Re: Surf-filter lists
At 02:31 PM 7/17/96 -0500, you wrote:
<rant>A Private organization cannot "censor" anything. The fundamental definition of the word require some agent of the government take action to censor. To accuse Surf-Watch, net-nanny, AOL, MSU, AT&T, or whatever of "censorship" accomplishes nothing except to make us look the fool.</rant>
I am not going to go into petty details about the actual definition of censor, and how private organizations do censor, but private citizens have the option of getting their information from an uncensored source, the same as when a government censors. The only difference is the government is allowed to use physical coercion, whereas on the surface corporations are not yet allowed to do so. I will, however, address your argument on a different level. Your view of this issue typifies one of the primary objections I have to many of the arguments amongst libertarians. The problem is NOT JUST GOVERNMENT. It is with any authority that has power over you. When a private entity becomes powerful enough that they have the ability to forcefully exert their influence over you, they are just as bad as Government. Granted, Surf-Watch and so forth haven't yet become that big, but there are some rather large Media companies who have, as well as institutions such as the Church. For example, I think our mainstream news IS censored, and not necessarily by the government, more by corporations intent on keeping us in the mindframe that will make them the most money and prolong and extend their power. I am not saying that a private entity doesn't or shouldn't have the Legal Right to censor, but I am saying that censorship of any form by any entity is a Bad Thing and the public (not the government, mind) should fight it on all fronts. This, in my mind, is the only reason to be dismayed by the decision on the CDA. It was found that the government shouldn't censor on the Internet because there were forms of Corporate censorship available. It would have truely been a great day if the decision had been that the government shouldn't censor on the Internet because censorship is wrong.
I agree that the problem with the "bait-and-switch" filtering of net materials by these various filtering packages needs to be addressed. If I want to protect my kids from seeing alt.naughty.pictures, I shoudl still be able to unfilter political and health speech. The real problem isn't censorship, it's disclosure by the makers of filtering packages about what exactly their packages are going to filter for me and my family.
That is another problem, not the Real Problem. The Real Problem is that parents are scared to have to explain to children why something they've seen is wrong or bad. They are afraid to teach their children their beliefs and values, so instead would rather just filter everything that conflicts with those beliefs, so that they believe it by default. This is a big problem when those children grow away from their parent's influence though, and creates bigotry and intolerance. (They don't know why they believe what they do, but believe it with fearful vengeance). //cerridwyn//
agree with most of your points CL, but
That is another problem, not the Real Problem. The Real Problem is that parents are scared to have to explain to children why something they've seen is wrong or bad. They are afraid to teach their children their beliefs and values, so instead would rather just filter everything that conflicts with those beliefs, so that they believe it by default. This is a big problem when those children grow away from their parent's influence though, and creates bigotry and intolerance. (They don't know why they believe what they do, but believe it with fearful vengeance).
as I wrote in the CuD article, it seems pretty darn reasonable to me to adopt a philosophy in which the younger the kid, the more that is blocked, and to decrease this blocking to none at all as they get older. the argument is not, "to block or not to block" as a lot of black-and-white polarized accounts are portraying it. I would like to see people stop ranting at parents merely because they want to block things like sex, violence, pornography, etc. especially when younger children are involved. I'm amazed at how often I see this argument, "the problem is not junk on the internet, the problem is hypersensitive and backward parents who can't innoculate their children". frankly I think that's what childhood is all about: not being exposed to all the harsh aspects that grownups call "reality". do we ask that children work in factories and make their own living? of course not. childhood is about *not* being exposed to the full harshness of reality, about being insulated from it by protective parents. it's a very innate and natural instinct for parents to embrace-- virtually the definition of parenthood. admittedly it can become authoritarian, but at root it's very basic to human nature.
On Fri, 19 Jul 1996, Vladimir Z. Nuri wrote:
agree with most of your points CL, but frankly I think that's what childhood is all about: not being exposed to all the harsh aspects that grownups call "reality". do we ask that children
I thought it was in large part learning to be a grown-up. Petro, Christopher C. petro@suba.com <prefered for any non-list stuff> snow@smoke.suba.com
participants (3)
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Cerridwyn Llewyellyn -
snow -
Vladimir Z. Nuri