December 2003 - cypherpunks-legacy

Open letter to Geoff Greiveldinger, DoJ
by Carl Ellison 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

I just posted the following. I'll have to wait to see if the moderator accepts it. Date: Sat, 9 Sep 1995 01:11:06 -0400 From: Carl Ellison <cme> To: risks(a)csl.sri.com Subject: Open letter to Geoff Greiveldinger, DoJ NIST (the National Institute of Standards and Technology) held a two day public meeting on September 6 and 7, 1995 to discuss Software Key Escrow as a possible means of achieving export of cryptography. In the morning of 9/7, Goeff Greiveldinger of the Department of Justice gave a description of the kinds of crimes which DoJ wants to use wiretapping to solve. He closed this litany of lawbreaking with the assertion that software manufacturers don't want to provide products which allow such lawbreakers to keep their criminal evidence hidden from law enforcement. I'm sorry to disillusion you, Geoff, but I *do* want to make such systems. Would you have Ryder stop renting trucks because some terrorist decided to fill one with explosives and kill many innocent children? Would you have Americans stop making automobiles because bank robbers have been known to use cars for getaways? Would you have all new buildings constructed with FBI microphones in every wall because some criminals meet in private rooms in order to plan crimes? When an American company sweeps its conference room for bugs, finds some and destroys them, it doesn't matter whether those bugs were planted by industrial spies or the FBI. The company has a right to eliminate them. When that company ties two such conference rooms together by video-conference equipment and encrypts the line between them using strong link encryption, it is performing the same defensive operation in cyberspace. It is protecting itself from spies and it doesn't matter that the wiretaps it frustrates might be illegal ones by industrial spies or legal ones by the FBI. The right to attempt to achieve privacy is a long-standing one in this country and not one to allow to be lost. When I design and build systems for privacy for my customers, I am providing products for law-abiding, honest people. I am aware of criminals, of course. Criminals are the threats against whom I protect my customers. These criminals are usually not in the government but that doesn't mean that I believe I should offer my honest customers up for a strip-search in cyberspace. The law enforcement agencies of this free country have no right to expect blanket access to the ciphertext of citizens. It will take legislation to get that right and I will do everything in my power to keep such legislation from passing. Barring such legislation, I will make sure that honest American citizens have cryptography with which to attempt to maintain their privacy, even from the government. We have the right to attempt to keep a secret from government agencies and continuous demonstration of that right is an important part of this free country. On the other hand, I am sympathetic to law enforcement officers. I have several friends in that business. I have asked my friends and acquaintances who do surveillance (2 IRS agents investigating organized crime for tax evasion; 2 undercover cops in Boston's highest drug neighborhood; 1 DEA agent in the midwest) if they ever encounter encrypted communications or files. They don't. Neither does anyone in their offices. Of course, even if they did it would remain so important to preserve our right to attempt to keep secrets from the government that their frustration would just have to be accepted. The fact that this isn't a real problem makes my decision that much easier. I am left with no moral qualms at all. In summary, criminals are so few that I will not design for them. I will not treat my vast majority of honest users as if they were criminals just because some criminal might someday use my product and frustrate you. ObRisk: We run the risk of losing our fundamental right to attempt to keep a secret from the government -- a practice we need to preserve in order to protect ourselves from criminals in cyberspace. There are powerful forces in the US government attempting to cajole us into giving up that right. [see http://www.clark.net/pub/cme/html/nist-ske.html for more on this subject]

1 0

Confirmation on Diana, please?
by bureau42 Anonymous Remailer 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Are there any Cypherpunks mailing list members who can confirm that there was a series of posts related to Princess Diana's death in the days before the event? I am particularly interested in information as to whether Cypherpunks were in any way responsible for a slight delay in the timing of her death. I am particularly interested in communicating with the person who sent me the anonymous messages between 8/24/97 and 8/30/97 using the nym "A'Tak A'Tdorn'. If you have information and an interest in sharing it, please send a post to the Cypherpunks list or the fight-censorship list, indicating such. If you wish for me to contact you through a neutral, third party, indicate that as well. Thank You

2 1

Scientology/Wollersheim as test case for key disclosure
by Greg Broiles 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Andrew Loewenstern writes: > > Modemac writes: > > Mr. Wollersheim has stated that he will go to jail before he reveals > > his encryption key. > [...snip...] > > Call this one: BIG WIN FOR PGP! > > Could this be it? The test case for forced key disclosure? The > Scientologists seem very determined and already have a grudge against > Wollersheim (according to a web page I saw Co$ owes him several million from > a settlement). Has Co$ filed against Wollersheim over this yet? > > If this does go to court and forcing Wollersheim to reveal the key becomes a > central issue, is this the test case "we" want? Is this a "BIG WIN FOR PGP!" > or not? Well, since it's (apparently) a civil case against Wollersheim, the potential Fifth Amendment self-incrimination issues may be murkier, so this may not be a good test case for the criminal context. In federal civil trials, material reasonably likely to lead to the discovery of admissible evidence is discoverable unless there's an applicable privilege - this means that in a civil case, a defendant may be forced to hand over material likely to expose them to liabilty. (The Fifth Amendment privilege against criminal self-incrimination still applies). I'm not sure that key disclosure will even be necessary - the Church (or whatever annoying tentacle of it is suing Wollersheim) is entitled to, for example, "a copy of . . . all documents, data compilations, and tangible things in the possession, custody, or control of the party that are relevant to disputed facts alleged with particularity in the pleadings" (Fed. R. Civ. P. 26(a)(1)(B)). I don't see why Wollersheim couldn't comply with the discovery rules by providing plaintext copies of all relevant information, unless for some reason the passphrase is itself relevant. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.2 iQCVAwUBMFFFG33YhjZY3fMNAQGmLAP/S412cBRTRFRWou6mVjh7jbT9O3CIUPEB oFuDLNy7pQR2ZaR5JOzSsCv9d96CpGdVjIWUxhP/Fz6tN3ZP7LuCXBssoIuiyuEp z2e+LQthjcksUDqipR+QggIhN3hU66esg14WCF61yjwpXCukn13cOISYtBHRjc9g sEiN0SXZ4tw= =knU6 -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

4 3

Princes Die! / Re: None
by Anonymous 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

The metallic custard scent ripped through the stegosaurus' nostrils. Clearly, the monotreme journey it would begin as it had ended. The ponder-tree hung itself in the heavy air, it's sap becomming purple, and flowed engimatically like a river of broken curves and powdered eggshells. - A'Tak A'Tdurn

1 0

===>> FREE 1 yr. Magazine Sub sent worldwide- 315+ Popular USA Titles ===>> FREE 1 yr. Magazine Sub sent worldwide- 315+ Popular USA Titles
by janetdove＠infosat.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Hi fellow 'netters, My name is Janet Dove and I recently started using a magazine subscription club in the USA that has a FREE 1 yr. magazine subscription deal with your first paid order- and I have been very pleased with them. They have over 1,500 different USA titles that they can ship to any country on a subscription basis. As for computer magazines from the USA, they more of a selection than I ever knew even existed. They have magazines for most every area of interest in their list of 1,500 titles. Within the USA, for their USA members, they are cheaper than all their competitors and even the publishers themselves. This is their price guarantee. Overseas, on the average, they are generally around one-fourth to one-half of what the newstands overseas charge locally for USA magazines. On some titles they are as little as one-tenth of what the newstands charge. They feel that mgazines should not be a luxury overseas. In the USA, people buy magazines and then toss them after reading them for just a few minutes or hours. They are so cheap in the USA! Well, this company would like to make it the same way for their overseas members. They are also cheaper than all their competitors in the USA and overseas, including the publishers themselves! This is their price guarantee. Around one-half their business comes from overseas, so they are very patient with new members who only speak limited English as a 2nd language. Their prices are so cheap because they deal direct with each publisher and cut-out all the middlemen. They will send you their DELUXE EMAIL CATALOGUE (around 400K-big and juicey) !)...if you completely fill out the form below. It has lists of all the freebies, lists of all the titles they sell, titles broken down by categories and detailed descriptions on nearly 1000 of the titles that they sell. Please do not email me as I am just a happy customer and a *busy* student. I don't have time to even complete my thesis in time, let alone run my part-time software business! Email them directly at: munish(a)grfn.org *------------cut here-----------------------------------------------* REQUEST FOR MORE INFO: please copy this section only and email to: munish(a)grfn.org (sorry, but incomplete forms *cannot* be acknowledged) Name: Internet email address: Smail home address: City-State-Zip: Country: Work Tel. #: Work Fax #: Home Tel. #: Home Fax #: Name of USA mags you currently get on the newstand or in the store: Name of USA mags you currently get on a subscription basis, through the mail: Name of USA mags you would like price quotes on when we call you: Catalogue format desired from below 2 choices (list "1" or "2"): (1. 22-part email message; 2. atttached file by email) {{{Note- 22-part email can be received by anyone with any computer. Attached file format may not be for you: it is sent as an uncompressed 400K file formatted in Microsoft World text only format, on a Mac; if you don't use Microsoft Word on a Mac - you will have to know how to convert into a usable text format. We cannot help you with this. If in doubt, we suggest you go with the universally acceptable 22-part email message. You can always manually spend a few minutes pasting the parts into one whole.}}} If you saw this on a newsgroup, which newsgroup did you see it on?: How did you hear about us (name of person who referred you or the area of the internet that you saw us mentioned in): Janet Dove 090895BGV *------------cut here-----------------------------------------------* They guarantee to beat all their competitors' prices. Sometimes they are less than half of the next best deal I have been able to find and other times, just a little cheaper - but I have never found a lower rate yet. They assured me that if I ever do, they will beat it. They have been very helpful and helped me change my address from the USA to Finland and then back again when I moved last month. They are very knowledgeable about addressing mags worldwide. They have a deal where you can get a free 1 yr. sub to a new magazine from a special list of over 300 popular titles published in the USA. They will give you this free 1 yr. sub when you place your first paid order with them to a renewal or new subscription to any of the over 1,500 different popular USA titles they sell. They can arrange delivery to virtually any country and I think they have clients in around 35 or 36 countries now. Outside the USA there is a charge for foreign postage and handling (on both paid and freebie subs) that varies from magazine to magazine. I have found their staff to be very friendly and courteous. They even helped me with an address change when I moved from one country to another. The owner thinks of his service as a "club" and his clients as "members" (even though there is no extra fee to become a member - your first purchase automatically makes you a member) and he is real picky about who he accepts as a new member. When he sets you up as a new member, he himself calls you personally on the phone to explain how he works his deal, or sometimes he has one of his assistants call. He is kind of quirky sometimes - he insists on setting up new members by phone so he can say hi to everyone (I sure wouldn't want to have his phone bills!), but you can place future orders (after your first order) via E-mail. He has some really friendly young ladies working for him, who seem to know just as much as he does about this magazine stuff. If you live overseas, he will even call you there, as long as you are interested, but I think he still makes all his overseas calls on the weekends, I guess cause the long distance rates are cheaper then. He only likes to take new members from referrals from satisfied existing members and he does virtually no advertising. When I got set-up, they had a 2-3 week waiting list for new members to be called back so that they could join up. (Once you are an existing member, they help you immediately when you call. ) I think they are able to get back to prospective new members the same day or within a few days now, as they have increased their staff. I am not sure about this.........but if you email the above form to them, that is the way to get started! They will send you some FREE info. via E-mail (the short version (around 40K) of their catalogue, or if you request it the DELUXE LONG VERSION (around 400K-big and juicey) !)...if you fill out the form near the top of this message. They then send you email that outlines how his club works and the list of free choices that you can choose from, as well as the entire list of what he sells; and then they will give you a quick (3-5 minute) friendly, no-pressure no-obligation call to explain everything to you personally and answer all your questions. Once you get in, you'll love them. I do. For more info, just fill out the form near the top of this message and email it to: munish(a)grfn.org Sincerely, Janet Dove

1 0

In the comfort of home
by dawn＠iTribe.net 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

<HTML><PRE><BODY BGCOLOR="#ffff80">Subj: MAKE MONEY with your COMPUTER too...it's EASY! Date: 97-08-22 12:53:52 EDT From: 18112320(a)gte.net Reply-to: the.money.tree(a)make.money.on.line.21.com To: all.investors.21(a)investing.on.the.net.com PLEASE TAKE THE TIME TO READ THIS. THIS PROGRAM REALLY DOES WORK! ***********We Will SEND 5000 E-Mails FREE************ Dear friend, Do you realize hundreds of thousands of dollars are made each day by way of the internet. Haven't you ever thought "I wish I could find a way to make money with my computer and my internet connection"? Well you can! The internet is making it possible for everyday, ordinary people like you and me to make lots of money. Many of you will read this and think "That can't work" or "It sounds too good to be true". But I challenge you to discard traditional thinking and allow yourself the opportunity to make some of those thousands of dollars that are exchanging hands each and every hour. The opportunity below is no scam and is very legal. It is a simplified form of email marketing using MLM techniques. The first time I saw it I deleted it immediately. But the next time I saw it I figured I had nothing to lose with so very little investment required. This is my 2nd time doing this program. The first time I did this I made very good money. I decided to do it again but make it even better by sending out more mail. Please at least read this as it may be the answer you've been looking for. You certainly have nothing to lose. "THINK ABOUT IT" Before you delete this program from your mailbox, as I almost did, take a little time to read it and REALLY THINK ABOUT IT. Get a pencil and figure out what could happen when YOU participate. Figure out the worst possible response and no matter how you calculate it, you will still make a lot of money! Definitely get back what you invested. Any doubts you have will vanish when your first orders come in. IT WORKS! Paul Johnson, Raleigh, NC Everything below this line is what was sent to me. *** Print This Now For Future Reference *** $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ This is a MONEY-MAKING PHENOMENON. PRINT this letter, read the program... THEN READ IT AGAIN !!! You are looking at the most profitable and unique program you may ever see. It has demonstrated and proven ability to generate large sums of money. This program is showing fantastic appeal with a huge and ever growing population which needs additional income. This is a legitimate LEGAL money-making opportunity. It does not require you to come in contact with people, do any hard work, and best of all, you never have to leave the house, except to get the mail. If you believe that some day you will get that lucky break that you have been waiting for, THIS IS IT! Simply follow the easy instructions, and your dream will come true! This electronic multi-level marketing program works perfectly...100% EVERY TIME! Thousands of people have used this program to raise capital to start their own business, pay off debts, buy homes, cars, etc., even retire! This is your chance, so don't pass it up. OVERVIEW OF THIS EXTRAORDINARY ELECTRONIC MULTI-LEVEL MARKETING PROGRAM Basically, this is what we do: We sell thousands of people a product for $5.00 that costs us next to nothing to produce and e-mail. As with all multi-level businesses, we build our business by recruiting new partners and selling our products. Every state in the U.S. allows you to recruit new multi- level business online (with your computer). The product in this program is a series of four business and financial reports. Each $5.00 order you receive by "snail mail" will include the e-mail address of the sender. To fill each order, you simply e-mail the product to the buyer. THAT'S IT!...the $5.00 is yours! This is the GREATEST electronic multi-level marketing business anywhere! FOLLOW THE INSTRUCTIONS EXACTLY! Let's face it, the profits are worth it! THEY'RE TREMENDOUS!!! So go for it. Remember the 4 points and we'll see YOU at the top! ******* I N S T R U C T I O N S ******* This is what you MUST do: 1. Order all 4 reports listed and numbered from the list below. For each report send $5.00 CASH, YOUR E-MAIL ADDRESS and YOUR RETURN POSTAL ADDRESS (in case of a problem) to each person listed. When you order, make sure you request each SPECIFIC report. You will need all four reports, because you will be saving them on your computer and reselling them. 2. IMPORTANT--DO NOT alter the names, or their sequence other than instructed in this program! Or you will not profit the way you should. Replace the name and address under REPORT #1 with yours, moving the one that was there down to REPORT #2. Move the name and address under REPORT #2 to REPORT #3. Move the name and address under REPORT #3 to REPORT #4. The name and address that was under REPORT #4 is dropped off the list and is NO DOUBT on the way to the bank. When doing this, please make certain you copy everyone's name and address ACCURATELY!!! Also, DO NOT move the Report/Product positions! 3. Take this entire program text, including the corrected names list, and save it on your computer. 4. Now you're ready to start a massive advertising campaign on the WORLDWIDE WEB! Advertising on the WEB is very, very inexpensive, but there are HUNDREDS of FREE places to advertise also. Another avenue which you could use is e-mail mailing lists. You can buy these lists for under $20/1,000 addresses. START YOUR AD CAMPAIGN AS SOON AS YOU CAN. ALWAYS PROVIDE SAME-DAY SERVICE ON ALL ORDERS!!! REQUIRED REPORTS ***Order each REPORT by NUMBER and NAME*** ALWAYS SEND $5 CASH (Concealed) FOR EACH ORDER REQUESTING THE SPECIFIC REPORT BY NAME AND NUMBER. ALWAYS SEND FIRST CLASS OR PRIORITY MAIL AND PROVIDE YOUR E-MAIL ADDRESS FOR QUICK DELIVERY. ______________________________________________________________ REPORT #1 "HOW TO MAKE $250,000 THROUGH MULTI-LEVEL SALES" ORDER REPORT #1 FROM: D.R. Marketing 2318 Halyard Lane Cheasapeake Va 23323 ___________________________________________________________________ REPORT #2 "MAJOR CORPORATIONS AND MULTI-LEVEL SALES" ORDER REPORT #2 FROM: Ann Rossi P.O. Box 5894 Glen Allen Va. 23058 ___________________________________________________________________ REPORT #3 "SOURCES FOR THE BEST MAILING LISTS" ORDER REPORT #3 FROM: "Bonni Cakes" (Randy) P O BOX 7247 Endicott, NY 13760-7247 ___________________________________________________________________ REPORT #4 "EVALUATING MULTI-LEVEL SALES PLANS" ORDER REPORT #4 FROM: Information Services 11006 4th St. North Box 160 St. Petersburg, FL 33716 ______________________________________________________________________ HERE'S HOW THIS AMAZING PLAN WILL MAKE YOU $MONEY$ Let's say you decide to start small just to see how it goes. Assume your goal is to get 10 people to participate on your first level. (Placing a lot of FREE ads on the internet could EASILY get a better response.) Also assume that everyone else in YOUR BUILDING ORGANIZATION gets ONLY 10 downline members. Follow this example for the STAGGERING results below. 1st level--your 10 members with $5 $50 2nd level--10 members from those 10 ($5 x 100) $500 3rd level--10 members from those 100 ($5 x 1,000) $5,000 4th level--10 members from those 1,000 ($5 x 10,000) $50,000 THIS TOTALS-----------> $55,550 Remember friends, this is assuming that the people who participate only recruit 10 people each. Dare to think for a moment what would happen if everyone got 20 people to participate! Some people get 100's of recruits! THINK ABOUT IT! By the way, your cost to participate in this is practically nothing.You obviously already have an internet connection and email is FREE!!! REPORT#3 will show you the best methods for bulk emailing and purchasing email lists. REMEMBER: Approx. 50,000 new people get online monthly! ORDER YOUR REPORTS NOW!!! *******TIPS FOR SUCCESS******* TREAT THIS AS YOUR BUSINESS! Send for the four reports IMMEDIATELY, so you will have them when the orders start coming in because: When you receive a $5 order, you MUST send out the requested product/report to comply with the U.S. Postal & Lottery Laws, Title 18,Sections 1302 and 1341 or Title 18, Section 3005 in the U.S. Code,also Code of Federal Regs. vol. 16, Sections 255 and 436, which state that "a product or service must be exchanged for money received." * ALWAYS PROVIDE SAME-DAY SERVICE ON THE ORDERS YOU RECEIVE. * Be patient and persistent with this program. If you follow the instructions exactly the results WILL undoubtedly be SUCCESS! * ABOVE ALL, HAVE FAITH IN YOURSELF THAT YOU CAN SUCCEED! *******YOUR SUCCESS GUIDELINE******* The check point that guarantees your success is simply this: You MUST receive 10 to 20 orders for REPORT #1! THIS IS A MUST! If you don't within two weeks, advertise more and send out more programs until you do. Then, a couple of weeks later you should receive at least 100 orders for REPORT #2. If you don't, advertise more and send out more programs until you do. Once you have received 100, or more orders for REPORT #2, YOU CAN RELAX, because you will be on your way to the BANK! -OR- You can DOUBLE your efforts! REMEMBER: Every time your name is moved down on the list you are in front of a DIFFERENT report, so you can KEEP TRACK of your PROGRESS by watching what report people are ordering from you. IT'S THAT EASY!!! NOTE: IF YOU NEED HELP with starting a business, registering a business name, how income tax is handled, etc., contact your local office of the Small Business Administration (a Federal agency) for free help and answers to questions. Also, the Internal Revenue Service offers free help via telephone and free seminars about business taxes. ******* T E S T I M O N I A L S ******* This program does work, but you must follow it EXACTLY! Especially the rule of not trying to place your name in a different position, it won't work, you'll lose a lot of money. I'm living proof that it works. It really is a great opportunity to make relatively easy money, with little cost to you. If you do choose to participate, follow the program exactly, and you'll be on your way to financial security. If you are a fellow Christian and are in financial trouble like I was, consider this a sign. I DID! Good Luck & God Bless You, Sincerely, Chris Johnson P.S. Do you have any idea what 11,700 $5 bills ($58,500) looks like piled up on the kitchen table?...IT'S AWESOME! My name is Frank. My wife Doris and I live in Bel-Air, MD. I am a cost accountant with a major U.S. Corporation and I make pretty good money. When I received the program I grumbled to Doris about receiving "junk mail"! I made fun of the whole thing, spouting my knowledge of the population and percentages involved. I "knew" it wouldn't work. Doris totally ignored my supposed intelligence and jumped in with both feet. I made merciless fun of her, and was ready to lay the old "I told you so" on her when the thing didn't work... well, the laugh was on me! Within two weeks she had received over 50 responses. Within 45 days she had received over $147,200 in $5 bills! I was stunned. I was sure that I had it all figured and that it wouldn't work...I AM a believer now. I have joined Doris in her "little" hobby. I did have seven more years until retirement, but I think of the "rat race" and it's not for me...We owe it all to MLM. Frank T., Bel-Air, MD This is the only realistic money-making offer I've ever received. I participated because this plan truly makes sense. I was surprised when the $5.00 bills started filling my mail box. By the time it tapered off I had received over 8,000 orders with over $40,000 in cash. Dozens of people have sent warm personal notes too, sharing the news of their good fortunes! It's been WONDERFUL. Carl Winslow Tulsa, OK The main reason for this letter is to convince you that this system is honest, lawful, extremely profitable, and is a way to get a large amount of money in a short time. I was approached several times before I checked this out. I joined just to see what one could expect in return for the minimal effort and money required. Initially I let no one in the organization know that I was an attorney and, to my astonishment, I received $36,470.00 in the first 14 weeks, with money still coming in. Sincerely yours, Phillip A. Brown This plan works like GANG-BUSTERS!!! So far I have had 9,735 total orders...OVER $48,000!!! I hope I have sparked your own excitement, if you follow the program exactly, you could have the same success I have, if not better. Your success is right around the corner, but you must do a little work. Good Luck! G. Bank Not being the gambling type, it took me several weeks to make up my mind to participate in this plan. But conservative that I am I decided that the initial investment was so little that there was just no way that I wouldn't get enough orders to at least get my money back. Boy I was surprised when I found my medium-size post office box crammed with orders. After that it got so over-loaded that I had to start picking up my mail at the window. I'll make more money this year than any 10 years of my life before. The nice thing about this deal is that it doesn't matter where in the U.S. the people live. There simply isn't a better investment with a faster return. Mary Rockland, Lansing, MI This is my third time to participate in this plan. We have quit our jobs, and quite soon we will buy a home on the beach and live off the interest on our money. The only way on earth that this plan will work for you is if you do it. For your sake, and for your family's sake don't pass up this golden opportunity. Remember, when you order your four reports, SEND CASH. Checks have to clear the bank and create too many delays. Good luck and happy spending! Charles Fairchild, Spokane, WA Typically when I look at a money-making deal I want to know if the company is strong, will it be here when it's time for my big pay off. In this crazy thing there is no company intervention for management to blow it. Just people like me ordering directly from the source! Interesting...I had a couple of projects I'd been trying to fund to no avail so I thought; Why not give it a try? Well 2 1/2 weeks later the orders started coming in. One project is funded and I'm sure the other will be soon! Marilynn St. Claire, Logan, UT We could be printing YOUR testimonial next!!! ORDER YOUR REPORTS TODAY AND GET STARTED DOWN THE ROAD TO YOUR FINANCIAL FREEDOM!!! - Comments: Authenticated sender is <the.money.tree(a)make.money.on.line.21.com> </PRE></HTML>

1 0

Re: not a flame please read and think about this
by an116512＠anon.penet.fi 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

to make my point: why is pat farrel helping the nsa and nist make better key escrow? i quote mr farrel: We reworded #5 to say "want to Trust the Product." This means that it is untampered, works as expected, etc. We then hashed out ways to know this. The list ended up looking like: 1. is available only as object code 2. contains some "hash" function to check for modifications 3. contains some unique hash, with uniqueness based upon something like "site," "per copy" or "per release" 4. Contains policies against modification, such as liscense language against decompilation. 5. OS-related security, such as runs "protected mode" instead of as a wild DOS program. and We then developed "goals" including: 1. One version for sale worldwide 2. Allow development in the US 3. Domestic Law Enforcement Agencies want Escrowed (I almost wrote GAK :-) 4. Must interoperate with everything 5. Receiver can only decrypt if escrow agencies can decrypt. hey why not just write the escorw code for them!!!??? is mr farrel just being naive or is does he realize who hes working for? sorry to single him out but this is just an example of what im talking about. he is not the only example by far. think people!!!!! ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- To find out more about the anon service, send mail to help(a)anon.penet.fi. If you reply to this message, your message WILL be *automatically* anonymized and you are allocated an anon id. Read the help file to prevent this. Please report any problems, inappropriate use etc. to admin(a)anon.penet.fi.

1 0

Re: Scientology tries to break PGP - and fails? (fwd)
by kelso＠netcom.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

> >Tom Rollins writes: > >> If this is the file that the Co$ is trying to crack, then what the > >> is being asked for is a pass phrase that can be handed to the Co$ > >> that will pass the PGP valid key check and still not decrypt the > >> data to anything usefull. > > > >Well, I don't have the PGP 'conventional' encryption format memorized, but > >there is probably a constant after the IV that is prepended to the data. The > >constant is used to determine if the key is correct. Since the conventional > >encryption runs in CFB mode and there is a full block of random IV at the > >beginning of the file, it is extremely unlikely that a key could be found > >that would properly decrypt only the first two blocks while leaving the rest > >unreadable... > > > >> If Larry Wollersheim does have the valid key. It would be a simpler > >> process to know what fake key to use and work it backwards through > >> the MD5 to arrive at an ascii string to produce the fake key. > > > >Not really. Even if you could find an IDEA key that would produce the > >desired output it would be hard to find a passphrase that would produce that > >key when hashed. One of the properties of one-way hash functions is that it > >is difficult to find a plaintext that produces a given hash. Hence the term > >'one-way'.... Even if you did find a passphrase (which, if MD5 is strong, > >would require something like 2^64 operations), it would likely be long, have > >8-bit chars, and would be impossible to type in. It would be tough to > >convince anyone that it was the real passphrase. > > > > > >andrew > > > > > There was a hack to pgp ui published a while back that would allow > someone decrypting a RSA encrypted file to print out the idea key. > > Another feature of the hack allowed someone with the idea key to decrypt > an RSA PGP encrypted file ignoring the RSA headers and using the IDEA > key directly. > > Using this software should allow the reciever of an RSA PGP encrypted > file to allow someone else to decrypt it (by giving them the IDEA key) > without exposing the secret key. The IV block check will allow them to > check that they are using the correct idea key. > Looking at the source code showes that all that is needed to pass the PGP key check is for the first two blocks to decode in such a way that the last 2 bytes of the IV match the 2 check bytes before the actual message. Thus the first 6 bytes of the IV and the last 6 bytes of the next block need not match the actual message. There was a bug in the older versions of PGP that set the IV to a constant instead of a random value when encrypting with the "-c" option. I made a mistake thinking that knowledge of the correct key would help in creating a fake key.

1 0

Live Live Live
by Announce＠gosnet.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

New Adult Site Experience LIVE adult shows inside your Browser* without any additional plug ins! See shows broadcasted LIVE from the USA with some of the hottest girls on the Internet. Unlike any other site, you can WATCH the shows WITHOUT paying per minute charges. Plus, view one of the best maintained picture archives around. Must be 18 years of age or older. Don't just take our word for it ==>Take an absolutely FREE tour and experience the future of adult entertainment on the internet, today. goto http://www.gosnet.com/kittycat and click on Guest * Must be running Netscape 3.0 or higher to view the streaming feed. Members can watch live show with NO per minute charges. Must be 18 years of age or older to take the Free Tour. To be placed on the Universal E-mail Remove List e-mail a letter to kittycat(a)gosnet.com and Place the word Remove in the Subject Line this will place you in the UERL pool and will help stop unwanted e-mail from other commercial e-mailers.

1 0

Sigh Re: not a flame please read and think about this
by Pat Farrell 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Subject line is bull*&^&, IMHO, of course In message Sat, 9 Sep 1995 16:40:00 UTC, an116512(a)anon.penet.fi writes: > to make my point: why is pat farrel helping the nsa and nist make Learn to spell my name. It is on my .sig, my keys, and in my userid. We blockheaded, Irish Catholic Americans are damn proud of our name. Farrell's (along with other cheap Irish labor) built the railroads from Chicago west. Please spell it correctly, even if you are flaming me. > hey why not just write the escorw code for them!!!??? > is mr farrel just being naive or is does he realize who hes working for? > sorry to single him out but this is just an example of what im talking > about. I doubt that this clown deserves a response, but... There were a number of cypherpunks there. I can't speak for all, but I expect movites include: - attempting to clarify vague and confusing wording so we could understand what they wanted. - seeing that working with them, rather than yelling at their stupidity, has a higher chance of getting results. - we got to meet influential folks from industry who agree with us. - some of us aren't completely apposed to CKE. I think it has value. If we could convert their plan for GAK into CKE, it would be a big win, well worth the effort. - they are going to promulgate a FIPS PUB standard next week, whether I like it or not, and whether I help or not. It is better to have that standard understandable and clear than fuzzy and subject to subective evaluation. - getting preposterous misstatements into the formal Federal Register so we can quote it back to them in the congressional hearings. Mr Geoff Greivelddinger's words should be handy to quote, for one example. - there are lots more, but I doubt that I can convince this clown. Pat Pat Farrell Grad Student http://www.isse.gmu.edu/students/pfarrell Info. Systems & Software Engineering, George Mason University, Fairfax, VA PGP key available on homepage #include <standard.disclaimer>

2 1

Top 10 Ways to Make a Grouchy Old CypherPunk Smile - #6
by Anonymous 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Top 10 Ways to Make a Grouchy Old CypherPunk Smile -------------------------------------------------- #10) Find his shoes for him. #9) Buy Kent Crispin a Dr. Kevorkian gift-certificate. #8) Nuke Washington DC #7) Send ten copies of this back to Vulis. #6) Have ? the Playtpus send him an email saying "Nude D.C." #5) #4) #3) #2) #1) [This space reserved for T.C. May]

1 0

WoT keyring (fwd)
by uSuRa 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Forwarded message: > From: don(a)stat8.byu.edu (Donald M. Kitchen) > > Due to problems distributing my Web of Trust keyring from my own site, > I have uploaded a .gz version. Please announce it to cpunks as soon > as you have changed the permissions. > > Thanks > Don This file is available from: ftp.hacktic.nl/pub/pgp/pgp-key-ring/donring.pgp.gz 944 -rw-r--r-- 1 pub pub 955577 Sep 8 18:37 donring.pgp.gz EnJoY ! -AJ-

1 0

Re[2]: [NOISE/Fun] some 'special' primes
by sharborth＠hai-net.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

No, it's ocht hundert elf Skip ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: [NOISE/Fun] some 'special' primes Author: Michael <mike(a)uac.net> at internet Date: 09-09-95 00:34 > A bit more fun : German : 811 (dunno how to write it, but it starts > with an "a") acht hundert uenf (I think) --Michael

2 1

Top 10 Ways to Make a Grouchy Old CypherPunk Smile - #5
by nobody＠rigel.cyberpass.net 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Top 10 Ways to Make a Grouchy Old CypherPunk Smile -------------------------------------------------- #10) Find his shoes for him. #9) Buy Kent Crispin a Dr. Kevorkian gift-certificate. #8) Nuke Washington DC #7) Send ten copies of this back to Vulis. #6) Have ? the Playtpus send him an email saying "Nude D.C." #5) Explain to him that the way John Young writes (Youngbonics) is actually a sophisticated form of crypto. #4) #3) #2) #1) [This space reserved for T.C. May]

2 1

Re: WoT keyring
by uSuRa 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

>From Donald M. Kitchen: > > Due to problems distributing my Web of Trust keyring from my own site, > I have uploaded a .gz version. Please announce it to cpunks as soon > as you have changed the permissions. > > Thanks > > Don > It's available from: ftp.hacktic.nl/pub/pgp/pgp-key-ring total 946 1 drwxr-xr-x 2 pub pub 512 Sep 9 21:15 ./ 1 drwxr-xr-x 4 pub pub 512 Sep 9 21:14 ../ 944 -rw-r--r-- 1 pub pub 955577 Sep 9 21:15 donring.pgp.gz Regards, -AJ-

1 0

Re[4]: [NOISE/Fun] some 'special' primes
by sharborth＠hai-net.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

1 0

$10,000/mo possible first month - Be a 900 Number Broker
by master25＠icon.co.za 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

It's True.... The AVERAGE U.S. 900 Number Business Earns $200,000/year. You can have one FREE. FREE REPORT shows you how to get it and how to run it.. in your spare time.....from home..........Details http://www.mail-response.com/beacon/900tpc.html eIis

1 0

DC-area Meeting Sept 16
by Pat Farrell 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

The next DC-area cypherpunks meeting will be next Saturday afternoon at Digex's headquarters in suburban Maryland. Please mark your calendars. Directions, maps, and exact time will be published soon. Doug Humphrey says that the office is less than one mile from public transportation. Carpools worked for the last meeting, so I expect rides from Northern Virginia and even Baltimore can be arrainged. Pat Pat Farrell Grad Student http://www.isse.gmu.edu/students/pfarrell Info. Systems & Software Engineering, George Mason University, Fairfax, VA PGP key available on homepage #include <standard.disclaimer>

1 0

Re: cryptography eliminates lawyers?
by Alan Olsen 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 02:44 PM 9/8/95 -0400, you wrote: >We wish! We really wish! "Fill that lawyer with a few more slugs of encryption!" The argument that encryption will free us from all the legal ills of the world is pretty specious. If anything it will make more work for lawyers as the non-clue-endowed portion of the world tries to come to terms with the new technology. They will make rules and subsets of rules and exeptions to rules and variations to interpetations of rules that will make the current set look like the rules to "chutes and ladders". Part of the job of the lawyer class is to guarentee the existance of work for other lawyers (as well as themselves). It does not depend on what the medium of exchange is. Lawyers and government forces will try and figure out some way to try and extract it from you. The government is trying very hard to keep any scrap of power from creeping away from them. You can bet that they will try every thing they can think of, rational and irrational, to regulate and control the wilds of cyberspace. They will pump up every imaginary boogieman to help them get the public to swallow what they are fed. By the time they figure out they have been had, it will be too late. Cypherpunks must be the syrup of ipecac to the governments dose of poison to the body politic! (I need to start drinking more coffee in the morning. I cannot believe I wrote that...) Unfortunatly the public does not thrive on logic. They had been trained to react emotionally to things and not react logically. I am not certain what can be used to get them to realize why they need encryption. Dispelling the bogeymen is none need. The other thing is that the tools need to be made as simple as possible. The current tools for use require a fair bit of technical understanding. Until they have an integrated front-end that makes it about as easy to use as America On-Line, encryption will not gain widespread usage. This is the type of code that needs to be written. Making integrated tools like newsreaders and mail programs that support strong encryption directly is what is needed for widespread use. (As well as being usable programs in and of themselves. Many of the programs for news and mail are crap.) Making cryptography a "cool and fun thing to use" will help dispell many of the myths and may help to defuse the government created bogey men. (Of course they will claim that it aids "criminals and terrorists", but to them EVERYONE is a criminal and a terrorist.) | Visualize whirled keys | alano(a)teleport.com | |"It's only half a keyserver. I had to split the | Disclaimer: | |other half with the government man." - Black Art | Ignore the man | | -- PGP 2.6.2 key available on request -- | behind the keyboard.| | http://www.teleport.com/~alano | <fnord> |

1 0

Re[2]: [NOISE/Fun] some 'special' primes
by goedel＠tezcat.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

> No, it's > > ocht hundert elf > > Skip > acht, not ocht. DJK

1 0

Re: None
by nobody＠REPLAY.COM 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Anonymous wrote: > Robert Marquand, Staff writer of The Christian Science Monitor This wouldn't be a signal that the French event instigated by the Masons has been completed, could it?

1 0

Internet commerce mtg, Denver
by Vladimir Z. Nuri 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

I went to an Internet commerce convention meeting in Denver last week, and thought some here would be interested in some of the topics and companies. the most important company I saw at the meeting is called "YellowNet". I knew this would happen someday, but this company is attempting to build up a *world wide* online business directory accessable over the web. they are trying to build up the infrastructure to handle up to 1M hits per day. a rep told me they were going to go all out in a publicity blitzkrieg at the beginning of Oct. , but for now they are getting ready for prime time. its currently a private company but I suspect they may go public in a year or two. the rep told me something interesting: he said that every Bell phone book is actually "seeded" with dummy names so they can detect copyright infringers. if you come out with a business directory, these Bells will just scan for the fake names that they have inserted into their own listings. if they find them, supposedly they can show them to a copyright judge and he will immediately close down your operation and fine you, almost no questions asked. I didn't know how much of this really happens (the legal stuff sounded questionable to me) but it is an interesting "real world" instance of copyright terrorism prevention that the "information liberation front" would have to contend with. the rep told me that they were willing to go to "phillipine calling houses" that do nothing but contract out to companies, and have the laborers dial the long lists of phone numbers to verify them. as I understand it they exist and supposedly the long distance is so cheap now that they are actually profitable being run out of the phillipines or wherever. he said his company was about to do this when they found a national CD directory of businesses, and they were grudgingly willing to license the CD informtion for the web pages. anyway, cpunks, you may be interested in getting into the ground floor of something like this. the yellow pages are an *extremely* lucrative source of income for phone companies and if they don't compete over the web, I think they are going to become increasingly obsolete-- esp. when the Web becomes accessable to the home more readily through e.g. cable companies. the URL: http://www.yellownet.com what I am suspecting however is that these kinds of services are going to be common, and it will not be that difficult to get your *pointer* into them for free. as far as them offering advertisements, though, I can't see how they could charge much more than a standard web site service charge for some pages. in other words, the days of hundreds of dollars for a display ad are probably not going to happen on the web, IMHO. and I don't see how they could charge for mere pointers at all, given that the competition will probably give them away. -- the other major companies at the show were generally large and small internet providers, and a lot of web page consulting firms (large and small). various network connection providers & consultants, etc. another thing I would like to clue everyone in on, if it isn't already obvious: the Web is going to go crazy as companies realize they can have dynamic forms to serve customers without any clerks required. this is going to be a *very* hot area of development over the next few years IMHO. it is really not that big of deal to have an inert "online brochure" but the technical capability required to do programming behind forms to interface with company databases is not trivial, and I think this is going to become an extremely hot occupation over the next few years. in other words, programmers who can customize web sites to interface to the existing company's databases and computer infrastructure will be very valuable. this is called "CGI"; many of you are probably already experts in it. (if you are, I'd like to talk to you about an application I'm trying to write...) examples of this are infinite, but a few: a customer could query the company inventory, find what stores are nearest to his home, find what store has what he wants in stock immediately, check on special prices and discounts of the moment, etc. he might be able to put himself on a company mailing list, etc. so far I have not seen this very widespread, these customized web applications, but I think they are really going to proliferate massively. I have also been seeing a lot of excitement over Java, and I think this really has the potential to become a "net standard binary interchange format". however I think the day when the Java apps are proliferating all over the net will be quite awhile away (6 mos or more at least) and that businesses are still probably going to want to use the more prosaic form interfaces for compatility and simplicity. Java is really starting out right, in that it begins as day 1 as a total free, open standard. Sun and Netscape are not claiming burdensome proprietary rights to it. this makes it amazingly attractive. the market has shown repeatedly that it will often go with an inferior open standard in preference to a technologically superior closed one. (and IMHO with good reason.. the market is pretty rational, just not in ways technophiles necessarily expect). another thing I saw that Sun is promoting: they now have Web authoring applications that require almost no HTML expertise whatsoever. you can drag and drop pictures where you want them in the documents etc. I suspect this may become the preferred way to work on web documents in the future to the point that people who actually memorize all the HTML commands may be in the minority. this actually argues in favor of a HTML that is not necessarily that pretty or syntactically consistent (of course, both aspects have already been pretty much lost in the mad rush to add new features anyway). -- another thing I'd like to point out is that there are a lot of hackers here with specialized knowledge into the web and perl and other tools, and in our culture (the cypherpunk list, e.g.) these things are considered pretty simple, mundane, and obvious, but there is an enormous business culture out there with a lot of money and not very many clues about this technology. the consulting opportunities for "small fries" are becoming very attractive and widespread. it is easy for us to say, "oh, that's no big deal, why would anyone pay money for that??" but in fact what is happening is that people are paying *big* money for simple things like HTML expertise. there were a total of about 50 classes at this show, and you'd be really surprised how many were on fairly basic subjects like "what is the internet? what is the web? what can it do for me?" etc. however many of these classes focused on secure banking transactions. and cryptographic expertise will probably move to the forefront of job requirements in about a year for these kinds of jobs, I would imagine. they will probably tend to emphasize the need for background in security related applications. right now there are a lot of toy, insecure applications but it is only a matter of time before people realize that if you really want to get serious, you have to have cryptography tied in and sharp people to plug all possible security holes, and you don't want stuff made out of "bubblegum and baling wire". so it appears that cypherpunks are really positioned on the crest of a tidal wave!! any of "us" who have been on the list in the pre-web era are beginning to feel like old fogeys from the prehistoric era!! it seems that cyberspace for the elite was born with the Internet, but "cyberspace for the unwashed masses" was born with the Web. --Vlad Nuri

1 0

Re: Princes Die! / Re: None
by nobody＠REPLAY.COM 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Anonymous wrote: > like a river of broken curves and powdered eggshells. > > - A'Tak A'Tdurn This couldn't mean that the attack at dawn is done, could it?

1 0

Re: Confirmation on Diana, please?
by nobody＠REPLAY.COM 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Bubba Rom Dos wrote: ... > Count the number of times you hear the press unwittingly mention that > she died just when her life was coming together and her star was rising. > When you are done counting, that is the number of reasons for why she > had to die. Think about it. > > ~~ > Bubba > ~~ Loose-cannon Diana became dead Saint Diana ala J.F.K. "What a wonderful person she is, now that she's gone." Why do the nefarious, omniprescent 'they' (TM) always announce the death by heart attack so many hours after rushing the target to the hospital? Does it have to do with airline schedules? Any reports of a second driver on the grassy knoll? Any guesses as to when the crash surviver bites it? !Bubba

1 0

Re: Scientology tries to break PGP - and fails?
by Donald M. Kitchen 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- >hack..print out the idea key. >using the IDEA key directly. This would be a neat addition to PGP. It would be fun to take random data and slap PGP headers on it, and maybe throw in a real encryption that doesn't report the true IDEA key. It would be a valuable trick for StealthPGP / stego systems, if we ever need it. Don -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.2 iQB1AwUBMFGJicLa+QKZS485AQH9vgMAwnofHnb7EOpcWVtCp9lWdySM2W7wAnQ5 wNvsKWrEW2aCK+lf1fvNUypLwXN5twA9W1ZLqVOqpJZMjLSVnoo9ulTOJ45hoF2p BZQGAaFqlnl6IQHbmA7l2vBt55GfWAnS =lDmq -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- <don(a)cs.byu.edu> fRee cRyPTo! jOin the hUnt or BE tHe PrEY PGP key - http://bert.cs.byu.edu/~don or PubKey servers (0x994b8f39) June 7&14, 1995: 1st amendment repealed. Death threats ALWAYS pgp signed * This user insured by the Smith, Wesson, & Zimmermann insurance company *

1 0