[WAR] George Soros calls on world to unite against Vladimir Putin
Oh poor, poor baby - what's wrong the world? Oh Georgey, the world isn't behind you in your desire to bring down Russia and launch your one world government new world order with your one world carbon tax and associated "one world" entities. There there Georgey, it'll all be over soon, Mr Big Bad Putin will get tired soon with his multi polar world and then you can get a good old sleep... Welp, least we know is who the big baddy is... George Soros smells war, blood, and profits. Calls on world to unite against Vladimir Putin http://theduran.com/george-soros-smells-war-blood-profits-calls-world-to-uni... Oh, you wanted to know the big baddy? Why, this'll explain it for ya: Watch This Journalist Prove Vladimir Putin was Behind Every Major Terrorist Attack – Ever http://theduran.com/journalist-proves-vladimir-putin-behind-every-major-terr... Ah, yes, glad we cleared that up... it's hard, really hard, to know what to think sometimes, that's why we have the Lame Stream Media to guide us. Well, at least the CIA and USA military's escapade in Syria has caused cold war tensions to ease to very benign and uneventful levels: http://theduran.com/russia-considering-military-bases-cuba-vietnam/ Ahem, what I meant is, USA just got bitch slapped: U.S. backs down over Syria after Russian threat to shoot down American aircraft http://theduran.com/us-backs-down-over-syria-following-russian-threat-shoot-... (Man, those crazy Russians: Russian couple climb highest construction site in the world in China http://theduran.com/russian-couple-climbs-highest-construction-site-in-the-w... ) But wait! Al-Qaeda must be saved: http://theduran.com/al-qaeda-saved-top-washington-officials-are-ready-to-att...
2016-10-08 13:37 GMT+03:00 Zenaan Harkness <zen@freedbms.net>:
George Soros smells war, blood, and profits. Calls on world to unite against Vladimir Putin http://theduran.com/george-soros-smells-war-blood- profits-calls-world-to-unite-against-vladimir-putin/
Oh, Zen, they are so fucken desperate... so desperate... sometimes it doesn't even make me angry, but starts amusing me :P :D Poor poor uSSa. Poor poor bloody oligarchs & other satanists. Your desperation makes us (sometimes) laugh to tears.
On Oct 8, 2016, at 6:49 AM, Александр <afalex169@gmail.com> wrote:
2016-10-08 13:37 GMT+03:00 Zenaan Harkness <zen@freedbms.net <mailto:zen@freedbms.net>>: George Soros smells war, blood, and profits. Calls on world to unite against Vladimir Putin http://theduran.com/george-soros-smells-war-blood-profits-calls-world-to-uni... <http://theduran.com/george-soros-smells-war-blood-profits-calls-world-to-unite-against-vladimir-putin/> Oh, Zen, they are so fucken desperate... so desperate... sometimes it doesn't even make me angry, but starts amusing me :P :D
Poor poor uSSa. Poor poor bloody oligarchs & other satanists. Your desperation makes us (sometimes) laugh to tears.
Yes, poor oligarchs. Poor oligarchs only in the USA. Because Russia is not equally a corrupt fucking kleptocracy. Now, back to grabbing pussy and popping tic-tacs… John
I am a comics addicted since my early years, but reading "SuperPutin wins" can melt my brain and make me completely blind to all Russian's politicians fails. I will become a verbose socketpuppet, non-stop talking about Russia in mailing lists and groups of discussion... :( http://superputin.win Putin, like all the other politicians, is very disgusting, nasty, a killer and a censor, not a "hero". Using comics to brain washing kids is creepy, abominable. USA did this kind of awful and repulsive propaganda for kids several times in the past and Russia learned very well how to imitate them in a repulsive and not original way! :((
http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/events/russian-anti-meme-law Russia created an "Anti-Meme Law" since the last year. So, I never spread so many Putins memes since 2015. https://www.memecenter.com/search/putin You know, the forbidden is always funnier and I hate those who use laws to legallize censorship.
Putin likes to hunt and he shoots Russian Unicorns, sniff !! Killer! :'( http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Shoot%20a%20Russian%20unicorn
On 10/08/2016 06:20 AM, Cecilia Tanaka wrote:
http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/events/russian-anti-meme-law
Russia created an "Anti-Meme Law" since the last year. So, I never spread so many Putins memes since 2015.
https://www.memecenter.com/search/putin
You know, the forbidden is always funnier and I hate those who use laws to legallize censorship.
Russia. America, but different. Rr "Revolution is not something fixed in ideology, nor is it something fashioned to a particular decade. It is a perpetual process embedded in the human spirit. When all today's isms have become yesterday's ancient philosophy, there will still be reactionaries and there will still be revolutionaries." ~Abbie Hoffman
On 10/08/2016 08:41 AM, Razer wrote:
On 10/08/2016 06:20 AM, Cecilia Tanaka wrote:
http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/events/russian-anti-meme-law
Russia created an "Anti-Meme Law" since the last year. So, I never spread so many Putins memes since 2015.
https://www.memecenter.com/search/putin
You know, the forbidden is always funnier and I hate those who use laws to legallize censorship.
Russia. America, but different.
Rammstein says ... Moskau <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OWand2bYeJo> Amerika <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rr8ljRgcJNM> :)
Rr
"Revolution is not something fixed in ideology, nor is it something fashioned to a particular decade. It is a perpetual process embedded in the human spirit. When all today's isms have become yesterday's ancient philosophy, there will still be reactionaries and there will still be revolutionaries." ~Abbie Hoffman
On Oct 8, 2016, at 9:07 AM, Cecilia Tanaka <cecilia.tanaka@gmail.com> wrote:
I am a comics addicted since my early years, but reading "SuperPutin wins" can melt my brain and make me completely blind to all Russian's politicians fails. I will become a verbose socketpuppet, non-stop talking about Russia in mailing lists and groups of discussion... :(
http://superputin.win <http://superputin.win/> LOL.. this is fucking hilarious.
I wish there was an English version…. maybe Zen will translate :) John
On Oct 8, 2016 6:17 PM, "John Newman" <jnn@synfin.org> wrote:
On Oct 8, 2016, at 9:07 AM, Cecilia Tanaka <cecilia.tanaka@gmail.com>
wrote:
LOL.. this is fucking hilarious.
I wish there was an English version…. maybe Zen will translate :)
Zenaan doesn't speak Russian, but I can print him a wonderful "Putin butt plug" as reward, if he tries the translation bravely enough! <3 http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/weird-news/vladimir-putin-sex-toy-popular-39434... The butt plug was printed used a 3D printing. I can contact the designer to use his art and print this model of "Putin sexual toy" here, in my own country. It was created for GLBTQ activists furious with *Russia's homophobic policies*, for protest against Putin and "put in" him in cozy, warm places. Awww... Peaceful protests are lovely! <3 sea sea
On 10/08/2016 04:32 PM, Cecilia Tanaka wrote:
On Oct 8, 2016 6:17 PM, "John Newman" <jnn@synfin.org <mailto:jnn@synfin.org>> wrote:
On Oct 8, 2016, at 9:07 AM, Cecilia Tanaka <cecilia.tanaka@gmail.com
<mailto:cecilia.tanaka@gmail.com>> wrote:
LOL.. this is fucking hilarious.
I wish there was an English version…. maybe Zen will translate :)
Zenaan doesn't speak Russian, but I can print him a wonderful "Putin butt plug" as reward, if he tries the translation bravely enough! <3
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/weird-news/vladimir-putin-sex-toy-popular-39434...
The butt plug was printed used a 3D printing. I can contact the designer to use his art and print this model of "Putin sexual toy" here, in my own country.
It was created for GLBTQ activists furious with *Russia's homophobic policies*, for protest against Putin and "put in" him in cozy, warm places. Awww... Peaceful protests are lovely! <3
sea sea
Russia doesn't have any "homophobic policies". Russians know that. That's why the Soros foundation and other western LGBT orgs (the kind that consider Chelsea Manning not worthy of an honorary place at the SF Pride Parade for instance) efforts to promote "LGBT rights" falls on deaf ears and is pretty much ignored. Not caring who loves or fucks who and thinking it shouldn't be dinner table conversation because there's nothing to really talk isn't Homophobia. Do you understand that? Promoting that conversation indicates an agenda. An agenda that isn't in the interest of LGBTs of Russia. Kapiche? Rr
On Oct 8, 2016 10:04 PM, "Razer" <rayzer@riseup.net> wrote:
Russia doesn't have any "homophobic policies". Russians know that.
That's why the Soros foundation and other western LGBT orgs (the kind that consider Chelsea Manning not worthy of an honorary place at the SF Pride Parade for instance) efforts to promote "LGBT rights" falls on deaf ears and is pretty much ignored.
Not caring who loves or fucks who and thinking it shouldn't be dinner
table conversation because there's nothing to really talk isn't Homophobia. Do you understand that? Promoting that conversation indicates an agenda. An agenda that isn't in the interest of LGBTs of Russia. Kapiche? ------ Scusami, ma veramente non lo capisco, Razer. One of my Russian friends and his boyfriend were almost dead when kissing and demonstrating affection in public. The police did with the both guys exactly what my first rapist did with me: strong kicks in the head and the whole body. We stepped on our bodies. In the middle of the legs too. I was burned with cigarretes there. My friends not, but they receiveid lots of kicks in the scrotum. You probably can imagine how being kicked in the balls is painful. Gays couples used to live with fear in Russia and Putin's homophobic politicies make being gay there almost a crime, with no serious investigations about their homicides and agressions, everything happens with the State convenience. It's enough for making me consider this situation unfair, illogical. That was the reason why they both run away and live in another country now. They still love Russia and miss their country, their families, but want to walking around, hand in hand, kissing each other, without being judged and killed just for loving. Sorry, my love, fuck politics and politicians. I want justice. Not a beautiful gay pride parade once a year. I want LGBTQ rights all the days.
On 10/08/2016 08:07 PM, Cecilia Tanaka wrote:
On Oct 8, 2016 10:04 PM, "Razer" <rayzer@riseup.net <mailto:rayzer@riseup.net>> wrote:
Russia doesn't have any "homophobic policies". Russians know that.
That's why the Soros foundation and other western LGBT orgs (the kind that consider Chelsea Manning not worthy of an honorary place at the SF Pride Parade for instance) efforts to promote "LGBT rights" falls on deaf ears and is pretty much ignored.
Not caring who loves or fucks who and thinking it shouldn't be dinner
table conversation because there's nothing to really talk isn't Homophobia. Do you understand that? Promoting that conversation indicates an agenda. An agenda that isn't in the interest of LGBTs of Russia. Kapiche?
------ Scusami, ma veramente non lo capisco, Razer. One of my Russian friends and his boyfriend were almost dead when kissing and demonstrating affection in public.
The police did with the both guys exactly what my first rapist did with me: strong kicks in the head and the whole body. We stepped on our bodies. In the middle of the legs too. I was burned with cigarretes there. My friends not, but they receiveid lots of kicks in the scrotum. You probably can imagine how being kicked in the balls is painful.
You started talking about you gay friends then it was a about you. OK... But you've failed to respond to my point. The police in the US kill black people, take bribes, rape women, but that's NOT legitimate government policy. There's footage on the web of a couple of Moscow cops with a transvestite in the car for some reason. They release her and then crack up laughing. Take your pick. Some cops are thugs. Some think TVs and gayfolk are unusual and funny, but most Russians simply don't care, AND my POINT is THERE ARE NO DISCRIMINATORY LEGAL POLICIES and haven't been since 1917. What a couple of pigs did to your gay friends is pretty irrelevant to laws regarding being gay in Russia. There are none. There ARE right wing reactionaries though. They tend to be cops. In the US too. Soros and co's LGBT 'rights' plan won't solve that. It would most likely bring on REACTION. As in REACTIONARY. Besises. All scum like Soros are interested in is opening up markets. Been to any Gay Pride Parades recently? In the US it IS a hot market, and affluent, and you an find EVERYTHING branded for Gay folk. You want that kind of liberation? Trick question... It ISN'T liberation. Liberation means freedom to do what you want without interference and the FEDERAL GOVERNMENT of Russia doesn't. Rr
Gays couples used to live with fear in Russia and Putin's homophobic politicies make being gay there almost a crime, with no serious investigations about their homicides and agressions, everything happens with the State convenience.
It's enough for making me consider this situation unfair, illogical. That was the reason why they both run away and live in another country now. They still love Russia and miss their country, their families, but want to walking around, hand in hand, kissing each other, without being judged and killed just for loving.
Sorry, my love, fuck politics and politicians. I want justice. Not a beautiful gay pride parade once a year. I want LGBTQ rights all the days.
AND my POINT is THERE ARE NO DISCRIMINATORY LEGAL POLICIES and haven't been since 1917.
Incorrect. The Russian Revolution in 1917 did bring about real change in that way. Under Lenin, homosexuals were allowed to serve in government positions, for example. HOWEVER. In 1933, Stalin recriminalized homosexuality including punishment of up to five years hard labor. Following his death, this eased, however homosexual acts remained illegal right up to Gorbachev and glasnost. Following the dissolution of the USSR, with Yeltsin in 1993, homosexuality between consenting males was decriminalized. In 1999, under Putin, homosexuality was removed from the list of mental disorders. If there was no discrimination present in Russian government then gay pride parades would be allowed, and police protection would be provided to the activists. Instead, they are routinely canceled in Moscow as religious leaders and others generally encourage violence towards them. In 2013, Russia passed a federal law banning distribution of "propaganda of non-traditional sexual relationships" to minors. Following its passage, there has been increased discrimination against gays, and increased protests. In 2013 the USA received over 800 asylum requests from homosexuals in Russia.
On Oct 9, 2016 12:33 AM, "Razer" <rayzer@riseup.net> wrote:
Been to any Gay Pride Parades recently? In the US it IS a hot market, and
affluent, and you an find EVERYTHING branded for Gay folk. I go to Parade all the years, dear. Here, in my country, it became a fabulous party, a gorgeous Carnival with music, joy, glitter and happy laughs, but no much activism, for being sincere. :-/ Our GLBTQ Pride Parade was elected the best of the world sometimes and and the biggest of the world for the Guiness Book of Records, but, you know, North-Americans don't care about numbers if they are not the best and the bigger. That usual 'ego trip' thing, aff... :( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/São_Paulo_Gay_Pride_Parade Well, in any case, it is always fun and I make a fabulous make up (glitter and colors) and sometimes dress like a ballet dancer, a geisha, an anime or a drag queen. Or use jeans and t-shirt. Everything is permissed! <3
On 10/08/2016 11:33 PM, Razer wrote:
On 10/08/2016 08:07 PM, Cecilia Tanaka wrote:
On Oct 8, 2016 10:04 PM, "Razer" <rayzer@riseup.net <mailto:rayzer@riseup.net>> wrote:
Russia doesn't have any "homophobic policies". Russians know that.
That's why the Soros foundation and other western LGBT orgs (the kind that consider Chelsea Manning not worthy of an honorary place at the SF Pride Parade for instance) efforts to promote "LGBT rights" falls on deaf ears and is pretty much ignored.
Not caring who loves or fucks who and thinking it shouldn't be dinner
table conversation because there's nothing to really talk isn't Homophobia. Do you understand that? Promoting that conversation indicates an agenda. An agenda that isn't in the interest of LGBTs of Russia. Kapiche?
------ Scusami, ma veramente non lo capisco, Razer. One of my Russian friends and his boyfriend were almost dead when kissing and demonstrating affection in public.
The police did with the both guys exactly what my first rapist did with me: strong kicks in the head and the whole body. We stepped on our bodies. In the middle of the legs too. I was burned with cigarretes there. My friends not, but they receiveid lots of kicks in the scrotum. You probably can imagine how being kicked in the balls is painful.
You started talking about you gay friends then it was a about you. OK... But you've failed to respond to my point. The police in the US kill black people, take bribes, rape women, but that's NOT legitimate government policy. There's footage on the web of a couple of Moscow cops with a transvestite in the car for some reason. They release her and then crack up laughing. Take your pick. Some cops are thugs. Some think TVs and gayfolk are unusual and funny, but most Russians simply don't care, AND my POINT is THERE ARE NO DISCRIMINATORY LEGAL POLICIES and haven't been since 1917.
What a couple of pigs did to your gay friends is pretty irrelevant to laws regarding being gay in Russia. There are none. There ARE right wing reactionaries though. They tend to be cops. In the US too.
Soros and co's LGBT 'rights' plan won't solve that. It would most likely bring on REACTION. As in REACTIONARY.
Besises. All scum like Soros are interested in is opening up markets.
Been to any Gay Pride Parades recently? In the US it IS a hot market, and affluent, and you an find EVERYTHING branded for Gay folk.
You want that kind of liberation? Trick question... It ISN'T liberation. Liberation means freedom to do what you want without interference and the FEDERAL GOVERNMENT of Russia doesn't.
Rr
Gays couples used to live with fear in Russia and Putin's homophobic politicies make being gay there almost a crime, with no serious investigations about their homicides and agressions, everything happens with the State convenience.
It's enough for making me consider this situation unfair, illogical. That was the reason why they both run away and live in another country now. They still love Russia and miss their country, their families, but want to walking around, hand in hand, kissing each other, without being judged and killed just for loving.
Sorry, my love, fuck politics and politicians. I want justice. Not a beautiful gay pride parade once a year. I want LGBTQ rights all the days.
Razer, wake up and face reality. Places like Russia or Poland are VERY dangerous for LGBT. As a TS woman i have avoided going to Poland to visit family because of very real, perhaps mortal danger from reactionaries. Laws are irrelevant. If the reactionaries beat you up and leave you for dead it's a problem. It does not matter if they are drunken thugs with or without badges, though the ones with the badges are the worst. --- Marina
On Oct 9, 2016 12:12 PM, "Razer" <rayzer@riseup.net> wrote:
On 10/09/2016 05:43 AM, Marina Brown wrote:
wake up and face reality.
I stopped right there.
I love and admire you, Razer, but I think you should reading Marina's message. She is sharing a bit of her experiences and her fears about being a trans woman. You are losing a chance of knowing how hard is living with constant fear of being hurt or dead just for being who you are. I am tired of discussions. Too much. I will stop here too. Kisses! <3
On Sun, 9 Oct 2016 00:07:51 -0300 Cecilia Tanaka <cecilia.tanaka@gmail.com> wrote:
On Oct 8, 2016 10:04 PM, "Razer" <rayzer@riseup.net> wrote:
Russia doesn't have any "homophobic policies". Russians know that.
That's why the Soros foundation and other western LGBT orgs (the kind that consider Chelsea Manning not worthy of an honorary place at the SF Pride Parade for instance) efforts to promote "LGBT rights" falls on deaf ears and is pretty much ignored.
Not caring who loves or fucks who and thinking it shouldn't be dinner
table conversation because there's nothing to really talk isn't Homophobia. Do you understand that? Promoting that conversation indicates an agenda. An agenda that isn't in the interest of LGBTs of Russia. Kapiche?
------ Scusami, ma veramente non lo capisco, Razer.
Accusing the russians or anybody else of being 'homophobic' is crass, american, war propaganda. It's not hard to understand. But in the case of the current amerikunt 'cold' war against russia it is especially crass. If you don't understand you should really do your homework regarding soros and the US military. One of my Russian
friends and his boyfriend were almost dead when kissing and demonstrating affection in public.
The police did with the both guys exactly what my first rapist did with me: strong kicks in the head and the whole body. We stepped on our bodies. In the middle of the legs too. I was burned with cigarretes there. My friends not, but they receiveid lots of kicks in the scrotum. You probably can imagine how being kicked in the balls is painful.
Gays couples used to live with fear in Russia and Putin's homophobic politicies make being gay there almost a crime, with no serious investigations about their homicides and agressions, everything happens with the State convenience.
It's enough for making me consider this situation unfair, illogical. That was the reason why they both run away and live in another country now. They still love Russia and miss their country, their families, but want to walking around, hand in hand, kissing each other, without being judged and killed just for loving.
Sorry, my love, fuck politics and politicians. I want justice. Not a beautiful gay pride parade once a year. I want LGBTQ rights all the days.
On Oct 9, 2016 1:40 AM, "juan" <juan.g71@gmail.com> wrote:
Accusing the russians or anybody else of being 'homophobic' is
crass, american, war propaganda. It's not hard to understand. Russian policies are being homophobic and it is being discussed for several years. It isn't simple "American propaganda". It is the sad reality. Search about the Russian laws before saying everything is a North-American lie. Being neurotic about North-Americans can make you blind to the truth, Juan. North-American politicians are trash and the Russians are the same trash. Both stink.
But in the case of the current amerikunt 'cold' war against russia it is especially crass.
If you don't understand you should really do your homework regarding soros and the US military.
On Oct 9, 2016 1:50 AM, "Cecilia Tanaka" <cecilia.tanaka@gmail.com> wrote:
On Oct 9, 2016 1:40 AM, "juan" <juan.g71@gmail.com> wrote:
Accusing the russians or anybody else of being 'homophobic' is
crass, american, war propaganda. It's not hard to understand.
Russian policies are being homophobic and it is being discussed for
several years. It isn't simple "American propaganda". It is the sad reality. Search about the Russian laws before saying everything is a North-American lie.
Being neurotic about North-Americans can make you blind to the truth,
Juan. North-American politicians are trash and the Russians are the same trash. Both stink. Always remember that military forces of all the countries work to their governments, to politicians.
On Sun, 9 Oct 2016 01:54:01 -0300 Cecilia Tanaka <cecilia.tanaka@gmail.com> wrote:
Always remember that military forces of all the countries work to their governments, to politicians.
I don't think you are in a position to teach how to look at this =) So, go ahead, Do your homework about the US. And spare me the "every one is bad" line.
I feel a +100 from Alex coming on.... random links: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT_rights_in_Russia http://www.pinknews.co.uk/2015/09/28/putin-condemns-homophobia-supports-lgbt... It seems fairly nuanced. I have no idea which country, US or Russia, is more tolerant taken on the whole... the few gay friends I had in central TX never had any problems (that they spoke of to me), and it's the same in the north eastern US. But surely worse in other areas. I do agree both countries are shit or "every one is bad", in most other important areas. E.g. the nations are each fucked up militaristic murderous entities, run by a small cabal of elites more interested in money and power than peace or the welfare of their people and the world. John sent by phone - pardon the formatting
On Oct 9, 2016, at 1:19 AM, juan <juan.g71@gmail.com> wrote:
On Sun, 9 Oct 2016 01:54:01 -0300 Cecilia Tanaka <cecilia.tanaka@gmail.com> wrote:
Always remember that military forces of all the countries work to their governments, to politicians.
I don't think you are in a position to teach how to look at this =)
So, go ahead, Do your homework about the US. And spare me the "every one is bad" line.
* Human Rights Watch - published in January, 2016: * Jail Time for Being Gay in Russia https://www.hrw.org/news/2016/01/14/dispatches-jail-time-being-gay-russia * Russia to debate banning all public displays of affection between gay people (January, 2016) http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/russian-duma-to-debate-bannin... * Russia Gay Propaganda Ban: Speaking in Defense of Gay Rights Now a Crime in Putin's Russia https://mic.com/articles/48017/russia-gay-propaganda-ban-speaking-in-defense... * There a lot of links, but I won't have time to copy and paste all the references, because I'll need to leave, sorry. These links are extracted in few minutes from a simple search on Google, first page. If you search on specific sites of defense of GLBTQ culture or Human Rights Watch, you will find more interesting material and several horrible depoiments about what means to be gay in Russia.
Human Rights Watch is PROUD of it's association with George Soros. "George Soros to Give $100 million to Human Rights Watch" https://www.hrw.org/news/2010/09/07/george-soros-give-100-million-human-righ... I'll bet you believe everything you read and NEVER bother to validate the source of your information.. Rr On 10/09/2016 03:58 AM, Cecilia Tanaka wrote:
* Human Rights Watch - published in January, 2016:
* Jail Time for Being Gay in Russia
https://www.hrw.org/news/2016/01/14/dispatches-jail-time-being-gay-russia
* Russia to debate banning all public displays of affection between gay people (January, 2016)
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/russian-duma-to-debate-bannin...
* Russia Gay Propaganda Ban: Speaking in Defense of Gay Rights Now a Crime in Putin's Russia
https://mic.com/articles/48017/russia-gay-propaganda-ban-speaking-in-defense...
* There a lot of links, but I won't have time to copy and paste all the references, because I'll need to leave, sorry.
These links are extracted in few minutes from a simple search on Google, first page. If you search on specific sites of defense of GLBTQ culture or Human Rights Watch, you will find more interesting material and several horrible depoiments about what means to be gay in Russia.
On Oct 9, 2016 12:32 PM, "Razer" <rayzer@riseup.net> wrote:
Human Rights Watch is PROUD of it's association with George Soros.
"George Soros to Give $100 million to Human Rights Watch"
https://www.hrw.org/news/2010/09/07/george-soros-give-100-million-human-righ...
I'll bet you believe everything you read and NEVER bother to validate the
source of your information.. I do read, but I admiss I don't search with more care about institutions that I like, in all moments, in all the news. Sorry for the bad example posted. I usually appreciate a lot the work realized for the Hamans Rights Watch.
John, thank you. Let's remind ourselves that fundamentally a one world hegemon, no matter if it's USA or Russia or anyone else for that matter, is not in our collective individual interests. This is probably not a controversial, and certainly not an uncommon, view. There are some whom, rather than code something useful, would rather steamroll the conversation into an "LGBTQVTs in Russia have it really bad in compared with USA 'cause I said so so there!" conversation. Some seem content to ignore the nuclear powered elephants in the room who are now quite close to facing off against one another, should the crazies from the basement manage to steer the USA government in that direction. A black, desolate world - the new Black? May be we (human race) should just not go there... It is slightly possible that there are a few individuals in positions of relevant authority and influence, who consider this is just may be more important than who gets to kiss who or use what loo in public. Here's hoping that others share such concern and do what they can to handle the war mongering crazies, steering them into directions of the obvious irresponsibility of such. Thanks again John, Zenaan On Sun, Oct 09, 2016 at 06:05:50AM -0400, John Newman wrote:
I feel a +100 from Alex coming on....
random links:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT_rights_in_Russia
http://www.pinknews.co.uk/2015/09/28/putin-condemns-homophobia-supports-lgbt...
It seems fairly nuanced. I have no idea which country, US or Russia, is more tolerant taken on the whole... the few gay friends I had in central TX never had any problems (that they spoke of to me), and it's the same in the north eastern US. But surely worse in other areas.
I do agree both countries are shit or "every one is bad", in most other important areas. E.g. the nations are each fucked up militaristic murderous entities, run by a small cabal of elites more interested in money and power than peace or the welfare of their people and the world.
John
sent by phone - pardon the formatting
On Oct 9, 2016, at 1:19 AM, juan <juan.g71@gmail.com> wrote:
On Sun, 9 Oct 2016 01:54:01 -0300 Cecilia Tanaka <cecilia.tanaka@gmail.com> wrote:
Always remember that military forces of all the countries work to their governments, to politicians.
I don't think you are in a position to teach how to look at this =)
So, go ahead, Do your homework about the US. And spare me the "every one is bad" line.
On Sun, 9 Oct 2016 06:05:50 -0400 John Newman <jnn@synfin.org> wrote:
I feel a +100 from Alex coming on....
That's great! That means I get 100 rubles transferretd to my swiss account!
random links:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT_rights_in_Russia
http://www.pinknews.co.uk/2015/09/28/putin-condemns-homophobia-supports-lgbt...
It seems fairly nuanced. I have no idea which country, US or Russia, is more tolerant taken on the whole... the few gay friends I had in central TX never had any problems (that they spoke of to me), and it's the same in the north eastern US. But surely worse in other areas.
I do agree both countries are shit or "every one is bad", in most other important areas. E.g. the nations are each fucked up militaristic murderous entities, run by a small cabal of elites more interested in money and power than peace or the welfare of their people and the world.
John
sent by phone - pardon the formatting
On Oct 9, 2016, at 1:19 AM, juan <juan.g71@gmail.com> wrote:
On Sun, 9 Oct 2016 01:54:01 -0300 Cecilia Tanaka <cecilia.tanaka@gmail.com> wrote:
Always remember that military forces of all the countries work to their governments, to politicians.
I don't think you are in a position to teach how to look at this =)
So, go ahead, Do your homework about the US. And spare me the "every one is bad" line.
On Sun, 9 Oct 2016 01:50:53 -0300 Cecilia Tanaka <cecilia.tanaka@gmail.com> wrote:
On Oct 9, 2016 1:40 AM, "juan" <juan.g71@gmail.com> wrote:
Accusing the russians or anybody else of being 'homophobic' is
crass, american, war propaganda. It's not hard to understand.
Russian policies are being homophobic and it is being discussed for several years.
Yes of course. Pentagon propaganda has been going for 'several years' .
It isn't simple "American propaganda".
It is.
It is the sad reality. Search about the Russian laws before saying everything is a North-American lie.
Being neurotic about North-Americans can make you blind to the truth, Juan.
I don't know what 'neurotic' means. I do know the ABC of political theory though.
North-American politicians are trash and the Russians are the same trash. Both stink.
But in the case of the current amerikunt 'cold' war against russia it is especially crass.
If you don't understand you should really do your homework regarding soros and the US military.
So go ahead. Do your homework =)
On Oct 9, 2016 2:10 AM, "juan" <juan.g71@gmail.com> wrote:
I don't know what 'neurotic' means. I do know the ABC of
political theory though. Definition of neurotic: http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/neurotic
So go ahead. Do your homework =)
I will learn something more useful for me than hating the USA, Juan. I am finishing the reading of an interesting book named "Speaking Code: Coding as Aesthetic and Political Expression" and I am thinking about new eletronics projects for making children laughing in the Halloween. Candies, electronics and happy kids make me feel blessed for still being alive. Politics and corrupt and hypocrite politicians make me strongly wish the suicide again. Do you understand the difference? :) I am tired of pompous people auto-denominating themselves "activists", speaking and writing millions of empty words, without saying something really relevant, like Zenaan, for example, always does. I want to code and to create new ideas, to make new things. I want to learn and I always said it since the beggining. I am still reading all the suggested bibliography about Anarchism and I am really grateful for all the wonderful references, but I am making _my own interpretations_ of all the texts. I am my own cat and all the places are mine, do you remember? I make my own choices, wrong or not. I always read several books and texts at same time and, it definitely isn't practical, but makes me happy. It's fun to think about cute pink unicorns and how to destroy governments at same time. I prefer learn how to coding well than the ABC of political theory, if it will make me a neurotic, who will see USA, military forces or fanatic religions in every disaster that happens in the world. Did Hurricane Matthew destroy Haiti because of USA military too? Was it lack of faith? Aff... :((( Governments, corrupt politicians are the evil. Not only USA government, but ALL the governments, Russian included.
On Sun, 9 Oct 2016 09:11:28 -0300 Cecilia Tanaka <cecilia.tanaka@gmail.com> wrote:
On Oct 9, 2016 2:10 AM, "juan" <juan.g71@gmail.com> wrote:
I don't know what 'neurotic' means. I do know the ABC of
political theory though.
Definition of neurotic: http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/neurotic
"tending to worry in a way that is not healthy or reasonable" Except that my 'worries' are fully reasonable so your definition doesn't apply. I'm not even bothering with the fact that 'neurotic' is snobbish pyschobable (xorcist would love the term!)
So go ahead. Do your homework =)
I will learn something more useful for me than hating the USA, Juan.
Like loving the pentagon, its propaganda, and its current war against russia?
I am finishing the reading of an interesting book named "Speaking Code: Coding as Aesthetic and Political Expression" and I am thinking about new eletronics projects for making children laughing in the Halloween.
Candies, electronics and happy kids make me feel blessed for still being alive. Politics and corrupt and hypocrite politicians make me strongly wish the suicide again. Do you understand the difference? :)
I am tired of pompous people auto-denominating themselves "activists", speaking and writing millions of empty words, without saying something really relevant, like Zenaan, for example, always does. I want to code and to create new ideas, to make new things. I want to learn and I always said it since the beggining.
I am still reading all the suggested bibliography about Anarchism and I am really grateful for all the wonderful references, but I am making _my own interpretations_ of all the texts. I am my own cat and all the places are mine, do you remember? I make my own choices, wrong or not.
I always read several books and texts at same time and, it definitely isn't practical, but makes me happy. It's fun to think about cute pink unicorns and how to destroy governments at same time.
I prefer learn how to coding well than the ABC of political theory, if it will make me a neurotic, who will see USA, military forces or fanatic religions in every disaster that happens in the world. Did Hurricane Matthew destroy Haiti because of USA military too? Was it lack of faith? Aff... :(((
Governments, corrupt politicians are the evil. Not only USA government, but ALL the governments, Russian included.
On Oct 9, 2016 4:31 PM, "juan" <juan.g71@gmail.com> wrote:
[Ceci] I will learn something more useful for me than hating the USA, Juan.
[Juan] Like loving the pentagon, its propaganda, and its current war against russia?
I already answered to your question before, Juan, and you strangely sent my old answer with this message. I only mentioned reading, coding and eletronics. Read it bellow with attention, please. Please, read my messages for complete before say some ridiculous and non sense thing "like loving the pentagon, its propaganda, and its current war against russia?" Aff... I have more to do than "loving the Pentagon". I won't spend my life in flame wars. ========
I am finishing the reading of an interesting book named "Speaking Code: Coding as Aesthetic and Political Expression" and I am thinking about new eletronics projects for making children laughing in the Halloween.
Candies, electronics and happy kids make me feel blessed for still being alive. Politics and corrupt and hypocrite politicians make me strongly wish the suicide again. Do you understand the difference? :)
I am tired of pompous people auto-denominating themselves "activists", speaking and writing millions of empty words, without saying something really relevant, like Zenaan, for example, always does. I want to code and to create new ideas, to make new things. I want to learn and I always said it since the beggining.
I am still reading all the suggested bibliography about Anarchism and I am really grateful for all the wonderful references, but I am making _my own interpretations_ of all the texts. I am my own cat and all the places are mine, do you remember? I make my own choices, wrong or not.
I always read several books and texts at same time and, it definitely isn't practical, but makes me happy. It's fun to think about cute pink unicorns and how to destroy governments at same time.
I prefer learn how to coding well than the ABC of political theory, if it will make me a neurotic, who will see USA, military forces or fanatic religions in every disaster that happens in the world. Did Hurricane Matthew destroy Haiti because of USA military too? Was it lack of faith? Aff... :(((
Governments, corrupt politicians are the evil. Not only USA government, but ALL the governments, Russian included.
On 10/08/2016 09:50 PM, Cecilia Tanaka wrote:
It is the sad reality.
You're still NOT making a case for the Russian government legislating homophobic polices. What X mentioned: "law banning distribution of "propaganda of non-traditional sexual relationships" to minors." isn't. And the rest: "Following its passage, there has been increased discrimination against gays, and increased protests. In 2013 the USA received over 800 asylum requests from homosexuals in Russia." Welp! THAT'S WHAT HAPPENS WHEN THE FUCKING "CONVERSATION" GETS STARTED! Reactionary behavior. Thanks for making my point X. Rr
What X mentioned: "law banning distribution of "propaganda of non-traditional sexual relationships" to minors." isn't.
Oh? Care to explain or should we just take your word for it? Because it seems to me that a law that makes a DISCRIMINATION between one type of material and another is, obviously, discriminatory. If it outlaws distributing ANY type of sexual-oriented propaganda to minors, I would agree with you. But the law is written, and intended, so that heterosexual propaganda can be distributed to homosexual kids. It's discrimination.
Thanks for making my point X.
Actually, my point was that you were wrong in your assertion that things were A-OK for homosexuals in Russia since 1917. That is what you claimed. You completely ignored my point about Stalin in '33. So, no I didn't make your point at all.
On 10/09/2016 08:50 AM, xorcist@sigaint.org wrote:
What X mentioned: "law banning distribution of "propaganda of non-traditional sexual relationships" to minors." isn't.
Oh? Care to explain or should we just take your word for it? Because it seems to me that a law that makes a DISCRIMINATION between one type of material and another is, obviously, discriminatory. If it outlaws distributing ANY type of sexual-oriented propaganda to minors, I would agree with you.
Better start looking through Russian laws about 'sexual-oriented propaganda'. Because, just off the top of my head, for a start, material suggesting young people visit prostitutes of the opposite gender is illegal. But I KNOW you're evading my point because that's what you do. That's ALL you do. Rr
But the law is written, and intended, so that heterosexual propaganda can be distributed to homosexual kids.
It's discrimination.
Thanks for making my point X.
Actually, my point was that you were wrong in your assertion that things were A-OK for homosexuals in Russia since 1917. That is what you claimed.
You completely ignored my point about Stalin in '33.
So, no I didn't make your point at all.
Better start looking through Russian laws about 'sexual-oriented propaganda'. Because, just off the top of my head, for a start, material suggesting young people visit prostitutes of the opposite gender is illegal.
Fine. But prostitution is illegal. That has nothing to do with outlawing propaganda aimed at providing information about an theoretically "legal" lifestyle like homosexuality. Is propaganda suggesting they get married to the opposite sex, and have a pair of kids illegal? Is propaganda suggesting that homosexuality is a choice, and that they can choose a "normal" life illegal? If not, the law as written is discriminatory. I'm quite willing to concede that there may be details that make this law non-discriminatory. From what I know, this isn't the case. But I'm willing to learn about other Russian laws that may come to bear on this. But again. That isn't even my point, per se. Because I'm quite willing to concede that life for homosexuals is better in Russia now, than in 1933 under Stalin.
But I KNOW you're evading my point because that's what you do. That's ALL you do.
No. You're evading the point about Stalin, and aren't even capable of simply offering a retraction saying "Ok, I didn't know about Stalin's actions post-1917. Stalin was shithead, and I was wrong."
Rr
But the law is written, and intended, so that heterosexual propaganda can be distributed to homosexual kids.
It's discrimination.
Thanks for making my point X.
Actually, my point was that you were wrong in your assertion that things were A-OK for homosexuals in Russia since 1917. That is what you claimed.
You completely ignored my point about Stalin in '33.
So, no I didn't make your point at all.
On 10/09/2016 09:23 AM, xorcist@sigaint.org wrote:
prostitution is illegal
Municipalities make those laws. At a federal level the laws are in regard to "Human Trafficking". Same is true in the US. The feds don't give a damn if you sell your ass as long as you aren't giving a cut to anyone or else those SS guys a few years ago would have been in jail over some sweet Colombian hookermeat they 'stiffed' in more ways than one, now wouldn't they? (SS peeps are ALWAYS subject to US laws (and never to any other country's natch)) Pimps get in trouble, but you're free to market you're own wares unless the city has a law. Which IS why the Russian rural areas are littered with brothels. Ask Mark Ames and Yasha Levine about it. They have EXTENSIVE experience. (Snigger. I hear they're honorary NAMBLA members... They should have stuck with picking up 'lonely Russian women' at the clubs. Getting busted for hitting on under-age bois will get you ejected from the country.) But back to my point. Where this go-nowhere convo ends... I SAID "material suggesting young people visit prostitutes of the opposite gender is illegal." I DID NOT SAY Prostitution was or wasn't You changed the topic. You lose. Here... A flowchart to help you determine if you’re having a rational discussion http://twentytwowords.com/a-flowchart-to-help-you-determine-if-youre-having-... Rr
Better start looking through Russian laws about 'sexual-oriented propaganda'. Because, just off the top of my head, for a start, material suggesting young people visit prostitutes of the opposite gender is illegal.
Fine. But prostitution is illegal. That has nothing to do with outlawing propaganda aimed at providing information about an theoretically "legal" lifestyle like homosexuality. Is propaganda suggesting they get married to the opposite sex, and have a pair of kids illegal? Is propaganda suggesting that homosexuality is a choice, and that they can choose a "normal" life illegal? If not, the law as written is discriminatory.
I'm quite willing to concede that there may be details that make this law non-discriminatory. From what I know, this isn't the case. But I'm willing to learn about other Russian laws that may come to bear on this.
But again. That isn't even my point, per se. Because I'm quite willing to concede that life for homosexuals is better in Russia now, than in 1933 under Stalin.
But I KNOW you're evading my point because that's what you do. That's ALL you do.
No. You're evading the point about Stalin, and aren't even capable of simply offering a retraction saying "Ok, I didn't know about Stalin's actions post-1917. Stalin was shithead, and I was wrong."
Rr
But the law is written, and intended, so that heterosexual propaganda can be distributed to homosexual kids.
It's discrimination.
Thanks for making my point X.
Actually, my point was that you were wrong in your assertion that things were A-OK for homosexuals in Russia since 1917. That is what you claimed.
You completely ignored my point about Stalin in '33.
So, no I didn't make your point at all.
You changed the topic. You lose.
Your assertion about Russian in 1917 was false. Period. You then picked up by ignoring that basic point, where you were wrong, and focusing on one dubious point claiming that a discriminatory law isn't discriminatory because... reasons. Some 'reason' somehow related to some other law related to material in regards to prostitution. YOU CHANGED the topic from homosexuality, and issues related to it - to bringing up prostitution. So, if a tangential point somehow makes you "lose" .. then, you lose on three points, rather than just two. Congratulations: 1. Your assertion regarding the Russian Revolution in 1917, and its effects on homosexuals was wrong. 2. You lack the basic intellectual honesty to even address the point regarding Stalin in 1933. 3. YOU tangentially brought up prostitution, and laws related to propaganda against it, instead of focusing on the real point: Stalin. 1933.
On 10/09/2016 09:52 AM, xorcist@sigaint.org wrote:
You changed the topic. You lose.
Your assertion about Russian in 1917 was false. Period.
No it wasn't. By your own statement
The Russian Revolution in 1917 did bring about real change in that way. Under Lenin, homosexuals were allowed to serve in government positions, for example. HOWEVER.
In 1933
Troll, begone. Rr
You then picked up by ignoring that basic point, where you were wrong, and focusing on one dubious point claiming that a discriminatory law isn't discriminatory because... reasons. Some 'reason' somehow related to some other law related to material in regards to prostitution.
YOU CHANGED the topic from homosexuality, and issues related to it - to bringing up prostitution.
So, if a tangential point somehow makes you "lose" .. then, you lose on three points, rather than just two. Congratulations:
1. Your assertion regarding the Russian Revolution in 1917, and its effects on homosexuals was wrong.
2. You lack the basic intellectual honesty to even address the point regarding Stalin in 1933.
3. YOU tangentially brought up prostitution, and laws related to propaganda against it, instead of focusing on the real point: Stalin. 1933.
On 10/09/2016 09:52 AM, xorcist@sigaint.org wrote:
Your assertion about Russian in 1917 was false. Period.
No it wasn't. By your own statement
You said "AND my POINT is THERE ARE NO DISCRIMINATORY LEGAL POLICIES and haven't been since 1917." That is patently false. What I agreed to in the portion you quote is that Lenin, in 1917 instituted fair practices. You are right about that. However your statement is WRONG in regards to the "haven't been SINCE 1917." In 1933, Stalin made homosexuality a crime. Period. You're wrong. And it is obvious to anyone with basic reading comprehension, which you clearly lack.
The Russian Revolution in 1917 did bring about real change in that way. Under Lenin, homosexuals were allowed to serve in government positions, for example. HOWEVER.
In 1933
Troll, begone.
Fascist, Stalin-loving troglodyte - begone.
Your lack of specificity as a way to keep trolling the convo has been noted over and over and over again by Juan. Are you too stupid to notice you've been (snigger) outed? AFAICT you're just collecting info to profile people for the Feds' social engineering ops. Rr On 10/09/2016 10:27 AM, xorcist@sigaint.org wrote:
On 10/09/2016 09:52 AM, xorcist@sigaint.org wrote:
Your assertion about Russian in 1917 was false. Period.
No it wasn't. By your own statement
You said "AND my POINT is THERE ARE NO DISCRIMINATORY LEGAL POLICIES and haven't been since 1917."
That is patently false. What I agreed to in the portion you quote is that Lenin, in 1917 instituted fair practices. You are right about that. However your statement is WRONG in regards to the "haven't been SINCE 1917."
In 1933, Stalin made homosexuality a crime.
Period. You're wrong. And it is obvious to anyone with basic reading comprehension, which you clearly lack.
The Russian Revolution in 1917 did bring about real change in that way. Under Lenin, homosexuals were allowed to serve in government positions, for example. HOWEVER.
In 1933
Troll, begone.
Fascist, Stalin-loving troglodyte - begone.
Your lack of specificity as a way to keep trolling the convo has been noted over and over and over again by Juan.
Right. Because calling you out with a specific year which negates your statement is a lack of specificity. Why not just address the point about Stalin, and forced work camps for homosexuals, starting in 1933?
Are you too stupid to notice you've been (snigger) outed?
Are you too stupid to realize that you're wrong? Or too much of a socialist ideologue to prevent anything as optional as facts to sway your view?
AFAICT you're just collecting info to profile people for the Feds' social engineering ops.
Right. Because people with minds as powerful and acute as yours, which fail to even be able to address points of fact, are such a threat to the world order. And more generally, anyone that disagrees with you at all, must be an agent of the state. You might like to read up on self-supporting, delusory belief systems and brain-washing. Witnessing the general ineffectiveness of government-run programs generally, it is doubtful whether a State-run COINTELPRO-type op could be as effective as your own self-induced state of hypnosis.
On 10/09/2016 11:04 AM, xorcist@sigaint.org wrote:
Your lack of specificity as a way to keep trolling the convo has been noted over and over and over again by Juan.
Right. Because calling you out with a specific year which negates your statement is a lack of specificity.
Why not just address the point about Stalin, and forced work camps for homosexuals, starting in 1933?
Honestly? Because I'm not interested. You DID correct my blanket statement about "since 1917" but the rest of your spew bores the living fuck out of me. Also note Stalin's pronouncements regarding gays and others was just as much a social aberration in Russia as the WWII internment of Japanese Americans was in the US. Stalin was illegitimate as an example of "Communism" btw, on his death bed Lenin said that Trotsky was the rightful heir to his work. He thought Stalin was scum, and Stalin's nurse was poisoning him. I'm concerned with my OWN country's REACTIONARY freaks. After all, you can get dragged to death or hung from a barbed wire fence, or bashed, in the 'LGBT-liberated' US. The Russians can worry about their reactionaries and I'll worry about mine. After all, they DID just recently in history overthrow their own government so I suppose they're more than capable ofd taking out the homophobes, and Solidarity DOESN'T MEAN getting your own closet-homophobic warmongering government to butt in so George Soros can open a 'market'. Rr
Are you too stupid to notice you've been (snigger) outed?
Are you too stupid to realize that you're wrong? Or too much of a socialist ideologue to prevent anything as optional as facts to sway your view?
AFAICT you're just collecting info to profile people for the Feds' social engineering ops.
Right. Because people with minds as powerful and acute as yours, which fail to even be able to address points of fact, are such a threat to the world order. And more generally, anyone that disagrees with you at all, must be an agent of the state.
You might like to read up on self-supporting, delusory belief systems and brain-washing. Witnessing the general ineffectiveness of government-run programs generally, it is doubtful whether a State-run COINTELPRO-type op could be as effective as your own self-induced state of hypnosis.
Why not just address the point about Stalin, and forced work camps for homosexuals, starting in 1933?
Honestly? Because I'm not interested. You DID correct my blanket statement about "since 1917" but the rest of your spew bores the living fuck out of me.
Thank you for retracting an inaccuracy. It leaves me to wonder, however, why you would choose to respond to the otherwise 'boring' points, rather than own the inaccuracy upfront to begin with and just move on.
Also note Stalin's pronouncements regarding gays and others was just as much a social aberration in Russia as the WWII internment of Japanese Americans was in the US.
This is an excellent, and fair point! I have no illusions about U.S. mis-deeds. I am not anti-Russian, nor some type of neo-McCarthyist. Quite the contrary. The current situation being what it is, I give the moral high-ground to Russia. Nevertheless whitewashing Russian (or American/British) history IS a misdeed. All governments fail in this way, and it is precisely the reason to distrust ALL government.
I'm concerned with my OWN country's REACTIONARY freaks.
Fine. But again, please don't whitewash Russian history. That was my only objection - your statement gave a rosy view of Russian history which is not real. I understand that not ALL of Russian history was so -- monstrous -- as under Stalin. I also understand that American history is equally, if not more-so, stained -- but that was not the issue at hand.
On 10/09/2016 08:23 PM, xorcist@sigaint.org wrote:
Why not just address the point about Stalin, and forced work camps for homosexuals, starting in 1933?
Honestly? Because I'm not interested. You DID correct my blanket statement about "since 1917" but the rest of your spew bores the living fuck out of me.
Thank you for retracting an inaccuracy.
It leaves me to wonder, however, why you would choose to respond to the otherwise 'boring' points, rather than own the inaccuracy upfront to begin with and just move on.
Because I had something to say first... Here's what I have to say now. I've watched your convos with Juan... The amount of conflicitng nonsense you post in your over-worded boilerplate makes my eyes glaze over. You do not and cannot get to the point because all you are doing is 'hitting every pin' trying to glean reactions. No point necessary. How much does Langley pay you by the word to do that? Rr
Also note Stalin's pronouncements regarding gays and others was just as much a social aberration in Russia as the WWII internment of Japanese Americans was in the US.
This is an excellent, and fair point! I have no illusions about U.S. mis-deeds. I am not anti-Russian, nor some type of neo-McCarthyist. Quite the contrary. The current situation being what it is, I give the moral high-ground to Russia.
Nevertheless whitewashing Russian (or American/British) history IS a misdeed. All governments fail in this way, and it is precisely the reason to distrust ALL government.
I'm concerned with my OWN country's REACTIONARY freaks.
Fine. But again, please don't whitewash Russian history. That was my only objection - your statement gave a rosy view of Russian history which is not real. I understand that not ALL of Russian history was so -- monstrous -- as under Stalin. I also understand that American history is equally, if not more-so, stained -- but that was not the issue at hand.
2016-10-10 17:56 GMT+03:00 Razer <rayzer@riseup.net>:
Here's what I have to say now. I've watched your convos with Juan... The amount of conflicitng nonsense you post in your over-worded boilerplate makes my eyes glaze over.
+1.
You do not and cannot get to the point because all you are doing is 'hitting every pin' trying to glean reactions. No point necessary.
+1.
How much does Langley pay you by the word to do that?
A HAHAHA!!! I think this stupid dick works for free, Razer.
On 10/09/2016 11:04 AM, xorcist@sigaint.org wrote:
anyone that disagrees with you at all, must be an agent of the state.
No... You're mistaking me for Juan. Your reams of vacillating bullshit to garner reactions as the convo goes this way and that way and sideways is typical of social engineering operators
On 10/09/2016 11:04 AM, xorcist@sigaint.org wrote:
anyone that disagrees with you at all, must be an agent of the state.
No... You're mistaking me for Juan.
Your reams of vacillating bullshit to garner reactions as the convo goes this way and that way and sideways is typical of social engineering operators
Whatever. Try owning your mis-statements, and dealing in facts. You'll find I reciprocate. Deal in bullshit ideology and willfully being blind to Russian (American, or other) misdeeds? And I'll call you out. Start slinging bullshit, and I have no qualms getting down to the farm as well.
On 10/09/2016 08:27 PM, xorcist@sigaint.org wrote:
Whatever. Try owning your mis-statements, and dealing in facts. You'll find I reciprocate.
Read the previous post. You don't 'own' anything. You correct factual mistakes but you have no 'side' in the discussion. Corrections just mean you need to go look it up and fix it. Not change your mind. How much does Langley pay you by the word to do that? Rr
Read the previous post. You don't 'own' anything. You correct factual mistakes but you have no 'side' in the discussion.
You're right. I don't take "sides" for the sake of taking sides. I try to see the value of as many perspectives as possible, and to understand and be able to reason from them. I said, from the outset, that I'm not ideological in that way. Ideology is rather like mental training wheels. There comes a time when you don't need it.
Corrections just mean you need to go look it up and fix it. Not change your mind.
I'm not sure what this even means. If I make a factual mistake, and look it up and see that I was wrong, I then change my mind regarding that fact. It may, or may not, change my interpretation of related facts, but I do change my mind. I presume any sane person thinks this way?
How much does Langley pay you by the word to do that?
We don't get paid by the word. If we did, I'd have already retired. And I don't work for Langley. Brussels.
Razer, my dear, You _mixed_ my message and Xorcist's message. There a lot of things that I did _not_ write, which were mentioned in your answer. And the way you answered to it, using my address as unique reference, can induce the readers in mistake. Read again the messages, please. On Oct 9, 2016 12:28 PM, "Razer" <rayzer@riseup.net> wrote:
On 10/08/2016 09:50 PM, Cecilia Tanaka wrote:
It is the sad reality.
You're still NOT making a case for the Russian government legislating homophobic polices.
What X mentioned: "law banning distribution of "propaganda of non-traditional sexual relationships" to minors." isn't.
And the rest: "Following its passage, there has been increased discrimination against gays, and increased protests. In 2013 the USA received over 800 asylum requests from homosexuals in Russia."
Welp! THAT'S WHAT HAPPENS WHEN THE FUCKING "CONVERSATION" GETS STARTED!
Reactionary behavior.
Thanks for making my point X.
Rr
On Sun, 9 Oct 2016 08:27:59 -0700 Razer <rayzer@riseup.net> wrote:
On 10/08/2016 09:50 PM, Cecilia Tanaka wrote:
It is the sad reality.
You're still NOT making a case for the Russian government legislating homophobic polices.
What X mentioned: "law banning distribution of "propaganda of non-traditional sexual relationships" to minors." isn't.
To 'minors'? Wait, doesn't that come directly from the jew-kkkristians and their junior anti-sex league?
And the rest: "Following its passage, there has been increased discrimination against gays, and increased protests.
Protests? Aren't the protests 'banned'? You still don't get it. There's discrimination againg gays in a lot of places. Focusing on discrimination in russia right now is WAR PROPAGANDA. You are doing your little part to fan the flames of war Cecilia, and you are helping the US government extend their power. Is that what you want?
In 2013 the USA received over 800 asylum requests from homosexuals in Russia
Welp! THAT'S WHAT HAPPENS WHEN THE FUCKING "CONVERSATION" GETS STARTED!
Reactionary behavior.
Thanks for making my point X.
Rr
Apologies, I replied to stuff Razer wrote thinking it was Cecilia's - but my point stands anyway. ------------------- On Sun, 9 Oct 2016 08:27:59 -0700 Razer <rayzer@riseup.net> wrote:
On 10/08/2016 09:50 PM, Cecilia Tanaka wrote:
It is the sad reality.
You're still NOT making a case for the Russian government legislating homophobic polices.
What X mentioned: "law banning distribution of "propaganda of non-traditional sexual relationships" to minors." isn't.
To 'minors'? Wait, doesn't that come directly from the jew-kkkristians and their junior anti-sex league?
And the rest: "Following its passage, there has been increased discrimination against gays, and increased protests.
Protests? Aren't the protests 'banned'? You still don't get it. There's discrimination againg gays in a lot of places. Focusing on discrimination in russia right now is WAR PROPAGANDA. You are doing your little part to fan the flames of war Cecilia, and you are helping the US government extend their power. Is that what you want?
In 2013 the USA received over 800 asylum requests from homosexuals in Russia
Welp! THAT'S WHAT HAPPENS WHEN THE FUCKING "CONVERSATION" GETS STARTED!
Reactionary behavior.
Thanks for making my point X.
Rr
On 10/09/2016 12:53 PM, juan wrote:
Apologies, I replied to stuff Razer wrote thinking it was Cecilia's - but my point stands anyway.
-------------------
On Sun, 9 Oct 2016 08:27:59 -0700 Razer <rayzer@riseup.net> wrote:
On 10/08/2016 09:50 PM, Cecilia Tanaka wrote:
It is the sad reality.
You're still NOT making a case for the Russian government legislating homophobic polices.
What X mentioned: "law banning distribution of "propaganda of non-traditional sexual relationships" to minors." isn't.
To 'minors'?
Wait, doesn't that come directly from the jew-kkkristians and their junior anti-sex league?
That wasn't relevant to the argument I was making. But since you brought it up is there a country where, let's say ... NAMBLA's operations are legal?
And the rest: "Following its passage, there has been increased discrimination against gays, and increased protests.
Protests? Aren't the protests 'banned'?
You still don't get it. There's discrimination againg gays in a lot of places.
Focusing on discrimination in russia right now is WAR PROPAGANDA.
THAT'S the argument I've been making.
You are doing your little part to fan the flames of war Cecilia, and you are helping the US government extend their power. Is that what you want?
In 2013 the USA received over 800 asylum requests from homosexuals in Russia
Welp! THAT'S WHAT HAPPENS WHEN THE FUCKING "CONVERSATION" GETS STARTED!
Reactionary behavior.
Thanks for making my point X.
Rr
On Sun, 9 Oct 2016 13:33:56 -0700 Razer <rayzer@riseup.net> wrote:
And the rest: "Following its passage, there has been increased discrimination against gays, and increased protests.
Protests? Aren't the protests 'banned'? You still don't get it. There's discrimination againg gays in a lot of places. Focusing on discrimination in russia right now is WAR PROPAGANDA.
THAT'S the argument I've been making.
Yes, my bad.
Focusing on discrimination in russia right now is WAR PROPAGANDA.
THAT'S the argument I've been making.
Ok. I get where you're coming from, and this is an important point of INFORMATION WARFARE / PROPAGANDA. In this aspect, I'll agree with you guys and admit that as distasteful to me as sexual/gender discrimination is, I will admit that that it is MUCH less important than the ramifications of war. But, ignoring or whitewashing the REAL discrimination that going on is, in my view, not the answer here. I would advocate calling out Russian discrimination towards homosexuals, AND calling out American aggression towards .. well.. the whole fucking world but Russia in particular right now. Especially Russia, even, because it is insanely egregious. Look, guys. It's obvious by now that we all have very different perspectives... Juan is coming from a libertarian view, Razer from more of a socialist / Communist view .. and I from a wild-eyed, messy hair / skid-marks in my shorts anarchist framework but in terms of trying to hold governments accountable, it seems like that may be the point of common ground we share. IW strategy is important, but the BEST IW strategy is FACTS. If we can be FACTUAL about American, Russian, Belizian, and other government misdeeds, and failures -- that is the ONLY way we're going to be able to generate the momentum to challenge them. After the governments crumble, and the dust settles, then we can hang out, have a few beers, and philosophize about libertarianism vs. socialism vs syndicalism vs martianism vs whatever. But even all that is nonsense. I, for one, will call out factual inaccuracies when I see them. I hope others do that for me. Our interpretation of the facts my vary, but we should be able to acknowledge the FACTS.
On Oct 8, 2016 6:17 PM, "John Newman" <jnn@synfin.org> wrote:
On Oct 8, 2016, at 9:07 AM, Cecilia Tanaka <cecilia.tanaka@gmail.com>
wrote:
LOL.. this is fucking hilarious.
I wish there was an English version…. maybe Zen will translate :)
Try this version, John: http://9gag.com/gag/aVzA8XO/super-putin-episode-1-the-phantom-menace
On Oct 8, 2016, at 8:05 PM, Cecilia Tanaka <cecilia.tanaka@gmail.com> wrote:
On Oct 8, 2016 6:17 PM, "John Newman" <jnn@synfin.org <mailto:jnn@synfin.org>> wrote:
On Oct 8, 2016, at 9:07 AM, Cecilia Tanaka <cecilia.tanaka@gmail.com <mailto:cecilia.tanaka@gmail.com>> wrote:
LOL.. this is fucking hilarious.
I wish there was an English version…. maybe Zen will translate :)
Try this version, John:
http://9gag.com/gag/aVzA8XO/super-putin-episode-1-the-phantom-menace <http://9gag.com/gag/aVzA8XO/super-putin-episode-1-the-phantom-menace> Perfect, thanks! The art actually isn’t bad.
John
Does Soros think the universe is a simulation too? You know that's just a rationalization for psychopathic behavior and megalomania. It the universe is just a construct it doesn't much matter what the fuck you do now does it? It's just one humungous video game, and if you blow up the universe just pull the cart out and stuff it back in. Sort of like Soros visualizes Ukraine et al. "Firmware upgrade" Rr On 10/08/2016 03:37 AM, Zenaan Harkness wrote:
Oh poor, poor baby - what's wrong the world? Oh Georgey, the world isn't behind you in your desire to bring down Russia and launch your one world government new world order with your one world carbon tax and associated "one world" entities. There there Georgey, it'll all be over soon, Mr Big Bad Putin will get tired soon with his multi polar world and then you can get a good old sleep...
Welp, least we know is who the big baddy is...
George Soros smells war, blood, and profits. Calls on world to unite against Vladimir Putin http://theduran.com/george-soros-smells-war-blood-profits-calls-world-to-uni...
Oh, you wanted to know the big baddy? Why, this'll explain it for ya: Watch This Journalist Prove Vladimir Putin was Behind Every Major Terrorist Attack – Ever http://theduran.com/journalist-proves-vladimir-putin-behind-every-major-terr...
Ah, yes, glad we cleared that up... it's hard, really hard, to know what to think sometimes, that's why we have the Lame Stream Media to guide us.
Well, at least the CIA and USA military's escapade in Syria has caused cold war tensions to ease to very benign and uneventful levels: http://theduran.com/russia-considering-military-bases-cuba-vietnam/
Ahem, what I meant is, USA just got bitch slapped: U.S. backs down over Syria after Russian threat to shoot down American aircraft http://theduran.com/us-backs-down-over-syria-following-russian-threat-shoot-...
(Man, those crazy Russians: Russian couple climb highest construction site in the world in China http://theduran.com/russian-couple-climbs-highest-construction-site-in-the-w... )
But wait! Al-Qaeda must be saved: http://theduran.com/al-qaeda-saved-top-washington-officials-are-ready-to-att...
More on the delusional behavior that might be exhibited if you're 'touched in da haid' enough to believe your own delusions about 'simulation', as translated into strategy and tactics. "The Chalabi Card". Juan Cole, professor of Persian studies, recounts a convo between AIPAC's BFF Doug Feith, who was head of the "Department of Lying to the American Public" at the Pentagon during the run-up to the War on Iraq, with a low-level State Department employee he was teaching during his short stint at one of the power-elite's Peer Reviewed institutions... Georgetown University: "State Dept. Official: “Doug, after the smoke clears, what is the plan?” Feith: “Think of Iraq as being like a computer. And think of Saddam as like a processor. We just take out the old processor, and put in a new one–Chalabi.” State Dept. Official: “Put in a new processor?” Feith: “Yes! It will all be over in 6 weeks.” State Dept. Official: “You mean six months.” Feith: “No, six weeks. You’ll see.” State Dept. Official: “Doug.” Feith: “Yes?” State Dept. Official: “You’re smoking crack, Doug.” Feith: “Oh, so you’re disloyal to the President, are you?” Source: http://www.juancole.com/2007/02/3-month-record-for-us-troops-killed.html Verification of Feith’s belief in a 'short war’ was published by the National Security Archive and it SEEMED to be due to the apparent fact that Chalabi and friends channeled funds to ostensibly sympathetic people in Iraq’s government… They REALLY expected the US to just walk in, greeted with flowers, because “Delusional”. TOP SECRET POLO STEP Iraq War Plan Assumed Only 5,000 U.S. Troops Still There by December 2006 […] “First, they assumed that a provisional government would be in place by ‘D-Day’, then that the Iraqis would stay in their garrisons and be reliable partners, and finally that the post-hostilities phase would be a matter of mere ‘months’. ” […] For more information contact: Thomas Blanton/Joyce Battle - 202/XXX-XXXX http://www.nsarchive.org Rr "The roots of repression are and remain real roots; consequently, their eradication remains a real and rational job. What is to be abolished is not the reality principle; not everything, but such particular things as business, politics, exploitation, poverty." ~Herbert Marcuse, Critique of UCSC's Philosophy professor Norman O. Brown https://www.commentarymagazine.com/articles/love-mystified-a-critique-of-nor... On 10/08/2016 07:35 AM, Razer wrote:
Does Soros think the universe is a simulation too?
You know that's just a rationalization for psychopathic behavior and megalomania. It the universe is just a construct it doesn't much matter what the fuck you do now does it? It's just one humungous video game, and if you blow up the universe just pull the cart out and stuff it back in. Sort of like Soros visualizes Ukraine et al. "Firmware upgrade"
Rr
On 10/08/2016 03:37 AM, Zenaan Harkness wrote:
Oh poor, poor baby - what's wrong the world? Oh Georgey, the world isn't behind you in your desire to bring down Russia and launch your one world government new world order with your one world carbon tax and associated "one world" entities. There there Georgey, it'll all be over soon, Mr Big Bad Putin will get tired soon with his multi polar world and then you can get a good old sleep...
Welp, least we know is who the big baddy is...
George Soros smells war, blood, and profits. Calls on world to unite against Vladimir Putin http://theduran.com/george-soros-smells-war-blood-profits-calls-world-to-uni...
Oh, you wanted to know the big baddy? Why, this'll explain it for ya: Watch This Journalist Prove Vladimir Putin was Behind Every Major Terrorist Attack – Ever http://theduran.com/journalist-proves-vladimir-putin-behind-every-major-terr...
Ah, yes, glad we cleared that up... it's hard, really hard, to know what to think sometimes, that's why we have the Lame Stream Media to guide us.
Well, at least the CIA and USA military's escapade in Syria has caused cold war tensions to ease to very benign and uneventful levels: http://theduran.com/russia-considering-military-bases-cuba-vietnam/
Ahem, what I meant is, USA just got bitch slapped: U.S. backs down over Syria after Russian threat to shoot down American aircraft http://theduran.com/us-backs-down-over-syria-following-russian-threat-shoot-...
(Man, those crazy Russians: Russian couple climb highest construction site in the world in China http://theduran.com/russian-couple-climbs-highest-construction-site-in-the-w... )
But wait! Al-Qaeda must be saved: http://theduran.com/al-qaeda-saved-top-washington-officials-are-ready-to-att...
participants (9)
-
Cecilia Tanaka -
John Newman -
juan -
Marina Brown -
Mirimir -
Razer -
xorcist＠sigaint.org -
Zenaan Harkness -
Александр