December 2003 - cypherpunks-legacy

RE: [REBUTTAL] Censorship on cypherpunks?, from The Netly News
by James A. Tunnicliffe 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Aga wrote: > > >Why? Are you a criminal? > > >What are you hiding behind your PGP? > > > > Okay, I'll bite. Where is it said that a person who wants h[is,er] > > privacy > > is a criminal? Charlie McCarthy might have said that. [...deletia...] > The more you PGP, the worse you look. Nobody reads your e-mail, > so stop being so paranoid. > > -aga Sigh. I really don't have time for unimaginative trollers, and you've caught your limit, so into the killfile you go. Still, I would appreciate it if you could see your way clear to quit posting these trolls on cypherpunks, since it does make it harder to effectively filter the responses from people who make the mistake of taking you seriously. Thank you for your kind consideration, Tunny ====================================================================== James A. Tunnicliffe | WWWeb: http://www.inference.com/~tunny Inference Corporation | PGP Fingerprint: CA 23 E2 F3 AC 2D 0C 77 tunny(a)Inference.com | 36 07 D9 33 3D 32 53 9C ====================================================================== begin 600 WINMAIL.DAT M>)\^(AH4`0:0" `$```````!``$``0>0!@`(````Y 0```````#H``$(@ <` M& ```$E032Y-:6-R;W-O9G0@36%I;"Y.;W1E`#$(`06 `P`.````S <+``\` M# `/`!<`!0`D`0$@@ ,`#@```,P'"P`/``P`#P`8``4`)0$!"8 !`"$````Q M.45"-#DQ148T,T1$,#$Q.3,P0S P04$P,$$U1C8P1 `B!P$-@ 0``@````(` M`@`!!( !`$ ```!213H@6U)%0E545$%,72!#96YS;W)S:&EP(&]N(&-Y<&AE M<G!U;FMS/RP@9G)O;2!4:&4@3F5T;'D@3F5W<R `K!4!`Y &`/0&```:```` M`P`F```````#`#8``````!X`< `!````/ ```%M214)55%1!3%T@0V5N<V]R M<VAI<"!O;B!C>7!H97)P=6YK<S\L(&9R;VT@5&AE($YE=&QY($YE=W,@``(! M<0`!````&P````&[TRS")QY)ZGT]]!'0DPP`J@"E]@T``&Y*9P`#`"X````` M``,`!A"T5Q>Q`P`'$$<#```>``@0`0```&4```!!1T%74D]413I72%D_05)% M64]504-224U)3D%,/U=(051!4D593U5(241)3D="14A)3D193U524$=0/T]+ M05DL24Q,0DE415=(15)%25-)5%-!24142$%405!%4E-/3E=(3U=!``````,` M$! ``````P`1$ `````"`0D0`0```+\#``"[`P``(@8``$Q:1G6BU5!"_P`* M`0\"%0*D`^0%ZP*#`% 3`U0"`&-H"L!S973N,@8`!L,"@S(#Q@<3`H,&,P1& M`@!P<G$Q()<(50>R`H,T$P]F-0/%0Q2S$B)S=&5M`H!]%PJ ",\)V3L9GS(U M-0\"@ J!#;$+8&YG,3 ^,Q0@"PH4(0OQ$W!G8:P@=P-@&' Z"H4^'T(@5VAY M/R 3<64@VGD(8" >8 4!;0N !T Z/Q[L805 "L @)&AI0F0+@&<@8F4BP&[& M9" R!<!01U A*A[I`$]K87DL($DGTFP#(&)I&' N'^ ?H-\$D" @! `G``5 M<PMP(X#2="(#(' $D',"(!YP+&AO'G `<'0$(&A;-00`+ 2071[I%-!I=KT` MT'D>Z2<1((D?X$,1P69L") %T&-#"L GP'FR("#09V@%0!' =B @S2=W+@J% M"H5;+B_@#;"^;!(`!S OX2FV'N=4)L!_+9 %L" D(_$ET"? ("!W3P6P$? @ M,QDP;VLF@4Z:;P;@9"V &:!A9 0(a)V2.C92T`P ,0+![G*&#Q)V!T;W C(2+R M-E$*L2T`<&\BT"[F/A[G+6';'E N_%,ML2: 2322)A!U+8!D`B G+>4P4 > M(-L"$ 7 =0,``,!G(.$P4+\[D@-@)A H0270`'!D"H7%($$G+B%C874MPB.C M^RS0(-!T)= V40N -I RTS)K`Q!L9@,0("1G;WTF@%,P4"80)=$*A3,@=?)L M(X!A<!30!9 ',!AP_R<R!I @,P6@0O(1\" C0K&?); @D# P"L% 87%U)E#Y M"H5P;QA@(O(RX3-1/3-7!" H<2K <";!<#Q0:_,]H0"0;F-#PSL0!Y$`P/YK M0\,1P02!"H5 80W!!9!_/.(ZX4$1&'!%\3'1&:!S_T;P`( 'D0-2*"$VH$$Q M***_2B,RX0J%(- 88$HR;T0@OT_1(O(@0A'P!1 (8',ZX/<N[3' `'!K(#,\ M$B.C4''_(X %H "!!($\T0(@-;92%O4\4&XJUCU6CU>?6*]9OZ(]"H4@2F$' M@D$F@#U5PFE%L :02\ ?X"!\8R:@7/!E8CHBL ) <- Z+R]W7= N"X!+P L9 MH$EA+@6@;2]^=/]5V27@7B85$4C !;!4@URR^2/Q($8B\4BQ!1 ",%U @2QQ M02 R,R!%$B 21F+004-BL$0@,-EC8#<W6N9?`T!?UUZB3URA7,%F#Q_@,S9C MH#=8($0Y9S!BT#-CD#/E$B U8M Y0U8?:;]JSR]KWUI>+OP8P0!O$ ! `#D` M0&7"NS'3NP$#`/$_"00```(!1P`!````,0```&,]55,[83T@.W ]26YF97)E M;F-E.VP]3$%.1%)5+3DV,3$Q-3(P,34R,UHM-30Q.0`````"`?D_`0```$H` M````````W*= R,!"$!JTN0@`*R_A@@$`````````+T\]24Y&15)%3D-%+T]5 M/4Y/5D%43R]#3CU214-)4$E%3E13+T-./5153DY9````'@#X/P$````5```` M2F%M97,@02X@5'5N;FEC;&EF9F4``````@'[/P$```!*`````````-RG0,C M0A :M+D(`"LOX8(!`````````"]//4E.1D5214Y#12]/53U.3U9!5$\O0TX] M4D5#25!)14Y44R]#3CU454Y.60```!X`^C\!````%0```$IA;65S($$N(%1U M;FYI8VQI9F9E`````$ `!S 0RY$3,=.[`4 `"#!P10V\,=.[`0,`#33]/P`` M`@$4- $````0````5)2AP"E_$!NEAP(a)`*RHE%QX`/0`!````!0```%)%.B ` M````"P`I```````+`",```````(!?P`!````4 ```#QC/553)6$]7R5P/4EN M9F5R96YC925L/4Q!3D1252TY-C$Q,34R,#$U,C-:+34T,3E ;&%N9')U+FYO 7=F%T;RYI;F9E<F5N8V4R+F-O;3X``P(R ` end

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Re: [REBUTTAL] Censorship on cypherpunks?, from The Netly News
by Dave Hayes 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Mike McNally writes: > Dave Hayes wrote: > > Symbolically, he punched holes in his ideology. That's my > > opinion. > Note that this is only true if John's ideology in the first place > was what you think it was. Excellent point. In point of fact, even if John Gilmore explained his ideology to me, I would *still* only have an ideology that was what I thought it was. There is no chance that I can get John Gilmore's exact ideology in my mind since our minds work differently. > He may have "punched holes" in the conception of John's ideology > that you'd formed in your own mind, of course. Yes, that is the case. Of course, my conception of "free speech" is unique. I see no difference between a government, a group of network administrators, or a panel of judges when it comes to censorship. ------ Dave Hayes - Altadena CA, USA - dave(a)jetcafe.org Freedom Knight of Usenet - http://www.jetcafe.org/~dave/usenet The King decided to force his subjects to tell the truth. Nasrudin was first in line. They asked him, "Where are you going? Tell the truth or be hanged" "I am going," said Nasrudin, "to be hanged on that gallows." "I don't believe you." "Very well, if I have told a lie, then hang me!" "But that would make it the truth!" "Exactly," said Nasrudin, "your truth."

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A New Crypto Announcement--Could be Ominous
by Timothy C. May 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

(My traffic from the Cypherpunks list comes in bursts interspersed by long gaps, so I don't know if this has been reported. It seems significant to me.) A few excerpts: H-P ( Hewlett-Packard Co ) says RSA Data ( Security Dynamics Technologies Inc ) in codes deal PALO ALTO, Calif., Nov 15 (Reuter) - Hewlett-Packard Co. said Security Dynamics Technologies Inc's RSA Data Security Inc electronic encryption company is involved in its planned announcement Monday of new advance in encryption technology. Hewlett-Packard said technology the company's Chairman and Chief Executive Lewis Platt is due to detail at the National Press Club on Monday aims to resolve this roadblock in the use of electronic commerce over the Internet. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^[emphasis added by Tim] Hewlett-Packard officials declined to give precise details, but said the technology has already received backing from the U.S. government and other ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ governments which it did not name, as well as major industry players. Senior executives of Microsoft Corp and Intel Corp are among those scheduled to make presentations on Monday, Hewlett-Packard said, but it declined to identify other companies whose technologies will be involved. ----end of item--- It sounds ominous to me. Another backroom deal, probably for some form of key recovery strategy, aka GAK. --Tim May, awaiting Monday's announcement with trepidation "The government announcement is disastrous," said Jim Bidzos,.."We warned IBM that the National Security Agency would try to twist their technology." [NYT, 1996-10-02] We got computers, we're tapping phone lines, I know that that ain't allowed. ---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---- Timothy C. May | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money, tcmay(a)got.net 408-728-0152 | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero W.A.S.T.E.: Corralitos, CA | knowledge, reputations, information markets, Higher Power: 2^1,257,787-1 | black markets, collapse of governments. "National borders aren't even speed bumps on the information superhighway."

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Re: It is getting easier
by frantz＠netcom.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 11:25 PM 11/14/96 -0800, Lucky Green wrote: >If I remember correctly, some of the newer transponders used on >commercial aircraft actually transmit GPS data back to the controller in >real time. I wonder how long it will be before the FAA will include such >information in their database. I don't think new transponders make much difference. The old ones heighten the radar image of the airplane which gives an accurate 2D position. This position is automatically entered into the FAA computer which maintains the ATC controller's display. In the old style, altitude is determined by an altimeter on the airplane which encoded into the transponder signal. If newer transponders are returning GPS signals, the position may be more accurate (but probably not unless they can decode the selective availability signal). (OBCrypto for those who care.) >"To obtain the position of any passenger flight in the US within 10 >meters, click here." In either case, the Passenger Name Records for the flight are in the airlines databases (and have been there for many years), and the airplane's physical position is in the FAA's computer (and has been for many years). The ability to find the current position of an airplane, or a passenger remains dependent on the incentives and disincentives for database linking and application development. There are no insurmountable technical problems. The technical problems are those of getting old-technology software to do something new. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bill Frantz | The lottery is a tax on | Periwinkle -- Consulting (408)356-8506 | those who can't do math. | 16345 Englewood Ave. frantz(a)netcom.com | - Who 1st said this? | Los Gatos, CA 95032, USA

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Re: [REBUTTAL] Censorship on cypherpunks?, from The Netly News
by frantz＠netcom.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

aga <aga(a)dhp.com> wrote: >Let's stay on topic here -- John Gilmore is a censorous asshole >for pulling Vulis's plug. The topic has nothing to do with >the Freedom-Knights. At 12:19 AM 11/15/96 -0600, snow wrote: >> [This is a rebuttal to a misguided news article.] >> > Cypher-Censored >> > By Declan McCullagh (declan(a)well.com) >> > The list is on Gilmore's machine and he can do what he wants with >> > it; he can moderate the postings, he can censor material, he can >> > shut the whole thing down. By kicking off an offending user, a >> > list owner merely exercises his property right. There's no >> > government involvement, so the First Amendment doesn't apply. And >> > the deleted, disgruntled user is free to start his own mailing >> > list with different rules. >> >> Notice how, once the opposition is admitted to, the rationalization >> begins. Suddenly this is not a matter of censorship, but of ownership. >> Just as suddenly, the classic anti-free-speech arguments of "if you >> don't like it, start yer own" begin to surface. (Anyone ever notice >> how this resembles the "love it or leave it" mentality of certain >> American patriotic organizations?) > > It still isn't censorship. Censorship, at least in my dictionary, >refers to censor, which uses the word "Official" several times. Mr. >Gilmore is not an "Official" in a government sense, he maybe in the EFF >sense, but this is not an "Official" EFF organ, so that doesn't count. Even more important is the fact that Mr. Gilmore did not prevent Mr. Vulis from speaking. No restraint on speech implies no censorship. Therefor Mr. Vulis was not censored. Q.E.D. You all are perfectly free to like or not like what Mr. Gilmore did. However, don't call it censorship because it wasn't. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bill Frantz | The lottery is a tax on | Periwinkle -- Consulting (408)356-8506 | those who can't do math. | 16345 Englewood Ave. frantz(a)netcom.com | - Who 1st said this? | Los Gatos, CA 95032, USA

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Re: Why is cryptoanarchy irreversible?
by frantz＠netcom.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 1:44 PM 11/13/96 +0000, Adam Back wrote: >A very good idea. There was some discussion of this kind of thing a >while back about doing this for Singapore. The suggestion at the time >was not to do it perfectly, but rather to arrange something simple to >allow people to circumvent the censorship enforced through their >compulsory use of a government censored web proxy. I hope it is ready. To quote from William Safire's 11/14/96 NYT column: "Let's run a test. "Information Technology and Political Control in Singapore" is a paper just issued by Prof. Gary Rodan of Murdoch University in Perth, Australia, distribued by Chalmers Johnson of the Japan Policy Research Institute in Cardiff, Calif. It's on this web site: http://www.nmjc.ord/jpri/. "If Lee blocks access, Singaporeans, try E-mail: cjohnson(a)ucsd.edu. But be careful, global business executives: the Architect of the New Century [Lee Kuan Yew - wsf] may be monitoring everything you download." ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bill Frantz | The lottery is a tax on | Periwinkle -- Consulting (408)356-8506 | those who can't do math. | 16345 Englewood Ave. frantz(a)netcom.com | - Who 1st said this? | Los Gatos, CA 95032, USA

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Re: [REBUTTAL] Censorship on cypherpunks?, from The Netly News
by Dave Hayes 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

> Umm, even if we accept Dave's claim that Gilmore pinched holes in > his ideology, these holes are no bigger than Dave Hayes's own holes, > since he exercises censorship of Freedom Fighters mailing list. Firstly, there is no "Freedom Fighters" mailing list. I have done nothing Gilmore didn't do. People can still send their missives to freedom-knights without being subscribed. ------ Dave Hayes - Altadena CA, USA - dave(a)jetcafe.org Freedom Knight of Usenet - http://www.jetcafe.org/~dave/usenet A person being delivered from the danger of a fierce lion does not object whether this service is performed by unknown or illustrious individuals. Why, therefore, do people seek knowledge from celebrities?

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Media seekers, reputation and banishment
by nobody＠huge.cajones.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

> A community offers few punishments for asocial behavior. Killfiles > are partly effective. But the strongest punishment is banishment. The "community" didn't decide anything. John Gilmore did. His machine, his mailing list, his decision, and his responsibility. > The issue is "do we individually banish asocial louts or > collectively?" and of course how do we decide who to banish. Collectively => ban for people who don't want to ban the person. > All of this is certainly easier when done individually yet it is > often prudent and effective to have someone take action when they > are in a position to do be effective. Gilmore acted properly in my > opinion. And DV remains in my killfile. If you still need a killfile, Gilmore wasn't very effective, was he?

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Re: [REBUTTAL] Censorship on cypherpunks?, from The Netly News
by Dave Hayes 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

> So you are explaining your problems in advance. Good, it tells > thoughtful readers to take you with a grain of salt. What a wonderfully self-referential statement. That's exactly what this statement does for you... > > In person-to-person interaction, one's only real defense against what > > one decides to call "unwanted" is to remove oneself from the arena of > > interaction. It may not be possible to ignore or run away from certain > > sources of input. > You forget "shutting down" the source of input. Turning off the > radio, TV etc, or turning off the person speaking. If people have difficulty ignoring those on a mailing list or newsgroup that they do not like, how can you expect them to know about this herculean feat of responsibility? > > > The list is on Gilmore's machine and he can do what he wants with > > > it; he can moderate the postings, he can censor material, he can > > > shut the whole thing down. By kicking off an offending user, a > > > list owner merely exercises his property right. There's no > > > government involvement, so the First Amendment doesn't apply. And > > > the deleted, disgruntled user is free to start his own mailing > > > list with different rules. > > Notice how, once the opposition is admitted to, the rationalization > > begins. Suddenly this is not a matter of censorship, but of ownership. > > Just as suddenly, the classic anti-free-speech arguments of "if you > > don't like it, start yer own" begin to surface. (Anyone ever notice > > how this resembles the "love it or leave it" mentality of certain > > American patriotic organizations?) > It still isn't censorship. Call it what you will. In my eyes, here is someone who is attempting (ineffectually, which is perhaps deliberate) to stop messages from being sent to another human which used to be sent to that other human. Censorship? Ownership? Why does ownership justify dishonor? > Censorship, at least in my dictionary, refers to censor, which uses > the word "Official" several times. Mr. Gilmore is not an "Official" > in a government sense, he maybe in the EFF sense, but this is not an > "Official" EFF organ, so that doesn't count. But he is an official of the list. Censorship is not just practiced by governments... > "Editorial Control" means that someone decides who get's published and > who doesn't. From your opposition to it, I guess you think that a magazine > dedicated to poetry should print all poems submitted, or as many, selected > in some sort of non-judgemental order, as they can fit. Or that a magazine > should print any writings submitted to it. Resistance to lack of editorial control prevents one from seeing the true nature of ideologies and opinions. Maybe you don't want this, but why deny it to others? Still... > I run 4 mailing lists, one is personal, one is in the process of coming > online, and 2 are up and running. One of these has a rule: No Politics allowed. > I guess I am a pathetic little censorous worm huh? If that is what you wish to call yourself. I maintain no such position. > That is what freedom is, the ability to _do it yourself_ not the > requirement that others do it for you, or allow you to use what they > have already built. Freedom is anything but categorizable in the terms you are using. ------ Dave Hayes - Altadena CA, USA - dave(a)jetcafe.org Freedom Knight of Usenet - http://www.jetcafe.org/~dave/usenet It has been said that man is a rational animal. All my life I have been searching for evidence which could support this.

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Re: Internet banking: more on Mbanx
by Robert Hettinga 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

--- begin forwarded text Sender: e$(a)thumper.vmeng.com Reply-To: Enzo Michelangeli <enzo(a)ima.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Precedence: Bulk Date: Fri, 15 Nov 1996 17:28:50 +0800 (hkt) From: Enzo Michelangeli <enzo(a)ima.com> To: Multiple recipients of <e$(a)thumper.vmeng.com> Subject: Re: Internet banking: more on Mbanx On Fri, 15 Nov 1996, networks(a)vir.com wrote: > Unfortunately, their promotional literature does not go > into their Internet services. The information I was given over > the phone was that by signing up they would supply me with > the 128bit version of Netscape for secure transactions. People outside of the US may be interested to know that there is a small, fully legal, free browser with 128-bit SSL security: it's called WorkHorse, and is available with ftp from ftp.mkt.co.uk (that must have got a 110 bps feed, if the connection speed is of any indication). The link inside Banknet's home page, at http://mkn.co.uk/bank/, seems to be wrong and anyway most browsers time out before getting connected. WorkHorse's interface is pretty ugly and the rendition is buggy, but the SSL connection does work: I got through mbanx's "Sign in" link at http://www.mbanx.com/banxing/5welcome.html , whereas MSIE and NS3 were kicked out due to their 40-bit RC4 limit. Enzo --- end forwarded text ----------------- Robert Hettinga (rah(a)shipwright.com) e$, 44 Farquhar Street, Boston, MA 02131 USA "The cost of anything is the foregone alternative" -- Walter Johnson The e$ Home Page: http://www.vmeng.com/rah/

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HP announcement re encryption (fwd)
by Michael Froomkin - U.Miami School of Law 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Fri, 15 Nov 1996 16:27:22 -0500 (EST) >From: Ross Stapleton-Gray [email was here] Subject: HP announcement re encryption >From Reuters... for those in the DC area, it'll be at the National Press Club at 8am Monday... PALO ALTO, Calif. (Reuter) - Hewlett-Packard Co. said Friday that it will unveil a breakthrough agreement on Monday in the long-deadlocked debate over software encryption, a development that could eliminate a key impediment to the growth of electronic commerce via the Internet. A spokesman said H-P Chairman and Chief Executive Lewis Platt will provide details of a deal involving computer industry leaders, the Clinton administation and other governments at a press conference in Washington. A. Michael Froomkin | +1 (305) 284-4285; +1 (305) 284-6506 (fax) Associate Professor of Law | U. Miami School of Law | froomkin(a)law.miami.edu P.O. Box 248087 | http://www.law.miami.edu/~froomkin Coral Gables, FL 33124 USA | It's warm here.

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RE: Remailer Pricing
by Mullen Patrick 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Peter Hendrickson's electrons stated >It looks like I wasn't perfectly clear again. Sorry about that. The user >does not tell anybody whether or not the mail has been read. In fact, >it's nobody's business but their own. This is the advertiser's problem, >and I don't really care whether they solve it. In fact, the user does >not have to put the remailer on the accept list. He or she just has >to tell the remailer operator that they would like to receive a dollar >(or whatever) if the remailer operator sends them any mail. Small point, but noted. I thought the word "read" was mentioned, but obviously it was "received"... Perhaps we've been thinking about anonymous mail the wrong way. Is it like the U.S. Post Office where you have to physically go someplace, buy a stamp, physically write your message, put it in a physical envelope, carry it to a box someplace, and then wait (maybe four days) for it to arrive, all for "only" 32 cents? Or is it more like Federal Express where you pay 20 bucks and it arrives the next day, for sure, every time? Earlier today somebody sent a message about his scary former employers and (apparently) how they just kill people. Would that person pay, say, $5 to have the message delivered reliably and very anonymously? My judgement is that it would be worth every penny, and probably more. >Right now the remailer network is a mess. There just aren't that many >remailers operating in a timely and reliable manner. I am not knocking >the remailer operators for this, it's just clear that "free" doesn't >make it worth their while to keep the remailers operating perfectly >at all times. Very true. This strengthens my point that the remailer operator would want a piece of the pie, as well... >A good pricing strategy for remailers would be to charge, say, $1 for >instant delivery, $.50 for 30 minute delivery, etc. To generate >interest, 4 hour delays could be imposed for free remailing, if the >resources are available. fTotalCostOfDelivery = fCostOfReceipt + nRemailersUsed * fRemailerCost Obviously, nRemailersUsed is only necessary for anonymous chaining... Don't get me wrong, there's nothing meant by this equation, no point trying to be made, nothing. I'm just showing you the pricing strategy. I strongly agree with you that paying for remailer use would greatly improve service, and would probably be a good thing. In the case of chaining, there would have to be a great deal of trust involved so none of the remailers stole all the postage w/out forwarding the message. (Just a thought, anyway) Here's an idea I was tossing around sometime earlier-- One capitalist idea that would invalidate this theory. A remailer would make a lot of money if they made a deal with an advertiser, esp. an advertising agency (containing ads for many companies, if I chose the wrong words) if they eliminated incoming postage, and possibly paid outgoing postage or had the ad agency pay the postage (within limits, of course). The remailer would then tag on advertisements to each mailing. Direct marketing (Note: This is what we're trying to avoid, but I see it happening) The non-charging remailer would become wildly popular, as they don't charge postage, and they would be fast, because they would have corporate sponsorship. This idea is *far* from being farfetched; it exists now. Every mail I receive at my free geocities account has an ad attached. Patrick

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Re: Why is cryptoanarchy irreversible?
by ph＠netcom.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 1:02 PM 11/15/1996, Bill Frantz wrote: >At 1:44 PM 11/13/96 +0000, Adam Back wrote: ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ >> A very good idea. There was some discussion of this kind of thing a >> while back about doing this for Singapore. The suggestion at the time >> was not to do it perfectly, but rather to arrange something simple to >> allow people to circumvent the censorship enforced through their >> compulsory use of a government censored web proxy. > I hope it is ready. To quote from William Safire's 11/14/96 NYT column: ^^^^^^^^ > "Let's run a test. "Information Technology and Political Control in > Singapore" is a paper just issued by Prof. Gary Rodan of Murdoch University > in Perth, Australia, distribued by Chalmers Johnson of the Japan Policy > Research Institute in Cardiff, Calif. It's on this web site: > http://www.nmjc.ord/jpri/. > "If Lee blocks access, Singaporeans, try E-mail: cjohnson(a)ucsd.edu. But be > careful, global business executives: the Architect of the New Century [Lee > Kuan Yew - wsf] may be monitoring everything you download." Guess Safire hits the Cypherpunks list when he needs material! Peter

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Clipper 3.11 executive order
by Michael Froomkin - U.Miami School of Law 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

http://library.whitehouse.gov/PressReleases.cgi?date=0&briefing=4 A. Michael Froomkin | +1 (305) 284-4285; +1 (305) 284-6506 (fax) Associate Professor of Law | U. Miami School of Law | froomkin(a)law.miami.edu P.O. Box 248087 | http://www.law.miami.edu/~froomkin Coral Gables, FL 33124 USA | It's warm here.

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RE: Leadership and Inscrutable Deficiencies
by Blanc Weber 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

From: Vladimir Z. Nuri, in his Ancient Warrior mode: I think many people need to learn a lesson that cyberspace doesn't change certain basic realities, such as how important a dynamic leader is in forward motion in any area. but they will have plenty of opportunities to learn over the next few years and decades. and I'll be snickering in the sidelines as long as they wonder aloud why their realities are as they are and they find the deficiencies therein inscrutable. ..................................................... Oh, Nuri, you're so Morally Superior and so far above us, being more "up" than anyone on inscrutable deficiencies. I find it incredible to realize that it will take *years* in cyberspace before I learn about the immutability of basic realities (and maybe about the Incommensurability of the Diagonal, too). Definitely it will be a very, very long time before I feel the need of being led (around, by the nose?), in place of exercising self-control and reasoned judgement. .. Blanc

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Mirror of new export control regulations
by Michael Froomkin - U.Miami School of Law 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Because it appears that the whitehouse URL changes daily for press releases, I've put a link to a copy of the text of the rules at the top of my homepage. You can also skip straight to it at: http://www.law.miami.edu/~froomkin/nov96-regs.htm A. Michael Froomkin | +1 (305) 284-4285; +1 (305) 284-6506 (fax) Associate Professor of Law | U. Miami School of Law | froomkin(a)law.miami.edu P.O. Box 248087 | http://www.law.miami.edu/~froomkin Coral Gables, FL 33124 USA | It's warm here.

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New Cryptography Regulations
by hallam＠vesuvius.ai.mit.edu 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

The changes themselves are pretty technical http://docs.whitehouse.gov/white-house-publications/ 1996/11/1996-11-15-exec-order-on-crypto-export-controls-administration.text http://docs.whitehouse.gov/white-house-publications/ 1996/11/1996-11-15-president-letter-on-change-in-crypto-export-control.text The main change is that from now on the decisions are to be made by the department of commerce and not by the department of state. This is probably good news since the commerce department has the interests of industry as its primary mission. There is a third document I believe but its not yet been issued. Phill

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Re: ideal secure personal computer system
by frantz＠netcom.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 3:10 PM 11/15/96 -0500, Adam Gulkis wrote: >a locked startup disk is not a good idea, if it is even possible. A system file and boot blocks you know can't be written to is a wonderful aid to a comfortable sleep. For a number of things, I would like to boot off CDROM. (E.g. the program which checks the cryptographic hash of all the executables on my hard drive and delivers me a report.) >Most applications setup scratch space on the startup volume. It would be better if they set up scratch space on the writable volume with the most available space. VM/CMS provided a system call to to this in the late 1960s/early 1970s. "Modern" systems should provide a similar service. >It would >be a better idea to setup a partition for applications and lock it, if >you feel that is necessary. Norton DiskLock is a nice tool that >provides a startup password protection as well as screensaver >password. It will request a password if the machine sleeps or to >reboot after a crash. Protection against strangers walking up to your machine and using it is nice, and easy to do. Protection against viruses which install Trojan horses in your system would also be nice, but is very hard to do in systems where programs run with all the privileges of their users. Examples include (in alpha order): DOS, MacOS, Unix, and Windows (including NT). ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bill Frantz | The lottery is a tax on | Periwinkle -- Consulting (408)356-8506 | those who can't do math. | 16345 Englewood Ave. frantz(a)netcom.com | - Who 1st said this? | Los Gatos, CA 95032, USA

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Reminder -- DCCP Meeting on Saturday, November 16
by Declan McCullagh 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

---------- Forwarded message ---------- WHAT: DC Cypherpunks Meeting WHEN: Saturday, November 16, 1996 @ 3 pm WHERE: 1050 Connecticut Ave NW, Suite 850, Washington, DC (Between K and L streets) WHO: From phone on eighth floor, call to be let in WHY: A description of the crypto protocols used in the SET (Secure Electronic Transaction) standard A PGP key signing HOW: Take the orange/blue line to Farragut West, walk two blocks north (past the park), 1050 Conn. Ave will be on left Take the red line to Farragut North, exit on L street at base of 1050 Conn. Ave From Baltimore, take BaltWashExpy south. It turns into New York Avenue, which turns into Massachusetts Avenue. Take Mass. Ave westbound to Dupont Circle. Then take Connecticut Avenue southbound. 1050 Conn. Ave will be about four blocks away on your right. MORE INFO: http://www.isse.gmu.edu/~pfarrell/dccp/

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Re: [REBUTTAL] Censorship on cypherpunks?, from The Netly News
by Terry Wright 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

>It just "looks" that way on the net. I do live-fucking, newsgroup >flooding, mailbombing, vote-tampering and defamation all legally, >and OPENLY on the InterNet. > >The more you PGP, the worse you look. Nobody reads your e-mail, >so stop being so paranoid. > >-aga > > Who is this idiot?

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Key Escrow
by Rick Osborne 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

For my Professional Ethics class I was charged to do an essay on something topical and analyze it using the three main systems of ethics (Utilitarianism, Kantian Rights, and Justice as fairness.) I have pretty much wrapped up the essay and was hoping I could get some feedback from you guys (and gals, to be PC) about it. It is supposed to stay under 5 pages, and is intended for Joe non-crypto-user, so I wasn't allowed to ramble on about crypto, but I would still like some feedback. Anyone who is interested can obtain the document at: http://www.spacey.net/oringer/rickoz/Ethics.htm and the original Word 7.0 version at: http://www.spacey.net/oringer/rickoz/Ethics.doc Thanks, Rick Rick Osborne / C++ VB Pascal HTML VRML Java / osborne(a)gateway.grumman.com ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Women like a guy who looks trim, neat. You got to be sharp. I look like I'm wearing a circus tent. Any minute now a little tiny car, with sixteen clowns in it is gonna come flying out my butt."

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National Emergency
by Hal Finney 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Michael Froomkin posted to the cyberia list a pointer to the Clinton administration's new export policy. He has a copy on his web site at: <URL: http://www.law.miami.edu/~froomkin/nov96-regs.htm >. The thing I found interesting is that it refers to the fact that we are currently living under a state of national emergency! I searched on the whitehouse web site and couldn't find the executive order referred to (maybe it was classified) but did find this one: For Immediate Release June 30, 1994 Executive Order #12923 - - - - - - - Continuation Of Export Control Regulations By the authority vested in me as President by the Constitution and the laws of the United States of America, including but not limited to section 203 of the International Emergency Economic Powers Act ("Act") (50 U.S.C. 1702), I, William J. Clinton, President of the United States of America, findthat the unrestricted access of foreign parties to U.S. goods, technology, and technical data and the existence of certain boycott practices of foreign nations, in light of the expiration of the Export Administration Act of 1979, as amended (50 U.S.C. App. 2401 et seq.), constitute an unusual and extraordinarythreat to the national security, foreign policy, and economy of the United States and hereby declare a national emergency with respect to that threat. Apparently this state of emergency is still in effect. This is what gives the President the power to unilaterally make changes in the export policy. It would be nice if our congresspeople would take some responsibility in this matter. Hal

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Re: Censor John Gilmore -- EFF is a disgrace!
by Bryondp＠aol.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

take me off this fucking list

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Executive order on crypto
by Peter D. Junger 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Ok, stop squabbling. Here is something important. The President has issued a couple of Executive Orders today that transfer crypto to Commerce (eventually) and that make things worse, not better, as far as I can tell at a quick reading. An important portion of the Executive Orders is a rehash of arguments that the government has made unsuccessfully in the Bernstein case and has also made in my case. I found out about the order from a posting by Michael Froomkin on Cyberia-L. The URL of the Executive Order, for today at least, is: http://library.whitehouse.gov/PressReleases.cgi?date=0&briefing=4 Michael Froomkin has also put up a mirror at: http://www.law.miami.edu/~froomkin/nov96-regs.htm I will have a copy up on my web server (http://samsara.law.cwru.edu) before the evening is over. It seems (again just at a quick reading) that the government is now limiting, or pretending to limit, its regulations on the ``export'' of cryptographic software to communications over the internet or on bulletin boards. As I read the Executive Orders they require that the final regulations shall contain the same sort of restrictions on crypto information that the Computer Decency Act applies to indecency--if the CDA cases are upheld by the Supreme Court, I think that these provisions will be struck down on the authority of that decision. The Executive Orders are not yet in effect. That awaits the proclamation of final regulations, which may be hard to draft--or may be issued on Monday for all I know. And argument in Junger v. Christopher is scheduled for Wednesday. Law is fun! Peter -- Peter D. Junger--Case Western Reserve University Law School--Cleveland, OH Internet: junger(a)pdj2-ra.f-remote.cwru.edu junger(a)samsara.law.cwru.edu URL: http://samsara.law.cwru.edu

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Re: National Emergency
by John Young 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Hal Finney wrote: >I found interesting is that it refers to the fact that we are currently >living under a state of national emergency! [Snip] The same emergency was invoked for the same purpose in December, 1995, with citation of the elusive EO 12924 identical to the latest EO. See: http://jya.com/exporeg1.htm

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