From: Dale Thorn If you could analogize the list to a human society, then you might understand that a pattern of decadence can set in here as it does in the more visible society, as is run from Washington DC, etc. It is my hope to make a contribution here (as in the more visible society) to fight off some of that decadence, even when I get beat up on for it. ................................................. There is a huge the difference between a society of people relating to each other based on principles of coercion vs an extemporaneous society of individuals who make their own decisions (daily) about when/where/how long they will associate with another. The society run by Washington,D.C. expects that people will have no choice but to fly in formation in the direction set by the leader who represents the majority (sort of). The virtual "society" of the cpunks is only based on their interest in opening up their mail and reading a few messages here & there according to their mood of the day or the moment. It is true that formal societies, like the one which was initially intended by The Founders (of the US), often run afoul of the original purpose for which it was begun. They decay for many reasons. This is precisely one of the elements in the background of the cpunks thinking ("the founders" and others) about societies and the "ties that bind" (supposedly) us to each other: the interest in being released from that supposition that we are bound to each other and are obligated to maintain a relationship of some kind (as determined by the PC moral 'authorities'). The concepts are too involved to discuss the details on this list, but the fact that individuals do not maintain a steady and predictable course throughout their lifetime, or the lifetime of the projects which they begin, is the very reason why your attempts at "fighting off the decadence" are doomed: the objects of your attention may not hang around on the list long enough to be reformed. Remember the purpose of the list is discussion & information, not moral rehabilitation (except as it clears the intellectual air regarding privacy & potential crimes to humanity). It could happen that some decadent subscriber would "see the light" and behave themselves, but if it does I expect it would be an indirect side-effect and the result of their own desire to change their style & manners. .. Blanc