason I went weighted, by the way, was the volunteer >nature of the project. In theory, number of vote tokens spent >should be proportional to willingness to actually volunteer. As >you point out, there could be feedback here as well: for instance, >if a proposal passes, if it is completed, the tokens spent on >the vote could be refunded to those who voted for it. If it dies >on the vine, the tokens could be refunded to those who voted >against it. Being right would give you more license to participate, >and being wrong would not, etc.. Again, a matter for the initial >bylaws. ... Not being right, just agreeing with the concensus. Remember that most of the Germans eventually agreed with Hitler, that did not make them right. By the way, the general populus is still mostly morons. Even with a higher literacy rate. Most of them seem to use it to read the National Enquirer and Hollywood based publications.

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A Remarkable Income Opportunity!!
by CV Communications 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

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North American crypto site -- correction
by Michael Paul Johnson 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Correction: the "front door" to the North American crypto site is http://www.sni.net/~mpj/usa/getcrypt.htm (the /usa was missing in in an earlier post) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 4.0 Personal Edition iQEVAgUBMuWW/W+Iqt/O4EnZAQHnSAgAmMNA1UcEsd8wTkLz50ayj16t8SCFnfLs y86ZwxUd0aD7PoyMwGXbr2KkY9E9/I+CQAf9P56DbxDSCWWPzZA0Tydy0Zb+yeH1 +hIoFYMJbWi4nj34B1OtiZeNW9QbWxqyD7CUu8gdaRncxM83tsFY9UAQd8+wyV3w IFyrT6MZj+WLNBh1IhzkKTSdJzNW1mool97hm2KHH/nVuSYtBiVixmeTXkyoB5NU NfesjceO9g0PrVl0jW7NE1kOCJteFI2AAEaAKVYLVYvgvEdGSUkO0DnAXzVFCGKv Eb7/Wk0S7YVEFgVfamxsHvu/PoofVnvXX92UtXPhcHmbobqANA/yfg== =2ZhX -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- Jesus Christ is coming back with power and glory! Are you READY? mailto:mpj@csn.net Bible site-> http://www.sni.net/~mpj Is 40:31 BBS 303-772-1062 PGPprint=3E67A5800DFBD16A 6D52D3A91C074E41

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Privacy-enhancing technologies for the Internet
by David Wagner 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Ian Goldberg, Eric Brewer, and I wrote a paper giving a high-level introduction to privacy-enhancing technologies for the Internet. Nothing terribly new, but it's about time this stuff made it past oral history and into the literature. To be presented at IEEE COMPCON '97 in February. The paper is available on the web. A html version is at http://www.cs.berkeley.edu/~daw/privacy-compcon97-www/privacy-html.html and there's a postscript version at http://www.cs.berkeley.edu/~daw/privacy-compcon97.ps Comments, critiques, and discussions are welcome.

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GOO_gol
by John Young 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Richard Crandall, NeXT scientist, writes eloquently on large numbers in February SciAm. He cites cryptographic strength as one result of research on the gargantuan googol and googolplex. He reviews current work on sieve techniques for factorization -- Quadratic, Number Field, Elliptic Curve Method and others -- as well as advanced algorithms. And exclaims: Blaine Garst, Doug Mitchell, Avadis Tevanian, Jr., and I implemented at NeXT what is one of the strongest -- if not the strongest -- encryption schemes available today, based on Mersenne primes. This patented scheme, termed Fast Elliptic Encryption (FEE), uses the algebra of elliptic curves, and it is very fast. ----- GOO_gol Thanks to PJP for pointing.

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about the e-mails that im recibing
by grupo textil glz ruelas 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Dir, cypher im recibing all your e-mails and i was wondering if you can do something abuot becouse to me all of this is pure yonk. so please do something and stop the e-mails im not a cypherpunk and i dont understan nothing you write ok see you.

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microcurrency: Netscape vs. Microsoft
by Vladimir Z. Nuri 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

it seems that microcurrency has still not hit the "big time" yet. or perhaps some people see otherwise. what is the evidence for how far it has penetrated ala DigiCash etc? I haven't seen much myself. I predict that microcurrency will not catch on in a big way until it is integrated with browsers, and when it is, it will be adopted in an insanely large rush like the way the web itself caught on with the GUI (and was mostly comatose before it). I'd like to have seen microcurrency catch on like a brushfire at this point, and was trying to figure out why it hadn't, and focused on the above key aspect. hence, I wonder: WHO WILL BE THE FIRST TO INCORPORATE A MICROCURRENCY FEATURE IN THEIR BROWSER, MICROSOFT OR NETSCAPE? why am I shouting? because I hope that we can create a buzz around this question, to the point that both manufacturers begin to realize how much is at stake in this single little feature. I'd like to see speculation and articles about it in the trade press. let it turn into a hot topic of conversation.. do either MS or Netsacpe have plans to do so right now? I suspect the future of the browser wars will belong to he who does the microcurrency feature. here's how it might work: the browser has an internal piggyback that can be filled up with cash. it has various features that prohibit a charge of greater than some fixed limit of being made, per time, per site etc... also in no case can more money than is currently in the piggy bank be charged. once the charge hits, there is no contesting allowed, because the charge is so low. a little bar on the user interface could indicate how much cash is left. the idea would also be to invent some new html tags that indicate the charge on a link. the charge is incurred when 1/2 of the page is sent (there would be all kinds of hacks in which people could retrieve only part of a page to avoid the charge, hence this limit or some variation thereof). so when I move my mouse over a link in the browser, I see not only its address as with Netscape's, but also some charge that will incur when I hit it. there could be color coding and little graphics for costs also. notice how much crypto really caught on when Netscape incorporated it, and how this action alone did more for the proliferation of crypto in cyberspace, almost, than all prior efforts combined. I think that microcurrency will be unleashed in a very similar way. the system I describe above can be built up pretty easily from existing technology such as DigiCash. pretty much all the major ingredients are available.. it's just a matter of time before some enterprising programmers plug it all together in an easy to use way. (as far as I know the Digicash software is not easily integrated with any browser, am I correct?) by framing the question as I have above, the question is no longer "how should microcurrency be implemented", or "should it be", but "who will be the first to do it?", a nice competitive incentive to the key companies involved. so, Netscape, Microsoft, are either of you listening? do you have any idea how much is riding on this option? are you working on it right now? if not, are you prepared to face the consequences? has anyone heard any rumors about their intention to implement microcurrency? I've long predicted some pretty revolutionary strides in cyberspace that will make all development up to now look pretty sickly and pale, when microcurrency is invented and brought into a trivial-to-use GUI. in a sense it is the the economic system that the whole industry (or even the whole world) has been waiting for ever since its beginning. it will unleash a torrent of frenzied innovation and reorganization beyond what anyone has ever seen or thought possible. p.s. has anyone done a plugin that handles cash in the way I am referring to? this may be a really neat way for third-party developers to cash in on this, but I suspect that it's so crucial that the browser manufacturers will eventually incorporate it themselves.

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Re: IMDMP: SOURCE CODE RELEASE ANNOUNCEMENT
by lucifer＠dhp.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 7:26 AM 1/18/1997, Sandy Sandfort wrote: >~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > SANDY SANDFORT > . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . > >C'punks, > >On Sat, 18 Jan 1997 paul(a)fatmans.demon.co.uk wrote: > >> ...but I must say the list has gone downhill sharply since >> the start of the censorship. > >I guess this a classic case of seeing what you want to see. >(Uh, Paul, the moderation experiment HASN'T STARTED YET.) No, he's got it right. The announcement of the moderation experiment was followed by a decline in interesting threads. "Why is the stock price falling? We only announced nationalization. IT HASN'T STARTED YET."

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Announcing On Line Tax Tips
by GJDCPA＠aol.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Hello,^Morons, January 17, 1997 Subject: Tax Tips and Important Due Date Reminder We are pleased to announce our site at http://www.gjdcpa.com. The purpose of our website is to provide information for the taxpaying public to assist you with your 1996 income tax return preparation.

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Cheap CyberShots
by Toto 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

In the interests of upgrading the quality of cheap shots in CyberSpace, I thought I would pass along the following as an example of how to 'finesse' a cheap shot. > Shouting Ground Technologies, Inc. is concerned about the increased > abuse of the internet with "spamming". In this instance, we find > ourselves in a dilemma. > * We do not condone any improper use of the internet, including > spamming. > * We respect the right of privacy of individuals, and the right > to conduct lawful business unhindered. ... > In the past few days we've received a lot of complaints about the > inappropriate messages. Several people have demanded that we take > immediate action. A couple were very critical that we did not > cut their internet access immediately. ... > So people are in effect suggesting that we > * Unilaterally violate the terms of their service contract, subjecting > us to liability for their lost business. > * Violate their right to privacy by filtering and reading all of > their e-mail and news traffic. > Presumably we would have the same culpability for all of our clients, > so we'd have to read everybody's e-mail before passing it on. We > suspect that anybody that wants to be treated that way already > has service with Prodigy.

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Internet Message
by Diode 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

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Re: microcurrency: Netscape vs. Microsoft
by Hal Finney 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

From: "Vladimir Z. Nuri" <vznuri(a)netcom.com> > I predict that microcurrency will not catch on in a big way > until it is integrated with browsers, and when it is, it > will be adopted in an insanely large rush like the way > the web itself caught on with the GUI (and was mostly comatose > before it). > [...] > notice how much crypto really caught on when Netscape > incorporated it, and how this action alone did more for > the proliferation of crypto in cyberspace, almost, than > all prior efforts combined. I think that microcurrency > will be unleashed in a very similar way. I assume you are referring to secure web connections via SSL in talking about crypto. In that case there was a very strong pent up demand for the service. Customers were afraid to send credit card numbers and other personal information across the web. Sellers were pressuring the net server companies to do something to quell these concerns so on-line selling could succeed. Netscape did it, and in the grand tradition of the net, implementation beat design and SSL defeated SHTTP. In its early versions SSL had a lot of problems but it was a good enough solution for what it needed to be. The question is whether there is similar market demand for pay per view web pages. Do web service operators think they can offer value added services which will motivate customers to click through the for-pay link? Maybe porn would be a good initial market. There are so many sites where you've got to sign up ahead of time for $20 or so for a month's membership. This is a considerable barrier. But if you could just take a peek for $.50 there would be a lot of people interested. Porn is what started the VCR market before it later "went respectable", so maybe the same thing could happen here. I know that a lot of the initial vendors with First Virtual were selling racy pictures, although I think the company has taken steps to reduce their association with that market. This is not exactly the microcurrency that Vladimir is talking about but it would be a good model for integrating some payment system with a browser and it could serve as the foundation for other for-pay pages with lower fees. There is also the issue of sellers learning to use the various payment systems which are out there. Here again if Netscape and Microsoft would just pick one then everyone could standardize on it, which would increase acceptance a great deal. Ecash as it is implemented now has the problem that the customer has to open a special bank account. What you need is a payment system where you can use your existing VISA card and withdraw cash against it into your electronic wallet. This is pretty close to the FV model but their payment system is somewhat clumsy. I haven't followed the electronic payment market closely for the last couple of years. Are there any payment systems which look like good candidates for integration with browsers? Hal

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Donna Rice, etc.
by John C. Randolph 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Toto wrote: > Sir Robin of Locksley wrote: > > > Donna Rice-Hughes from Enough is Enough says: "It discusses > > > three primary areas of our concern: letting the court know the > > > problems on the Internet. Adult pornography, indecency, and > > > child porn as well. > > Now it's porn, tomorrow it's you saying what you beleive (that > > might also be the truth...) If one is offended by something, > > don't look! How come Catholicism doesn't get banned and outlawed? > > Hell, it offends me... >I didn't see the question anywhere, so I'm asking: >This Donna Rice-Hughes couldn't possibly be the Donna Rice who sat on >Gary Hart's lap for the famous picture, could she? Yes, it's the very same Bimbo who scuttled Gary Hart's campaign, and then parlayed that notoriety into a modeling contract.. Mind you, I'm all for Bimbos knocking dipshit hypocrites out of the running for a presidential nomination, but the idea of having this "party girl" try to police the content of my beloved internet really pisses me off. She made money in the past wiggling her tits for the camera, and again, I'm all for bimbos making money wiggling for cameras, but when she tries to tell me what I should or shouldn't be able to see, my reply *must* be: Fuck you, you hypocritical, ignorant, little slut. I am also going to take issue with her trysting with a married man. I wish Hart's wife had verbally beaten the living shit out of her. -jcr Obligatory Crypto Policy reference: Why couldn't she have scuttled Feurher Clinton's career, instead?

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CFP'97
by Bruce Koball 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

The Seventh Conference on Computers, Freedom, and Privacy March 11-14, 1997 San Francisco Airport Hyatt Regency; Burlingame, California CFP'97 : Commerce & Community CFP'97 will assemble experts, advocates, and interested people from a broad spectrum of disciplines and backgrounds in a balanced public forum to address the impact of new technologies on society. This year's theme addresses two of the main drivers of social and technological transformation. How is private enterprise changing cyberspace? How are traditional and virtual communities reacting? Topics in the wide-ranging main track program will include: PERSPECTIVES ON CONTROVERSIAL SPEECH THE COMMERCIAL DEVELOPMENT OF THE NET GOVERNMENTAL & SOCIAL IMPLICATIONS OF DIGITAL MONEY INTERNATIONAL PERSPECTIVES ON CRYPTOGRAPHY CYPHERPUNKS & CYBERCOPS REGULATION OF ISPs SPAMMING INFOWAR INTELLECTUAL PROPERTY AND INFO-PROPERTY THE 1996 ELECTIONS: CREATING A NEW DEMOCRACY THE COMING COLLAPSE OF THE NET CFP'97 will feature parallel-track lunchtime workshops during the main conference on topics including: THE CASE AGAINST PRIVACY HOW A SKIPTRACER OPERATES CYBERBANKING HOW THE ARCHITECTURE REGULATES RIGHTS IN AVATAR CYBERSPACE NATIONAL I.D. CARDS PUBLIC KEY INFRASTRUCTURES EUROPEAN IP LAW SEXUAL HARASSMENT IN CYBERSPACE VIRTUAL COMMUNITIES DOMAIN NAMES ARCHIVES, INDEXES & PRIVACY GOVERNMENT REGULATION OF ECASH CRYPTO AND THE 1st AMENDMENT The conference will also offer a number of in-depth tutorials on subjects including: * The Economics of the Internet * Regulation of Internet Service Providers * The Latest in Cryptography * The Constitution in Cyberspace * Info War: The Day After * Personal Information and Advertising on the Net * Transborder Data Flows and the Coming European Union * Intellectual Property Rights on the Net: A Primer INFORMATION A complete conference brochure and registration information are available on our web site at: http://www.cfp.org For an ASCII version of the conference brochure and registration information, send email to: cfpinfo(a)cfp.org

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Mondex
by nobody＠zifi.genetics.utah.edu 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Warning: if you fuck a Tim Mayflower in the ass, a tapeworm might bite your penis. /// (0 0) ____ooO_(_)_Ooo__ Tim Mayflower

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DO YOU BELIEVE THAT YOU'RE MEANT TO BE HEALTHY, HAPPY AND FINANCIALLY FREE?
by meritassoc＠earthlink.net 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Hello,^Morons, Do you believe that youre meant to be healthy, happy and financially free? Nutritionist and other health professionals tell us that we should eat the right foods, to get the appropriate vitamins and minerals in our daily diet and exercise in order to stay healthy, right. RIGHT! We are slowly realizing that the soil from which our fruits & vegetables come from is also being depleted and in spite of the fact that we try to restore those nutrients artificially, we are not really putting everything back in. Several years an amazing discovery was made in the Soviet Union and kept secret from the rest of the world until the fall of the Berlin Wall. This discovery stimulated long term research, funded completely by the Soviet government and headed by the late Dr. I. I. Brekhman, a world renowned & brilliant scientist. His vision and breakthrough research over 45 years revealed many of natures most important secrets, which recognized him as the "Father of Adaptogens". Dr. Brekhman, with a team of over 1,200 biologist and physicians, analyzed and investigated adaptogens in one of the most massive programs of human testing in scientific history. [No where else except the Soviet Union could this have taken place.] They produced thousands of dietary studies which definitively validated the safety, benefits and astounding capabilities of adaptogens. The cosmonauts used Dr. Brekhmans formulas to cope with motion sickness, extended confinements, weightlessness and inherent stress of space travel. The Olympic athletes used Dr. Brekhmans formulas to improve performance, immune resistance, stamina, endurance, recovery and to cope with the stress of competition. In a broadly-based study of 60,000 truck drivers at an automobile plant in Tolyiaatti for over 10 years revealed that those workers using adaptogens experienced a 25% reduction in lost time as well as a 40% decrease in influenza and a general improvement in their overall health. In another study of 655 flight personnel, adaptogens improved the recovery process after long and tiring flight schedules. We could go on with the results of his research, but I think you get the picture. The secrets of Dr. Brekhmans work are no longer locked inside Russia. Adaptogens could soon become as American as apple pie. In 1991, Dr. Brekhman joined forces with PrimeQuest in an exclusive collaboration to convert his wisdom into a whole new generation of adaptogenic formulas. The results far exceed his work with cosmonauts and athletes. He designed a total program for well-being...a program which gives you what you have been missing. Before his death in July 1994, Dr. Brekhman was able to complete the goal of his lifes work: "It has always been my dream to create a special formula for life, to make them healthy, stable, happy and to protect them from stress. All of my life I have worked toward this goal - and now, finally I have achieved a breakthrough. It is a complicated preparation of natural plant materials which are the best and most effective ingredients I have studied in all of my years of research...ingredients that work together in a combination that derives additional power from the mixture itself." No other product on the market today has undergone the clinical studies on humans that these products underwent in the 40+ years of research. PrimeQuest products can increase your energy and vitality in the most natural way. You can: · Reduce Stress · Lose body fat · Increase energy · Eliminate A.D.D. · Improve Sex Drive · Reduce P.M.S. To get a FREE TAPE in which a Harvard MD reveals the SECRET and more information about obtaining these products or becoming a distributor yourself. E-mail your name, address & phone # to Meritassoc(a)earthlink.net or call 1-800-305-6451.

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