Questions about Other Crypto Discussion Forums
I noticed some topical overlap between the cypherpunks mailing list and the cryptography mailing list at https://www.metzdowd.com/. Is there any relationship between these two lists or the people who administer them? Are there other lists or forums on related subjects that could be recommended for me to peruse? Search engines any more seem to spit out endless pages of irrelevant claptrap, spammy blogs, and endless Stack Exchange errata. So I defer to word of mouth from the haunt of the true, original cyber rebels. In short, Number Five needs input. Nikopol ------------------------------------------------- S P I R I T O F N I K O P O L Don't swap synthetic brains for your real brains. broadcast on BitMessage (https://bitmessage.org) subscribe: BM-NBEz3C1WktcyMZwVRWgDNGpU5gMRZ2iT
On Sat, 14 Dec 2019 17:32:44 -0000 "Spirit of Nikopol" <nikopol@danwin1210.me> wrote:
I noticed some topical overlap between the cypherpunks mailing list and the cryptography mailing list at https://www.metzdowd.com/.
Is there any relationship between these two lists or the people who administer them?
the so called cryptography mailing list is owned by his lordship-ruler jakobo metzger. Metzger used to be a member of the original cpunks lists, and used to be an 'employee'/accomplice of lehman brothers. Imagine that. A self proclaimed 'libertarian' working for the supreme heroes of free capitalism! so anyway, metzger's list is owned by his lordship metzer, and so are list members. It logically follows then that list members can only say what his lordship jakobo metzger allows them to say. you can draw your own conclusions about the relationship between jakobo metzer and cryptoanarchy.
On Sat, Dec 14, 2019 at 05:53:12PM -0300, Punk-Stasi 2.0 wrote:
On Sat, 14 Dec 2019 17:32:44 -0000 "Spirit of Nikopol" <nikopol@danwin1210.me> wrote:
I noticed some topical overlap between the cypherpunks mailing list and the cryptography mailing list at https://www.metzdowd.com/.
Is there any relationship between these two lists or the people who administer them?
the so called cryptography mailing list is owned by his lordship-ruler jakobo metzger. Metzger used to be a member of the original cpunks lists, and used to be an 'employee'/accomplice of lehman brothers. Imagine that. A self proclaimed 'libertarian' working for the supreme heroes of free capitalism!
so anyway, metzger's list is owned by his lordship metzer, and so are list members. It logically follows then that list members can only say what his lordship jakobo metzger allows them to say.
you can draw your own conclusions about the relationship between jakobo metzer and cryptoanarchy.
Metzdowd is censored, rigorously, "to ensure civil, and "on topic" discussions only". That which strays over their particular preferred lines is studiously evicted. Intolerable for many who strangely seem to gather here for uncensored discussions instead - who woulda thought?
On Sat, Dec 14, 2019 at 05:32:44PM -0000, Spirit of Nikopol wrote:
I noticed some topical overlap between the cypherpunks mailing list and the cryptography mailing list at https://www.metzdowd.com/.
Is there any relationship between these two lists or the people who administer them?
Are there other lists or forums on related subjects that could be recommended for me to peruse? Search engines any more seem to spit out endless pages of irrelevant claptrap, spammy blogs, and endless Stack Exchange errata. So I defer to word of mouth from the haunt of the true, original cyber rebels.
In short, Number Five needs input.
Nikopol
By the way, straight back atcha, pls sir, may I have your recommended link to "Nikopol"? As to crypto forums, many think some new tech funk will save the world. At best, a better hammer may help those who act in ways which may, possibly, uplift humans in one way or another. We ivory tower to our detriment, to avoid the confront of life, interactions with other humans, or what might be called "reality". Meat space ever remains. Real humans, their thoughts, their hopes, their intentions and their actions, are the grist of life, the only place real change can occur. "Except that you earn your father's inheritance anew, you shall not be able to keep it."
On Sat, December 14, 2019 11:25 pm, Zenaan Harkness wrote:
By the way, straight back atcha, pls sir, may I have your recommended link to "Nikopol"?
Immortal (2004) - Linda Hardy, Thomas Kretschmann, Charlotte Rampling https://youtu.be/yzHJf-am0QY ------------------------------------------------- S P I R I T O F N I K O P O L Don't swap synthetic brains for your real brains. broadcast on BitMessage (https://bitmessage.org) subscribe: BM-NBEz3C1WktcyMZwVRWgDNGpU5gMRZ2iT
On 12/15/19, Spirit of Nikopol <nikopol@danwin1210.me> wrote:
Immortal (2004) - Linda Hardy, Thomas Kretschmann, Charlotte Rampling
infohash:A968E616F7E30B01405264795E9E87E16104E8B7 infohash:3793793F47554246A066F5D1D998E3FBC4445CB5 backup infohash:F07012C4C59906BCB8AD91AA9449DB197453E820
Zero censorship @ ██████████████████████████████████████ █░░░░░░░░░░░░░░█░░░░░░░░███░░░░░░░░███ █░░▄▀▄▀▄▀▄▀▄▀░░█░░▄▀▄▀░░███░░▄▀▄▀░░███ [chan] 711 █░░░░░░░░░░▄▀░░█░░░░▄▀░░███░░░░▄▀░░███ spooky mart █████████░░▄▀░░███░░▄▀░░█████░░▄▀░░███ always open █████████░░▄▀░░███░░▄▀░░█████░░▄▀░░███ █████████░░▄▀░░███░░▄▀░░█████░░▄▀░░███ https://bitmessage.org █████████░░▄▀░░███░░▄▀░░█████░░▄▀░░███ █████████░░▄▀░░███░░▄▀░░█████░░▄▀░░███ █████████░░▄▀░░█░░░░▄▀░░░░█░░░░▄▀░░░░█ █████████░░▄▀░░█░░▄▀▄▀▄▀░░█░░▄▀▄▀▄▀░░█ █████████░░░░░░█░░░░░░░░░░█░░░░░░░░░░█ ██████████████████████████████████████
Until it doesn't, anymore.
Meat space ever remains.
Real humans, their thoughts, their hopes, their intentions and their actions, are the grist of life, the only place real change can occur. "Except that you earn your father's inheritance anew, you shall not be able to keep it." On Sat, Dec 14, 2019, 11:39 PM Zenaan Harkness <zen@freedbms.net> wrote:
On Sat, Dec 14, 2019 at 05:32:44PM -0000, Spirit of Nikopol wrote:
I noticed some topical overlap between the cypherpunks mailing list and the cryptography mailing list at https://www.metzdowd.com/.
Is there any relationship between these two lists or the people who administer them?
Are there other lists or forums on related subjects that could be recommended for me to peruse? Search engines any more seem to spit out endless pages of irrelevant claptrap, spammy blogs, and endless Stack Exchange errata. So I defer to word of mouth from the haunt of the true, original cyber rebels.
In short, Number Five needs input.
Nikopol
By the way, straight back atcha, pls sir, may I have your recommended link to "Nikopol"?
As to crypto forums, many think some new tech funk will save the world.
At best, a better hammer may help those who act in ways which may, possibly, uplift humans in one way or another.
We ivory tower to our detriment, to avoid the confront of life, interactions with other humans, or what might be called "reality".
Meat space ever remains.
Real humans, their thoughts, their hopes, their intentions and their actions, are the grist of life, the only place real change can occur.
"Except that you earn your father's inheritance anew, you shall not be able to keep it."
On 12/14/19 11:32, Spirit of Nikopol wrote:
I noticed some topical overlap between the cypherpunks mailing list and the cryptography mailing list at https://www.metzdowd.com/.
Is there any relationship between these two lists or the people who administer them? Not really. The cryptography list is more of a technical list and moderated (*NOT* censored, but moderated) for topic. Cypherpunks is unmoderated, with a nominal topic of cryptography and privacy-related interests, and this nominal topic is stretched quite thin on occasion, with such things as the race and nationality of certain government officials somehow being qualified as related to that topic... or maybe not.
I wouldn't even call the cypherpunks list an example of what cryptography would be if it were unmoderated, as it's something else entirely. I believe in the cypherpunk ethos, but not in a lot of this anti-Semitic, racist, ageist, misogynist, xenophobic, "label anything I don't like with 'NSA-'", anarchist all-laws-are-bad-fuck-the-pigs-and-burn-all-the-law-books, etc rubbish. And before anyone even asks me these questions: No, Tor is not perfect; it certainly beats nothing, but shouldn't be considered a complete countersurveillance solution in and of itself for many threat models. No, the laws in the US, as they exist now are not perfect, far from it (the imperfections start with the Electoral College and drug prohibition). Yes, governments have committed some first-class fuckups, this includes but is by no means limited to the US government (China and North Korea come to mind as well, but I'm sure there are others; show me a perfect government and I'll show you my $100 million oceanfront mansion in South Dakota). -- Shawn K. Quinn <skquinn@rushpost.com> http://www.rantroulette.com http://www.skqrecordquest.com
On 12/15/2019 12:11 AM, Shawn K. Quinn wrote: <snip>
No, Tor is not perfect; it certainly beats nothing, but shouldn't be considered a complete countersurveillance solution in and of itself for many threat models.
I used to think pretty much that. Now it seems all too possible that some malicious relays operate with the tacit approval of at least some Tor Project staff. Given the FOIA production that I've seen. So sure, "it certainly beats nothing". But it's proselytized in ways that foster a false sense of security. At this point, if you want low-latency connectivity, botnets are your safest bet. Or, for those who consider that immoral, nested VPN chains. You can go at least five deep, with iptables rules to prevent leaks. <snip>
On Sun, Dec 15, 2019 at 01:26:18AM -0700, Mirimir wrote:
At this point, if you want low-latency connectivity, botnets are your safest bet. Or, for those who consider that immoral, nested VPN chains. You can go at least five deep, with iptables rules to prevent leaks.
Tor is for most folks, at best, a plausible deniability network. If you want genuine traffic mixing you must do what torproject.org -used- to recommend, in days gone past (pre-Applebaum lynching days), that is, run an exit node, get a few friends up to speed and have them on-ramp through your exit node, and only every on-ramp through your exit node. These days, torproject steers everyone to Tor Browser (TBB), downloaded straight from the NSA's torproject.org or googleplay.com websites. It's a sad state of affairs and almost entirely misleading of end users. If you're going to "chuck a Manning", your main problem anyway is distancing yourself from the data you are releasing - anything "important" is going to have a limited subset of folks who have access to that data anyway (except in rare circumstances), and so you need to be prepared for that. Freedom has a price, and we need to be prepared to pay the price of freedom. Manning, despite being pardoned, is once again paying the price for the stand taken (releasing the helicopter gunship video etc, which was a great service to us all indeed). What I'm really trying to say here is that sometimes you gotta man up, do the right thing, and accept the consequences, and not cower in fear. If Tor or a botnet are sufficient, great. But if not, what is the right thing to do anyway? When more and more folks start doing the right thing, it gets easier and easier for the next guy to do the right thing. Good luck, God speed, and may you find that which your Soul seeks for you,
‐‐‐‐‐‐‐ Original Message ‐‐‐‐‐‐‐ On Sunday, December 15, 2019 12:24 PM, Zenaan Harkness <zen@freedbms.net> wrote:
If you want genuine traffic mixing
Sorry, does not exist. That was unfortunate and problematic wording.
Do not trust Tor, if you need privacy against the USA gov and its entities (MIC, NSA, CIA, etc).
I might be missing something here, provided you dont leak information in your message, isn't it Tor secure even if many exit nodes belong to NSA?
On Mon, 16 Dec 2019 14:43:15 +0000 "other.arkitech" <other.arkitech@protonmail.com> wrote:
I might be missing something here, provided you dont leak information in your message, isn't it Tor secure even if many exit nodes belong to NSA?
where, exactly, did you get that idea from? What's your evidence showing that the tor network is 'secure' - at all?
On Sun, Dec 15, 2019 at 01:11:51AM -0600, Shawn K. Quinn wrote:
prohibition). Yes, governments have committed some first-class fuckups, this includes but is by no means limited to the US government (China and North Korea come to mind as well, but I'm sure there are others; show me
Nope, USA, China and NK are the only govs that have stuffed up. The rest b federalizin into a ssshining cccity erected on the hill. Please less denigratin of upstandin demoncratic examples of virtuosity, or we might have to censor^Bmoderate you, I mean, your speech. NB4 "SKQ's a fascist censorship loving Americunt!" :D
On 12/14/19, Spirit of Nikopol <nikopol@danwin1210.me> wrote:
the cryptography mailing list at https://www.metzdowd.com/ cryptography@metzdowd.com Perry Metzger
That list is censored and message steered by a censor and his order following cronies. You will get censored for freely posting on topic per charter arguing countergrain or alternative viewpoint. When you call out the hypocritical censor in public, elsewhere since the censor will censor that too, the censor will permaban you without explanation or recourse, the censors sheeple being left none the wiser. To credit, they could probably offer a level of classical crypto Q&A and review if needed. Part of the remaining chatter is RNG circlejerk, various news, birthday parties, and typical corporate and government think.
A self proclaimed 'libertarian'
The actual utterance was "I'm a rabid libertarian myself", and with it, talk of cryptocurrencies appears to have become progressively chilled to zero thereafter... a curious action given the charter permits a broad range of talk on the subject.
cryptoanarchy
There is none above.
Is there any relationship between these two lists or the people who administer them?
Increasingly less after the forking.
Are there other lists or forums on related subjects that could be recommended for me to peruse?
The internets is an ocean of layers, seek the great gyre of garbage and ride it on down till you find one. Sublevel 33 Room 01 an old pitstop along the way, your mind the doorkey.
Search engines any more seem to spit out endless pages of irrelevant claptrap
Expected when seeded by clap, and run by trap.
So I defer to word of mouth
Many rabid foamed and dispensing cyanide.
haunt of the true, original cyber rebels.
Decrepit dusty ass crypt. Brighten it up a bit, bring flamethrower... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S1hpFaXerm8
participants (8)
-
grarpamp -
Mirimir -
other.arkitech -
Punk-Stasi 2.0 -
Shawn K. Quinn -
Spirit of Nikopol -
Steven Schear -
Zenaan Harkness