
Well, folks, after four or five years here, I'm finally leaving. I've picked this moment for two reasons. First, the signal to noise ratio here is now too low to be measured without expensive lab equipment -- as bad as Usenet, or even worse. Second, I now have two candidate sites to host a new cryptography & cryptography politics mailing list to replace this one. The new list will be run very tightly. Some people will doubtless label me a fascist and say I'm impinging on their ability to be "free". Those that feel that the best use of their freedom is to urinate into their own drinking water are entitled to their beliefs -- but they will not be welcome on the new list.* It is time to get back to cryptography. You all remember cryptography, don't you? Its the "cipher" in CYPHERpunk. Years ago, on cypherpunks, Phil Karn noted, after Stuart Baker of NSA named his nightmare vision of strong crypto embedded in every $20 phone and every fax machine, "Gentlemen, I believe we have our design specification." One cannot imagine that sort of thing being said here now. Four years ago, PGP 2.0 was released, and the first shot was sent across the bow of those that would stop us. It is more than time to fire off another round or two. Cypherpunks file lawsuits! Cypherpunks develop protocols! Cypherpunks write RFCs! Cypherpunks start companies! Cypherpunks WRITE CODE, damn it! Cypherpunks don't wait for the administration to move -- they move first! They move FASTER! Cypherpunks don't wait for someone else to deploy cryptography -- they deploy it themselves! Cypherpunks do not sit on their asses and pull their puds while discussing warmed over theories about personal freedom. Cypherpunks BUILD THE TOOLS TO IMPLEMENT THE THEORY! Cypherpunks don't fantasize, they create! In short, CYPHERPUNKS DO! They don't live for blather. Cypherpunks Mark I used to be a glorious place. Son of Cypherpunks may fail, but we must make the attempt to create it. In short, Cypherpunks is dead, Long live Cypherpunks! I will post pointers to the new list within ten days -- on or before October 20, 1996. Perry * Those that feel that peeing into their own drinking water is a good idea are directed to http://www.envirolink.org/orgs/coe/snuffit2/living_water.jpg and http://www.envirolink.org/orgs/coe/snuffit2/lifewater.html where you will find others who agree with you.

"Perry E. Metzger" <perry@piermont.com> writes:
Well, folks, after four or five years here, I'm finally leaving.
I'm very sorry to hear that. Another person who actually knows crypto and is willing to share his knowledge has been driven off this list by Timmy- generated noise and flame wars. What a shame.
I will post pointers to the new list within ten days -- on or before October 20, 1996.
I'm looking forward to it. Would you be interested in my "wire clippings"? --- Dr.Dimitri Vulis KOTM Brighton Beach Boardwalk BBS, Forest Hills, N.Y.: +1-718-261-2013, 14.4Kbps

Perry E. Metzger wrote:
Well, folks, after four or five years here, I'm finally leaving.
[pathetic whining snipped]
The new list will be run very tightly. Some people will doubtless label me a fascist and say I'm impinging on their ability to be "free". Those that feel that the best use of their freedom is to urinate into their own drinking water are entitled to their beliefs -- but they will not be welcome on the new list.*
[more whining snipped] Nothing in the real world is perfect, ideal, or even relatively close to either one. If you want to really solve your problems, it will not likely be in running away, but in getting some therapy (seriously). As far as Fascist goes, fascism is fun enough when everyone gets to participate, but I get the idea you feel "some of the pigs are more equal than others", if you know what I mean, and I think you do. I haven't been on the list more than 6-8 weeks, but in that time, it's been more interesting than I would have guessed for a non-technical forum, which isn't necessarily good, but this is the real world.

dthorn@gte.net wrote to All: d> Perry E. Metzger wrote:
Well, folks, after four or five years here, I'm finally leaving.
d> I haven't been on the list more than 6-8 weeks... You might be expected to defer to those of us who have been here for years and have seen the list go terribly downhill. d> ...but in that time, it's d> been more interesting than I would have guessed for a non-technical d> forum, which isn't necessarily good... It's especially not "nesessarily good" when the list was _supposed_ to be a technical forum concerning cryptography and privacy technology, along with the few posts concerning pending legislation and the social effects of such tech. Now, the average day's traffic is about two-thirds pure noise. What on earth is interesting about _that_?

dthorn@gte.net wrote to All: d> Perry E. Metzger wrote:
Well, folks, after four or five years here, I'm finally leaving. d> I haven't been on the list more than 6-8 weeks... You might be expected to defer to those of us who have been here for years and have seen the list go terribly downhill. d> ...but in that time, it's d> been more interesting than I would have guessed for a non-technical d> forum, which isn't necessarily good... It's especially not "nesessarily good" when the list was _supposed_ to be a technical forum concerning cryptography and privacy technology, along with the few posts concerning pending legislation and the social effects of such tech. Now, the average day's traffic is about two-thirds pure noise. What on earth is interesting about _that_?
With the execption of those twits flaming Mr. May, there is noise, and there is NOISE. The noise here is more valuable, insightful, and thoughtful than the signal most places. I joined this list primarily to lurk, as I had been told that it was primarily techincal in nature, and I don't have much to add at that level. I was pleasantly suprised to learn that the content was much more than just technical. There are many of us who _can't_ code, but "we" can think about the protocalls at a different level, and we MUST understand the implications of the technology that "we" are assisting to deploy. "We" must understand what "we" are unleashing, to do less is irresponcible. Petro, Christopher C. petro@suba.com <prefered for any non-list stuff> snow@smoke.suba.com

Dale Thorn <dthorn@gte.net> writes:
Perry E. Metzger wrote:
Well, folks, after four or five years here, I'm finally leaving.
[pathetic whining snipped]
The new list will be run very tightly. Some people will doubtless label me a fascist and say I'm impinging on their ability to be "free". Those that feel that the best use of their freedom is to urinate into their own drinking water are entitled to their beliefs -- but they will not be welcome on the new list.*
[more whining snipped]
Nothing in the real world is perfect, ideal, or even relatively close to either one. If you want to really solve your problems, it will not likely be in running away, but in getting some therapy (seriously).
As far as Fascist goes, fascism is fun enough when everyone gets to participate, but I get the idea you feel "some of the pigs are more equal than others", if you know what I mean, and I think you do.
I haven't been on the list more than 6-8 weeks, but in that time, it's been more interesting than I would have guessed for a non-technical forum, which isn't necessarily good, but this is the real world.
It's time to split the folks who want to do crypto from the folks who want to read Timmy May's inanities, lies, and personal attacks. Who gets to keep the name "cypherpunks"? --- Dr.Dimitri Vulis KOTM Brighton Beach Boardwalk BBS, Forest Hills, N.Y.: +1-718-261-2013, 14.4Kbps

Let me know when you'll do this. I'd like to add it to the filtered list. :) ============================================================================= + ^ + | Ray Arachelian |FL| KAOS KERAUNOS KYBERNETOS |==/|\== \|/ |sunder@brainlink.com|UL|__Nothing_is_true,_all_is_permitted!_|=/\|/\= <--+-->| ------------------ |CG|What part of 'Congress shall make no |=\/|\/= /|\ | "A toast to Odin, |KA| law abridging the freedom of speech'|==\|/== + v + | God of pretzles!" |AK| do you not understand? |======= ===================http://www.brainlink.COM/~sunder/========================= ActiveX! ActiveX! Format Hard drive? Just say yes!
participants (6)
-
Dale Thorn
-
dlv@bwalk.dm.com
-
nobody@huge.cajones.com
-
Perry E. Metzger
-
Ray Arachelian
-
snow