[occi-wg] confusion about status of link / headers

[Gary Mazz]

Hi Andre,

I read Adrian's email in regards to the a tested history of stuffing 
attributes into http headers. I'm not debating that issue. It does work, 
or else http wouldn't.

What is not proven and my issue is this is an unproven technology for 
management applications. We have 2 new items here, a new and unproven 
management protocol and now a new and unproven networking protocol. 
Selling one is hard enough when questions like is it proven in a 5-9s 
environment on a global scale. Adopting both is far too risky for 
serious enterprise adoption. Believing it can happen, is just 
unfamiliarity with the market.

My issues are not driven by technology for technologies sake. And there 
are places for that, like apache incubators. My concerns are derived 
from practical business issues including technology risk management.

Honestly, I'm have run out of road on this issue, and have more pressing 
commitments to spend my time on.

Andre, I think many in this group has lost perspective and is caught up 
in rhetoric.  Its up to the proposer's to justify and provide evidence 
that this is a viable technology that can be deployed. Not the other way 
around. Proposer should  noted whether the target environment and 
application is it intended for a web browser technology, as life 
critical application technology; is it indented to support reliably as 
"best of breed" in the global enterprise.

-gary



Andre Merzky wrote:
> Quoting [Gary Mazz] (Oct 20 2009):
>   
>> Adrian,
>>
>> These issues are business issues and not appropriate discussion for this 
>> group. The issues about this technology have been brought up by myself 
>> and others. I'm done discussing this issue. If you trust S3, go for it.:-)
>>     
>
> Uhm, I think Adrian is trying to make a technical point, i.e. is
> citing prior art.  If you consider the S3 prior art invalid, ok, I
> am sure he'll listen to your arguments, and he and Sam will try to
> find another example...
>
> Andre.
>
> PS.: You know, it is great to see a group with strong individuals -
> but I would not like to chair it... ;-)
>
>
>   
>> -gary
>>
>> Adrian Cole wrote:
>>     
>>> Hi, Gary.
>>>
>>> I attended the AWS enterprise meetup in LA last week.    The number of
>>> objects they mentioned that are stored in S3 is currently 70 billion
>>> and the service has been running for over 3.5 years.   Granted that
>>> their "global story" is shorter, but they do 2 years presence in the
>>> EU.   All 70 billion objects use headers for metadata.
>>>
>>> What metadata system is more proven then this?  What are the technical
>>> risks of using headers?   Are there clients or systems that are unable
>>> to pass http headers, but are able to pass entities?
>>>
>>> None of this matters, if the concern is the code impact to your
>>> application.  However, I'd like to know the details of the broader
>>> concern you may be implying.
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> -Adrian
>>>
>>> On Tue, Oct 20, 2009 at 4:24 PM, Gary Mazz <garymazzaferro at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>   
>>>       
>>>> Look Sam,
>>>>
>>>> If you feel that this is the best way for move occi forward, go for it.
>>>> I'm iust trying to preserve the integrity of the work and support it
>>>> properly in this group. I will be rolling out an occi interface or occi
>>>> like interface publicly by Q1'10. I will not be deploying this proposed
>>>> protocol until it is proven to work in a global environment. If that
>>>> means abandoning occi, well, I'll abandon occi.
>>>>
>>>> I personally, feel I cannot and will not risk a customer's business or
>>>> the livelihood of partners and their families on a single opinion and
>>>> unproven technology. When you get real numbers from a global time study,
>>>> I'll be glad to review them and support your efforts.
>>>>
>>>> Enjoy your night off.
>>>>
>>>> cheers
>>>> gary
>>>>
>>>> Sam Johnston wrote:
>>>>     
>>>>         
>>>>> Gary,
>>>>>
>>>>> And here I was thinking I was getting the night off...
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>     I am advocating this is not the only interface.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> It's not the only interface - there's currently this one for machines
>>>>> and XHTML5 for users (and masochistic machines who like to parse XML).
>>>>> However it is the only interface users would have to implement (rather
>>>>> than having to code XML, JSON *and* text, which was the case before).
>>>>>
>>>>> Anyway I see Adrian has kindly stepped up to discuss the details with
>>>>> you so I can get back to writing PyUnit unit tests.
>>>>>
>>>>> Sam
>>>>>
>>>>>       
>>>>>           
>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>> occi-wg at ogf.org
>>>> http://www.ogf.org/mailman/listinfo/occi-wg
>>>>
>>>>     
>>>>         
>>>   
>>>       
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>>     
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