For ZH.... The religion of hate in one image and a few words
Hi Zeenan... You never DID get back to me about where you got that perverse interpolation of some salafist screed about the rules of Goat-Fucking, sweetheart. Here are some references. The basic tenets of the religion of hate analyzed... https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CoEZh2JWcAAgj7E.jpg:large Also see: Open Letter to al-Bagdadi and ISIS by Muslim scholars from around the world. http://auntieimperial.tumblr.com/search/islam/page/2 1. It is forbidden in Islam to issue fatwas without all the necessary learning requirements. Even then fatwas must follow Islamic legal theory as defined in the Classical texts. It is also forbidden to cite a portion of a verse from the Qur’an—or part of a verse—to derive a ruling without looking at everything that the Qur’an and Hadith teach related to that matter. In other words, there are strict subjective and objective prerequisites for fatwas , and one cannot ‘cherry-pick’ Qur’anic verses for legal arguments without considering the entire Qur’an and Hadith . 2. It is forbidden in Islam to issue legal rulings about anything without mastery of the Arabic language. 3. It is forbidden in Islam to oversimplify Shari’ah matters and ignore established Islamic sciences. 4. It is permissible in Islam [for scholars] to differ on any matter, except those fundamentals of religion that all Muslims must know. 5. It is forbidden in Islam to ignore the reality of contemporary times when deriving legal rulings. 6. It is forbidden in Islam to kill the innocent. 7. It is forbidden in Islam to kill emissaries, ambassadors, and diplomats; hence it is forbidden to kill journalists and aid workers. 8. Jihad in Islam is defensive war. It is not permissible without the right cause, the right purpose and without the right rules of conduct. 9. It is forbidden in Islam to declare people non-Muslim unless he (or she) openly declares disbelief. 10. It is forbidden in Islam to harm or mistreat—in any way—Christians or any ‘People of the Scripture’. 11. It is obligatory to consider Yazidis as People of the Scripture. 12. The re-introduction of slavery is forbidden in Islam. It was abolished by universal consensus. 13. It is forbidden in Islam to force people to convert. 14. It is forbidden in Islam to deny women their rights. 15. It is forbidden in Islam to deny children their rights. 16. It is forbidden in Islam to enact legal punishments (hudud ) without following the correct procedures that ensure justice and mercy. 17. It is forbidden in Islam to torture people. 18 It is forbidden in Islam to disfigure the dead. 19. It is forbidden in Islam to attribute evil acts to God. 20. It is forbidden in Islam to destroy the graves and shrines of Prophets and Companions. 21.Armed insurrection is forbidden in Islam for any reason other than clear disbelief by the ruler and not allowing people to pray. 22. It is forbidden in Islam to declare a caliphate without consensus from all Muslims. 23. Loyalty to one’s nation is permissible in Islam. 24. After the death of the Prophet, Islam does not require anyone to emigrate anywhere. —
2016-07-23 21:39 GMT+03:00 Rayzer <rayzer@riseup.net>:
Hi Zeenan...
You never DID get back to me about where you got that perverse interpolation of some salafist screed about the rules of Goat-Fucking, sweetheart.
Here are some references.
The basic tenets of the religion of hate analyzed...
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CoEZh2JWcAAgj7E.jpg:large
Also see: Open Letter to al-Bagdadi and ISIS by Muslim scholars from around the world.
http://auntieimperial.tumblr.com/search/islam/page/2
1. It is forbidden in Islam to issue fatwas without all the necessary learning requirements. Even then fatwas must follow Islamic legal theory as defined in the Classical texts. It is also forbidden to cite a portion of a verse from the Qur’an—or part of a verse—to derive a ruling without looking at everything that the Qur’an and Hadith teach related to that matter.
In other words, there are strict subjective and objective prerequisites for fatwas , and one cannot ‘cherry-pick’ Qur’anic verses for legal arguments without considering the entire Qur’an and Hadith .
2. It is forbidden in Islam to issue legal rulings about anything without mastery of the Arabic language.
3. It is forbidden in Islam to oversimplify Shari’ah matters and ignore established Islamic sciences.
4. It is permissible in Islam [for scholars] to differ on any matter, except those fundamentals of religion that all Muslims must know.
5. It is forbidden in Islam to ignore the reality of contemporary times when deriving legal rulings.
6. It is forbidden in Islam to kill the innocent.
7. It is forbidden in Islam to kill emissaries, ambassadors, and diplomats; hence it is forbidden to kill journalists and aid workers.
8. Jihad in Islam is defensive war. It is not permissible without the right cause, the right purpose and without the right rules of conduct.
9. It is forbidden in Islam to declare people non-Muslim unless he (or she) openly declares disbelief.
10. It is forbidden in Islam to harm or mistreat—in any way—Christians or any ‘People of the Scripture’.
11. It is obligatory to consider Yazidis as People of the Scripture.
12. The re-introduction of slavery is forbidden in Islam. It was abolished by universal consensus.
13. It is forbidden in Islam to force people to convert.
14. It is forbidden in Islam to deny women their rights.
15. It is forbidden in Islam to deny children their rights.
16. It is forbidden in Islam to enact legal punishments (hudud ) without following the correct procedures that ensure justice and mercy.
17. It is forbidden in Islam to torture people.
18 It is forbidden in Islam to disfigure the dead.
19. It is forbidden in Islam to attribute evil acts to God.
20. It is forbidden in Islam to destroy the graves and shrines of Prophets and Companions.
21.Armed insurrection is forbidden in Islam for any reason other than clear disbelief by the ruler and not allowing people to pray.
22. It is forbidden in Islam to declare a caliphate without consensus from all Muslims.
23. Loyalty to one’s nation is permissible in Islam.
24. After the death of the Prophet, Islam does not require anyone to emigrate anywhere.
—
Thank you, Rayzer! It's extremely important to purify the True Islamic Religion/Quran from all the garbage the western fuckers/crazy extremists have put on it.
On 07/23/2016 10:05 PM, Mirimir wrote:
On 07/23/2016 10:35 PM, Александр wrote:
<SNIP>
Thank you, Rayzer! It's extremely important to purify the True Islamic Religion/Quran from all the garbage the western fuckers/crazy extremists have put on it. Except for the religious bullshit, it's not far off anarchocapitalism.
Like Christianity... It doesn't HAVE TO be capitalist but note point 5. "It is forbidden in Islam to ignore the reality of contemporary times..." Contemporary times is Crapitalist times, and organized religions, for better or worse, will go with that flow. As little as I like organized religions they ARE a vehicle for moving masses of people in a given direction. Too bad psychopaths take over just as surely as they take over corporations and any other organizational structure. Rr
On 07/23/2016 11:20 PM, Rayzer wrote:
On 07/23/2016 10:05 PM, Mirimir wrote:
On 07/23/2016 10:35 PM, Александр wrote:
<SNIP>
Thank you, Rayzer! It's extremely important to purify the True Islamic Religion/Quran from all the garbage the western fuckers/crazy extremists have put on it. Except for the religious bullshit, it's not far off anarchocapitalism.
Like Christianity... It doesn't HAVE TO be capitalist but note point 5. "It is forbidden in Islam to ignore the reality of contemporary times..." Contemporary times is Crapitalist times, and organized religions, for better or worse, will go with that flow.
I think that there's market-based stuff in Islam that predates Western capitalism. There's also a lot that anticipates socialism. Building on Christianity. I sometimes wonder where we'd be if Islam had gone global before Christianity did.
As little as I like organized religions they ARE a vehicle for moving masses of people in a given direction. Too bad psychopaths take over just as surely as they take over corporations and any other organizational structure.
Yes, too bad :(
How's the situation in Turkey? On Jul 24, 2016 2:01 PM, "Bastiani Fortress" <bastianifortress@yandex.com> wrote:
Islam forbids interest (interest as an economy term), and a bank in turkey has been taking interest in such a complicated way (i don't know how, exactly) that it claims they do not take interest and is halal to attract fundematalist clients :D Islam in many ways does resemble socialism, but it's still total bullshit in many other ways. (i say this as an atheist, living in turkey btw)
24.07.2016, 11:38, "Mirimir" <mirimir@riseup.net>:
On 07/23/2016 11:20 PM, Rayzer wrote:
On 07/23/2016 10:05 PM, Mirimir wrote:
On 07/23/2016 10:35 PM, Александр wrote:
<SNIP>
Thank you, Rayzer! It's extremely important to purify the True
Islamic Religion/Quran from all the garbage the western fuckers/crazy extremists have put on it.
Except for the religious bullshit, it's not far off anarchocapitalism.
Like Christianity... It doesn't HAVE TO be capitalist but note point 5. "It is forbidden in Islam to ignore the reality of contemporary times..." Contemporary times is Crapitalist times, and organized religions, for better or worse, will go with that flow.
I think that there's market-based stuff in Islam that predates Western capitalism. There's also a lot that anticipates socialism. Building on Christianity. I sometimes wonder where we'd be if Islam had gone global before Christianity did.
As little as I like organized religions they ARE a vehicle for
moving masses of people in a given direction. Too bad psychopaths take over just as surely as they take over corporations and any other organizational structure.
Yes, too bad :(
-- You’re not from the Castle, you’re not from the village, you are nothing. Unfortunately, though, you are something, a stranger.
On Jul 24, 2016 7:01 PM, "Bastiani Fortress" <bastianifortress@yandex.com> wrote:
We even fear to make jokes in whatsapp, rumor has it that policemen ask
to see your phone too when they do a routine check at the city center. Please, consider using Signal or Telegram instead whatsapp. I will test Wire this week for fun. They are not totally secure apps, but certainly are a bit better than whatsapp. I am a fan of Durov brothers' work, but I am still waiting for an answer about this security fail for curiosity: https://twitter.com/telegram_macos/status/756989757801005057?p=v I don't know about migration to Europe as you asked in another thread, but if the things become worst in Ankara, maybe could you consider to know Brazil in person? I am not interesting, but my neighbour is the always charming Juan! :P I always say things like "Thank God I am Atheist!", but I sincerely try to respect people's faith and, even considering God's existence very uncertain, I always ask to God protect my loved ones. It isn't a logical thing, but I feel more comfortable because I know I can't protect my family and my friends in all the moments. Hope God, if exists, can love and feel compassion for every single person in this crazy world. I have Muslim friends and I was very frustrated yesterday because I've found a Brazilian Telegram group saying awful, disgusting things about the Islamism. All the religions are about love. There are crazy radical people in all the religions and being a Christian doesn't mean anything. It was very disgusting seeing so many people using Jesus and the Bible as excuses to offend and to attack other persons, aff... :(( Take care, my dear! Warm straight hugs and my best wishes of inner peace and hope! Be strong! :* Ceci
On 07/24/2016 10:53 AM, Bastiani Fortress wrote:
Islam forbids interest (interest as an economy term), and a bank in turkey has been taking interest in such a complicated way (i don't know how, exactly) that it claims they do not take interest and is halal to attract fundematalist clients :D Islam in many ways does resemble socialism, but it's still total bullshit in many other ways. (i say this as an atheist, living in turkey btw)
My understanding is the Islamic banks have a 'workaround'. Instead of charging interest you simply owe the loan amount plus whatever the interest is. If you borrow $100 and the interest is 5% you've borrowed $105 dollars. Except for the more extreme fundamentalists, it's been accepted that way for a long time. No one said "point 5" was gonna be easy... Ps. As I was reading Gadaffi's 'Little Green Book' online a while back I noted his ideas had a lot in common with Anarcho-Syndicalism. Rr
24.07.2016, 11:38, "Mirimir" <mirimir@riseup.net>:
On 07/23/2016 11:20 PM, Rayzer wrote:
On 07/23/2016 10:05 PM, Mirimir wrote:
On 07/23/2016 10:35 PM, Александр wrote:
<SNIP>
Thank you, Rayzer! It's extremely important to purify the True Islamic Religion/Quran from all the garbage the western fuckers/crazy extremists have put on it.
Except for the religious bullshit, it's not far off anarchocapitalism.
Like Christianity... It doesn't HAVE TO be capitalist but note point 5. "It is forbidden in Islam to ignore the reality of contemporary times..." Contemporary times is Crapitalist times, and organized religions, for better or worse, will go with that flow.
I think that there's market-based stuff in Islam that predates Western capitalism. There's also a lot that anticipates socialism. Building on Christianity. I sometimes wonder where we'd be if Islam had gone global before Christianity did.
As little as I like organized religions they ARE a vehicle for moving masses of people in a given direction. Too bad psychopaths take over just as surely as they take over corporations and any other organizational structure.
Yes, too bad :(
-- /You’re not from the Castle, you’re not from the village, you are nothing. Unfortunately, though, you are something, a stranger./
oh come on :) 24.07.2016, 21:10, "juan" <juan.g71@gmail.com>:
On Sun, 24 Jul 2016 19:53:38 +0200 Bastiani Fortress <bastianifortress@yandex.com> wrote:
Islam in many ways does resemble socialism, but it's still total bullshit in many other ways.
As if socialism wasn't total bullshit, ha ha ha.
-- You’re not from the Castle, you’re not from the village, you are nothing. Unfortunately, though, you are something, a stranger.
On Sun, 24 Jul 2016 23:59:32 +0200 Bastiani Fortress <bastianifortress@yandex.com> wrote:
oh come on :)
--- You’re not from the Castle, you’re not from the village, you are nothing. Unfortunately, though, you are something, a stranger.
I was about to ask if that was a turkish saying, but after searching, I see it's a quote from kafka. Unsurprisingly, the meaning isn't too clear =P But yeah, I am a stranger, and also a 'citizen of the world'?
On Mon, 25 Jul 2016 06:45:16 +0200 Bastiani Fortress <bastianifortress@yandex.com> wrote:
That wasn't intended for you, it's just my signature btw :D
Ahaha! Now I look pretty retarded =) - Or some would say, I've revealed my true self...
The castle of kafka and the tartar steppe of buzzati (bastiani fortress is a reference to the tartar steppe) are among my favorite novels.
I didn't know buzzati - italian - looks interesting. I might try to read something.
Tendency in this group is towards anarchism, rather than socialism i guess?
Well, that's the case as far as I'm concerned. Socialism may be OK as long it's practised between consenting persons - but it's not my cup of tea... As to the group's party line...there probably are different opinions =P, although I'd expect a sizable amount of cpunks to be free-market anarchists... J.
On 07/24/2016 02:14 AM, Mirimir wrote:
I sometimes wonder where we'd be if Islam had gone global before Christianity did.
The Persian civilization spawned three major religions: Zoroastrianism, Manichaeism (which heavily influenced Saint Augustine before he turned to Christianity), and the Bahá'í Faith. They even contributed greatly to Islam. Another religion that arose from ancient Iran is Mazdakism, which has been dubbed the first communistic ideology. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persian_people#Religion https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mazdak
On 07/23/2016 11:20 PM, Rayzer wrote:
On 07/23/2016 10:05 PM, Mirimir wrote:
On 07/23/2016 10:35 PM, Александр wrote:
<SNIP>
Thank you, Rayzer! It's extremely important to purify the True Islamic Religion/Quran from all the garbage the western fuckers/crazy extremists have put on it. Except for the religious bullshit, it's not far off anarchocapitalism.
Like Christianity... It doesn't HAVE TO be capitalist but note point 5. "It is forbidden in Islam to ignore the reality of contemporary times..." Contemporary times is Crapitalist times, and organized religions, for better or worse, will go with that flow.
I think that there's market-based stuff in Islam that predates Western capitalism. There's also a lot that anticipates socialism. Building on Christianity. I sometimes wonder where we'd be if Islam had gone global before Christianity did.
As little as I like organized religions they ARE a vehicle for moving masses of people in a given direction. Too bad psychopaths take over just as surely as they take over corporations and any other organizational structure. Yes, too bad :(
France, possibly, begins to wake up on this one: France opens up its eyes to Salafism, rethinks counterterrorism https://www.rt.com/op-edge/352975-salafism-france-terror-muslims/ " Could it be that France has just blown the whistle on Salafism, and finally anchored its counter-terrorism narrative against not Islam, but the devolution which has worked to hijack its Scriptures and redact its principles? "
A needed addition to this thread: Europeans: the Most Brutal Mass Murderers of All Time? “It is true that the “new Europe” has largely kept itself in check over the past few decades choosing peace and prosperity over war. But is that about to change? Is “Western Christian” Europe backsliding and reverting to her old ways?” http://russia-insider.com/en/history/europeans-most-brutal-mass-murderers-al...
2016-07-26 11:26 GMT+03:00 Zenaan Harkness <zen@freedbms.net>:
Is “Western Christian” Europe backsliding and reverting to her old ways?
backsliding?! Oh, you are an optimist, Zen! They never "slided" away from the bloody path of parasitizing/killing others in the benefit of themselves. In Europe and the US - there are no old days or new days - there are eternal "PRESENT DAYS" of oppression and mass murders over the weaker countries.
On Sun, Jul 24, 2016 at 03:14:39AM -0600, Mirimir wrote:
I think that there's market-based stuff in Islam that predates Western capitalism. There's also a lot that anticipates socialism. Building on Christianity. I sometimes wonder where we'd be if Islam had gone global before Christianity did.
You should check out the When Gravity Falls trilogy by George Effinger, classic cyberpunk written in the late 80s... Very reminescent of Gibson's sprawl stuff, except the central conceit is that Western society has collapsed and the Islamic countries have come to dominance. Its been a while since I've read them, and obviously they are just as dated as Neuromancer, but I think the books hold up pretty well... (Neuromancer still holds up quite well, IMO).. John
On 07/25/2016 06:45 AM, John Newman wrote:
On Mon, Jul 25, 2016 at 08:42:44AM -0400, John Newman wrote:
You should check out the When Gravity Falls trilogy by George Effinger, classic cyberpunk written in the late 80s...
Correction: book is called "When Gravity Fails"
Thanks, I will :)
On Sat, 23 Jul 2016 23:05:03 -0600 Mirimir <mirimir@riseup.net> wrote:
On 07/23/2016 10:35 PM, Александр wrote:
<SNIP>
Thank you, Rayzer! It's extremely important to purify the True Islamic Religion/Quran from all the garbage the western fuckers/crazy extremists have put on it.
Except for the religious bullshit, it's not far off anarchocapitalism.
If you take the religious bullshit out of sick jokes like kkkristianity, jewism and islam, what's left, exactly? I daresay, nothing. As to 'anarchocapitalism' having anything to do with islam or similar criminal organizations, well that doesn't speak too well of 'anarchocapitalism' does it.
participants (9)
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Bastiani Fortress -
Cecilia Tanaka -
John Newman -
juan -
Mirimir -
Rayzer -
swalow swalow -
Zenaan Harkness -
Александр