'Peking' vs 'Beijing'

[Tyler Durden]

I wrote...

"For the knowledgeable, it might be argued that the pronunciation 'Peking' 
has Manchurian roots, because the Mings were Manchus."

Oops. Meant to write "Qings". The Yuan were Mongol, the Ming Han Chinese, 
and the Qing Manchu.

-TD






>From: "Tyler Durden" <camera_lumina at hotmail.com>
>To: frantz at pwpconsult.com, cypherpunks at minder.net
>Subject: Re: 'Peking' vs 'Beijing'
>Date: Wed, 09 Apr 2003 14:50:05 -0400
>
>Bill Frantz wrote...
>
>"the third Ming emperor, however, restored it as the Imperial
>seat of the dynasty and gave it a new name, Peking (Northern Capital)."
>
>Well, this simplifies things, as it should for an Encyclopedia entry, but 
>it doesn't explain the "Peking" 'transliteration'. As I said before, there 
>is no sound "king" in Mandarin. And indeed, "jing" means capital in 
>Mandarin. So what this paragraph refers to as "Peking" was always 
>pronounced by Chinese as "Beijing" to each other. The British, however, 
>introduced the pronunciation "Peking" for some reason. (I may have the 
>history in one of my books which I'll peruse tonight.)
>
>(For the knowledgeable, it might be argued that the pronunciation 'Peking' 
>has Manchurian roots, because the Mings were Manchus. But this is not the 
>case. For one, by the 20th century, the Beijing Court had completely 
>forgotton how to speak Manchu (only a few dozen people still speak it 
>today). For two, Manchu is not a Chinese dialect, but derived by one of the 
>trans-siberian groups. So it would not share the "Bei" sound indicating 
>"northern".)
>
>-TD
>
>
>
>
>>From: Bill Frantz <frantz at pwpconsult.com>
>>To: cypherpunks at lne.com
>>Subject: Re:  'Peking' vs 'Beijing'
>>Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 10:46:59 -0700
>>
>>From the Encyclopaedia Britannica (1974 edition):
>>
>>"More than 2,000 years ago, a site near present-day Peking was already an
>>important military and trading centre for the northeastern frontier of
>>China.  Not until the Mongol dynasty (AD 1279 to 1368) was a successor 
>>city
>>-- called Ta-tu -- to become the administrative capital of China.  During
>>the reign of the first emperor of the Ming dynasty (1368 to 1644), Nanking
>>became the capital, and the old Mongol capital was renamed Pei-p'ing 
>>(Peace
>>in the North); the third Ming emperor, however, restored it as the 
>>Imperial
>>seat of the dynasty and gave it a new name, Peking (Northern Capital).  It
>>remained the capital until the 20th century, when, after the successful
>>campaign of the Chinese Nationalist troops against warlords in Peking in
>>1927, Nanking was selected as the national capital, and Peking once again
>>resumed its old name -- Pei-p'ing -- a name still used b the Nationalist
>>government in Taiwan."
>>
>>Cheers - Bill
>>
>>
>>-------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>Bill Frantz           | Due process for all    | Periwinkle -- Consulting
>>(408)356-8506         | used to be the         | 16345 Englewood Ave.
>>frantz at pwpconsult.com | American way.          | Los Gatos, CA 95032, USA
>
>
>_________________________________________________________________
>The new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 2 months FREE*  
>http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail


_________________________________________________________________
Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8. 
http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail