Bantering with punk-stasi-victim was Re: Slavery was Formally Abolished Today, Happy Freedom Day

Punk-BatSoup-Stasi 2.0 punks at
Mon Feb 8 12:12:44 PST 2021

On Sat, 6 Feb 2021 18:46:14 -0500
Karl <gmkarl at> wrote:

> Here we go again with totally different answers!
> On 2/6/21, Punk-BatSoup-Stasi 2.0 <punks at> wrote:
> > On Sat, 6 Feb 2021 14:34:57 -0500
> > Karl <gmkarl at> wrote:
> >
> >> On 2/6/21, Punk-BatSoup-Stasi 2.0 <punks at> wrote:

> >>
> >> Punk, I bumped into a weirdo.  He said I had to draw a square on the
> >> wall, and if I ever told anybody about him, the instructions, or the
> >> square, he would kill me!
> >
> >
> > 	Do you like to speak in riddles? Or do you do it because you think it
> > serves some purpose? Problem is, I don't understand your riddles. I can try
> > half guessing, but it takes effort and makes the discussion even harder to
> > follow.
> It's not a riddle.  It's a summarisation of things that have happened
> to me.  The parts were changed to ones I made up.  It's meant
> straight, plus obvious similarity.

	Well, you're talking about it. Now you're going to be killed? 

>> As far as I can
>> tell you're saying that abolition of government is a more violent form of
>> government. Which is absurd.  

> Personal slavery.  Where the government is not a large organised body
> but rather a smaller representative of pain.

	are you saying that abolition of government leads to personal slavery? 

> >
> > 	No. When you abolish government, all the problems that governmetn causes
> > dissapear. That's the whole point of abolishing government.
> Sorry, thought you were blaming all problems on government.

	Yes. Or to be more accurate, the vast amajority of problems are caused and amplified by government. 

> So you do you propose abolishing "government" and not abolishing "slavery"?

	...? I never proposed not-abolishing-slavery...

> Personally, like, anarchism is cool, but to me govcorp looks pretty
> blurry.  The USA government would basically disappear by actually
> respecting people if the powers pulling their strings were wrangled.

	 Govcorp is blurry? Not sure what you mean by that. 

>US  government would....disappear....if the powers pulling their strings were wrangled.
	govcorp IS the power pulling the strings. 

> >> But often people leave stuff  out when planning.
> >
> > 	social planners are interested in planning. Social planners are the
> > opposite of anarchists.
> These similarity of "planning" does not mean that planners are
> governments.  

	But it does. Planners have the wrong mindset. They are wannabe tyrants, 'planning' what other people should do. Also, look at all the fucking technocrats around here...

> Me, I'd like to live in a community where we do not
> enslave people, but rather respect everyone in it.

	Fine. That's a principle, not a plan. 

> What do you think of the idea of offering a service to governments and
> anarchists both, where young women can be forced to seduce activists,
> possibly even marry them, to take them out of their activism?

	Sounds convoluted. 

> "laws".  "we love human rights bla bla".
> Many people believe those laws and follow and live by them.  Many of
> these people are where the government's power comes from, so they
> actually defend the laws for those people.


> > 	Those 'human rights' 'laws' are of course more propaganda. In practice the
> > US has the highest incarceration rate on the planet, it's the most dangerous
> > rogue state on the planet, has military bases all over the planet, etc, etc,
> > and does all that according to their 'laws'.
> Most of that stuff is picked by humans, kind of outside the laws.

	bullshit. All those crimes are commited 'by law' and 'inside' the 'laws'.

> Like, the law might say some human can pick stuff, and the human picks
> that bad stuff.

	Govt crimimals write 'laws' which are nothing but a description of their crimes, and 'execute' the 'laws', i.e. commit the crimes. 

> But, like, yeah, laws are bad.  It's really hard to talk like the
> die-hard antigov you pretend to be after my brainwashing.
> Is there a
> word for not actually being a government agent but being about as
> gross as one?  I'm about as gross as a government agent, just in a way
> that yields great pity, so I think of laws as helpful, now.

	In the past you claimed you were an 'anarcho-primitivist'. It doesn't seem that's the case tho.

> >> Really, with a good blockchain'd camera and a big and diverse crowd,
> >> you could win lawsuits altering the harmful behaviors of the US, based
> >> on antislavery laws.
> >
> >
> > 	Haha. Win lawsuits? By definition the govt owns the courts.
> I've had success in two court battles myself.

	Well yes, you can win a few 'lawsuits' which in practice won't affect the operation of government and would give the false idea that government isn't tyrannical.

> >> Happy to run whatever campaign is willing to welcome all supporters,
> >> and listen to all their ideas.  If you're intentionally excluding
> >> people who want to support you, or their ideas, that's a recipe for
> >> disaster, leave me out.
> >
> >
> > 	Why wouldn't I exclude people who parrot govt propaganda.
> Obviously because somebody would train everybody to parrot it, so that
> they got the people instead of you.

	Somehow "people who want to support you" and "people who parrot govt propaganda" got mixed up. Anyway, you don't want support from people who parrot what your enemy tells them to parrot. And if they believe govt propaganda they won't support anti government actions so they are not a great loss.

> Say there were a tiny bit of human trafficking.  Say I had even
> experienced it!  What would be a respectful way to engage this,
> without spreading bullshit propaganda?

	I don't know. 

> Anyway, here's how to start a human trafficking ring.
> Clean out your basement.
> etc

	thanks for the instructions 

> Here's what's actually true, rather than that bullshit:
> When somebody tries to control your behavior, they vomit on your soul
> in a way you can never, ever forget.  Like they have told you they
> hate you in a way so real that you become it.  Maybe you consciously
> forget everything that hurt, everything that is bad, maybe you can't
> bring to mind any memories of this.  But it is written on ever fibre
> of your being, in a way every part of you understands and knows, like
> nothing else.
> This is why government cannot last.  Not because of some fake world rebellion.

	Not sure I follow. By "government cannot last" you mean it's going to somehow self-destruct? 

> >> > 	Nobody told me what to do here. And when I'm told what to do I usually
> >> > do
> >> > the opposite.
> >>
> >> Yeah?  Who would you love to disobey the most?  \0xDynamite told me
> >> they were in charge, I think.
> >
> > 	Oh yes, he's literally a jew theocrat. You can imagine how much I would
> > obey him.
> So you're speaking backwards-language?  You were told what to do, and
> you are following orders?

	I wasn't told what to do. And I added that in the hypothetical case that I were given orders, I'm pretty unlikely to follow them. 

> >> >> You also quoted that slavery is only legal in the united states as
> >> >> punishment for a crime the victim has been duly convicted of.
> >> >
> >> > 	so slavery IS STILL LEGAL. What part you don't get?
> >>
> >> It sounds like you are really interested in helping close the last
> >> loopholes?
> >
> > 	last loopholes? The 'loophole' is the existence of government itself.
> >
> > 	And no I'm not particulary interested in making govt laws look prettier.
> > The fact that the US govt makes slavery explicitly 'legal' is a good
> > reminder of what governments actually are.
> Totally.  Justice is run by human beings, not laws.  

	The 'legal' system is run by pseudo-human trash who write 'laws' and execute them. That's obviously not 'justice, and yes it is run by 'laws' and the assholes who write them.

> That justice can
> be a mob of people, a court of law, a mediation, it can be anything.
> But we need to take action and talk with people, to make it happen.
> Anyway, sorry you were enslaved to downplay my sharing of rescue
> information.  

	Funny you keep saying that. Do you mean you are enslaved to post govt propaganda here? Because that's what you keep doing. 

> > 	Government can put anybody they want in jail for any reason (that is, for
> > no reason at all). That's what government is all about.
> You mean organised crime!  It's organised crime that does that.

	Yes government is organised crime. That's pretty much a self-evident fact.

>  In the USA laws get in the way of government immediately imprisoning  people.

	meh, now you are just trolling. 

> > 	You think you're teaching me something with your false analogy? Churches
> > are a fucking criminal cancer.
> So is carbon monoxide and ozone!  It's obviously because they have
> oxygen in them!

	Churches are a cancer and your retorts are not relevant. If you care about human freedom you should be against jew-kristianity. 

> [insert lost story around coordinating with an organiser of a quaker
> meeting, 

	fuck the quakers. Puritan english theocrats. 

> > 	You can start with this : christianity is a form of totalitarianism derived
> > from jew savagery and totalitarianism.
> Although many people make that logical sloppiness, nobody really does
> it in this context.

	What logical sloppiness. Organized religion is  criminal fraud. European jew-kkkristianty is a derivative of jew anti-culture. Basic moral and historical facts. 

> My names is FakeAnarchistGimmeMoreBeerAndWeed
> FakeAnarchistLetsFuckingBlowUpTheFuckingWhiteHouse
> Anyway, if you want to fucking die in the street while fucking cops
> rip your fucking tent to shreds and fucking brutalise your fucking
> body, be my guest, 

	There's no need to get into a fight with cops, unless there's enough people to beat the cops to death slowly, like they deserve. 

> but shit do fucking smart people fucking sign up
> for fucking government aid and talk to a fucking therapist 

	smart people don't sign up for govt 'aid' either. You presented a false choice. 

> who doesn't
> fucking slur through a pile of fucking forties to say everything.
> I dunno, man.  Maybe you don't know how nice it is to be able to
> contact a freedom resource when what you've been through is beyond
> what anybody you talk to seems able to comprehend.  I asked my
> therapist if he could find somebody who had experience working with
> torture victims.  He said he'd try a little bit.
> I can't fend for myself anymore.  I've always given to others.  When
> I'm on the streets, people can tell that I had a middle-class
> experience.  But now I need to take to myself to survive.  I'm a
> software developer.  It's like all I know how to do well.  It would be
> really powerful if I could do anything useful with it, but I'm
> brainwashed not to.  Hmm.

	How are you brainwashed exactly? And what can a single software developer do anyway. I mean, there's already software out there and the problem is that people mostly don't use it. Just look at monero for instance. Very underused. 

> I'm so confused.
> Are you asking me to join street communities instead of calling the
> human trafficking hotline?  Why are you speaking in riddles when you
> do this?

	If anything I'm asking you to not spread govt propaganda. If you want to call teh 'govt hotline', go ahead. But why post about it here. 

> I like doing that.  I love being outdoors.

	joining a street community sounds goood

> Okay here's why I'm weird:  I want to talk to someone who understands,
> and the streets are full of people who understand.  I don't have to
> hop through 200 therapists to find this.

	That sounds sensible.

> > 	If you call the governmetn's 'human trafficking' 'hotline' you'll increase
> > modern day  slavery by playing into the governmetn's hands.
> Well, due to phone surveillance and culture organisation, yes, 

	that's one of the various ways yes.

> but
> you'll also expend their resources monitoring you and influencing the
> people working there, 

	the more you spend 'their' resources, the more they will grow. It's a demand/supply thing. You don't sabotage the government by playing their game. 

> and you they'll have to listen to some of the story and could turn into rebels.

	Maybe that could happen to a few 'therapists' but the chances are pretty low.

> Anyway, so, you work for a government? 


> Since you're clearly doing a  job here and keep blaming the government for slavery.

	How does that follow, exactly? I'm presenting the anti government case, and your conclusion is that I work for some government? 

> >
> > 	The details are everywhere. Did you hear about the fake 'covid' 'pandemic'
> > and the fact that that half the world has been/is under house arrest? What's
> > your take on all that?
> Hey this long answer was where my email closed!
> So, as far as I know, it's the response that's fake.  Covid is real,
> the response is fake.  So that's just 1 layer of unclear communication
> with you there.  Usually many more it seems.

	'covid' is just the ordinary flu. That's the only sense in which it's real. 

> It seems to be a way to gain better control of the world as technology
> and communicatoin resulting from grassroots activism develop, dunno.

	yes, the only purpose of the flu farce is to expand the power of govcorp.

	Point being, while we're talking about the virtues of the govt 'hotline' and how 'helpful' govt 'laws' are, the govt criminals keep radically expanding their power. 

> Kinda looks like it also helps people stimulating disruption, what
> with the public masks hiding faces and all.
> Oh, it reduces the need for surveillance infrastructure, since
> everybody is indoors and online.  

	The surveillance infrastructure is being expanded. See bell's posts calling for/ praising  'thermal cameras' and more retardphone surveillance. 

> This probably helps defuse the
> ongoing cold war.  The nice thing about that is that people with
> urgent importance can of course leave their home to do things, but
> most people won't which probably satisfies a lot of powerful people.
> Oh, and it supports internet businesses, showing development between
> big social / big tech / whatnot and international crime.

	yes, it shows that the US govt and amazon-joogle-microshit-etc are one and the same. 

> Maybe it's a mediation point between many possibly-secret
> international power groups who may be quite happy to take down
> government if protected in doing so.  What was left out for your
> values?

	The 'international' power group is the US govt. The US govt is not going to take down the US govt. 

> My request for a show was serious.  Most shows I find are kinda
> stupid, assuming there is no corruption or that it isn't deeply
> intertwined with everything.

	Pretty much.

> >> >> Regarding anarchism, this is faulty logic.  You have more power if you
> >> >> steal money from your government.
> >> >
> >> > 	1) the govt doesn't  'own' any money. All they have, they stole it.
> >> > When
> >> > you take govt money you just become an accomplice of government theft.
> >> > The
> >> > exact opposite of what any actual anarchist would do.
> >>
> >> The government makes the money.  But yeah it's all stolen from their
> >> people.
> >
> > 	right, the govt prints the pseudo money, but the actual resources are
> > stolen from all the holders of money. In the case of US dollars, the US govt
> > is STEALING from people ALL OVER THE WORLD.
> obviously, why are you saying this
> i suppose because you don't know what to say, and don't want to talk
> about slavery.

	lawl - I mentioned that because you could have argued that by spending govt money you're getting back what you pay in taxes. HOWEVER, in the case of the US, a good deal of the loot doesn't even come from US taxpayers. So when you spend 'govt money' you're being subsidized by people all over the world. And it seem pretty relevant given all your pro US govt comments. 

> >> > 	2) the govt only gives money to their accomplices and other useful
> >> > idiots
> >> > who are not a threat, at all, to government.
> >>
> >> Whistleblowers.
> >
> > 	whistleblowers are not paid for what they do. They are persecuted by the
> > govt.
> they were paid before they blew their whistle.

	right. They were paid when they were criminal accomplices of the govt, and are persecuterd when they stop being accomplices of the govt. 

> >> Social aid.
> >
> > 	propaganda, vote buying, crums to keep the masses from revolting, etc.
> > 'social aid' is obviously bad, unless you're a social democrat who is
> > selling statism.
> i've got an idea
> let's find all those homeless bums living off social aid because they
> were enslaved by a street-representative of their local law
> enforcement and some pharmaceuticals, steal all their money, and
> invest it in cryptocurrency right before a bubble, then we can use the
> money to make a brainwashing camp where we train the homeless to hate
> the government more.  whaddaya think?

	I think government should be abolished. 

> >> Also, hackers who have been influenced
> >> to work for them, of which many are likely on this list, honestly
> >> believing themselves to be anarchists.
> >
> > 	if you're talking about 'hackers' working for the govt, those worthless
> > scumbags need killing. They belong in the "sellout" category and in the
> > "enabler-of-child-murder" category.
> did you get that phrasing from pr?  i didn't know we were killing
> people.  is the service available to people looking for suicide after
> being forced to do something they hate for years?

	who is 'we'? Are you a 'hacker' working for the government? 

> >> You can get paid a ton as a  hacker.
> >
> > 	yeah the more corrupt you are, the bigger your govcorp paycheck is.
> we were trained since we were kids that money was the only way to
> survive, i mean give us a little break here.  how do you survive
> without money?


> > 	So, hopefully you see that taking money from the govt is bad in many
> > different ways.
> none of them seemed convincing to me. 

	go figure. You also think US government laws are 'helpful'. 

> >
> > 	we need some critical mass of people who know what they are talking about.
> we need some critical mass of people who know what they are talking about.
> - how do we know whether they know what they are talking about?
> - note: people who know about everything and talk about it get
> seriously harmed.  so we would probably have people who know about
> different things, that they are talking about.
> any further thoughts?

	not really. You can have the last word if you want ^-^

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