OR/WA Election System Flawed: Votes Changed by Black Hatters

Karl gmkarl at gmail.com
Tue Oct 27 07:25:59 PDT 2020

On Mon, Oct 19, 2020 at 12:30 AM Zenaan Harkness <zen at freedbms.net> wrote:
> On Sun, Oct 18, 2020 at 10:07:09PM -0400, Karl wrote:
> > Can we discuss whether trump is good or bad?
> "I've changed my mind about Trump -- Trump is a demi God :D"
> Is the Sun good or bad?
> When I'm cold, more Sun is good, and rain is bad.
> When I'm hot and dry in the desert, Sun is bad, rain is good.
> Good/Bad is often a false dichotomy.

I agree with you here strongly around nondichotomy.  _everything has context_.
I feel a little mean to your politics, to hear you expressing what I
believe.  What's relevent is that our contextual needs are not being
honored, and mine are different from yours.

> What policies are good?  (E.g. reducing/eliminating certain laws, regulations, size of gov, etc.)

When considering what policy is good, I would consider whom it most
impacts.  What would you consider?

> What freedoms are good?  (E.g. speech, gathering, travel, self defence, self medication, etc)

What freedoms do you consider good?

I would consider it good for people to not only have complete freedom,
but importantly also hold the responsibility of defending the freedoms
of others.  Please verify you received my reply regarding why an
assertion of harassment isn't baseless, below.  Some may consider that
responsibility to involve limiting some freedoms.

> A little more nuance that merely black white dichotomy may (possibly) result in the possibility of a constructive outcome...

mmm good thought

> > Over here among the liberal-likes, there has been a lot of suffering.
> Today many "liberals" of even a few years ago are now branded "far right conservatives".
> Are you aware of this shift in "the public discourse" ?

It seems these years it goes both ways: branding of both sides as more
extremely different than ever before.  Do you disagree?

Naive leftist dialogue: Are you aware of the form of "left" and
"right" politics, where "right" is the beliefs of the old leaders, and
"left" is the beliefs of the new?
 If you view left as the young and right as the old, it aligns with a
constant slow trend towards the left, which doesn't stop because it's
not a straight line: what is new keeps changing.

To speak from the far-left, liberals were never leftists.

> > Like, massive harassment of people just for expressing their views.

Please verify you recieved my reply to your next expression.

> Baseless assertion.

This simply isn't baseless.  We have scads of personal experience and
records of people specifically saying they were doing this.  We have
video of many people being killed this year.

> "Conservatives", i.e. those who support Trump, including African Americans, are being targetted by so called "social justice warrior liberals" under the banners of BLM and ANTIFA.

You and I have both expressed blame for other groups.  Can you
acknowledge with me that people have harmed others, and we must act to
make it right?  Can we still make decisions, knowing these things are

> Bring a fact or expect a pointless handwaving cirlce straw man empty space.

Please verify my request above.  But I am totally fine with handwaving
spaces, because I am trying to share understanding, not form logical
proofs that life and conflict exist, which is obvious.

Two or more groups are fighting for their values.  They have been
fighting hard because talking was not working.

> > Domination of communication channels.  Overt expressions of harm
> > against large groups.  People losing their lives, across the country,
> > from new changes being made.  Trump does not seem anti-government at
> > all, over here.
> Trump is not anti government.
> No one said Trump is anti government.

Eh, that idea was what I liked about 'im.

> > I haven't heard anything good _about_ trump; just a lot of assumption
> > that he's good.  _WHY_ is he good?  _WHY_ do people like him and vote
> > for him???
> For some of the things he has said.  If you have not listened to anything he has said, then all you have to go on is partisan opinion porn.

Trump doesn't seem to say anything that is _consistent_, the things I
am able to see him saying.  I don't know how to understand him.  What
do people like about what he says?

> Do your own research if you can be bothered.  Or don't, but don't complain when the opinions of "your superiors" come across contradictory and partisan...

I am looking for what is real, not what some purchased marketing
algorithm inside google or some other corporate server shows me.

> Good luck,

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