December 2003 - cypherpunks-legacy

Re: The Big Lie
by E. ALLEN SMITH 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

tcmay(a)got.net (Timothy C. May) writes: > [Note: I present this as a line of thinking that is > actually often the result of suppression of views. "If They > are suppressing it, maybe there's some truth to it." Note > also that the views of Zundel and other Holocaust Deniers > are not causally related to the deaths of millions of Jews, > gypsies, and others in WW II. The damage, if any, is in the > "hurt feelings" and "insults" felt by survivors and their > relatives. While survivors and their relatives are certainly the most hurt by such, I would like to mention that the insults in question also include those who allegely lied about the camps. My grandfather (Ltc. (Ret.) William H. Smith) was directly behind the front lines in his Army Intelligence work (document gathering and sorting at that point). He and his sergeant were the first Allied discoverers of one of the camps- I believe Dachau. Moreover, he was in charge of the Paris Documents Center at one point. I don't like his being called a liar. Despite that, I still regard Holocaust Revisionists as having free speech rights. It's just if they try to recreate Krystallnacht (sp?) that I want them dead. -Allen

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[NOISE] Re: The Big Lie
by jfricker＠vertexgroup.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

My grandfather was drafted towards the end of world war ii. he was a doctor and was among the first medical teams to land at anzio. his hospital was the first to arrive at auswitz <sp?>. When asked how that affected him, my grandmother said "After he returned from the war there was no joy left in him." I do not doubt the existance of prison camps in the third reich. Whether the stories have been exaggerated is another question. Besides in this day and age where Isreal is a nuclear arsenal run by nutty rightwing warlords who in their right mind would dare belittle their tragedies. Rewriting history is a powerful tool, whether it be the history of the death of Hendrix, the death of Kennedy, the logging of the pacific northwest or of ethnic cleansing. The only way to combat the powerful who would seek to rewrite history is to create an authenticatable system for document storage. Text books have long been regarded as the predominant model yet, pick up any high school history book and marvel at the differences from say Zinn's "The People's History of the United States". What is needed is more though. A system whereby one can trace the source of the information to the actual time and place of an event as well as authenticating identity. At 02:07 PM 1/28/96 -0800, you wrote: >At 7:59 PM 1/28/96, Mike Duvos wrote: > >>I just visited the Ernst Zundel Webcom page, which given the >>number of server overload errors I experienced trying to browse >>it, is now the Numero Uno Web Site on the entire Internet, thanks >>to some anonymous and largely clueless official running >>telecommunications services for the former Third Reich. > >Like many born after the Second World War, I took it as a fact that the >so-called Holocaust actually happened. I saw pictures of death camps, >interviews with survivors, etc. > >But if it really happened, why are so many countries trying to suppress the >evidence that it was all just a CIA-Mossad plot? It seems more likely that >the pictures were faked, or were pictures taken of dying Germans in Russian >POW camps on the Eastern Front. > >If They are trying to suppress discussion, maybe there's something to their >ideas. > >If the Germans are suppressing attempts to get at the truth, I suspect the >stories are true that the Holocaust was part of Truman's "Big Lie." > >--Tim > > > >[Note: I present this as a line of thinking that is actually often the >result of suppression of views. "If They are suppressing it, maybe there's >some truth to it." Note also that the views of Zundel and other Holocaust >Deniers are not causally related to the deaths of millions of Jews, >gypsies, and others in WW II. The damage, if any, is in the "hurt feelings" >and "insults" felt by survivors and their relatives. The other danger often >cited, that Zundel will recruit a Fourth Reich or somesuch, is no more >likely than that Jerry Falwell will recruit a New Crusade, or that J. >Random Ranter will do the same. In a free and open society, we let people >believe in "wrong ideas" (witness Christianity, Islam, Scientology, >Judaism, and a thousand other cults).] > >Boycott espionage-enabled software! >We got computers, we're tapping phone lines, we know that that ain't allowed. >---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---- >Timothy C. May | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money, >tcmay(a)got.net 408-728-0152 | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero >W.A.S.T.E.: Corralitos, CA | knowledge, reputations, information markets, >Higher Power: 2^756839 - 1 | black markets, collapse of governments. >"National borders aren't even speed bumps on the information superhighway." > > > > >

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The boss is watching...
by dfickes＠advice.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

I've just been contacted by the producer of a cable news/analysis program who is putting together a show focusing on employees fooling around on the Web and what employers can do about it. (Trust their employees?). She is very interested in stories and tales of employers who have taken action against employee "abuse" but also is looking for companies that have policies that satisfy the "auditors" without becoming "onerous." She has convinced me that she is interested in presenting a balanced report and I've offered to gather whatever information I can lay my hands on before Feb 2. Incidentally, I was contacted because of my work on the announcement of "Internet WatchDog", a computer monitoring tool, which was previously mentioned on the list. Thanks for your help in advance... regards, -d David Fickes dfickes(a)advice.com ADVICE Marketing phone: 415/321-2198 366 Cambridge Avenue fax: 415/321-2199 Palo Alto, CA 94306

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Re: [NOISE] Re: The Big Lie
by tcmay＠got.net 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 11:54 PM 1/28/96, John F. Fricker wrote: >My grandfather was drafted towards the end of world war ii. he was a >doctor and was among the first medical teams to land at anzio. his >hospital was the first to arrive at auswitz <sp?>. When asked how that >affected him, my grandmother said "After he returned from the war there >was no joy left in him." > >I do not doubt the existance of prison camps in the third reich. Whether >the stories have been exaggerated is another question. Besides in this day >and age where Isreal is a nuclear arsenal run by nutty rightwing warlords >who in their right mind would dare belittle their tragedies. ..... You need to read a wider variety of articles, and gain an understanding of irony used to make a point. I sometimes despair when I get these comments. (The ones I get in private mail often reveal incurable cluelessness, even if the correspondents are just high school students who somehow found the CP list.) To make it clear to those readers out there who take all posts as literal (and who didn't read my note at the bottom!), I was not doubting that Jews were exterminated. Also, John, you need not quote my entire article at the end of your own comments. Use your editor to quote only the parts you wish to discuss. --Tim Boycott espionage-enabled software! We got computers, we're tapping phone lines, we know that that ain't allowed. ---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---- Timothy C. May | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money, tcmay(a)got.net 408-728-0152 | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero W.A.S.T.E.: Corralitos, CA | knowledge, reputations, information markets, Higher Power: 2^756839 - 1 | black markets, collapse of governments. "National borders aren't even speed bumps on the information superhighway."

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The Dangers of Cross-Pollinating Other Mailing Lists
by tcmay＠got.net 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Folks, When people decide to copy other mailing lists on messages they send to Cypherpunks (or vice versa), we often get flooded with insults and spams from people who don't share our views. (While I have nothing against trying to recruit others to our views, in my opinion this is best done by judicious writing of essays for _them_, tuned to their interests, and not in mindless spamming of every list that might have a passing interest in some of the topics.) We already have enough traffic here, and don't need replies from a bunch of other lists, be they libertarian lists, digital commerce lists, human rights lists, or java lists. The latest example of this is the rantfest invvolving these players: ------ From: Jack Hammer <jh(a)teleport.com> To: jim bell <jimbell(a)pacifier.com> Cc: Rich Graves <llurch(a)networking.stanford.edu>, cypherpunks(a)toad.com, nwlibertarians(a)teleport.com, hammernet-l(a)teleport.com, libernet-d(a)dartmouth.EDU, liberty-and-justice(a)pobox.com ------ I recognized Bell and Graves, but not the others. And I see no reason why our list should be dragged into flames about "fart sacks" by people on all of these other lists. This was the final straw, and I have no choice except to add Bell, Graves, Hammer, etc. to my filter list, which I will now proceed to do before sending this message off. [Done] Words have consequences. So do flames. --Tim May Boycott espionage-enabled software! We got computers, we're tapping phone lines, we know that that ain't allowed. ---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---- Timothy C. May | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money, tcmay(a)got.net 408-728-0152 | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero W.A.S.T.E.: Corralitos, CA | knowledge, reputations, information markets, Higher Power: 2^756839 - 1 | black markets, collapse of governments. "National borders aren't even speed bumps on the information superhighway."

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Re: The Big Lie
by Daniel Miskell 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Hey Tim- Just a thought. When you stated that other countries might be trying to (basically) pretend the holocaust had never happened, because it might NOT have happened and may very well be a big lie, you forgot to consider somthing. Had the holocaut happened, which i believe it did, it was of such horific magnitude that, since (for a time) we sat back and let it happen, let 6 million innocent people die, we might be trying to forget about it so as to not have to take responsibility for it having happened. It is much easier to say that it never existed and have no responsibility, than to acknoledge that it happened, and to look at what kind of people it makes us to let it happen. Just a thought. :) Dan --- _________________________________ *!Cheese Doctrine:!* Though cultured over time, and aged to perfection, one must not yield to produce mold. One must also not belittle themselves by conforming to the "whiz", but melt over the unprocessed ideas of Ghuda. _________________________________

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Opinion piece in NYT; responses needed
by jrochkin＠cs.oberlin.edu 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

> The New York Times, January 2, 1996, Business, p. 14 > > > Viewpoint: J. Walker Smith > > Standoff in Cyberspace Gulch > > > In the new frontier that is cyberspace, a showdown is > shaping up as the law moves into town. On one side is a > band of cybercitizens bent on protecting their privacy as > they explore this unmapped territory. On the other are the > lawmakers charged with safeguarding all cybercitizens from > crime, even if it means forcing them to give up some of > their privacy by, say, signing in as they enter town. > > This is how the public debate over cyberspace security has > been framed. And on-line users are, indeed, worried about > security. Yankelovich Partners surveyed 400 randomly > selected on-line users, aged 16 and older, by telephone in > mid-October and found that 90 percent agree that better > Internet security is needed to insure that personal and > financial information is not accessible to unauthorized > people. Nearly 80 percent believe it is too easy for one's > credit card number to be stolen if used on the Internet. > And almost 70 percent agree that pornography on the > Internet has gone far beyond reasonable bounds. This op-ed starts out by portraying the two 'sides' as 'lawmakers safeguarding from crime", and "citizens bent on protecting privacy"--which I'd say is fairly accurate. The next paragraph, however, discusses the fact that almost everyone agrees that 'better internet security ' is neccesary is support for the lawmakers side of things. It goes on to say: [...] > A cyberspace that offered privacy, security and decency > would clearly be preferred. But recognizing that this > simply may not be technologically achievable, most on-line > users put security and decency ahead of absolute privacy. > Fifty-three percent of cybercitizens agree that > guaranteeing Internet security is more important than > worrying about the privacy of each user. The rest of the opinion piece only gets worse--the author thinks that, while privacy is a good goal, "in no way should [privacy] distract regulators from maintaining order and decency on this new frontier, nor should it be allowed to defeat the progress of commercial ventures. " Now, first of all, the cypherpunks are clearly an entity that values _both_ privacy and security, and doesn't see them as at all contradictory. They're two sides of the crypto coin. The very same encryption that can make it possible to set up secure credit card transactions also makes it possible to use anonymous remailers--and the security isn't harmed by people with anonymous shell accounts or access to the net. Chaum's digicash could theoretically provide security _and_ anonymity, without any contradiction. Now, Walter Smith probably wouldn't be satisified with cypherpunkian solutions--he doesn't want anonymous communications _regardless_ of whether we also get secure credit card transactions, and would be perfeclty happy with crypto available to everyone, and a law against anonymous communications on the net. But, regardless of his own opinion of privacy/anonymity and security individually, in this piece he portrays them as linked, and in fact mutually damaging. There is a danger of this view becomming commonplace--whenever we encounter it, we should take pains to argue that privacy/anonymity and security _aren't_ mutually exclusive, are sometimes mutually _enhancing_ (ITAR restrictions make anon remailers and secure financial transactions a pain in the ass to set up legally). And we should make it clear that there are a lot of people out there who value both extremely highly, and don't see any need to sacrifice one for the other. [I'm not sure of the proper email address to send a response to this viewpoint, but you might try "viewpts(a)nytimes.com", which is the proper place to submit "viewpoints", ie op-ed pieces in Business section of the NYT]. Very interesting also, is that Smith explicitly says that privacy concerns shouldn't be allowed to "defeat the progress of commercial ventures". It's unclear exactly what the 'progress' that Smith is talking about is, that would be defeated by putting too much emphasis on privacy. But the previous paragraph mentions "users will find it in their self-interest to reveal more and more about themselves so the interactive system can cater easily to their needs and preferences.... 71 percent of respondents found it highly desirable to be able to receive customized information, while only 35 percent felt the same about a guarantee of anonymity." Smith appears to be saying that the interests of commercial ventures in ammassing data about what consumers visited what web sites, and what consumers are likely targets of customized marketting (customized information?), should take precedence over the interests of citizens in keeping their information private! Many on cypherpunks are used to thinking of business interests as if they match cypherpunks interests, I think--certainly they seem to where ITAR is concerned, at the moment. But it's good to remember that 'business interests', at least as interpreted by some businesses, are going to contradict cypherpunks interets. Unfortunately, business interests often seem to have the advantage in the U.S. legislative process--with this in mind, lobbying action from 'public interest' groups like the EFF, and us as individuals, is more important when it doesn't line up with business interests (protecting anonymity) then when it does (getting rid of ITAR). Large corporations are lobbying for loosening ITAR, and we can help them, but when lobbying for allowing anonmity, if it comes down to that, we'll have fewer/less powerful allies. Also, clearly in this survey, they asked two independent questions "Do you find it desirable to be able to receieve customized information" (71% said yes), "do you find it desirable to be able to guarantee anonymity" (35% yes, which is actually enhearteningly higher then I would have thought). In the context of his opinion piece, though, he clearly sets them up against each other--what if the surveyed had been asked "When guaranteeing anonymity comes into conflict with allowing commercial ventures to send you customized adverts, which is more important"? Obviously, that question is biased also, but my point is that it's important to make this connection in people's minds. Here, there might _be_ a tradeoff--and consumers frequently get up in arms about how anyone can get their credit report, or their driving record, or whatever. It's important that we create a connection between anonmity on the net, and empowerment to keep personal information personal--we need to link the "customized information" which Smith's surveyees were so enamored of, to the privacy invasions posed by credit reports and such, that consumers already know about and know they don't like. [I'm going to try to make myself write a letter to the NYT in response to that viewpoint, making some of these points I'm saying it's important to make, but you should too. :) ]

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Opinion piece in NYT; responses needed
by John Young 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Responding to msg by jrochkin(a)cs.oberlin.edu (Jonathan Rochkind) on Sun, 28 Jan 7:33 PM > The New York Times, January 2, 1996, Business, p. 14 > Viewpoint: J. Walker Smith > Standoff in Cyberspace Gulch That's January 28, 1996, no lie. Mein typo, bitte schoen. Back to Mr. Rochkind's assail.

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mailing list
by tchen＠mindport.net 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

can i get on the mailing list?

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Re: "German service cuts Net access" (to Santa Cruz)
by David K. Merriman 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- At 04:02 PM 01/28/96 -0600, m5(a)dev.tivoli.com (Mike McNally) wrote: > >olmur(a)dwarf.bb.bawue.de writes: > > It's illegal in Germany to publish material denying the holocaust. In > > the same moment this guy sent his book [...] per snail-mail from Canada > > to Germany he commited a crime here in Germany. > >Hi. President M5 of Psychonia here. I'm afraid we've recently >enacted legislation in the tiny nation of Psychonia that makes it >illegal to parenthesize question marks in electronic mail messages, >because such acts are a direct offense to some of the members of >primitive hill tribes who live in remote portions of our land. > >I issue this warning not to set foot in Psychonia or any of the >countries with whom we share extradition treaties, or you will be >arrested and brought here for trial, conviction, and punishment. > This message is _clearly_ an effort to spread *pornography* on the net. I know this to be true through the use of a 3-letter code that I have cleverly deleted . If you continue to spread this vile and disgusting trash, I shall have no choice but to complain to my government representatives and have all imports from your country banned, and to pressure companies not to do business in/with your nation. Dave Merriman -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.2 iQCVAwUBMQtudMVrTvyYOzAZAQEJlAP/WeH2TkFaa0MBz2AfWsbOU30flSmghqCn Hg30Uwi44fHg4zpGsQYPfwPofK5BJ+cwPcTBuhurZgmKxhEJuj5OrrOw/kaKLjnu uJ82MEIEhkojCUGAQicYgW+B2g62vtJXYhBuQWTKzrKpiys2vYucil6m/8fxZFKx TDSq4sHK5IA= =MtgG -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- ------------------------------------------------------------- "It is not the function of our Government to keep the citizen from falling into error; it is the function of the citizen to keep the Government from falling into error." Robert H. Jackson (1892-1954), U.S. Judge <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><> My web page: http://www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/1148

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Escrowing Viewing and Reading Habits with the Government
by tcmay＠got.net 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 2:59 AM 1/28/96, Lucky Green wrote: >Of course the V-Chip transmits the ID number of the program to be rated >upstream. Since all programs will be rated by the chip, regardless if you >choose to use the rating or not, the exact channel you are watching will be >tracked and logged. > >Have fun, This is a serious misstatement of the proposal! I am shocked, simply shocked. If Lucky only knew what I know... The logged information is only available to law enforcement if they have a legitimate need to know, as evidenced by a valid court order, an authorization from the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court, a request by a regional or local police department, or upon suspicion that a sex offender or pedophile is displaying too much interest in children's shows or "Baywatch." The "Library Awareness Program," administered by the Justice Department, is designed to identify potential criminals before they have a chance to commit their deeds. The visits to libraries made by the FBI are used to determine who is reading subversive or dangerous material. According to Director Freeh, "If we had had this program in place when Timothy McVeigh was a child, we could have detected his interest in ANFO and picked him up for reeducation, or at least recruited him for the CIA's Lockerbie team." Finally, I am confidant the the viewing habits "escrowed" with the government will only be used for good purposes. The policeman is our friend. --Klaus! Boycott espionage-enabled software! We got computers, we're tapping phone lines, we know that that ain't allowed. ---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---- Timothy C. May | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money, tcmay(a)got.net 408-728-0152 | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero W.A.S.T.E.: Corralitos, CA | knowledge, reputations, information markets, Higher Power: 2^756839 - 1 | black markets, collapse of governments. "National borders aren't even speed bumps on the information superhighway."

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Re: Downsizing the NSA
by jf_avon＠citenet.net 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Timothy C. May wrote: >AT&T is downsizing, IBM downsized a while back, so why couldn't the NSA >just do the right thing: admit that the Soviet threat is no more, >congratulate the victors, and downsize by 20,000 employees? Your post is very interesting. I would like to add to it in the form of a question: Q) What are the factors, in what context did AT&T and IBM and many other big companies downsize? Or, in other words: What are the ultimate contextual causes of the downsizing? Regards to Cypherpunks from a new guy on the mailing list. JFA

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Re: "German service cuts Net access" (to Santa Cruz)
by jrochkin＠cs.oberlin.edu 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 1:47 AM 01/29/96, Felix Lee wrote: >> Are you saying that, if I ran a bookstore, and accepted international >> mail orders, I would have to screen every order to ensure I did not >> ship something offensive to the German government? > >urrr. yes? anyone doing international shipping has to comply with >customs regulations anyway. this isn't really any different. (except >when telecom or broadcast media become involved.) > >(excuse me while I see if I can ship smallpox to germany.) >-- If you violate customs regulations on the receiving end, all that's going to happen is the book you sent gets confiscated. Which is only bad for the receiving party (in Germany), since you already have the money, which is fine since it's reasonable to expect the receiving party in Germany to know German customs regulations. You, as shipper, certainly won't get extradicted to Germany from Denmark or anywhere else. Trying to ship smallpox to Germany might be another matter, of course.

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Re: "German service cuts Net access" (to Santa Cruz)
by jf_avon＠citenet.net 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Well, here is a very costly but ultimate answer: Cancel all business you have with germany and let them know the reason. This will speak much more louder than any civil liberty protest. The feodal view of most europe makes any appeal to liberty futile. JFA

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Ernst Zundel impersonator on Usenet
by Declan B. McCullagh 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Ernst Zundel is the holocaust revisionist who sparked the Wiesenthal Center's attempts at censorship, and the latest move by the German government. Now an AOL alias, "ernstzundl(a)aol.com", is being used in the course of an impressive trolling spree on Usenet newsgroups including aus.flame, alt.skinheads, alt.mindcontrol, and soc.culture.jewish. Some excerpts from posts to soc.culture.jewish: Prior to 1904, there *were* no black people. But they invented the whole myth of Africa, the slave trade, pyramids in Egypt, etc-- to serve their own ends. I know this because *I* have studied history. This is why I am the Revisionist Extraordinaire. I know obscure things about history that nobody except me knows. FOIL THE JEWISH PLOT!! POLUTE THE EARTH!! CONTAMINATE THE WATER!! DESTROY EVERY LIVING THING TO SAVE IT FROM THE JEWS!! AND THEN WAIT FOR THE MOTHER SHIP TO BRING US TO OUR HOME IN THE STARS! I found an interesting message with the help of Alta Vista. Posted by "ernstzundl(a)aol.com" to rec.scuba, it said: Does anyone know of any scuba clubs in or near Kingston, NY? Thanks! I'm not familiar with how AOL screen names work, but my guess is that the Kingston, NY resident impersonating Zundel forgot to switch back to his other screen name before posting. -Declan

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Decrypting the "MIG Group"
by James M. Cobb 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Friend, A 01 29 96 Electronic Telegraph newsstory ----------------------------------------- Riddle of spooks in the White House BY AMBROSE EVANS-PRITCHARD reports: Official logs kept by the US secret service...indicate that a top White House aide, Patsy Thomasson, met a team of secret service technicians at her office on the night of Mr Foster's death. Evans-Pritchard writes: ...logs kept by Secret Service staff at the White House --pub- lished in Senate documents on the death of Mr Foster-- show that a so-called "MIG Group" was checked into offices occupied by Miss Thomasson and her boss, David Watkins...at 7.10 pm on July 20, 1993. Miss Thomasson was the only member of the White House staff log- ged into the office at the time. She checked out at the same time as the "MIG Group" at 7.44 pm.... E-P inquired about MIG, but-- The press spokesman for the Secret Service at first said that he had not heard of the acronym "MIG". The next day he changed his account, saying that the "MIG Group" was a team of Secret Service technicians that had gone to Miss Thomasson's office that night to conduct a routine alarm check. He said he could not divulge what the acronym MIG stood for be- cause the unit was secret. However, Intelligence sources have told The Sunday Telegraph that "MIG" stands for "military intelligence group". MIG groups are typi- cally known as Technical Services Counter-Measure teams (TSCMs), highly classified units that handle high-tech counter-espionage. Their duties, for example, include sweeping for bugs at the White House. Sources say that the high-tech counter-espionage staff at the White House are controlled and operated by the Federal Emergency Management Agency, known as FEMA. This agency...has enormous power and can draw freely on the capabilities of the CIA, the FBI, and the Pentagon. E-P concludes: ...[The logs] add to the growing weight of evidence that a tiny group at the White House was tipped off early about Foster's death, long before the official notification at 8.30 pm. It would have provided a window of at least an hour to cover things up before anybody was alerted. If so, America is facing a White House scandal that is every bit as serious and nasty as Watergate. The Electronic Telegraph can be accessed at: http://www.telegraph.co.uk The newsstory is under World News. Its online filename is wamby- 27.html. Cordially, Jim

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Re: "Concryption" Prior Art
by Bill Stewart 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

>>However the Con-cryption patent covers first compressing, then >>encrypting. > >Isn't that how PGP does its thing (first compress the data and then feed it >into the Encryption Stage)? PGP is prior art in-and-of-itself. Peter Wayner posted that the "new" thing about the way they do it is that it saves time by combining the steps. But I think I've seen approximately the same done with arithmetic-coding compression? #-- # Thanks; Bill # Bill Stewart, stewarts(a)ix.netcom.com, Pager/Voicemail 1-408-787-1281 # # "Eternal vigilance is the price of liberty" used to mean us watching # the government, not the other way around....

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Re: CP LITE: A Censorship Device?
by Bill Stewart 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 03:54 AM 1/28/96 -0600, you wrote: >I've been watching this CP Lite thing develop. > >Sounds like an attempt to moderate the list. >I mean it's easy to post out of it, >but hard to answer to it. >And all of the good back and forth discussion >gets lost in a backwash of private email. The default behaviour of Eudora seems to work reasonably well for replying to these. Reply pops up a message with To: John Doe #2 <jdoe-2(a)alpha.c2.org> From: My Name <me(a)here.com> Subject: Re: whatever Cc: At 03:54 AM 1/28/96 -0600, you wrote: > WHATEVER IT WAS and you can just fill in cypherpunks(a)toad.com as the Cc:. Your mailer may vary, but it's probably got a similar capability. The main problem I have is the "you wrote" as opposed to "John Doe <jdoe-2(a)alpha.c2.org> wrote", which is more like what you want for mailing lists, but that can be copy&pasted or ignored. The person you're replying to usually gets two copies, but that's minor. #-- # Thanks; Bill # Bill Stewart, stewarts(a)ix.netcom.com, Pager/Voicemail 1-408-787-1281 # # "Eternal vigilance is the price of liberty" used to mean us watching # the government, not the other way around....

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Re: Denning's misleading statements
by Bill Stewart 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 04:54 PM 1/28/96 -0500, perry(a)piermont.com wrote: >Well, not really. Silvio Micali did some work on this topic. Er, yes - Micali's term "fair cryptosystem" outranks even "key escrow" on my outragious pro-government toadyism bogometer ..... #-- # Thanks; Bill # Bill Stewart, stewarts(a)ix.netcom.com, Pager/Voicemail 1-408-787-1281 # http://www.idiom.com/~wcs

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Re: Denning's misleading statements
by Bill Stewart 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 03:12 PM 1/28/96 -0500, Ben Samman. wrote: >There's quite a few folks in the Yale CS department that are pro-Clipper >or fence sitters. They justify it in class by claiming that law >enforcement needs these abilities if LE is to remain effective. They're quite correct - it's a problem of values and goals, and theirs differ from mine. IF law enforcement is to be effective (at those things it's effective at, like self-preservation and politician-electing), then it WILL need this increase in power. Because otherwise we WILL move to crypto-anarchy. I hope we will anyway, and perhaps the tackiness of the Clipper forces will encourage the general public to get there faster rather than slower. BTW, the reason Swiss banking laws were so strong for so many years was because the Nazis were pressuring bankers to give out information on their Jewish customers... #-- # Thanks; Bill # Bill Stewart, stewarts(a)ix.netcom.com, Pager/Voicemail 1-408-787-1281 # http://www.idiom.com/~wcs

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pub key
by an253362＠anon.penet.fi 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

Hi all! Interested in discussing underground matters of cypherpunks. Send your pgp pub key for more privacy. FYI, my pub key: -----BEGIN PGP PUBLIC KEY BLOCK----- Version: 2.6.2i mQCNAzCao3cAAAEEANtplwCQqBOzXFfnHqUj6DCUfxhGPNH4J5/GadrqHjxSboDd E0PEaXqg3JvAxMckmvasugDSK80rzEwgYJspeVuh6Cuq2fLhcFwGi1zn2mDrDlzO 0rQB8+CPj3dc03Eih9h8UvMcPl41VDwdtSV7CYXa5isMqw1fwh4YWpiTx+FtAAUR tAxIZWxsJ3MgQW5nZWyJAJUDBRAw8rfgHhhamJPH4W0BAdezA/9hu5OUg6hiEuJ4 CU2cPdeoesTt8IfyGmAI7QCe5fXnGuNFTDjdlzS7FBUUE13ci5RNBUUs+jUNHeWp ubyNBT0jvZUsTOBsrftrBxCW9PpeqZCXXSpxFx8XOgjdAQmf7a9bAKvq0IWx5/19 0NozRdmy61sBGMzFMNuSayLS3qR7kbQfQW5nZWxvIDxhbjI1MzM2MkBhbm9uLnBl bmV0LmZpPg== =Wv6H -----END PGP PUBLIC KEY BLOCK----- --****ATTENTION****--****ATTENTION****--****ATTENTION****--***ATTENTION*** Your e-mail reply to this message WILL be *automatically* ANONYMIZED. Please, report inappropriate use to abuse(a)anon.penet.fi For information (incl. non-anon reply) write to help(a)anon.penet.fi If you have any problems, address them to admin(a)anon.penet.fi

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[UTTER NOISE]Re: FV Demonstrates Fatal Flaw in Software Encryption of Credit Cards
by stevenw＠best.com 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

>> INFORMATION IS INSECURE THE MOMENT YOU TOUCH A KEY. > >> This does not mean that Internet commerce is dead. Any scheme that is >> not based on self-identifying one-way financial instruments such as >> credit cards will be essentially unaffected by this problem. Moreover, >> even credit cards may be made safe on the Internet using one of two >> approaches: secure hardware add-ons and the First Virtual approach. etc. My name for this kind of software: Terminate and Stay Clueless ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Steven Weller | "The Internet, of course, is more | than just a place to find pictures | of people having sex with dogs." stevenw(a)best.com | -- Time Magazine, 3 July 1995

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Re: Downsizing the NSA
by Karl A. Siil 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 08:18 PM 1/28/96 EST, Dr. Dimitri Vulis wrote: >I went to a talk by Andy Koenig a few weeks ago and he claimed that even >though AT&T is laying off people (and splitting) they're still hiring every >internet/security person they could find. I don't know if this is tacky or politically incorrect for this list (so I'll keep it short), ... Speaking for my security group, this is correct. Anyone interested is urged to send me private e-mail. Karl

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List of reliable remailers
by Raph Levien 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

I operate a remailer pinging service which collects detailed information about remailer features and reliability. To use it, just finger remailer-list(a)kiwi.cs.berkeley.edu There is also a Web version of the same information, plus lots of interesting links to remailer-related resources, at: http://www.cs.berkeley.edu/~raph/remailer-list.html This information is used by premail, a remailer chaining and PGP encrypting client for outgoing mail, which is available at: ftp://ftp.csua.berkeley.edu/pub/cypherpunks/premail/premail-0.33a.tar.gz For the PGP public keys of the remailers, finger pgpkeys(a)kiwi.cs.berkeley.edu This is the current info: REMAILER LIST This is an automatically generated listing of remailers. The first part of the listing shows the remailers along with configuration options and special features for each of the remailers. The second part shows the 12-day history, and average latency and uptime for each remailer. You can also get this list by fingering remailer-list(a)kiwi.cs.berkeley.edu. $remailer{"extropia"} = "<remail(a)extropia.wimsey.com> cpunk pgp special"; $remailer{"portal"} = "<hfinney(a)shell.portal.com> cpunk pgp hash"; $remailer{"alumni"} = "<hal(a)alumni.caltech.edu> cpunk pgp hash"; $remailer{"bsu-cs"} = "<nowhere(a)bsu-cs.bsu.edu> cpunk hash ksub"; $remailer{"c2"} = "<remail(a)c2.org> eric pgp hash reord"; $remailer{"penet"} = "<anon(a)anon.penet.fi> penet post"; $remailer{"ideath"} = "<remailer(a)ideath.goldenbear.com> cpunk hash ksub reord"; $remailer{"hacktic"} = "<remailer(a)utopia.hacktic.nl> cpunk mix pgp hash latent cut post ek"; $remailer{"flame"} = "<remailer(a)flame.alias.net> cpunk mix pgp. hash latent cut post reord"; $remailer{"rahul"} = "<homer(a)rahul.net> cpunk pgp hash filter"; $remailer{"mix"} = "<mixmaster(a)remail.obscura.com> cpunk mix pgp hash latent cut ek ksub reord ?"; $remailer{"ford"} = "<remailer(a)bi-node.zerberus.de> cpunk pgp hash ksub ek"; $remailer{"hroller"} = "<hroller(a)c2.org> cpunk pgp hash latent ek"; $remailer{"vishnu"} = "<mixmaster(a)vishnu.alias.net> cpunk mix pgp hash latent cut ek ksub reord"; $remailer{"robo"} = "<robo(a)c2.org> cpunk hash mix"; $remailer{"replay"} = "<remailer(a)replay.com> cpunk mix pgp hash latent cut post ek"; $remailer{"spook"} = "<remailer(a)valhalla.phoenix.net> cpunk mix pgp hash latent cut ek reord"; $remailer{"rmadillo"} = "<remailer(a)armadillo.com> mix cpunk pgp hash latent cut ek"; $remailer{"ecafe"} = "<cpunk(a)remail.ecafe.org> cpunk mix"; $remailer{"wmono"} = "<wmono(a)valhalla.phoenix.net> cpunk mix pgp. hash latent cut"; $remailer{"shinobi"} = "<remailer(a)shinobi.alias.net> cpunk mix hash latent cut ek reord"; $remailer{"amnesia"} = "<amnesia(a)chardos.connix.com> cpunk mix pgp hash latent cut ek ksub"; $remailer{"gondolin"} = "<mix(a)remail.gondolin.org> cpunk mix pgp hash latent cut ek reord"; $remailer{"tjava"} = "<remailer(a)tjava.com> cpunk mix pgp hash latent cut"; $remailer{"pamphlet"} = "<pamphlet(a)idiom.com> cpunk pgp hash latent cut ?"; $remailer{'alpha'} = '<alias(a)alpha.c2.org> alpha pgp'; $remailer{'gondonym'} = '<alias(a)nym.gondolin.org> alpha pgp'; $remailer{'nymrod'} = '<nymrod(a)nym.alias.net> alpha pgp'; catalyst(a)netcom.com is _not_ a remailer. lmccarth(a)ducie.cs.umass.edu is _not_ a remailer. usura(a)replay.com is _not_ a remailer. Groups of remailers sharing a machine or operator: (c2 robo hroller alpha) (gondolin gondonym) (flame hacktic replay) (alumni portal) (vishnu spook wmono) Use "premail -getkeys pgpkeys(a)kiwi.cs.berkeley.edu" to get PGP keys for the remailers. Fingering this address works too. Note: The remailer list now includes information for the alpha nymserver. Last update: Mon 29 Jan 96 6:45:43 PST remailer email address history latency uptime ----------------------------------------------------------------------- nymrod nymrod(a)nym.alias.net *+***+* 10:20 99.99% pamphlet pamphlet(a)idiom.com +-++++++++++ 44:43 99.99% ecafe cpunk(a)remail.ecafe.org #####*###*## 6:24 99.98% c2 remail(a)c2.org +**+******** 16:42 99.96% flame remailer(a)flame.alias.net ++-++++--+++ 2:20:51 99.96% ford remailer(a)bi-node.zerberus.de -+___.-+--++ 13:18:57 99.96% tjava remailer(a)tjava.com ** ###-*#### 3:55 99.94% alpha alias(a)alpha.c2.org #**** ****** 3:33 99.89% mix mixmaster(a)remail.obscura.com -------++-+ 1:34:41 99.83% alumni hal(a)alumni.caltech.edu *#+ *+*+-+## 17:44 99.82% portal hfinney(a)shell.portal.com *## # #*#+*# 2:10 99.72% hroller hroller(a)c2.org ############ :31 99.53% penet anon(a)anon.penet.fi .__--.._ .- 27:57:50 97.03% shinobi remailer(a)shinobi.alias.net + #+### #### 2:06:45 94.21% extropia remail(a)extropia.wimsey.com ...-_.-_. 24:28:54 92.68% rahul homer(a)rahul.net *+***--** ## 17:20 99.69% vishnu mixmaster(a)vishnu.alias.net +**** +*+* 14:48 83.47% replay remailer(a)replay.com ** 6:00 56.93% hacktic remailer(a)utopia.hacktic.nl ** 8:12 55.13% bsu-cs nowhere(a)bsu-cs.bsu.edu * 8:49 8.99% History key * # response in less than 5 minutes. * * response in less than 1 hour. * + response in less than 4 hours. * - response in less than 24 hours. * . response in more than 1 day. * _ response came back too late (more than 2 days). cpunk A major class of remailers. Supports Request-Remailing-To: field. eric A variant of the cpunk style. Uses Anon-Send-To: instead. penet The third class of remailers (at least for right now). Uses X-Anon-To: in the header. pgp Remailer supports encryption with PGP. A period after the keyword means that the short name, rather than the full email address, should be used as the encryption key ID. hash Supports ## pasting, so anything can be put into the headers of outgoing messages. ksub Remailer always kills subject header, even in non-pgp mode. nsub Remailer always preserves subject header, even in pgp mode. latent Supports Matt Ghio's Latent-Time: option. cut Supports Matt Ghio's Cutmarks: option. post Post to Usenet using Post-To: or Anon-Post-To: header. ek Encrypt responses in reply blocks using Encrypt-Key: header. special Accepts only pgp encrypted messages. mix Can accept messages in Mixmaster format. reord Attempts to foil traffic analysis by reordering messages. Note: I'm relying on the word of the remailer operator here, and haven't verified the reord info myself. mon Remailer has been known to monitor contents of private email. filter Remailer has been known to filter messages based on content. If not listed in conjunction with mon, then only messages destined for public forums are subject to filtering. Raph Levien

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Re: "German service cuts Net access" (to Santa Cruz)
by James A. Donald 17 Dec '03

17 Dec '03

At 09:43 PM 1/28/96 MET, Olmur wrote: >The difference is, that the German government was not ordering this >block. German prosecutors are sending intimidating messages to various ISPs. Some ISPs are more easily intimidated than others. The messages fall short of saying "You will be prosecuted if you do not obey", but they do say "You may be prosecuted if you do not obey." --------------------------------------------------------------------- | We have the right to defend ourselves | http://www.jim.com/jamesd/ and our property, because of the kind | of animals that we are. True law | James A. Donald derives from this right, not from the | arbitrary power of the state. | jamesd(a)echeque.com

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