Re: Cypherpunks vs. Coderpunks

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Tim May, an unelected spokesman of the Cypherpunk Ghetto (tm) wrote:
Apparently the Cyphepunks list is thus being left to those of us who either don't want to code, or have no skills at coding, or who think the sociopolitical issues are more interesting.
I think you're misinterpreting what's going on. Participants in the Coderpunks list are not generally abandoning Cypherpunks. Some people who have long been absent from the Cypherpunks list have joined it, but I've seen posts from most of the Cypherpunk participants of Coderpunks on Cypherpunks since it was formed. My concern is that the two lists will become more disjoint than they already are. I believe that the content of Cypherpunks is enhanced by having the programmers present, just as the coders benefit from the guidance of seeing the possibilities opened by their endeavors. The remailers network is the most obvious example of the benefits of this synergy. I'd hate to see us lose later rewards that could otherwise be reaped. I don't believe that it'll be sociopolitical content that'll chase the coders away: if the constant fighting over indisputable metaphysics doesn't do it, the fighting over who was killfiled by whom first and who's a total loon will. -- Todd - --- [This message has been signed by an auto-signing service. A valid signature means only that it has been received at the address corresponding to the signature and forwarded.] -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.2 Comment: Gratis auto-signing service iQBFAwUBMSAgvSoZzwIn1bdtAQE0CQF/Zk1TkLEnHKcBsi1IETtwqMP7y6oO6dmF R3bAM7bpP2Rg4HphYkxEAIyo6zztkDrr =jTwL -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

Leslie Todd Masco writes:
My concern is that the two lists will become more disjoint than they already are. I believe that the content of Cypherpunks is enhanced by having the programmers present, just as the coders benefit from the guidance of seeing the possibilities opened by their endeavors.
I agree and would like to amplify. I'm really sick of the folks who can post to libernet, com-priv, talk.politics.guns, etc, pissing on the parade. The thing that makes Cypherpunks worthwhile is that its a place where you could, once, get news updates about GAK, information on the latest research into cryptography, organize mass key crackings, discuss APIs, talk a bit about the politics of cryptography, etc. Now, we get anonymous posters putting up bits on corruption in the DEA, sections of Tsutomu Shimomura's sex life, and other garbage. I don't give a damn if you think "Perry's a whining asshole; no one appointed him God", the stuff I'm mentioning is almost totally irrelevant to the topic at hand. (I *still* see no relevance to the late great Kevin Mitnick discussion, and frankly, I don't give a damn if he's in jail.) I also really am not impressed enough with the justification for why Jim Bell's "ideas" need to be discussed here. For some people without jobs (I won't name names) there is no problem with this. However, some of us have trouble keeping up, and unfortunately Cypherpunks has content that is key to our work and interests. Sadly, there isn't another place with the momentum where people are a bit more polite and talk about the same information. Yet. Perry
participants (2)
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Leslie Todd Masco
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Perry E. Metzger