August 2002 - cypherpunks-legacy

Re: TCPA/Palladium -- likely future implications
by AARG! Anonymous 10 Aug '02

10 Aug '02

I want to follow up on Adam's message because, to be honest, I missed his point before. I thought he was bringing up the old claim that these systems would "give the TCPA root" on your computer. Instead, Adam is making a new point, which is a good one, but to understand it you need a true picture of TCPA rather than the false one which so many cypherpunks have been promoting. Earlier Adam offered a proposed definition of TCPA/Palladium's function and purpose: > "Palladium provides an extensible, general purpose programmable > dongle-like functionality implemented by an ensemble of hardware and > software which provides functionality which can, and likely will be > used to expand centralised control points by OS vendors, Content > Distrbuters and Governments." IMO this is total bullshit, political rhetoric that is content-free compared to the one I offered: : Allow computers separated on the internet to cooperate and share data : and computations such that no one can get access to the data outside : the limitations and rules imposed by the applications. It seems to me that my definition is far more useful and appropriate in really understanding what TCPA/Palladium are all about. Adam, what do you think? If we stick to my definition, you will come to understand that the purpose of TCPA is to allow application writers to create closed spheres of trust, where the application sets the rules for how the data is handled. It's not just DRM, it's Napster and banking and a myriad other applications, each of which can control its own sensitive data such that no one can break the rules. At least, that's the theory. But Adam points out a weak spot. Ultimately applications trust each other because they know that the remote systems can't be virtualized. The apps are running on real hardware which has real protections. But applications know this because the hardware has a built-in key which carries a certificate from the manufacturer, who is called the TPME in TCPA. As the applications all join hands across the net, each one shows his cert (in effect) and all know that they are running on legitimate hardware. So the weak spot is that anyone who has the TPME key can run a virtualized TCPA, and no one will be the wiser. With the TPME key they can create their own certificate that shows that they have legitimate hardware, when they actually don't. Ultimately this lets them run a rogue client that totally cheats, disobeys all the restrictions, shows the user all of the data which is supposed to be secret, and no one can tell. Furthermore, if people did somehow become suspicious about one particular machine, with access to the TPME key the eavesdroppers can just create a new virtual TPM and start the fraud all over again. It's analogous to how someone with Verisign's key could masquerade as any secure web site they wanted. But it's worse because TCPA is almost infinitely more powerful than PKI, so there is going to be much more temptation to use it and to rely on it. Of course, this will be inherently somewhat self-limiting as people learn more about it, and realize that the security provided by TCPA/Palladium, no matter how good the hardware becomes, will always be limited to the political factors that guard control of the TPME keys. (I say keys because likely more than one company will manufacture TPM's. Also in TCPA there are two other certifiers: one who certifies the motherboard and computer design, and the other who certifies that the board was constructed according to the certified design. The NSA would probably have to get all 3 keys, but this wouldn't be that much harder than getting just one. And if there are multiple manufacturers then only 1 key from each of the 3 categories is needed.) To protect against this, Adam offers various solutions. One is to do crypto inside the TCPA boundary. But that's pointless, because if the crypto worked, you probably wouldn't need TCPA. Realistically most of the TCPA applications can't be cryptographically protected. "Computing with encrypted instances" is a fantasy. That's why we don't have all those secure applications already. Another is to use a web of trust to replace or add to the TPME certs. Here's a hint. Webs of trust don't work. Either they require strong connections, in which case they are too sparse, or they allow weak connections, in which case they are meaningless and anyone can get in. I have a couple of suggestions. One early application for TCPA is in closed corporate networks. In that case the company usually buys all the computers and prepares them before giving them to the employees. At that time, the company could read out the TPM public key and sign it with the corporate key. Then they could use that cert rather than the TPME cert. This would protect the company's sensitive data against eavesdroppers who manage to virtualize their hardware. For the larger public network, the first thing I would suggest is that the TPME key ought to be in hardware, so it can't be given out freely. Of course the NSA could still come in and get their virtual-TPM keys signed one at a time. So the next step is that the device holding the TPME key must be managed in a high security environment. This may be difficult, given the need to sign potentially thousands of TPM keys a day, but I think it has to be done. I want to see watchdogs from the EFF and a lot of other groups sitting there 24 hours a day watching over the device. Remember how Clipper was going to use a vault, split keys and all this elaborate precautions? We need at least that much security. Think about it: this one innocuous little box holding the TPME key could ultimately be the root of trust for the entire world. IMO we should spare no expense in guarding it and making sure it is used properly. With enough different interest groups keeping watch, we should be able to keep it from being used for anything other than its defined purpose.

4 3

FREE REPORT: Making over half million dollars every 4 to 5 months!!!
by steve 10 Aug '02

10 Aug '02

Steven W. Pratt Ph: 610-842-6318 233 Brandywine Rd Collegeville, PA 19426 USING THE POWER OF INTERNET, READ THE FOLLOWING MESSAGE CAREFULLY AS SEEN ON NATIONAL TV: ''Making over half million dollars every 4 to 5 months from You're home for an investment of only $25 U.S. or CANADIAN Dollars expense one time'' THANKS TO THE COMPUTER AGE AND THE INTERNET! ================================================= BE A MILLIONAIRE LIKE OTHERS WITHIN A YEAR!!! Before you say ''Bull'', please read the following. This is the letter you have been hearing about on the news lately. Due to the popularity of this letter on the Internet, a national weekly news program recently devoted an entire show to the investigation of this program described below, to see if it really can make people money. The show also investigated whether or not the program was legal. Their findings proved once and for all that there are ''absolutely NO laws prohibiting the participation in the program and if people can follow the simple instructions, they are bound to make some mega bucks with only $25 out of pocket cost''. DUE TO THE RECENT INCREASE OF POPULARITY & RESPECT THIS PROGRAM HAS ATTAINED; IT IS CURRENTLY WORKING BETTER THAN EVER. This is what one had to say: ''Thanks to this profitable opportunity. I was approached many times before but each time I passed on it. I am so glad I finally joined just to see what one could expect in return for the minimal effort and money required. To my astonishment, I received total $ 610,470.00 in 21 weeks, with money still coming in''. Pam Hedland, Fort Lee, New Jersey. --------------------------------------------------- ----- **** PRINT THIS NOW FOR YOUR FUTURE REFERENCE **** $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ $$$$ If you would like to make at least $500,000 every 4 to 5 months easily and comfortably, please read the following...THEN READ IT AGAIN and AGAIN!!! $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ $$$$ FOLLOW THE SIMPLE INSTRUCTION BELOW AND YOUR FINANCIAL DREAMS WILL COME TRUE, GUARANTEED! INSTRUCTIONS: **** Order all 5 reports shown on the list below. **** For each report, send $5 CASH, THE NAME & NUMBER OF THE REPORT YOU ARE ORDERING and YOUR E- MAIL ADDRESS to the person whose name appears ON THAT LIST next to the report. MAKE SURE YOUR RETURN ADDRESS IS ON YOUR ENVELOPE TOP LEFT CORNER in case of any mail problems. **** When you place your order, make sure you order each of the 5 reports. You will need all 5 reports so that you can save them on your computer and resell them. YOUR TOTAL COST $5 X 5 = $25.00. **** Within a few days you will receive, via e- mail, each of the 5 reports from these 5 different individuals. Save them on your computer so they will be accessible for you to send to the 1,000's of people who will order them from you. Also make a floppy of these reports and keep it on your desk in case something happen to your computer. **** IMPORTANT __ DO NOT alter the names of the people who are listed next to each REPORT, or their sequence on the list, in any way other than what is instructed below in step '' 1 through 6 '' or you will loose out on majority of your profits. Once you understand the way this works, you will also see how it does not work if you change it. Remember, this method has been tested, and if you alter, it will NOT work!!! People have tried to put their friends / relatives names on all five thinking they could get all the money. But it does not work this way. Believe us, we all have tried to be greedy and then nothing happened. So Do Not try to change anything other than what is instructed. Because if you do, it will not work for you. Remember, Honesty reaps the reward!!! 1.... After you have ordered all 5 reports, take this advertisement and REMOVE the name & address of the person in REPORT #5. This person has made it through the cycle and is no doubt counting their fortune. 2. Move the name & address in REPORT #4 down TO REPORT #5 3. Move the name & address in REPORT #3 down TO REPORT #4 4. Move the name & address in REPORT #2 down TO REPORT #3 5. Move the name & address in REPORT #1 down TO REPORT #2 6. Insert YOUR name & address in the REPORT #1 Position. PLEASE MAKE SURE you copy every name & address ACCURATELY! ================================================= **** Take this entire letter, with the modified list of names, and save it on your computer. DO NOT MAKE ANY OTHER CHANGES. Save this on a disk as well just in case if you loose any data. **** To assist you with marketing your business on the Internet, the 5 reports you purchase will provide you with invaluable marketing information, which includes how to send bulk e-mails legally, where to find thousands of free classified ads and much more. There are 2 Primary methods to get this venture going: METHOD #1: BY SENDING BULK E-MAIL LEGALLY ================================================= Let's say that you decide to start small, just to see how it goes, and we will assume you and those involved send out only 5,000 e- mails each. Let's also assume that the mailing receive only a 0.2% response (the response could be much better but lets just say it is only 0.2%. Also many people will send out hundreds of thousands e-mails instead of only 5,000 each). Continuing with this example, you send out only 5,000 e- Mails. With a 0.2% response, that is only 10 orders for REPORT # 1. Those 10 people responded by sending out 5,000 e-mail each for a total of 50,000. Out of those 50,000 e-mails only 0.2% responded with orders. That's = 100 people responded and ordered REPORT # 2. Those 100 people mail out 5,000 e-mails each for a total of 500,000 e-mails. The 0.2% response to that is 1000 orders for REPORT # 3. Those 1000 people send out 5,000 e- mails each for a total of 5 million E-mails sent out. The 0.2% response to that is 10,000 orders for REPORT # 4. Those 10,000 people send out 5,000 e- mails each for a total of 50,000,000 (50 million) e-mails. The 0.2% response to that is 100,000 orders for REPORT # 5 THAT'S 100,000 ORDERS TIMES $5 EACH = $500,000.00 (half million). Your total income in this example is: 1...$50 + 2...$500 + 3...$5,000 + 4...$50,000 + 5...$500,000 Grand Total = $555,550.00 NUMBERS DO NOT LIE. GET A PENCIL & PAPER AND FIGURE OUT THE WORST POSSIBLE RESPONSES AND NO MATTER HOW YOU CALCULATE IT, YOU WILL STILL MAKE A LOT OF MONEY! --------------------------------------------------- -------- REMEMBER FRIEND, THIS IS ASSUMING ONLY 10 PEOPLE ORDERING OUT OF 5,000 YOU MAILED TO. Dare to think for a moment what would happen if everyone, or half or even one 4th of those people mailed 100,000 e-mails each or more? There are over 150 million people on the internet worldwide and counting. Believe me, any people will do just that, and more! _________________ AVAILABLE REPORTS __________________ ORDER EACH REPORT BY ITS NUMBER & NAME ONLY. Notes: Always send $5 cash (U.S. CURRENCY) or Canadian for each REPORT. Checks NOT accepted. Make sure the cash is concealed by wrapping it in at least 2 sheets of paper. On one of those Sheets of paper write the NUMBER & the NAME of the REPORT you are ordering, YOUR E-MAIL ADDRESS and your name and postal address. PLACE YOUR ORDER FOR THESE REPORTS NOW: ================================================= REPORT #1 ''The Insider's Guide to Advertising for Free on the Net'' Order REPORT #1 from: Steven Pratt 233 Brandywine Rd Collegeville, PA 19426 __ _________________________________________________ REPORT #2 ''The Insider's Guide to Sending Bulk e- mail on the Net'' Hubert Fulkerson 402 East Las Palmaritas Drive Phoenix, AZ 85020-3436 _________________________________________________ REPORT #3 ''The Secret to Multilevel marketing on the Net'' Order REPORT #3 from: Glen Kelly 890 Ravenwood Ct. Biloxi, Ms. 39532 ___________________________________________________ REPORT #4 ''How to become a millionaire utilizing MLM & the Net'' Order REPORT #4 from: C Shaw P.O. Box 468 Schomberg, Ontario Canada LOG ITO ___________________________________________________ REPORT #5 ''HOW TO SEND 1 MILLION E-MAILS FOR FREE'' Order REPORT #5 from: Elaine Rix 138 Dundas Street, West, #243 Toronto, Ontario Canada M5G 1C3 _________________________________________ $$$$$$$$$$$$ YOUR SUCCESS GUIDELINES $$$$$$$$$$$$$$ Follow these guidelines to guarantee your success: *** If you do not receive at least 10 orders for REPORT #1 within 2 weeks, continue sending e-mails until you do. *** After you have received 10 orders, 2 to 3 weeks after that you should receive 100 orders or more for REPORT #2. If you did not, continue advertising or sending e-mails until you do. *** Once you have received 100 or more orders for REPORT #2, YOU CAN RELAX, because the system is already working for you and the cash will continue to roll in! THIS IS IMPORTANT TO REMEMBER: Every time your name is moved down on the list, you are placed in front of a Different REPORT. You can KEEP TRACK of your PROGRESS by watching which REPORT people are ordering from you. IF YOU WANT TO GENERATE MORE INCOME SEND ANOTHER BATCH OF E-MAILS AND START THE WHOLE PROCESS AGAIN. There is NO LIMIT to the income you can generate from this business!!! ___________________________________________________ FOLLOWING IS A NOTE FROM THE ORIGINATOR OF THIS PROGRAM: "You have just received information that can give you financial freedom for the rest of your life, with NO RISK And JUST A LITTLE BIT OF EFFORT. You can make more money in the next few weeks and months than you have ever imagined. Follow the program EXACTLY AS INSTRUCTED. Do Not change it in any way. It works exceedingly well as it is now. Remember to e-mail a copy of this exciting REPORT after you have put your name and address in REPORT #1 and moved others to #2 ..........#5 as instructed above. One of the people you send this to may send out 100,000 or more e-mails and your name will be on everyone of them. Remember though, the more you send out the more potential customers you will reach. So my friend, I have given you the ideas, information, materials and opportunity to become financially independent. IT IS UP TO YOU NOW! **************** MORE TESTIMONIALS ***************** --------------------------------------------------- -------- ''Not being the gambling type, it took me several weeks to make up my mind to participate in this plan. But conservative that I am, I decided that the initial investment was so little that there was just no way that I wouldn't get enough orders to at least get my money back''. ''I was surprised when I found my medium size post office box crammed with orders. I made $319,210.00 in the first 12 weeks. The nice thing about this deal is that it does not matter where people live. There simply isn't a better investment with a faster return and so big''. Dan Sondstrom, Alberta, Canada --------------------------------------------------- -------- ''I had received this program before. I deleted it, but later I wondered if I should have given it a try. Of course, I had no idea who to contact to get another copy, so I had to wait until I was e-mailed again by someone else.........11 months passed then it luckily came again...... I did not delete this one! I made more than $490,000 on my first try and all the money came within 22 weeks''. Susan De Suza, New York, N.Y. --------------------------------------------------- -------- ''It really is a great opportunity to make relatively easy money with little cost to you. I followed the simple instructions carefully and within 10 days the money started to come in. My first month I made $ 20, 560.00 and by the end of third month my total cash count was $ 362,840.00. Life is beautiful, Thanx to internet''. Fred Dellaca, Westport, New Zealand --------------------------------------------------- -------- ORDER YOUR REPORTS TODAY AND GET STARTED ON YOUR ROAD TO FINANCIAL FREEDOM! ================================================== If you have any questions of the legality of this program, contact the Office of Associate Director for Marketing Practices, Federal Trade Commission, Bureau of Consumer Protection, Washington, D.C. /////////////////////////////////////////////////// //////// ONE TIME MAILING, NO NEED TO REMOVE /////////////////////////////////////////////////// //////// This message is sent in compliance of the proposed bill SECTION 301. per Section 301, Paragraph (a)(2)(C) of S. 1618. Further transmission to you by the sender of this e-mail may be stopped at no cost to you by sending a reply to youcansucceed(a)hotmail.com Steven W. Pratt Ph: 610-842-6318 (Please call if you have questions or concerns) 233 Brandywine Rd Collegeville, PA 19426 This message is not intended for residents in the State of Washington, screening of addresses has been done to the best of our technical ability.

1 0

Re: Thanks, Lucky, for helping to kill gnutella (fwd)
by R. A. Hettinga 10 Aug '02

10 Aug '02

At 1:03 AM +0200 on 8/10/02, Some anonymous, and now apparently innumerate, idiot in my killfile got himself forwarded to Mr. Leitl's cream of cypherpunks list: > They will protect us from being able > to extend trust across the network. As Dan Geer and Carl Ellison have reminded us on these lists and elsewhere, there is no such thing as "trust", on the net, or anywhere else. There is only risk. Go learn some finance before you attempt to abstract emotion into the quantifiable. Actual numerate, thinking, people gave up on that nonsense in the 1970's, and the guys who proved the idiocy of "trust", showing, like LaGrange said to Napoleon about god, that the capital markets "had no need that hypothesis, Sire" ended up winning a Nobel for that proof the 1990's*. Cheers, RAH *The fact that Scholes and Merton eventually ended up betting on equity volatility like it was actually predictable and got their asses handed to them for their efforts is beside the point, of course. :-). -- ----------------- R. A. Hettinga <mailto: rah(a)ibuc.com> The Internet Bearer Underwriting Corporation <http://www.ibuc.com/> 44 Farquhar Street, Boston, MA 02131 USA "... however it may deserve respect for its usefulness and antiquity, [predicting the end of the world] has not been found agreeable to experience." -- Edward Gibbon, 'Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire' --------------------------------------------------------------------- The Cryptography Mailing List Unsubscribe by sending "unsubscribe cryptography" to majordomo(a)wasabisystems.com

2 1

Re: Signing as one member of a set of keys
by Anonymous 10 Aug '02

10 Aug '02

Here are the perl scripts I cobbled together to put the ring signature at the end of the file, after a separator. I called the executable program from the earlier C source code "ringsig". I call these ringver and ringsign. I'm no perl hacker so these could undoubtedly be greatly improved. ringver === #! /usr/bin/perl # Usage: $0 pubkeyfile < filetoverify die("Usage: ringver pubkeyfile < filetoverify") if @ARGV != 1; $outfile = "/tmp/sigdata$$"; $sigfile = "/tmp/sigfile$$"; $separator = " \\+\\+multisig v1\\.0"; $pubfile=$ARGV[0]; -r $pubfile || die ("Error reading $pubfile"); open (OUTFILE, ">".$outfile) || die ("Unable to open $outfile for output"); open (SIGFILE, ">".$sigfile) || die ("Unable to open $sigfile for output"); # Skip leading blank lines on input file $_=<STDIN> while /^$/; # Save lines to outfile until separator print OUTFILE $_; while (<STDIN>) { last if /$separator/; print OUTFILE $_; } die ("No signature found in input file") if !$_; # Save remaining lines ot sigfile print SIGFILE while <STDIN>; close INFILE; close OUTFILE; close SIGFILE; open (SIG, "./ringsig -v $outfile $pubfile < $sigfile |") || die ("Error running verify program"); # Print output from program print while <SIG>; close SIG; unlink($sigfile); unlink($outfile); exit($?); ringsign === #! /usr/bin/perl # Usage: $0 filetosign pubkeyfile privkeyfile die("Usage: ringsign filetosign pubkeyfile privkeyfile > outfile") if @ARGV < 3; $outfile = "/tmp/sigdata$$"; $separator = " ++multisig v1.0"; open(INFILE, $ARGV[0]) || die ("Unable to open $ARGV[0] for input"); $pubfile=$ARGV[1]; $secfile=$ARGV[2]; -r $pubfile || die ("Error reading $pubfile"); -r $secfile || die ("Error reading $secfile"); open (OUTFILE, ">".$outfile) || die ("Unable to open $outfile for output"); # Skip leading blank lines on input file $_=<INFILE> while /^$/; # Save lines to outfile print OUTFILE $_; print OUTFILE $_ while <INFILE>; close INFILE; close OUTFILE; # Re-open infile open(INFILE, $ARGV[0]) || die ("Unable to open $ARGV[0] for input"); open (SIG, "./ringsig -s $outfile $pubfile $secfile|") || die ("Error signing"); @sigs = <SIG>; close SIG; die ("Error from signature program") if ($?); # Output infile, separator, sig print while <INFILE>; print $separator . "\n"; print @sigs; unlink($outfile);

1 0

RE: Challenge to David Wagner on TCPA
by AARG! Anonymous 10 Aug '02

10 Aug '02

Lucky Green wrote: > Ray wrote: > > To make their denial credible, they could give the owner > > access to the private key of the TPM/SCP. But somehow I > > don't think that jibes with their agenda. > > Probably not surprisingly to anybody on this list, with the exception of > potentially Anonymous, according to the TCPA's own TPM Common Criteria > Protection Profile, the TPM prevents the owner of a TPM from exporting > the TPM's internal key. The ability of the TPM to keep the owner of a PC > from reading the private key stored in the TPM has been evaluated to E3 > (augmented). For the evaluation certificate issued by NIST, see: > > http://niap.nist.gov/cc-scheme/PPentries/CCEVS-020016-VR-TPM.pdf This has to be true for the basic security goal of remote trust, right? The purpose is so that the user can credibly convince a remote system that he is running a certain program. Explain to me how he could do this if he were able to reload the TPM key with one of his own, or get access to the private key? Wouldn't that let him forge arbitrary messages? You might as well complain that Verisign doesn't share their private key with everyone. Either way you lose the trust properties of the system. > > If I buy a lock I expect that by demonstrating ownership I > > can get a replacement key or have a locksmith legally open it. > > It appears the days when this was true are waning. At least in the PC > platform domain. We have had other systems which work like this for a long while. Many consumer devices are sealed such that if you open them you void the warranty. This is to your advantage as a consumer; it means that you can take the device in to get it fixed, and the intact seal proves that you didn't mess with the insides and break it. By your logic, consumers ought to be able to bypass such seals since they own the device. But if this were true, don't you agree that it would make the seals useless?

2 1

See YOUR CREDIT improve Online in Real Time! 11695
by Kay Hoag 10 Aug '02

10 Aug '02

1 0

fRAT insurrection in BC.
by Matthew X 10 Aug '02

10 Aug '02

http://www.infoshop.org/inews/stories.php?story=02/08/09/3418651 Fireworks in Vancouver.Someone died at one of these potlatch events once.A long time ago in a galaxy far,far away...The context of the current class war in British Columbia includes - - An attempt by B.C. Government Employeees Union (B.C.G.E.U.) members to charge into a hotel on January 23rd, 2002, where Premier Gordon Campbell was set to speak. - Illegal wildcat strikes in late January by the B.C. Teachers Federation (B.C.T.F.) and the B.C.G.E.U. - A tent-city occupation by street youth and students on the front lawn of the provincial legislature building in Victoria in February which ended with it's dismantling by riot police - The fire-bombing of Premier Gordon Campbell's office on the night of February 21st. - A B.C Federation of Labour rally at the legislature in Victoria by more than 20,000 people, at which a group of about 10 anarchists intervened by attacking a security barrier and throwing rocks at the legislature building. - An anti-poverty Snake March in Victoria on March 25th that went through a mall and several corporate stores, leaving splatters from paint-bombs and graffitti behind. - An anti-poverty march to one of Premier Gordon Campbell's homes in Vancouver on April 1st. - An all-womyn anti-poverty brigade's occupation of a "Member of the Legislative Assembly" office in Victoria on April 25th that was broken up by riot police who pepper-sprayed several demonstrators. - A May Day demonstration in Vancouver against the 6-dollar training wage that included a half-hour blockade of a McDonalds restaurant (one of the businesses using the training wage, and a major contributor to the Liberal's election campaign.). After the end of the demonstration a masked group charged through a downtown mall and carried out small acts of vandalism and sabotage. - A July 14th demonstration at the opening of a gallery show at the Vancouver Art Gallery at which the Premier was scheduled to speak at, but failed to show his face in public - because of "security concerns" caused by hundreds of angry demonstrators who attempted to dismantle a security fence, spat on police officers, and were then pepper-sprayed.

1 0

Leechnet.
by Matthew X 10 Aug '02

10 Aug '02

As a former beta tester for Leechnet,all this P to P chat reminded me to revisit Nordic Research.They may be onto something with,"...the concept of cybercash one step closer to reality." Maybe,youse would probably know better than me."extra skin?" Caveat Lecter. http://www.leechnet.com/product.html Featured product: Opticart Web page developers using the OptiCart system are praising that the website no longer has to be built around the shopping cart unlike other shopping cart software and e-commerce software, but is instead added as an extra skin after the design and implementation has already been made. The OptiCart system uses Java technology to provide real-time updates of the contents of the shopping basket and brings the concept of cybercash one step closer to reality. The OptiCart system uses Java technology to provide real-time updates of the contents of the shopping basket and brings the concept of cybercash one step closer to reality.

1 0

None
by AARG! Anonymous 09 Aug '02

09 Aug '02

Adam Back writes a very thorough analysis of possible consequences of the amazing power of the TCPA/Palladium model. He is clearly beginning to "get it" as far as what this is capable of. There is far more to this technology than simple DRM applications. In fact Adam has a great idea for how this could finally enable selling idle CPU cycles while protecting crucial and sensitive business data. By itself this could be a "killer app" for TCPA/Palladium. And once more people start thinking about how to exploit the potential, there will be no end to the possible applications. Of course his analysis is spoiled by an underlying paranoia. So let me ask just one question. How exactly is subversion of the TPM a greater threat than subversion of your PC hardware today? How do you know that Intel or AMD don't already have back doors in their processors that the NSA and other parties can exploit? Or that Microsoft doesn't have similar backdoors in its OS? And similarly for all the other software and hardware components that make up a PC today? In other words, is this really a new threat? Or are you unfairly blaming TCPA for a problem which has always existed and always will exist?

2 1

AARG and eugene are net.loons-why signatures of binaries always change.
by cyphrpnk 09 Aug '02

09 Aug '02

Hi all, Its obvious that some of us here are developers and still others have never typed make or gcc in their lives. -v and -V options given to various forms of ld caused the embeddment of version information in the binary(Sunpro does this also, AND early versions of MSC allowed embeddment of version information also.) The fact that most environments dont link -Bstatic and instead link -Bdynamic means that every time you attempt to produce a binary from 2 different systems that the dynamic link information will be different checkout link.h link_elf.h link_aout.h in /usr/include in addition MOST modern developement environments include a date field when compiled and linked in the binary sheesh a cypherpunk BTW. AARG and eugene are idiots nyah nyah nyah!!

2 1